SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Please excuse the excessive length. I am two months out, and during this time I have not had access to a secure computer with a real keyboard. I promised myself I would write out my whole story as soon as I got one and post it here - I just never thought it would take this long to be able to do it. So now the story is getting longer and longer, so I thought I would just post a chunk of it at a time, on different days so it doesn’t get too overwhelming for anybody to read or for me to post. So this will be the first of many posts.

Part One - Discovery

My WH and I have been together for 15 years, married for 12, have three kids under age 8. A little over a year ago we relocated to the midwest, after 6 months of unemployment, for his dream job. Pay is fantastic, but hours for the first year would be super crazy. The move, the new climate (we are from Texas), and his crazy hours took a toll on our family. But it was mid June 2011, the year of crazy hours was almost over, and I could see the light at the end of the tunnel. My WH went out to the hardware store, so I plugged the kids into a movie in the basement so I could check my gmail in peace. I tried to fire it up, but instead of my account, I was in someone else’s.

It was WH’s secret account that he forgot to log out of when he left. The messages were suspicious, so despite the guilt of invading privacy I read them. There were about two dozen emails from the last ten days, nothing else. It was then, about ten feet away from my three children, I found out my WH was soliciting prostitutes, and had his last encounter days ago.

I was in shock and devastated. I was shaking and trying not to throw up. It came out of the blue, I had no reason to suspect it could have been true. I was ignorant of what to do, so I didn’t forward or print all the emails. Somehow I managed to forward the one email that proved his last session, where he said he would set up another one in a week or so (when I would be out of town with the kids). I didn’t know to lay low and collect more evidence, the proper way to confront, or what survelliance to have in place after confronting. I was out of my mind and barely holding it together. Luckily my kids were totally absorbed into the first viewing what would become their favorite movie of all time so they didn’t notice.

I went upstairs and waited for WH to come home. I confronted right away, so stupid. But somehow I kept my cards close to my chest, didn’t reveal my sources, and told him it was his chance to come clean and tell the whole truth and not F it up. I fully expected him to deny, to lie, and/or to blame me somehow, and I was ready to kick him out or leave.

That’s when he told me he had been seeing hookers for three years. Starting right after the birth of our third child. Now if that wasn’t earth-shattering enough, he answered every question I had without hesitation with what appeared to be the truth. He did not cry or show anger, any kind of emotion, was very matter of fact, but answered every question directly (yet did not volunteer any other information). He said there was no excuse for what he did, it was not my fault, he was wrong and he was sorry and regretted doing it and what it was doing to me. When I stopped asking questions, and had finally been quiet for a while, he said it all again and asked if I would ever be able to forgive him and give him another chance.

My head was spinning. I wasn’t expecting this. I told him I didn’t know, what would be advise his daughters if they were in the same position? Visibly rattled, he finally said I suppose I would tell them they have to know why it happened before they could decide if they could forgive.

This pissed me off. I knew whatever HE thought the reason why, wasn’t the real reason why. And whatever the reason was he thought it was, would only piss me off further. And I told him that. He continued to apologize and take a bit of verbal abuse from me.

I told him he had to quit all porn, anything electronically questionable including facebook etc because I would be monitoring everything from now on. He would not be going to the weddings and bachelor parties out of state he had planned to attend that summer. He would be telling me his every move from now on. He would be going to counseling to find out what was wrong with him. We would be going to MC to see if it was even possible to fix this. He would have to give me money to set up in an account in my name so I could leave if I felt I needed to (I am a SAHM). He would have to have a vasectomy, because he wasn’t having any more kids with me or anybody. He would have to be tested for STDs. He would have to take the kids to the wiggles concert, etc. because I wasn’t doing it LOL. I wouldn’t touch him, I wouldn’t look at him. He agreed to it all, said he would do whatever it took to earn back my trust.

THEN I found SI. To this day I am a lucky fool to get enough of it right this far. Good thing I did, because otherwise I would have made a lot of mistakes in the days to come.

