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We are done! Just contemplating how to tell her.

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beenthereinco posted 7/3/2017 10:32 AM

Do you think that the 2BFs are relaying the things you say to them to your WW in the same way they are telling you what she is saying? That could explain why she is saying exactly what you say you wanted to hear. I think this is going too far to be honest. You need to disengage now. Not continue to indulge in these conversations with these friends as the go-between. I think they are working toward a reconciliation on behalf of your wife no matter what they tell you. If you don't want that why are you spending so much time talking and thinking about what she did and is doing now?

[This message edited by beenthereinco at 10:33 AM, July 3rd (Monday)]

harrybrown posted 7/3/2017 10:43 AM

have you given your stbxw the words to the song

you give love a bad name?

Sorry for your pain.

Hope you and the kids heal.

ohforanewme posted 7/3/2017 10:50 AM

Hi Beenthere

I say noting to 2BF, just listen and absorb. I can't be certain but I get the distinct impression that hey are not telling WW that they are discussing anything with me.

Harry, don't know the words to the song but am going to look them up now.

devotedman posted 7/3/2017 10:58 AM

I haven't posted previously because I simply had nothing to add. However, I do have at least comments now.

First, kudos upon your handling of this whole sordid mess that was visited upon you. You show character, empathy, caring, integrity, and other positive adjectives. I'd never hesitate to shake your hand.

I'm not correcting your English with this next, I'm simply explaining difference between your (excellent) English and mine. The term "ghost", at least here in the states, usually refers to a new dating situation in which one simply ceases to communicate with a new interest. What you're doing is, at least on this board and in the US, known as NC - No Communication (except about finances and kids). So, more precisely, no "relationship" talks, no emotional communication. NC equals No New Hurts.

The type of car that you described building is known in the US as a "sleeper." Usually a sedan or saloon instead of a coupe. Sleepers are cool. They don't have flashy paint or loud exhaust (until you use the cutouts, if so equipped). They do run like a striped-assed ape (pronounced stri with a long i, ped as in pedicure). If you want to read about some grass roots racing and a great engine rebuild experience on a Mercedes-Benz google this phrase exactly, quotes and all:
mazdeuce "r63 amg the unicorn of my destruction"

As for whether or not your WW is rewriting the A history: Not really, because it is a tale of betraying you, betraying herself, betraying her kids and her mother. It is a tale of cheap sex had in cheaper places. It is a tale of her _not_ having integrity, character, the ability to be Open, Authentic, Trustworty, and Honest (OATH) in her communication with you. This didn't seem to be an Exit Affair, done to cement the death of her feeling for you before leaving. It was a reflection of her brokenness. Viewed in the harsh light of reality how could it be anything but hated and hateful?

That does not mean, however, that her path to fixing herself is guaranteed. People _need_ to feel good about themselves for their own mental health and the easiest way to do that is to re-write it yet again, somehow. Fixing oneself is hard, lying to oneself is much, much easier. Less rewarding, but easier.

As you talk to the 2BF can you take notes? Can you tell them, OATH-style, that you're mentally adrift and can't remember some things that were said and ask again?

Your WW has a lot of soul-searching to do to be a safe partner for anyone. Her Why is not "Ohforanewme let me down in some way" or "I craved adrenaline and excitement", her Why is the answer to the question "What about _me_ was so broken that 'Have an affair' was the proper answer to any question and why was that part of me so broken?"

Her breaking things in the hotel room says something. That question should be "Why is it okay to break things and why is it okay to break things that someone else must pay for?" Breaking things like crockery can be very therapeutic, like hitting a punching bag. Breaking someone else's things, though, kind of selfish, no?

Her easing pain through getting drunk isn't so hot a solution, either, is it? She's tasting the fruits of her own actions and she doesn't like the taste. Her reaction isn't, though, go fix herself, it is break stuff (that you must pay for) and tell you how great you are. Not the best coping mechanism.

Your WW has lost something that she values greatly - you and her home and family. She was "cake eating," having her cake and eating it, too, with her A's. Don't be surprised if (likely not if but when) she broaches the subject of Reconciliation. She will be asking herself what she can do to get her old life back. Whether or not she decides that an attempt is worth a go is her decision, but don't be surprised.

Limboaz posted 7/3/2017 11:31 AM

Just a couple of observations. When you read your first SI post to your wife where you basically spill your guts about how her affairs almost pushed you to suicide, there was no emotional response from her. When you played back the rantings of AP2 to her, she sobbed uncontrollably, because it was a bad reflection on HER.
She appears to be a raging narcissist. You are wise to not believe a word she says, and I would caution you against hooking your self esteem to anything she may say about you while she is trying to butter you up for potential reconciliation. It could just as fast turn to cutting insults once the reality of your determination to D starts to sink it.

