Me: Hey I am going to Vegas in June with the boys for Dr. Xs going away party Is that OK?
Her: Sure, you know you have a free pass to fuck other girls if you want.
Me: What the hell are you talking about?!!! That is bizarre. Are you OK?? Why would you say that?
May 23rd 1st intercepted text
" I miss u, can I come see u?"
"No my Dad's is over"
Confrontation. Denial. "We are just friends and you know that". We have had our issues and you work so much, its nice to talk with him."
Her parents drop by in the middle of this fight and we have a spontaneous intervention suspecting all this shit is related to her drinking. We give her 2 weeks to find a place for rehab.
May 24 My 10 year old finds an additional phone in her purse.
Confrontation. Denial "I just found this in the yard. I think its the gardeners. I am waiting until they come next to
return it." Then, "I enjoy his company and we meet over coffee, that phone was to keep you from getting jealous"
May 24 I text the OM (whose wife cheated on him, then divorce)
"looks like its your turn to break up a marriage and family."
May 29 I see attorney
May 31 OM response
"Not sure where that came from. Love for the kids to have a play date. Your place or mine & if there are issues we need to discuss I am more than happy to . Nothing going on between your wife and I."
Meanwhile my wife and I are looking for places for her to go into rehab soon.
We go to a nice dinner together and she is uncharacteristically kissing me, touching me (not sexually) at the table saying how she loves me, can't imagine life without me.
I am on call. Unusually light for emergencies that day so I come home. She is asleep or passed out by the pool and I look at her phone and find this.
OM: Me and mine on stay cation" pic
WW: Adorably sexy. Goodness I miss u & don't know what I will do this summer (she leaves for 2 months).
OM: I know
WW:I luv u & am drawn to you every second of every day. I can't explain it either. I am a self-reliant woman who doesn't need a man, but I need you. I pace my house all day wanting to talk with you. How pathetic is that?
OM: I figured
WW: I am bawling like a baby right now. I ma at a cross roads & do not know which way to turn. I know the direction I should b headed, but want the other. (mind you he is unemployed and she is high maintenance). This sucks for all involved. I think I'll call my Mom believe or not (she didn't).
OM: Yup, maybe a good idea
WW: she is awesome you would love her.
Hammer comes down. I tell her I have already met with an attorney, I will get 100% custody and fuck off, although I was crying. I got in the car (her car the high end German sports car she loves but is leased through my practice) unscrewed the bling license plate holder and threw it at her. I drove to her parents and cried to them that there is more than drinking. I showed them the evidence and phone records.
During my drive I get these texts:
WW: I will seek out any mental/physical treatment u see fit for me. I love you and know what I did was wrong. I am not asking for forgiveness, just a chance as a family. I get the fact that I fucked that one up but I am begging you to come home and lets work this out. I love you even if my actions haven't shown it. "Seeing you cry killed me. I am sorry to have hurt u like that. It's real to me and I am sorry."
"Maybe its a midlife crisis? I now see all that has taken 43 yrs to build I have destroyed. I swear to u this would never happen again. I need my life back and to be the women you married not this old washed up shell. I will go to rehab in a shared room?! (previously the Queen would only go if there was room in their executive suite.)"
Per the housekeeper (I trust her), she drives to his house and tells him its over
June 3 Her father forces her into rehab about 8 am and I find this note on her (now my car) at 6 am
"As I stay awake at 2am, I am sickened by my behavior. I will seek help for my multitude of problems. I do love you and our family.
I will seek treatment. I do not expect you to take me back, but I sure hope you do. I think deep down I was trying to be caught in the inappropriate friendship because only then we could work on things. What I didn't see was the full effect of my actions on you and the children. I will forever be sorry. Please try to forgive me. Maybe it took a wake-up call to show me the preciousness of life and realize actions go way beyond ourselves.
I took a vow and broke it, not physically, bt that doesn't matter. Sorry to hurt you like that and sorry to have hurt the family."
June 7 Housekeeper confirms to me she was bringing guy into my house and doing him.
June 8 I press her and she admits to 3 romps and 1 parking lot BJ.