(((hathnofury)))

I am sending hugs your way. I can only imagine how horrible you must feel. I am so sorry you have found yourself in this position, but this is a place where people really can understand what you are going through. Your story is overwhelming.

Please take care of yourself. I'm hoping you have also gotten tested for STD's? Also that you have found a good counselor for yourself. Please post often as everyone is here to help you through. You are in my thoughts.

Feelforgotten, I have been tested, and that part of the story will be covered in a later post. I didn't know this at this point on day one, but it takes up to 30 days for some STDs to show up on tests so I would have to wait a bit before I could get tested. He had had his last encounter a few days ago at this point, and I had sex with him the night before.

I'm so sorry you are in this pain, the only positive thing I see is that your WH answered all your questions and agreed to all of your boundaries.

His focus has to be on the marriage now if there is any chance of R, not his job, his friends, or any other activities. You and the family. Period.

He needs intense counseling to get to the bottom of his actions, he is an adult and certainly understands the consequences of sleeping with prostitutes. He gambled with his life and yours.

Take care of YOU for now so you can be there for your children.

This is the next installment of my story. I think there will probably be about ten parts before I catch up to present day.

Part Two - Aftermath of Discovery

So that very D Day, after confrontation, I found SI. I posted some, but not a lot, because I felt I didn’t have much to contribute. I was also wary since at the time most of the people posting had WS’s who had affairs, not just ONS or hookers and was questioning if I was in the right place, since most of the advice was geared at those in that situation. And it took me a couple of days to find the posts about the 180 and understand what it was. Since I didn’t have a secure computer, I didn’t try very hard to do more than read. I missed a very good opportunity to get some valuable insight from the people here that have much more knowledge and experience give me advice specific to my situation that could get me on the right track.

So during that time, WH shut down all his porn accounts and such, cleared out his secret email and tried unsuccessfully to shut it down, in an effort to follow my interpretation of NC. He gave me every password to every account, his phone, etc. which I checked daily. I had several panic attacks, one bad enough he had to come home from work and care for the kids. I then found the long thread by choppingonions and got educated on survellance and some of my mistakes in confronting, glimpses of issues to come, and started posting more so I could get into Investigative Tips. In my posts, people suggested I should perhaps investigate whether WH was a SA, which I had never considered before. WH was reporting his every move by text or phone, answering all my questions, helping out and being there, trying to do everything he could while I slowly went crazy and didn’t discuss it with anyone IRL, as I was afraid to open a door I couldn’t close.

And we also had a major setback two days after DDay. WH has always had all my passwords, and he logged into my email to print my flight itinerary for me. While he was in there, he saw my forwarded copy of his email from his secret account, and he deleted it. Not permanently, just put it in the trash. I happened to log in right as it was happening or I may not have noticed for a while. I chewed him out, said it was NOT the way to earn my trust. He apologized profusely, said he saw it and didn’t want me to have to look at it every day on my trip. He realized now he had panicked and it was wrong. Whatever. I told him he was a fool if he thought that was the only evidence I had on him (ha ha), and that I could make his life a living hell, and walked out. I was seriously reconsidering everything at that point, but I had to have some time to think.

So in finding SI, I discovered it was not only okay to take 6 months to a year to wait to make any decisions, it was a wise thing to do. I also decided to go ahead and go on my trip with my kids to follow the 180, even though I didn’t want to go and didn’t want to leave WH unsupervised for two weeks. WH said he understood if I couldn’t go, he would make up something to get me out of it if needed. But I did, visiting my parents in their ongoing renovation house with three kids under 8, which was stressful in itself but a well-needed break. Before I left, I told WH to not F it up again, to assume I could see and hear everything while I was gone. He took it to mean I hired a PI, LOL, and I didn’t correct him. He said he would text his every move and call every day. I told him it didn’t matter, if he went astray I would know. So he took me and the kids to the airport for our two week trip to visit my parents and his.

