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All the crap I went through after d-day to save my marriage, it wasn't worth it, my wife is not worth it.

This last week has been a real drag. I've been thinking a lot about how I handled things post D-Day and I am so full of regret. I lost all self-respect and I feel so pathetic.

My WW continued talking to the OM after I found out. She would text him and chat with him on Facebook while I was sitting right next to her. She would lock herself in the bathroom and talk to him on the phone while I was still around. She told me she didn't love me and that she didn't think she could ever love me again. She said despised her marriage and the thought of not talking to the OM was worse than the thought of leaving her marriage.

She told him all the time how much better that me he is. She would refer to our kids as his step-daughters.

A little over a year ago my wife decided she didn't want any more children. I didn't think I minded too much, things were pretty good with just two kids. So a year ago I got a Vasectomy. I was only 27 years old and I got a Vasectomy because I thought that my wife didn't want anymore children. Well, the OM has a daughter and wants a boy. He would tell my wife that he would only be with her if she would give him a boy. She was totally willing to try and have a kid with him.

I remember thinking that I am still young, that I could still start a new life. But I can't have kids anymore... unless I wanted to pay $15k for a reversal. It's probably for the best anyway.

I remember she was texting him throughout our daughters birthday party (1 month post d-day). The morning of her party was first time I cried like a baby. I cried before, but the thought of my family breaking up really hit me when I was getting things ready for her party and I totally lost it. My wife saw me and I had to lock myself in the bathroom and cry. She couldn't even hold off talking to him during our daughters party. That really stung.

She would talk to him all the time and she would get so frustrated that the OM would not leave his wife for her. She only stayed with me because he would not leave his wife. If the OM wanted my wife, he could have had her. She had to settle for me.

After a few months, contact between the OM and my wife was becoming less frequent but still present. Eventually my wife agreed to NC, which she broke several times. She lied about it several times.

The last time, I gave her an ultimatum, if you so much as talk to him again, it is over. Well...I had been spying on her for about three weeks post d-day. But I eventually stopped because it was only causing me so much pain. Well about 3 weeks after her 2nd NC attempt I intercepted a suspicious message and I started spying on her again. A few days later I saw a conversation between them and she arranged for him to visit her at her office so they could "talk".

I made sure to be there. I walked in and there they were. I just looked at her, I told her it was over and I left. God I wish I had done something. I wish I had made a huge fucking scene....

Well, my wife didn't really care. She kept messaging him "well I guess we're getting divorced so you should come visit me." Eventually I calmed down and I didn't leave. I told her that she needed to choose, me or him. She said she didn't know who she would choose. For days she left me hanging, I was "Pending". She sent him an email telling him that she wasn't sure what she was going to do... Eventually she picked me, I guess. She spoke with him only two more times after that, short exchanges to tell him to leave her alone.

Things have gotten much better. I think my wife is truly out of the fog. But now I just feel so pathetic and It's eating me up inside.

"I'm just a sucker with no self esteem."

You are not a sucker; you are a young married man who has been beaten down by a selfish, manipulative, narcissistic wife. She doesn’t seem sorry that she hurt you. She seems sorry her game is over. You don’t have to stay with her. She doesn’t deserve you. Your DD is two days after mine. My WS was really foggy for several months. Only time will tell if he is sincere in his reconciliation but if he’s not and I find other wise he’s out. I cannot do this again. If she is not sorry, if she is not asking for forgiveness or another chance to make things right you need to start 180 hard and gain back your strength!

After all of her bullshit, do you still want her?

You deserve to treated better than this.

There are many women in the world that would be faithful and loving wives. Vasectomy reversal works, and you can pay over time. Also, many women already have children and don't want anymore. Don't let the vasectomy influence your decision to stay with your WW.

I'm sorry to say this, but she sounds like a horrible, thoughtless, self absorbed bitch.

Do you really want to waste your life with her?

oh ((((((Tempus))))))

do you still feel as though she settled for you?

are you in any IC/MC?

have you thought more about reversing your vasectomy, FOR YOU?

can you give yourself any forgiveness/compassion for reacting to the trauma of your ww's infidelity the way you did? that more likely you were in shock, as opposed to being a sucker

be gentle on yourself in your post d-day analysis - it's so easy to shit on ourselves in the aftermath - hindsight yadda yadda

it's okay to reflect - NOT okay to flagellate - capiche?

be gentle on yourself in your post d-day analysis - it's so easy to shit on ourselves in the aftermath - hindsight yadda yadda

it's okay to reflect - NOT okay to flagellate - capiche

Exactly. Go easy on yourself. Trying to save your marriage doesn't make you pathetic, it means you're determined and strong and love her.

((((Tempus))))

(((Tempus)))

I am sorry for what you are going through. You are not a fool and you sound like a good person and husband.

