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I've been married almost 18 years and we have 3 kids together. My husband had a physical affair 11 years ago. There have been small "incidents" several times since. Such as having inappropriate conversations with women and asking and receiving a barely clad picture of a woman. We have went to counseling several times. He always says the right things. I know he doesn't want a divorce. I tried to give him an easy out and he wouldn't take it. On the outside things look perfect and we do get along great, enjoy our kids and have fun doing things together. I just don't know how to trust again.

Trust is so important. I was advised to do a list of pros and cons about the relationship it helped me. Trust can be re-built but from what you say his on-going actions are making it very difficult for you to build on developing it. The idealistic dream I had of finding my soulmate was destroyed trust takes time, if you want to go down that path hang in there if not get out while you are young enough to build another life.

I am sorry Amberdawn.

IMO your H doesn't want to D because he gets the best of both worlds.

He is married to a wonderful woman and he has little "incidents" through the years...?

You cannot trust someone who is not trustworthy, Period!

Has he ever had any IC, has he ever had to face consequences for his actions?

He needs to do a lot of work before you can trust him...ever. Blind trust after an A is gone. They lose that right.

(((hugs)))

[This message edited by karmahappens at 5:13 AM, May 3rd (Friday)]

Welcome Amberdawn

We have went to counseling several times. He always says the right things.

Was this Marriage counseling where you went as a couple to "fix" the relationship?

If so that would have allowed him to pass off much of the work that he needed (and clearly still needs) to do onto the Marriage. The work that needs to be done in counseling is on him, not you. You describe a marriage where you get along well and actually enjoy the company of one another.

His words may have been right...but his actions are those of a broken man who needs validation and attention from outside himself. His "incidents" are telling you that he has not changed or grown, or done the necessary work to be a good marriage partner. This means that you are not safe in the M, and will make it almost impossible to begin to trust again.

He will need IC with a therapist who knows how to deal with infidelity. One who knows that marriage problems DO NOT CAUSE Affairs! There may even be other issues that he has that need to be addressed. After his issues are addressed and he owns them for himself...then perhaps marriage counseling would be helpful to fix any damage his "incidents" have caused.

This is a long and difficult journey and I hope you can find comfort and healing here.

... My husband had a physical affair 11 years ago. There have been small "incidents" several times since. Such as having inappropriate conversations with women and asking and receiving a barely clad picture of a woman. We have went to counseling several times. He always says the right things. I know he doesn't want a divorce. I tried to give him an easy out and he wouldn't take it. On the outside things look perfect and we do get along great, enjoy our kids and have fun doing things together. I just don't know how to trust again.

Amberdawn,

As a former wayward husband, I recognize the behavior that your H is demonstrating as extremely dangerous.

He has no boundaries and likely doesn't intend to form any.

Based on his ability to con, I wouldn't be surprised to find that he's had other affairs along the way.

I would recommend a polygraph if you are going to stay in the marriage. At least you'll know what you're facing.

Waywards either do one of three things when facing a polygraph - they either refuse, which means they are hiding things, giving you solid assurance of their guilt, or they sing like a canary the day before the test. The third is that they willingly and happily go, because they never had anything to hide to begin with.

You can never trust someone when you don't know the truth. And it takes years of transparency and working a marriage recovery plan before trust/loyalty can ever be re-established. However, He can create an environment where you can have day to day trust again. Loyalty, however, that's years away.

How do you ever trust again?

it takes years of transparency and working a marriage recovery plan before trust/loyalty can ever be re-established. However, He can create an environment where you can have day to day trust again. Loyalty, however, that's years away.

I don't know if I will ever trust WH 100% again. But I am hoping to get close.

My husband had a physical affair 11 years ago. There have been small "incidents" several times since. Such as having inappropriate conversations with women and asking and receiving a barely clad picture of a woman.

Big red flags here. How do you know for sure that he has not had other As or is not currently in one? Maybe you should increase your surveillance (VAR, key logger, check phone records, etc.)

Good luck.

[This message edited by mchercheur at 8:40 AM, May 3rd (Friday)]

Lots of great answers here.

Mine?

You don't.

Now you get a new question: how do you conduct a relationship with someone you don't trust?

I am afraid that I won't ever trust again. So, how do I continue a marriage like that? On the flip side, how do I walk away and break my family apart? I don't want my kids to suffer. The therapy was marriage therapy. I still go, but by myself. He thinks everything is great with our marriage.

....I still go, but by myself. He thinks everything is great with our marriage.

Of course he thinks everything is great.... He's a cake eater!

He gets to have his cake and eat it too.

CARD, what do I do then in this situation?

Now you get a new question: how do you conduct a relationship with someone you don't trust?

M334455, I'll bite.... :)

You don't have a relationship with someone you can't trust unless you're a glutton for punishment .