While there, I told my mom I had a UTI thus was not feeling well or acting like myself, so she wouldn’t worry about something obviously being very wrong with me. I downloaded books about betrayed spouses and the infamous Out Of The Shadows book by Carnes, which is the gold standard for sexual addicition, because it was the only ebook I could find on such short notice and I didn’t want my parents to see what I was reading. In retrospect it is not the best book to read when you are less than a week out from DDay from a potential SA, it can scare the crap out of you, but I’m glad I did. There were certainly enough red flags for concern. Meanwhile WH is texting his every move, calling and leaving messages, etc and I am not calling or texting back unless he needs specific info from me. He finally asks me to please call and let him talk to the kids, which I do, and am very emotionless when I do.

He calls on our anniversary (yeah, I had planned a trip during our anniversary, we were going to celebrate after I got back), which I thank him for acknowledging, and he says he tried to redeem our miles to get a flight there to be there on our anniversary but it couldn’t process fast enough. I’m thinking our anniversary means nothing to me ATM, but I coolly thank him for thinking of me but it wasn’t necessary. I even made an offhanded comment that if he was going to spend all that on a last minute flight, it would make more sense for him to do it when he could help me take all three kids home, not really meaning he had to.

Three days later he was on a plane to meet us and had bought a ticket back with our return flight. IHe said it was “too hard to do this in different states. I need to be here with you.” I t was difficult since my whole extended family was there, but I managed to pull off the 180 fairly well without too much suspicion.

But upon my return home, I would have many obstacles much more challenging to overcome.

Oops. Double post. ;)

[This message edited by hathnofury at 3:38 PM, August 21st (Sunday)]

then found the long thread by choppingonions and got educated on survellance

Good job grasshopper! ;-)

Sound like you're on top of your game right now... I'm impressed... Many times we get broken down souls ready to sell their souls to the devil to save their M's... You've been very measured...

My biggest concern is about how you're taking care of yourself... Are you eating and sleeping? Are your kids doing good?

Self presevation is very important here... You can and will get lost in his problems... Let me tell you this... His problems are only your problems as long as you say they are...

Talk to a lawyer... To protect yourself and your children... In the mean time... See what else he'll do to secure your and your childrens future in case he's just too screwed up...

I would have never believed my ex was as screwed up as she was... It was just too unbelievable to me... But it was reality... It was a reality I faced head on without a clue as to how to face it...

Keep posting... Believe me... We've seen so much here... It's hard to shock us.. (much)..

WB

The fact that you have your "Mad" on at this stage of the game is good. Great, in fact. You are strong. If you are dealing with an SA, you will need it. If that seems to be the path that life is taking you, you MUST do a few things.

1) He must find a Certified Sex Addiction Specialist for IC. Anyone else is simply a waste of time and money. My fWH sees someone who, while not Certified, is a specialist working toward that certification. She is amazing

2) both of you should attend a 12 step meeting regularly. You for spouses of addicts, he for addicts. There are several groups, SA, SAA, and SLAA for addicts, all with very similar programs and philosophies, based on AA, and for you, S-ANON, or COSA. If you can't find either of these, go to an AL-Anon meeting.

As a "yeah but" not all individual meetings are created equal. My fWH has found some to be too large, or too triggery, or too something else, but he has found 2 meetings that he benefits from. My meeting was a life and sanity saver for me.

The third thing for you to do is to educate yourself about SA. It does help somewhat to understand the mechanics of addiction. Two books that are "bibles" and are available for download are Deceived, by Claudia Black And Shattered Vows: Hope and Healing for Women Who Have Been Sexually Betrayed By Debra Laaser.

the book Mending the Shattered Heart is by far the best for Newbies but I am not certain if it is in ebook form.

There is a link in the "I can relate" forum for spouses of SA. Lots of good info on the first post.

