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Wayward Side :
4 H's and 4 R's

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 wincings_sparkle (original poster member #27129) posted at 5:52 PM on Sunday, July 18th, 2010

This is not meant to generalize or offend in any way. All situations are different.

***Take what you need and leave the rest.***

Remember this is the only chance that you get to save your marriage. Staying with your betrayed spouse is a gift. It may only be given once. If you break it, it is irreplaceable. There are not a multitude of chances. There is not an endless supply of opportunity. There is not any reason to give you another chance in the first place. Treasure and protect this precious gift, it is priceless.

Adapted from "Just Listen" by

Mark Goulston, M.D.

The 4 H's

When you betray someone's trust at such a deep level you trigger in them: Hurt, Hate, Hesitation to Trust, Holding onto a Grudge.

1. Hurt - Not only have you betrayed your BS's trust, you let whoever you are/were having an affair with know just how little you respect your spouse. You trigger intense, savage hurt in your spouse. The BS can become physically ill and mentally devastated. They thought they could trust you and you have proven how untrustworthy you turned out to be.

2. Hate - After you have ripped a hole in their gut, mind and soul with a direct blow to their core, they have the right to become infuriated and enraged. It is usually the reaction, even if the rage is slow in coming. One of the things that is most enraging and difficult to get past is that during the time they suspected you were cheating and you kept reassuring them you weren't. Maybe you told them they were imagining things or being paranoid, you put them in an emotional blender. Either you were lying to them, you made them think that you weren't and that they were just crazy. Many spouses will choose to believe the latter, because believing you are lying to them is incompatible with them emotionally and literally. More enraging and difficult, they trusted you so blindly that they never thought you would think about cheating, never mind actually do it. Both change the BS's entire world view.

3. Hesitation to Trust - Your BS went against their own instincts and were willing to think it was their imagination and that they were crazy. Now, they are not going to lower their guard. Your BS believed that you would be faithful to them. They are not going to trust you again only to be re-traumatized. You broke the self confidence that they had in their own judgment.

4. Holding Onto a Grudge - Being hesitant to trust is a way of protecting themselves, but having to be ever vigilant is exhausting. Holding a grudge is a much less exhausting way to protect themselves. While holding a grudge is obstructive to repairing a relationship, doing so enables them to keep their guard up. They are fortified with/by their anger.

The 4 R's

In order for a person who has been betrayed to forgive, their 4 H's need to be responded to by the 4 R's: Remorse, Restitution, Rehabilitation, Request for Forgiveness.

1. Remorse - This is not the same as regret. Regret is saying, "Okay, I messed up. I'm sorry. It won't happen again. I promise, can we just move on?" Regret is almost insulting to the hurt that the injured party feels. In most cases it makes them feel worse, as if they're doing something wrong by not letting it go.

Remorse is feeling incredible and unbearable pain for having hurt your BS. By looking into their eyes, (you may have to plead with them to look into your eyes) you should be able to see what your betrayal did to them. Look, really look at your spouse. They might not see that you're seeing their pain and they might not see that seeing their pain causes you unbearable pain. Remorse should be painful and it should not be self serving. You should not want to help your spouse to relieve your own pain. Your goal should be to relieve your BS's pain as much as you can and expect nothing in return.

2. Restitution - Your betrayal cut your BS to their core and took something away that was incredibly important to them, the ability to unconditionally trust you. It took away the specialness of your relationship with your BS. Hurt may be satisfied with remorse if you are sincere in your remorse, but their hatred needs a payback. Your restitution needs to cut to your core as deeply as your betrayal cut to theirs. Maybe it's therapy (if you don‘t want to go), maybe it's public humiliation, maybe it’s ignoring you, maybe they will withholding affection or maybe it's listening to them continuously verbally berate you and vent until they've emotionally punched themselves out.

Restitution also includes:

No contact with the affair partner

Take complete responsibility for your actions.

A humble confession of the wrongdoing. Do not excuse your behavior. There should be no "If, and or buts". There should be, "I did this, this and this." Period.

Acknowledge your BS's pain and your family's pain.

Do whatever you can to right the wrong.

Ask what your spouse needs and follow through.

Verbalize that you will not ever have another A.

Answer any question with absolute honesty.

3. Rehabilitation - In order for your partner to overcome their hesitation to trust you, they will need to see you have changed the way you deal with stress. They need to see you deal with upset, disappointment and frustration in ways that do not include betraying them, abusing them, ignoring them and/or lying to them. Furthermore, they will need to see that you actually enjoy your new ability to deal with things in a healthy way. If they feel you have only learned a new coping mechanism to appease them and your heart is not into it, you really haven't rehabilitated yourself.