However, you can create an environment, that a wayward agrees to live within, that makes you feel safe enough to trust them under those conditions. Very specific conditions.

Conditions like total transparency, all passwords to emails, installing keyloggers on the computers and phones, gps tracking, etc. etc. etc.

Creating the environment that allows YOU to feel safe.

Otherwise it's like playing Russian Roulette, and the next affair is the bullet in the chamber.

CARD, what do I do then in this situation?

Do what my wife did....

Ask for a Polygraph and ask for complete transparency with specific conditions!

My wife packed my shit and thew it to the curb when I didn't agree to these things...

Since several months have passed since I found the picture, I don't feel like I have a good catalyst to bring things back up. I keep waiting for him to do something else. I found the picture on Christmas Day. We did talk a lot and go to therapy. I do know his email accounts and passwords but I feel like I'm missing something. He is a detective so his job keeps him out a lot and dealing with lots of other people. I'm not sure where else to look. He deleted the picture before I could read the messages that went with it. I wish I could have read those.

Since several months have passed since I found the picture, I don't feel like I have a good catalyst to bring things back up

The fact that you feel concerned is catalyst enough. You don't need some major event to feel justified in bringing this up to him. You can simply tell him that you need to discuss something that has been bothering you for a long time. It is fair game if it happened yesterday or 25 years ago. You are in a marriage...and your well being within it, is ALWAYS a good reason to discuss anything.

He deleted the picture before I could read the messages that went with it.

THAT is a red red flag. He is hiding what really happened regarding that incident and you are right not to trust him. He is keeping information from you. Lies of omission are still lies, minimizing the truth...still lying, tweaking the story just a little...still lying. Deleting texts, and pictures is a lie of omission. If you don't see it...it didn't happen.

Given his history, I would not wait for concrete proof. He hasn't done what he needs to do to EARN your trust back. And your Marriage is clearly not fine. I don't think you should continue to let him believe that he is successfully pulling the wool over your eyes.

Your other option is to do nothing and to continue living the way you have been living.

((hugs))

This is hard stuff.

I agree with whoever said...

YOU DON'T.

I also agree that you don't have a relationship with someone you don't trust.

BUMMER.

Think about this for a moment, and I know it's going to sound shallow, but I'm going to put it out there.

You have been married for 18 years and 3 children together. In most places you would be entitled to his half of his pension/retirment forever.

I'd seriously consider divorce because not only he is not trying to change his ways, he is going about the business of hiding it. From him being a detective, he probably knows how to do it without your knowledge. He probably also knows when you're trying to check up on him.

You might want to have a secret meeting with your lawyer at a secret time and location and not mention anything about divorce until it is time to serve papers. And when you do, change the locks on the doors and put his stuff in a suitcase on the front door. I know this sounds extreme, but he's a detective and knows the legal system. Also he sounds like a smooth talker and might be able to talk you out of it.

I think you need to set this boundary before you can ever trust him again. He needs to be outed for him to have any remorse at all. He needs to be separated from you and the kids to make him feel what he's lost. You also have to understand that he may not miss you or the kids at all.

Normally, I wouldn't encourage divorce even in the face of an affair, but in this case, you need to protect yourself legally and financially.

Remember, let's say he divorces you and marries another. Unless you have it in your divorce decree, guess who gets the pension?

Easier to do all this when you're in charge and not him.

We're here for you.

The question is, will I ever trust him again? It took me a while to get there, but this is where I stand right now. I do trust him only because I do not want to waste my time wondering if he is playing around. What I would change is if I see even a little sign of infidelity I would act up on right away instead of wondering "is he....." He had a second chance, and he better not mess it up again.

Today I was able to find some messages that weren't completely deleted, between him and the girl who sent him a picture. I can't tell when they were sent and its only one line from each conversation. I did a spotlight search. One of them is asking the other if they are going to come see the other one the next day. Another one asks what their favorite part of the house is and the answer is living room. Then one asks what the other is doing right now. Answer is "doing what??? Nothing here to take a picture of." I know that's not much to go on, but I think it shows there is at least an inappropriate conversation. Am I right?

^^^^ YES that is very clearly inappropriate. Sounds to me like there is a PA going on. I'm so sorry, Amberdawn. ((hugs)) You sound like a loyal, kind, loving woman and you do not deserve this.

Amberdawn - I have to agree the messages you read suggest another A. His behavior of deleting messages and pictures when you ask about them is also a red flag. I remember going through that phase of WH trying to convince me he wasn't having an A and saying he was going to work on being a better a husband only to find a text months later from OW (hidden under some guys name on the contacts)that WH could not deny he was having an A.

I am sorry but the red flags are waving. Your question about trust - You can't regain trust if you can't verify their actions. When I finally had all the passwords and could track his whereabouts on his iphone, I started to feel some trust. Before this I did not trust where he was or if he was still in contact with OW. I realize they can go underground but the behavior does not change.