Finally, despite what the prevailing belief is, don't be quick to label yourself as a co-dependent or an enabler. I know that I developed co-dependent and enabling behaviors as a survival skill, but I reject those as labels. We often behave in unhealthy ways when we are faced with unhealthy people as a way to deal with the trauma they inflict on us.

And BTW, while this is a TOUGH addiction to beat, I personally know many fine men, who are successfully sober for many years. Have hope, get help and take care of YOU!

[This message edited by scaredyKat at 12:23 AM, August 22nd (Monday)]

(((hathnofury))

Wow, your story pretty much parallels mine 4 years ago.

You are doing all the right things. One question...I noticed you did not mention your WH giving you a timeline. Have you asked for one? Have you gotten a "body count" if you know what I mean? Were there a few...a lot?

Also, one thing I demanded from my WH is that he pay US back for all the $ he spent on the hookers. (It came to something over $2,000 if you count gasoline traveling to/from his "encounters", special phone, etc.)

Did you ask him if he wore his wedding ring while with the hookers? Mine kept it on. Needless to say, that wedding ring is LONG gone. (replaced by a new ring)

Your post got my stomach churning bringing back such ugly memories. So sorry this happened to you.

Keep us informed on how things are going. You are not alone.

One GREAT book also, Your Sexually Addicted

Spouse...Barbara Steffens. This book describes IMHO exactly how spouse of SA behave in ways that appear co-dependent but are, in effect, self protective. BUT, it goes on to say, that 12 step groups still are very helpful in that they encourage one to become independent from the addiction cycle.

Wow, thanks for all the support. Will try to answers questions as they come.

As far as self-care at that point, not very good. The trip was intended to make sure someone else would feed me, lol, because I tend to stop eating in times of high stress. The sleeping, um, no. I have a 3YO that does not sleep well in new environments, and he had bad allergies upon arriving in TX, then (although I never mention in the posts I've written) all three get a stomach virus and throw up all night long on different nights while on the trip. When WH arrived I did take some melatonin and slept one night really well when no one is sick.

As far as the kids...they can tell mama is sad and stressed out. I am not the best mama I can be. But they don't really see it as a problem with mama and daddy.

I do see a lawyer, and it is covered in a later post.

The SA evaluation by a CSAT will be covered in a later post. See, I am paying attention when I read here, LOL. 12 step, no. It will be explained in time.

No, Mending the Shattered Heart is not in E-form. I could only have ebooks on that trip if I didn't want anyone else to see what I was reading. I also have not been able to find it in a bookstore. I'm debating ordering it online now, although I wondering how it will be helpful now 60+ days out.

Body count and timeline is covered in disclosure in a later post. Also money spent for such activities and making amends for that. IDK about the wedding ring, probably so, I never thought to ask.

I will also post what books I have read, if that is helpful, later today.

[This message edited by hathnofury at 2:38 PM, August 22nd (Monday)]

Okay, as promised I checked my reading list, and in addition to Out of the Shadows by Carnes I have also read Deceived by Claudia Black and Your Sexually Addicted Spouse by Barbara Steffens. I was hoping by this point (the story is only up to day 30 or so, it is now day 60-something) I would have been told to read more things by our MC and the CSAT, no such luck. So I am taking notes as you recommend things. Thanks again for everyone's support.

Again I am portioning out the story because it is so long, having not posted this stuff as it happened. I'm not afraid of shocking anyone, LOL, or divulging too much, or whatever. I have been really really lucky in my journey to have benefit from other's examples here and I am hoping posting my story will do the same.

I will say it has been tremendously helpful in that I learned the hard way a long time ago to not take things personally, more often than not whatever problem is at hand - it is probably not *about* me. Even if it looks like it, or feels like it, or affects me deeply. This makes distancing myself and looking at what I need to do a little easier. I notice here so many people get buried in the onslaught of hurt, and they can't get past the "WHY ME? What did I do?" and it breaks my heart. That's not to say I was not buried in the hurt, believe me I still am, but I know it is NOT my fault and that is often my saving grace in getting the crap done that needs to get done for me to survive, heal, and endure.