Deb346 posted 7/3/2017 12:02 PM

I am wondering how you would feel if she was not so upset. You sound as if you enjoy seeing her in pain. Iḿ sorry but I find this disturbing.

midnightschild99 posted 7/3/2017 12:05 PM

Deb - Please cut oh some slack. He's gone above and beyond to ensure that his wife is taken care off after she ripped his heart out and handed it to him.

TimelessLoss posted 7/3/2017 12:15 PM

WW has agreed that we meet at the hotel for dinner on Wednesday to discuss what we are going to say to the kids on Friday.

Ohforanewme, you are going to have to be extraordinarily disciplined to keep the conversation only on the meeting with the children. She will not want that. You should remind her at the outset that you'll leave the table if the conversation does not adhere to the agenda. The children have to be put first.
Do you think that WW is perhaps rewriting the A history and now wants to see it as being far less enjoyable than what it seemed at the time?
Simply out, yes, it is rewriting the history of the adultery. It is classic: blame shifting, minimizing, selfish, self centered tripe. She is a cheater, cheaters lie, she is lying. She is managing her image for her friends. She is now a victim, deserving of their sympathy.

You need to stop meeting with the 2BFs. And set a boundary with your STBXW. The communication boundary with the 2BFs is that you only want to hear if there are health concerns. The boundary with your STBX is communication only about the children.

The 2 BFs are feeding you ego kibbles from your STBX. That is not healthy for you.

Mrhealed posted 7/3/2017 12:20 PM

ohforanewme

At the moment and form your previous posts, seems like she experienced the A as a totality and not just sex, and cuddling, etc. That’s why she still fonds OM1 even when there was not much sex as with OM2. As you can read in the WW part, when a great pain is related to the A is when the WS starts seeing it under a new perspective where, as they say, everything they remember bring feeling guilty, pain and shame. In other forums you also can read that the Sex with AP was the best ever, the most exciting thing!

Is like a Cancun spring break memory…is easy to think of it as exiting, forbidden, once in a life experience…

Sex in not in the genitalia but in the brain! The fantasy matches, in the A, the perfect love story, so at least at the time your WW was living a love made in heaven.

You WW is rewriting due to all she has lost, even the sex with you. Now she is going to have to go through her As and reexamine each moment under a totally new scope (event with kids she missed, that she will never be with you again, etc).

In your specific case, I believe you WW didn’t give you what you need to heal because she was still reliving the great moments she had with OM1 and OM2, she was still in love with OM2, or the fantasy of him, so didn’t have emotional energy to deal with what she has done to you. Even now the bad guy is OM2, she hasn’t think that OM1 is also POS…she should ask OM1wife about it.

Just one thing, 2BF are WW friends, you cannot believe all they are saying. I bet WW has a plan to engage you into R. IMO they are feeding you what you want to hear. If she were for real OM1 would also be into the rants, but coincidently just OM2 is, as was the one you confront…IMO a truly remorseful WW will, recognize what a POS OM1 was as well and the role he played to destroy her marriage.

Other thing, well seems like everybody knew about OM1. Seems also like she didn’t care what other, coworkers, would think of you or your kids if ever meet. You should ask her if she ever badmouthed you or was tired of being a mother…

If she really feels what she is saying, ask her to justify all she said and wrote to OM2. Also ask her to justify he feelings for OM1. Also what is her opinion of OM1 as he is such a nice gentleman because she couldn’t see how OM1 throw her under the bus with his wife. She just hates OM2 because she had evidence of what a coward he was, not because what they did was wrong….

Other thing, if she is feeding you what she thinks you want to hear, why don’t you ask her why during R she never committed emotionally, ask if she until yesterday still was in love with OM2 and misses OM1.

Sorry for my post, but I strongly believe that she is just doing damage control and transmitting what she believes you want to hear. When I say tha you should ask her, it is just to make a point. IMO you should go dark and even tell GFs to not give you more feedback other than if WW is doing fine.

MidnightRun posted 7/3/2017 12:23 PM

There was no need for her to seek out another man to treat her like a princess.

She had a prince of a husband at home.

She threw away the real deal for cheap excitement.

She's now tweaking the narrative of the affairs to reconcile the mental turmoil she's experiencing.

Don't dwell on the particulars of deceit.

Infidelity is infidelity.

Accept the ego-boosting salves, then move on.

The war is over.

Indeed, she was used big-time, but that's no longer your concern.

Make sure her conversatios are limited to the children or the divorce.

She knows what she has lost.

That's life.


When I discovered the affair, I promptly dumped my wife, who had said AP reminded her of me.

She then dumped AP.

Thus she was left with neither the real deal nor the fantasy.

Again, don't allow the particulars of the affairs rent too much space in your head.

The deed is done.

And you,sir, were masterful, leaving your emotional adversaries (WW,OM) in shreds.

All the very best.