Your wife on the other hand, sounds like she is a very selfish woman and has made it clear that she doesn't want to be with you. She has continued to disrespect you on many levels without any regard for your feelings. She doesn't care that you know, because she doesn't even bother to erase her phone (which is sneaky to begin with, but nonetheless)...but is shows that your feelings don't matter.

Save your money. You don't have to tell her. Make plans for a plan B especially if she doens't want R. Don't worry about having kids until you meet the right person again.

I wish you the best.

Tempus,

If this is how you truly feel, then why are you staying?

All the crap I went through after d-day to save my marriage, it wasn't worth it, my wife is not worth it.

For perspective, things finally ended in November... So it's been a few months since things turned around. My wife has been doing a decent job trying to make me feel better about what happened...

I don't know, looking back, I just wish I had left. At least I would have had my dignity.

(((Tempus)))

You did the best you knew how to do. You have no reason in this world to feel pathetic for handling your dday the way you did.

Do you know how much fucking strength it takes to have your heart trampled on, stand back up, have your heart trampled on, stand back up, have your heart trampled on and STAND BACK UP?!!!

Dude you're a rockstar!

You are mighty and fierce!! Your strength is admirable!!

You have proven reason to stand tall and hold your head high! Your WW is damn lucky that you're still around. Maybe, just maybe she can grow into a woman who deserves you.

Tempus, I want to support you because you deserve it. She may have said words to smooth things over, but HOW CAN YOU SAY THAT SHE HAS WORKED to make you feel better about the situation if she is still in contact with this guy? Calling YOUR CHILDREN his step-daughters, contacting him in your presence and inviting him to her place of employment?

It doesn't sound like she is trying. You are a good guy and you deserve better.

[This message edited by overcoming2003 at 1:59 PM, February 4th (Friday)]

Dude.

You aren't a sucker. You took a stand for your family. Your WW certainly has her issues and needs to make a lot up to you. You did the right and honorable thing for your family. You can look back with no regrets. Your kids are better off for having seen how a man should treat real adversity.

Look at your kids ? What obstacle wouldn't you face for them ? Right now giving it time to see what you want isn't weak. It is smart. It takes great courage to face obstacles that stand in your way, confront them. Don't forget that.

ETA: IF you had left how would you imagine your life would be different ? Deciding to leave shouldn't be about pride. It should be about what is the best thing for you.

You mention your W is doing a decent job of making you feel better. She doesn't need to make you feel better, she needs to make you feel safe in your relationship. Specifically what has she done ? Transparency, Regret/remorse, reading books, building your ego back up ?

I suspect you are feeling this way is becasue your wife has done little or nothing to make you feel safe in your M. I might be wrong, but she needs to be the one to be re-assuring you right now. If she doesn't or can't, you have options. You have to help her and request these things, but they will make you feel better. IC/MC can help there too.

[This message edited by numb&dumb at 3:19 PM, February 4th (Friday)]

(((Tempus)))

Does his wife know what went down?

Degrading ourselves is never worth it.

[This message edited by wincing_at_light at 3:34 PM, February 4th (Friday)]

Tempus, Your story breaks my heart. It is so awful to see how one spouse could be so heartless to another.

I think my BH feels sometimes like he was second choice because OM dumped me. In the fog, I probably would have had a hard time "choosing". But now, God, I am so grateful the right choice was made for me. I never look down on my BH for deciding to R. I am the one who deserves to feel ashamed, not him. He is my number one.

She doesn't need to make you feel better, she needs to make you feel safe in your relationship. Specifically what has she done ? Transparency, Regret/remorse, reading books, building your ego back up ?

Haha. That's funny.

Transparency - WW isn't deleting her phone messages, emails, and browser history anymore, but she still feels entitled to her privacy. She doesn't want me checking her phone or email...

Remorse/regret - Only recently has she started expressing remorse/regret. I would pour my heart out to her all the time and she would either defend or completely ignore me. She was rug-sweeping big time. She flat out told me that she didn't like thinking about what happened and she just wants to move past it. I took so long for her to finally start telling me how she felt. Now she does try to reassure me when I am down. She says she is sorry and she feels ashamed. But it feels like too little too late.

Reading Books - LOL. She is too busy. I send her articles and stuff, but she usually doesn't say anything about them. So I wont even know if she read them most of the time.

Boosting my ego - She does, but only when I express to her that I am sad. She usually doesn't initiate anything. Just this morning I told her I was feeling really down and she responded with "You are a wonderful father and Husband. You don't have to blame yourself, I made bad choices"

Does his wife know what went down?