Part 3 - DIY Private Investigating

We did have a car ride together where we could talk for 20 minutes during the trip, and I reiterated all my requirements and boundaries, said once again that healthy people do not do what he did, and he needed also to be evaluated for SA. I said he should know that by my not throwing him out I was giving him a gift. I said that no matter what happened, he was the father of my children, and if he was to have a relationship with them he needed to be healthy. That giving him the opportunity to heal himself, SA or whatever it was, was also a tremendous gift. My voice was matter of fact, but I could not stop the tears from flowing. WH was visibly shaken from what I said. He said he doubted that he was SA, but maybe that was because he didn’t really know what it was. He would do whatever I wanted him to, whatever it takes to save the M and regain my trust and love. In his defense he was doing everything I asked him to until this point.

I had also told him at some point I needed full disclosure, and he needed to work on a comprehensive list of all his offenses so I could understand the scope of what I was dealing with. He said he wasn’t sure he could get all the dates right or remember every single time, but he would try. Of course from reading here I knew he would say that. I told him if he had so many offenses that he could not remember every single time he violated our vows, we had a serious problem. I said I didn’t care about exact dates, just the number of times and approximate dates. He said he could do that, he would make a list and we would go over it whenever I was ready.

On that trip, my MIL gave me $700 for my birthday, our anniversary, and our youngest child’s birthday prior to WH’s arrival., considerably more than she usually gave for such things. I avoided talking about it with WH, but I knew eventually he would ask about it. Upon my return home, I used it to buy prepaid CCs to purchase a VAR, mobile phone spyware, and a keylogger, kicking myself I didn’t do this prior to confrontation. I lost a golden opportunity to see if he covered any tracks of other things I wasn’t aware of right after Dday that I will never have again.

I also hacked into the secret email he was unable to shut down, and since it was a gmail account, I was able to see his internet search history for the past three years, every search he ever made while logged into that account. I found all his porn sites, all his escort services, his search of a penis pump and a tracphone (both of which I learned later he purchased), his search explaining the different kinds of threesomes you can request from escorts (also meaning two guys and a girl, and what the different focuses of that could be), and the piece de resistance - an extensive search of adult bookstores with glory holes in the area, gloryhole stories and etiquette, etc from the week before confrontation. It was a tremendous blow.

In installing the mobile phone software, it retrieved every picture he had ever taken with his smartphone, including ones he deleted. There were a half dozen explicit pictures of one encounter in there among the hundreds of pictures of his children. Bear in mind I find all this out BEFORE we have had our disclosure discussion. Yet another blow. I decide to use this info to my advantage to see if he tells me the truth.

I searched his briefcase, and found two boner pills in a bottle with his diabetes medicine. I took them out and hid them. The pills were nothing new, he has had them on and off for years not because of impotency but because he likes the neverending boner. The fact they were in his briefcase was what was the problem, clearly he wasn’t using them with me. Strike three. I am about toast now. It is killing to hold all this inside, but I have to be able to see if he is telling me the truth during disclosure.

I searched his desk at home, and found a debit card card I didn’t recognize. I remember some tips from SI, and just call the automated number to see the balance and see if I can pull up the last few transactions without talking to a human. I can, and there is only $7 on it. However, it said there was a deposit for March for about $800, then two consequent withdrawals for $400 (the limit you can pull from the ATM), and same again for April and May (at this time, it is currently July). After three strikes, I hit the roof. I figured he had some sort of monthly bonus at his new job he wasn’t telling me about, and was withdrawing the cash on the sly, and god only knows what he was spending it on. I call him immediately at work and tell him to come home. This is something that cannot wait for disclosure, if it is what it appears to be it is game over.