June 10 Intercepted email to best friend from rehab
"Yes, I really need this and knew it. I am not scared anymore. I am excitied to live a sober lifeand get the real me back. The hardest part will be if (me) decides to leave me. That is what I am most scared
of. Fucking up a marriage is a hard thing to fix."
June 11 Email to me
"The fact remains true that I love you. I dont give a shit about OM. I know you find that hard to believe, but its true"
June 14 Email to me
"I will never stop loving you. I want our marriage to work and work even better with me healthy."
June 15 Email to me
"I love you so very much and I am excited to start life over."
"You are my love forever. I hope you understand that I am not lying when I say I love you. I have hurt you so much and do not know how to approach you yet. You say I repulse you so I just do not know what to do or not to do."
I cant believe what I have done to us and our family. I do not know if I will ever forgive myself for that or what brought me to do what I did. I have no answers and may never have them."
"Toward the end, I was living my life in a fog. In some sick twisted part of my brain I think I wanted to do something to get your attention. Well I did that! I suppose it took such depravity on my part to get help and your attention. I understand why you didn't want to go to MC, but I couldn't see it then. I wish we could have been more honest with one another months ago."
June 17 Personal conversation.
I tell her my son cannot play on the same soccer team as the OM's son is also on the team. Within a few hours, without telling me but me intercepting e-mails, she has removed him from his current team and placed him on a different team in an entirely different league.
June 25 intercerpted email to best friend.
"I get out on the afternoon of the 2nd. I am scared to go back to the hood as everyone knows everything. The guilt & shame is tearing me up but as the saying goes, "You make your bed so sleep in it."
I am terrified Rattus will never forgive me. I really realize how much I do love him through all this. I did a really shitty thing and have great remorse! I can't take it back so I just have to continue to heal and be a better person, showing him how much I love him. "
I know this is long, but it was kinda therapeutic to organize this and get it out there. Your eyes will see things in these correspondence that I can't. I am resolutely on 180 but my biggest concern about R is the energy needed to deal with alcoholism will sap the energy need to reconcile. I am 60 D/40 R today.
I am interested to hear you take on this crap cuz I am too emotional to analyze it.
BEST TO YOU ALL!
[This message edited by Rattus2000 at 10:40 AM, June 25th (Tuesday)]
As for the communication. She still isn't owning that it was physical...She's still lying about it - that's a problem! And she is reaching for convenient excuses MLC, booze.
Let her work on her sobriety - you work on you. Just be aware, the A was not just a symptom of the drink. There are layers of issues here. Getting sober won't fix everything, nor should it. But one step at a time.
Dealing with addiction adds a whole other level of hell to infidelity. I am sorry you are dealing with this.
Honestly, in her emails I read nothing but mad scrambling to try and save herself. There is not much acknowledgment of the pain she caused - unless you count 'I can't believe what I did to us and our family'. I actually don't count that; it sounds more like an expression of regret and not remorse, to me. In other words, she is freaking out about fucking up her life, not yours.
That is my analysis. But look, I grew up with alcoholism in my immediate family, and I don't think you can trust anything she says until she has some measured time of sobriety behind her. I don't know what that measurement should be - a month? six months?
You seem like a nice and caring individual. You might feel better in the long run if you give her a chance in rehab before you make a decision. Use this time to think about the future that you want. The standard advice on this site is to give yourself time - six months to a year - before making a major decision. You've been through a very traumatic series of events - use her time in rehab to find your equilibrium and figure things out. Good luck.
Edited for weird autocorrect as well as to say - shit like 'I wish we'd been more honest months ago' is nothing but blame shifting. It is impossible to communicate with an active alcoholic who is engaged in another relationship. Don't let that talk make you feel like any of this is your fault.
[This message edited by lost_in_toronto at 12:02 PM, June 23rd (Sunday)]
If she was so unhappy, she could have left you. There is no excuse for her lying and deceiving you. She cannot put one ounce of blame on you.
The fact that she already had a secret phone and was completely lying to you even after you confronted her, that's not a good sign. She again had a chance to come clean, and she continued to manipulate you and lie to you.. And she manipulated the OM into lying to you too.. I would find it so very difficult to ever trust her after that..