[This message edited by MidnightRun at 1:22 PM, July 3rd (Monday)]

Sharkman posted 7/3/2017 12:45 PM

You need to let OBS1 know of your change in marriage status

Sanibelredfish posted 7/3/2017 12:45 PM

Ohfor, I know it is nice to hear that your WW realizes the error of her ways that she regrets at least one of the As (OM1 and A1 is scarcely mentioned, yet it went on twice as long as A2). There is some vindication for you there, but please tread carefully.

As you know all too well, your WW is a lying liar who lies. So, take everything, and I do mean everything, with a huge grain of salt. She is working the R angle and her friends may be witting or unwitting accomplices in this effort. Put me down as another party that would suggest limiting your contact with both WW and the 2GF. Your notable progress will likely increase further still once you limit those discussions to only what is absolutely necessary (her health and the kids).

[This message edited by Sanibelredfish at 12:46 PM, July 3rd (Monday)]

Deb346 posted 7/3/2017 13:02 PM

I have had a similar experience...When my unfaithful husband wanted me back I felt more in control and I held all the cards. After time I realized this was extremely unhealthy for everyone involved including my children. You have to stop this madness.

Deb346 posted 7/3/2017 13:15 PM

I have just re-read all of the posts. Why do you have to meet with her at the hotel? Why dont you talk through your attorney?
This ego boost drama is so sad. You are setting yourself up for disaster. Something terrible is going to happen if you do not stop engaging with all people involved. I think you are deeply in love with her and probably will take her back when she shows real remorse.

[This message edited by Deb346 at 1:16 PM, July 3rd (Monday)]

ChamomileTea posted 7/3/2017 13:46 PM

JMHO, but it sure sounds like the BFF's are working you.

It's your call, of course, but if you're really going to move on with your life, you're going to at some point need to disengage from the drama and adopt a "not my circus, not my monkeys" attitude. That should include the OBS and her impending divorce. That's not mean or unsupportive. Your role in all this is finished. You did what was required of you. Now, the important thing is you and your children.

((strength))

MidnightRun posted 7/3/2017 14:04 PM

He'll never take her back, that's for sure.

The salacious, utterly despicable tirade by OM2 is forever seared in his mind.

Few men can countenance that--despite WW attempts to downplay.

He knows that the marriage is dead, and needs only a burial plot with a proper head stone.

Keep discussions with WW succinct and all business--an approch she should have taken with her co-workers.

All the best Wednesday.

SI is here for you.

[This message edited by MidnightRun at 2:55 PM, July 3rd (Monday)]

ohforanewme posted 7/3/2017 15:29 PM

Hi all

Typing on a phone with thumbs covered in oil so will be short.

I absolutely know not to believe a word that comes out of that mouth. I honestly believe that the 2 good ladies are not complicit in some R plot but I would not put that past WW to be trying to use them in some master plan of hers. Did not really take any of dark compliments seriously. If I was that good would she ever have needed to find the fantasy elsewhere? Was worth a chuckle though.

I need to meet with WW to agree on how we break it to the kids on Friday. That is not something that we can do only through the attorneys. Realise the risk of histrionics and that is why I did not want to meet, just the 2 of us at home. Going for a public place. The agenda is a great idea. Will draft 1 and get it to her.

Thanks for explaining the meaning associated with the terms. Funnily enough I nearly called the car a sleeper but then was unsure of the terminology so described it instead.

Then I go and get the one that I do use wrong. Oh well, live and learn.

Will look up the clip. DSs all time favourite Utube clip is of a stock looking Nissan Juke nuking a Bugatti Veyeron to the quarter and only being caught at the mile.

Also, thanks for the concern but we are done. No going back on that.

ohforanewme posted 7/3/2017 15:40 PM

MidnightRun

I love your take! All of it, but most of all
"The war is over."

devotedman posted 7/3/2017 16:31 PM

If I was that good would she ever have needed to find the fantasy elsewhere?

Bzzzt! Wrong answer.

You are conflating two very different things: Your worth or ability and her brokenness. Stop that!

I know how it is and I understand your doing that. Spouses become an "us" and we treat them, think of them, as we think of ourselves.

ohforanewme, you married a broken woman who just hadn't showed flaws that you recognized. _Her_ unilateral decision to have an A does not reflect upon _you_, your worth, or any of your abilities.

Just as AP#2's decisions to cheat on his wife do not reflect one whit upon her abilities or worth as a person. You've talked to her, is she lacking? Would you suggest to her that she is somehow lacking?

Dude, you rock. Even assuming that your WW weren't a WW but just a W who divorced you because you two don't get along all that that necessarily means is that two fine people don't get along. Happens all of the time.

Now, do we all have things to work on about ourselves? Sure we do. None of those things is any excuse at all to cheat on a spouse.

ramius posted 7/3/2017 16:47 PM

Sounds like her rationalization hamster is on the wheel. And it's running fast.

Let her spin whatever story she wants to herself.

The reality is....she is a serial cheating liar.

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