I confronted him in the driveway in the car, away from the kids who were busy playing games inside. He took one look at the card and reminded me it was the debit card that was given to him for unemployment last year, that they did deposits that way. It all came rushing back to me, the deposit amounts did match and we did withdraw in that manner in those months the LAST year. The automated caller only said the day and month of the last six transactions, did not state the year. I felt a little foolish I didn’t figure this all out on my own, but in my defense I never did actually see the actual debit card before. I just saw the statements and such. WH said he didn’t blame me one bit and I had every right to react the way I did. It was lunchtime and he asked if he could go bring us lunch and have lunch together since he was here anyway. He dried my tears and told me he was so sorry he was doing this to me, it was not my fault.

At this point, I don’t know what end is up and now I am second guessing all the evidence I have collected.

Part 4 - Focus on self care

So every day I am reading in SI, reading my books, etc and trying to focus on my healing and take care of myself first. Immediately upon return from my trip, I schedule an appointment with my OB for a full STD screening. I research divorce lawyers and find a large firm that only represents women that has free informational seminars, and I reserve a spot. I find a counseling center than focuses on marriage and relationship counseling, that has a couple of addiction therapists, and get DH to set up an appointment for both of us initially. I also find a counseling center that focuses on SA, run by a leading CSAT expert in SA that writes books with Patrick Carnes on related subjects. I figure if it pans out he has SA leanings, or the first place doesn’t work, we would go there next. The only reason I don’t go to the CSAT place first is they don’t take insurance and is very expensive, and I figure it is best to start slow. I had told WH we may not get the ideal therapist on the first try, we might go through a few before we find the right one.

I called a friend overseas, who is concerned and can tell even thousands of miles away something is up. I tell her everything, because we have no common friends locally or in my family so I know it won’t get out to them. She is currently in a tough spot with her marriage, no infidelity but is also in a less than ideal coexisting situation waiting out changes in her husband, so she is very sympathetic and not judgemental in the least. It feels so good to be able to talk to someone about it, even if she has no perspective on it at all.

We do see the MC. She is obviously deeply disturbed by what is going on, we are not the garden variety marital issues she probably sees. It is at that time WH reveals that the hooker visits averaged to once a month(in d day, he had said “not that often”), and states his reason why because she asked. He basically said because after the birth of our third child, I flat out refused to have anal sex anymore and other nonstandard things, and he got pissed off and decided to pursue those things with others rather than make more reasonable choices. That I had been much more sexually experienced in these things prior to our marriage, and he had not, and he somehow in his head needed to level the playing field with or without me. That it was in no was my fault, he was wrong, he made the choice to do it and bears all the responsibility for his actions. That he quit the day I confronted, and would never ever do it again. He was willing to do whatever it took to save the M and regain my trust and love.

I keep my anger in check, because as I said I before I knew this is not the real reason why, and whatever reason he would state would only piss me off further since it would be bullcrap. The hold on kinky stuff was during the newborn phase of child #3, remember I also had a 2 and 4YO at the same time. I was too tired and overwhelmed to deal with his increasing demands of non-vanilla sex. We had plenty of vanilla sex at the time, and after #3 became a toddler I was up to kinky stuff again. The use of hookers not only continued through all this but increased when the kinky stuff resumed, I would later learn. The therapist asks to schedule an individual session with each of us the next week, and both of us again the week after that.

The OB visit is hard. This is the first person IRL I admit what is happening to in person other than the therapist, who of course had to respond a certain way because that’s how therapy works. The OB is sympathetic, says infidelity is way more common than you can imagine and it kills her how many women from all walks of life come in her office for the same thing. She asks if it his first time to go astray, and I have to tell her what I know. When she finds out the scope of my WH’s infidelity, she flatly says, “Well, then, it’s time to go.” She tells me I need to find support groups, that being with others in the same situation is the best step in healing in her opinion. She tells me it is a very good sign that I have no outward symptoms of anything, but if that should ever change in my lifetime I should get it checked out immediately. She then tells me i will be tested for syphillis, gonorrhea, clamidia, herpes, etc and if they come back negative, they should always stay negative as long as I am not exposed in the future. She cautions that a majority of people test positive for herpes, because the oral variety will produce a positive result. She says the HIV test will have to be done again in 6 months to be sure, and again it only holds true if I am not exposed again. It just happens that I am due for a pelvic exam in 6 months, so I can get it all done at once at that time.