I agree you need to take things one step at a time here. That's great you have the support of her parents to get her into rehab. That's just one issue out of many that she needs to work on. I think it's going to take a very long time for her to fix all of her problems, and you need to stay strong and take care of yourself and your kiddos in the meantime. You have a lot to heal from too..
"Well I guess she lied to you too. A lie of omission that is. Did she tell you she has genital herpes? I doubt it. In some states it is a crime to not inform a sexual partner of your known STD. Shortly after I started dating her I seroconverted despite taking precautions (a lie). FYI: The test may not be reliable until a few months after exposure as it takes time for the body to produce measurable anti-bodies to the virus. The mess you have caused my family is incalculable. Hopefully you didn't get a lifelong STD b/c I imagine that could make dating a bitch."
Never got a response on that one.
[This message edited by Rattus2000 at 1:07 PM, June 23rd (Sunday)]
Also agree it is time to take care of *you*. Maybe check out an Al Anon meeting - I got to a few men's meetings and it is a great place to share and connect with men who have been there. Lots of guys have had similar experiences.
Sorry youre here with us Bro...gonna assume you have read the healing library in its entirety...if not...please do.
Being married to an alcoholic/addict I understand your situation...BTDT!! And it blows...
It took my FWW a couple of trips to rehab - usually a trip every 5 years or so...after I would file for divorce after having enough of her bullshit...before she finally "got it"!!!
I cant believe what I have done to us and our family. I do not know if I will ever forgive myself for that or what brought me to do what I did. I have no answers and may never have them."
Another...."stay in today"...."don't drink today"...a lot of that "today" bullshit....I told my FWW that I wouldn't "leave you today".....I was a real prick about it too...but I had had enough.....no more "humping my leg"....or humping OM either.....KWIM?
One thing about alcoholics.....I kept hearing that is not a question of "if" they will cheat....its a question of "when"....hard pill to swallow, being married and in love with one...
My take on all this...(and some shrinks as well) - people drink, drug, spend money, play online games, gambling, etc .....yes even have affairs......as a form of self medication for what I call "pre-affair issues"....the APs derive a "high" from cheating....now im talking about the basic "shits and giggles" affairs, - NOT exit affairs, rekindled affairs with past lovers, etc....the "feel good", ego stroking banging the pool boy/neighbors wife affair.....its a selfish act with unicorns, rainbows, Disneyland, they are bullshit affairs.....they are an escape from reality...think a junkie an crack...its a "high"....based on lies and deceit .....
I am not a shrink...but I stayed at a holiday in express once...(bad joke, sorry)...From what you posted, I do believe your wifes affair is of the "shits and giggles" type...good thing - there is probably not a very high level of emotional attachment that would be there if she was banging an old boyfriend or ex-husband. It was for stroking her little ego. Her affair was forbidden, new, exciting, he made her feel sexy.....she got "high" doing it...it was NO bills, kids, laundry, cooking etc.... it was a fantasy..an escape from reality...she was knee deep in pheromones...
Heres a kicker, bro....very few...I mean ...VERY FEW people remain clean one year after a trip to rehab...especially a forced rehab...you mentioned her father "forced her to go"....relapses are common....but it is possible.
I suggest IC for your wife....she needs to find out the "whys" of her decision to cheat....compounded by her drinking problems...weekly if possible...I also assume she is doing "Bill and Bob's" AA program....she need to do the "90 meetings in 90 days" with a daily meeting....My FWW did one every day....she needs to get a sponsor and call her every day....basically "work her program"....all the steps, etc...
Try to get some rest....your sleep patterns are probably "jacked"....eat something....I lost about 45 pounds on the "infidelity diet"...don't recommend it either...drink liquids (not beer)...and post often....
It is possible to "R" after something like this happens to you....we did, but it took a FWW that was willing to "do all the right things"....and a lot of patience (not one of my better virtues)...its NOT an 8 second ride (yeah...im a redneck)...its all in my profile if you care to look at it...
Keep us posted....