Yes. I probably wasn't going to say anything. But he contacted my wife after she told him not to anymore, so she sent him flowers while he was at work so that his wife would receive them. The note said something like "You need to stop contacting me. You need to let our affair go".

[This message edited by Tempus at 3:47 PM, February 4th (Friday)]

You need to stop doing the work to save the marriage. Stop sharing with her. Do a 180.

She feels safe because she thinks she's got you in the bag, man. When you pour your emotional hurt out to her, you send her the message that she's your support network and you rely on her for your emotional safety.

Time to mix that up. Time to remind her that she's the optional one in your life, not the other way around. Rock her little princess boat.

Stop being safe.

Stop letting her be the one who gets to pick.

Stop being her partner.

Stop being predictable.

Stop being reliable.

Make her fend for herself, and in the meantime, you need to find your sources of strength, support and understanding from places that don't have a stated agenda of destroying your life to get what they want.

She can be your emotional support and the person who gets access to your thoughts/hopes/dreams when she earns it back. Until she convinces you that she's worthy of that again, she should have exactly as much access to your authentic self as the guy who serves you your coffee.

[This message edited by wincing_at_light at 3:53 PM, February 4th (Friday)]

You can choose to not choose her, just sayin'

I was over looking what I was wrote. I think it sounds worse that it really is. My WW is not completely devoid of regret/remorse and she does try to reassure me. Things have gotten better recently, but my main issue now, and my reason for starting this thread, is that I feel like my handling of things post d-day took all the wind out of my sails and now I feel pathetic and full of resentment.

Here is a letter she wrote me two weeks ago (I should have gotten something like this two months ago):

Hey Babe,

I have been wanting to write you this morning and was not quite sure what to say. I figured that just speaking my thoughts would be good, so forgive me if things are jumbled. I know that today may be a hard day for you and I have been thinking about how hard everything has been for you. I hope you can stay happy and positive as I love you so much and I love how wonderful things have been lately. I want to make you happy and I am trying to do things to show you that I love you and care about you. You have helped in communicating your feelings to me and I really hope that you can continue sharing your thoughts and feelings with me. That helps me understand a little more about what you are going through and what you need from me to help you heal and move forward.

I am sorry for all of the pain I have caused you. Even though I was hurt by you, I made a bad choice to seek attention from another man. I was not thinking clearly and I am greatly ashamed by the way I acted during the dark time. It was like I was in another world separated from you and our family. I do not have any excuses, nor do I want to make any, as I just want to convey that I am upset by the way that I handled the situation with our impaired relationship. I hope that I can show you that I love you for the real you, the great husband and father that you really are. You and I are a great team, and I want to be united and never be distant from one another again. I will continue to show you that I love you, listen to you, support you when you are down, and take all of your time and attention :) (Maybe share you a little with the kids, but that is it!) I love you very much and I can not wait to see you later to have dinner with our family :)

That letter is complete bullshit.

I am sorry for all of the pain I have caused you. Even though I was hurt by you, I made a bad choice to seek attention from another man. I was not thinking clearly and I am greatly ashamed by the way I acted during the dark time. It was like I was in another world separated from you and our family. I do not have any excuses, nor do I want to make any, as I just want to convey that I am upset by the way that I handled the situation with our impaired relationship.

She doesn't want to make any excuses?! She just made THREE.

She wasn't thinking clearly? She's not a little kid. She was thinking just fine -- but forgetting she might get caught.

And whatever your relationship problems were -- if there even were any -- it doesn't justify an affair and throwing that into the "apology" effectively negates the apology.

Oh Tempus. Honey. It breaks my heart that you see that letter as a POSITIVE.

It absolutely SHAMEFUL.

I hope you can stay happy and positive as I love you so much and I love how wonderful things have been lately.

Translation - I I I ME ME ME. I like it when you act happy. You better make things wonderful for ME so I can be happy. Cos we know what happens when I don't feel "happy".

You have helped in communicating your feelings to me and I really hope that you can continue sharing your thoughts and feelings with me. That helps me understand a little more about what you are going through and what you need from me to help you heal and move forward.

Translation- I feel very secure when you express your pain every now and again. I like to hear how much I hurt you because it reassures me no end. And helps me see how powerful I am in our relationship and how securely I have you by the balls. I know you will never leave me when you are reeling in pain. And even though you tell me what you need, it doesn't mean I have to do it. I just that little inside view into how you tick.

Even though I was hurt by you, I made a bad choice to seek attention from another man.

Translation- Make no mistake, I blame you and it was ALL YOUR FAULT.

And those are just a few of the MANY things that jumped out at me. The entire thing is ME ME ME ME I I I I. Very disturbing.

I am so sorry Tempus, but she is NOT remorseful at all and I fear that she will cheat again. Probably with OM if she gets the chance.

Huge hugs,

Sammie