The same day I attend the divorce seminar at the law firm. DH is home with the kids, he has no idea where I’m going, assumes it is a IC session and I don’t correct him. I find out my state does do alimony, that child custody is a separate legal procedure from divorce, that post nups are legal in our state, I would not be held liable for his massive law school loans, etc. all sorts of information that is helpful and leaves me hopeful. I make an appointment for them later in the week to discuss my options.

It was a good day. I had hope. It was nice to have hope that day, even if it didn’t last long.

(((hathnofury))) you my dear are so very strong...from day 1 you have taken back your life...I commend you! You are a great example of a strong women to your children. They are so very lucky to have you!!!!

Thanks for that, Forks. Honestly it is pretty easy to sound strong writing about it now. I can guarantee you I was a hot mess then. I am still struggling with my patience and not snapping to quickly at my kids, because it is not their fault my world has been turned upside down.

I'm doing all these things, but I am also crying in the bathroom, having strained convos with WH, alternately kicking myself for not exposing him to everyone I know but knowing it is tremendous leverage if I don't. I have wild mood swings that I desperately try not to show outwardly. But I get a lot of strength and guidance just reading stuff here, knowing I'm not alone and that others have been down this road before. It is a tremendous help.

I'm so sorry for everything you've been through. Your story is heartbreaking and your strength is amazing. I didn't handle myself with nearly as much dignity, I was way too volatile and vocal

I also got the pathetic "after the kids were born..." line about sex. what a load of horseshit that excuse is. They didn't seek out hookers because of a vanilla sex life. I loved watching a SA therapist confront WH on that issue, it was priceless!

Keep writing, I can hear the progression of strength in your story.

Wow, I am following your story, I am so sorry you are going through this. You have been amazing holding your cards close to your vest.

Part 5 - The legal crap

I get a sitter to cover the appointment with the lawyers, WH doesn’t even know I’m going., to explore my options. I tell them my situation, and they say in their experience when they confess to X number of instances of infidelity it is usually twice that amount. They are glad we don’t own any property, as it makes any potential scenario easier. They are concerned that the bulk of our money is in a joint account, and that I don’t have any cash in my name only. They are also concerned some of the bigger debts are in my name (because I had better credit at the time). I tell them about finding the photos via mobile spyware, and they are worried because it most likely violates privacy laws in our state even though the cell phone account is in my name. They tell me they will check on this with a criminal lawyer to confirm.

They tell me because of my age (early 40s) and education (MBA), even though I put him through law school and then haven’t worked full time in six years since having children, that best case scenario I could get maybe $1000/mo (EDIT: for 30 months, not life) in alimony, probably less even if I could prove his guilt. They told me child support for our three kids would likely be in the neighborhood of $2100/mo. Both figures highly dependent on the judge we get in either case. That any law firm should be giving me (or my WH) the same approximate estimates. My WH currently makes six figures (recent development), and if I were to look for work today, I would be lucky to get *any* job in the low 20s with benefits. We have amassed a large amount of debt from WH being laid off three times in the past six years, and I was legally liable for half with the exception of his law school loans. So this was a blow.

I know many would look at these numbers and say, well, that’s more than enough to live on, why are you complaining, you ungrateful toad LOL. Fair enough. But these numbers are best case scenarios, meaning I may not get them. Heck, I might not get anything from him, and it could take months for me to get a job that paid more than the cost of daycare for me to have employment to sustain myself. Remember I just moved cross country and have no family or support here, so I would have to pay for any childcare. Also it takes time to get set up via the courts, as many can attest here, so I could be without any income for him for months even if I was awarded anything.