[This message edited by bufffalo at 1:41 PM, June 23rd (Sunday)]
She's just not giving you enough to work with here to give you a shot at R.
my biggest concern about R is the energy needed to deal with alcoholism will sap the energy need to reconcile. I am 60 D/40 R today.
I think that one of the biggest mistakes a BS makes is not seeing that they have a 3rd choice- Personal recovery before reconciliation or divorce.
It takes a hell of a lot of energy to recover from the blow of finding out that your spouse had an A. It takes a ton of energy and time to figure out who your WS has turned into and whether or not you want to R or D...or IF you should even try to R.
If your WW wants to remain married to you than she'll respect your need to be in limbo- on the fence- not ready to make any decisions at this time.
Even if she didn't have alcoholism to deal with, she wouldn't be ready to R. She has to first understand what she did and why and how it has rocked you and the family unit.
Hopefully you didn't get a lifelong STD b/c I imagine that could make dating a bitch."
This made my day! Don't you know every time he feels a twinge down there, he's gonna wonder!
Just remember, there are no rules here so sit back & let it unfold. Decide what you can be alright with and, what you can't. There's so much to absorb from the A fallout that you can't possibly do it in a short period of time. She was being incredibly selfish while only thinking of what she needed/wanted so, now it's your turn & I believe that time is on our side. Time for my H is excruciating & I have to admit, I get a little pleasure sometimes watching him sweat!
I really liked how you: "unscrewed the bling license plate holder and threw it at her" That was awesome and I bet it felt good.
My H, too has addictions. It makes this mess all the harder to work on...
After you can function properly, it would be wise to see a chemical dependency therapist to try to understand her. More for the logical part of your brain that asks, why she did this to you.
Well, from your descriptions, sounds like she's trying to hang on to her "decent life." I think that's what my H is doing. The alternative isn't too pretty- single loser drunk dad living with his folks, that's what would happen to him if I leave him. Being that I'm the respectable member or society, much like yourself, I find myself trying to mend his broken wings. Not for me, for himself as a father. When he's stable enough, I'm going to leave him.
I'm sorry, I'm afraid much like my H, the addiction is just as hard to deal with.
Heck, I'm 7 months out and I have no plans on R-ing. I'm just giving it a year with IC/MC, like everyone says. The shock is slowly starting to lift for me...
[This message edited by libertyrocks at 2:20 PM, June 24th (Monday)]
You have got a lot of good advice already. I guess the only thing I have to add is that she seems to be talking a good game. Time will tell if this is genuine or another ulterior motive at work.
While she is in rehab this is hard, but watching actions is the only way to determine sincerity. Does what she say and do match up ? NC, transparency, sobriety, etc. All important "needs" or "boundaries" to protect yourself from further hurt.
Down in the I can relate their is forum for betrayed men. Stop in and read there. I have found a lot of support there too.
DS 1, DD 6
Dday 8/31/11. EA/PA. Lied to for 3 years.
Every truth comes to light in a long enough timeline.
Took the kiddos to family day at rehab for a 2 hr visit.
My 8 y/o son who I have never mentioned the OM to wrote at the request of his mother 5 things to Mom on what he wanted to see changed in her.
One request said, "Just because another boy is nice to you doesn't mean you have to be nice to him. Just be nice to Dad".
My 11 year old said to me when asked after the visit, "what do you think of Mom's progress?" "She looks healthy and she has thank God gained weight (she is a 2 petite who lost 36 pounds from January to June), but Dad she still is a monster for destroying this family just for some wine."
I find this so amazing that they have this insight, but so shocking they have it too. But guess what, when the WW gets wind of this she will blame it on me poisoning the children's minds against her. The reality is that they have observed her behavior and that has poisoned their minds. But she cannot accept that--yet
Wish I could meet you all and shake your hands and give you a big hug. The experience we all have is so destructive to the core, so unbelievable, it so transcends normal thought, but in a strange way our collective experience is positively healing. This place and all of you are so unique. Thank you for the balance of rational advice, humor, revenge mentality and angst. You have kept me grounded and able to carry on. No one in my life but you all know the depth of my despair. Forged from the hell of deranged spouses, you all are a model of and for what is or what is good in life.