Up until this point, my WH and I planned our whole lives, every move around me being home with the kids while they were small and him getting this high-paying job so we could pay off our massive debts quickly and retire without worry. We were finally in the phase the debts were actually getting smaller at a rapid pace. I never considered the plan could leave me with half the debts and way less than half his income to pay them, maybe NONE of his income, on top of regular living expenses. That HE could be the one to screw it all up and still give me the short end of the stick. That is the blow, the injustice of it all, not the actual numbers or maybe having to start all over from nothing. Remember on D day, I was ready to kick him out, take the kids back to Texas, and live with my parents or his mother and start all over. I still am if needed. That’s what I have the $5k in the bank in my name only for.

To be fair, WH had agreed to assume *all* debts if we D and he would never allow me or the kids to be in dire straits. But honestly what good is that promise to me, when he also promised to be faithful to me in front of God, a preacher, our parents, and 150 of our friends and family on our wedding day? It means nothing if not in a legally binding document.

I asked the lawyer about a post-nup. Told them WH thought it was some simple sort of document that should be inexpensive. They said all lawyers outside of family law think that, but in actuality it is quite complicated. It is essentially doing all the legwork and paperwork of a divorce but not having to deal with a judge, only negotiating an agreement between the two parties. That papers and such have to be filed appropriately so that, for example, I would in fact get my share of the pension when he died if that was in the agreement, etc. He said that no reputable lawyer would represent both of us, but if WH wanted to represent himself to save money that would be fine. It would run about $5k on average to do this, more if the estate was complicated or there was a lot of haggling (times two if he got his own lawyer to represent him). He also suggested we employ a different lawyer to update our estate planning and wills at the same time to reflect the post-nup agreement, and he would be happy to refer some.

Then I asked about custody. That there shouldn’t be any fight for the kids, we could work it out easily, but what would happen if I wanted to take them back to Texas. Well, as it turns out it is good I didn’t just stay in Texas with the kids, I could have been charged with felony kidnapping if WH wanted to. I don’t think that he would have, but the fact that he *could* have rattled me. I can go through the procedure to request this, but I could get denied, it happens. Then he said that the problem with changing states is usually the spouse that leaves gets the short end of the stick. They lose the kids every Christmas and summer, and have to pay the bulk of the transportation costs for the privilege of living elsewhere than our state. He said if I really wanted to take the kids back to Texas, I should get D in Texas. Like get a job there and take the kids there with DH’s blessing, get residency there and file for D there.

This was a big blow too. I have only lived here a year and don’t have a real support system in place. If I were to go back to Texas, I’d have my parents and MIL to lean on for support and childcare, in addition to all our old neighbors and friends. Going on my own here, with no support, in an area that has been hit harder in the economy than most areas of the US, would be very very difficult. Now, again, to be fair WH had said if I wanted to go back there with the kids, I could, and he would fly there every other weekend to limit their trips up here, as it is difficult and expensive to fly three young kids anywhere and he would want to see them that frequently. But again, how can I trust his word at this point? I have to assume what I am legally entitled to over anything he promises me.

So I left with a packet of info to collect in the event of post nup or D, a promise of a followup call for the mobile stuff legality and estate planning referrals, and a big sinking feeling I was SCREWED.

[This message edited by hathnofury at 4:33 PM, October 30th (Sunday)]

Wow, reading this all now really triggers me out. I wish I had been able to write it as it went along. But then if I did it then it probably wouldn't make sense, it would be a bunch of hysterical mumbo jumbo.

I also appreciate everyone applauding my strength, but I didn't feel strong then and don't now. I feel like if I shared this outside of this forum, then or now, everyone would see me as weak. Everyone would ask me why I am still here? Why didn't I expose him to everyone? How can I even think there is a remote chance this can succeed, what kind of example am I setting for my children? 2x4s.

Ugh. It's hard.