My warmest regards.
[This message edited by Rattus2000 at 10:11 PM, June 24th (Monday)]
((((((Rattus2000 and kiddos))))))
The hardest part will be if <REAL NAME FOUND HERE> decides to leave me.
Bufffalo pretty much nailed it all.
I see this situation as fairly promising if she can stay sober. There is a lot of advice here to the effect that you can not R with an addict, but there is also an old bit of wisdom here that says you don't have to decide anything yet. In fact, it is recommended that you not make any irrevocable decisions for a while, the only debate is how many months constitutes "a while".
I see that you are still in the very early stages, and probably still dealing with a lot of the common side effects we can all relate to. I used to write sensitive detailed posts about how to cope with each of these, but that has become harder as I move farther out (proof that you can recover and not be driven mad by this forever). I also realized that all of the specific advice can be summed up (as trivial as it sounds) by saying to treat it just like a cold. Eat what you can (including meal supplements if necessary, but a week long diet of chocolate or potato chips probably won't kill you), drink plenty of liquids (including sports drinks to maintain electrolytes, I prefer the blue flavoured ones), rest as much as possible, and consider whatever is in the pharmacy to treat the worst symptoms (AD's, xanax, vitamins). Also understand that, like a cold, there is no quick cure, but if you look after yourself you will recover a lot faster than if you don't.
*POSER is a recent acronym, replacing POSOM. POS refers to piece of shit, while it was felt that it was inappropriate to refer to the affair partner as a man, so there is a movement to drop the OM, and refer to the as ER, short for Ensign Rivera (though I prefer the ethnicaly neutral and childish Ensign Ricky), just another meaningless redshirt that may be necessary to set up the story, but is ultimately irrelevant and disposable. He won't be beaming up with the landing party of your life.
Do not back up. Severe tire damage.
The person who suggested Alanon was right on. Also, if you don't feel comfortable going into a meeting, you can go on their website and they will list phone meetings. yep, just listening in really helps me process it all. 90 meetings in 90 days for alcoholics and the same for the spouse, I say. You will learn that you can't control her, you can't cure her, because you did not cause it.
But guess what, when the WW gets wind of this she will blame it on me poisoning the children's minds against her. The reality is that they have observed her behavior and that has poisoned their minds. But she cannot accept that--yet
The above quote is what AA or Celebrate recovery is for. It teaches an alcoholic how to live, because that is what they are most lacking in. When I was married first time to an alcoholic who went into recovery, I was told they would grow much faster than I would if I did not get help also from living with the effects of alcoholism. Heck, get your whole family on the same page. Everyone goes to whatever support group this treatment center recommends. You all are going to need support, especially if you (or she) decides on a divorce in the future.
Lastly, someone on this site said one time that the alcoholic has to heal, the BS has to heal, but also the marriage has to be repaired/healed. It's probably a little early for that, now, but I did get a divorce from an alcoholic who quit drinking. In alanon they teach us not to make a major decision right now, nor think every day, "what am I gonna do?". Instead, set a date, about 6 months out. And tell yourself, ok from this date to this date, I am going to observe wife's behavior, (meetings, contact with sponsor,etc), work on myself, make sure wife works on healing our marriage, then on this (future date) I will then begin making a decision. (See how Alanon helps the BS?)
I have noticed on this website, the people who get help (MC, or Alanon) really get it all together much quicker than those who muddle thru on their own.
One Day at a Time
[This message edited by homewrecked2011 at 5:01 AM, June 25th (Tuesday)]
me BS 52
him - 46
married 15 years DIVORCED 10 31 12
children - ds15 ds12
I gave a 24hour ultimatum then went to attorney next day
I admire your courage and the love you have for your wife.
Your kids are smart beyond their years.
I wish we could have been more honest with one another months ago."
Notice the "we" above.
When your wife starts saying I is when she fully realizes the damage she has done o you, the boys and your marriage.
She needs to take responsibility for her horrible decisions and actions.
You are not responsible for her lousy decisions.