4. Request Forgiveness - You can't undo or take back what you did; all you can do is practice the first 3 R's - Remorse, Restitution, Rehabilitation - over and over again until you have internalized them into your personality. And that can take 6 to 18 months (If you are sincere-longer if you don‘t step up and do the work required of you.). At that point, you have earned the right to ask for forgiveness. If you want forgiveness before you have made the changes necessary to yourself, to insure that you will never have another affair, you are asking for cheap forgiveness. Asking for forgiveness early on is only to relieve your guilt and make you feel better. Betrayed spouses do not have to ever forgive you. They may forgive but they do not have to forget. They may let their anger and distrust go all at once or in increments as you continue to be consistent with the changes you have made in yourself. They may give you a second chance and you may truly begin to reconcile. That doesn't mean that they have to forget what you did. It doesn't mean that they will not hurt, trigger, or not have doubts.

If they are unable to forgive, they are responsible for their being unforgiving. The BS's ability to forgive is an act of faith. It is a gift to themselves as much as to you. They may forgive you and still not want to stay with you. That is not something that you can control. You can only control what you do. Keep practicing the first 3 R's. Number 3 should last throughout your lifetime. Maybe your BS needs to see that your changes are not just a sop. The need to be reassured of your sincerity may take a long time.

Recognize that rebuilding trust is a process, a staircase to climb, not an event.

Remember this is the only chance that you get.

*Any time that you break the 4 R’s:

Breaking NC

Betraying them again

Asking them to move on

Becoming defensive

Being uncommunicative

Lying about anything (even the color of your socks)

Making excuses

Blaming anything or anyone else

Falling back into old habits

You reset the clock. Any progress that you have made toward Recovery and Reconciliation becomes null and void. You may have just thrown away the only opportunity that you had to right your wrong doing.

You must start all over again. If your lucky and your spouse allows you to continue to try, Express your gratefulness for the opportunity.

Again, There are not a multitude of chances. There is not an endless supply of opportunity. There is not any reason to give you another chance in the first place. Treasure and protect this precious gift, it is priceless.

Redo the 4 R’s again.

I understand that some people may not agree with everything outlined above. There may be some objection to the wording or concepts. I found this helpful and posted it in the hopes that someone else may find it helpful as well.

"When you hold resentment toward another, you are bound to that person or condition by an emotional link that is stronger than steel. Forgiveness is the only way to dissolve that link and get free."
- Catherine Ponder
Me-FWW. BH-wincing_at_light

posts: 1615   ·   registered: Jan. 8th, 2010
id 4697507
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eyesnowopen ( member #28406) posted at 8:12 PM on Sunday, July 18th, 2010

BS here, I read this today and realized just how far my WH has come since our 2 D day. Thank you for posting it, I really needed this eye opening experience today

Me: selfish witch who didn't want three people in our marriage
Him: FT who thought he could have both of us and the OC too

Divorced..drama free...movin on!

posts: 328   ·   registered: Apr. 30th, 2010
id 4697695
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GeauxTigers ( member #28301) posted at 8:29 PM on Sunday, July 18th, 2010

Yes, thank you. My WW has a ways to go (don't we all!), but I was able to recognize that she has done quite a few of these things, and I think is working toward the rest.

This helps me clear my head of some of the "I'm doing EVERYTHING, she's doing NOTHING" thoughts that creep up from time to time. They're simply not true.

Thanks!

Sigh... how did I end up here?

posts: 1379   ·   registered: Apr. 18th, 2010   ·   location: Nashville
id 4697709
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lost_in_space ( member #24302) posted at 11:56 PM on Sunday, July 18th, 2010

Thank you for posting this.

I hope it doesn't sound to strange to say that when I read these types of posts it makes me feel like what I want and need is not crazy.

Me: BW 38

Last DDay: 7/15/09
TT: 2/28/11
TT: 3/5/11
Dday again: 3/10/2011
All Done: Better late then never.





posts: 3513   ·   registered: Jun. 7th, 2009
id 4698024
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AREYOUKIDDINGME? ( member #27864) posted at 5:03 AM on Monday, July 19th, 2010

I am a BS, hope it is okay to post.

All I wanted to say was, I think your post is absolutely perfect. Thank you for articulating what is difficult to put into words.

BW-Me 39
D-Day #1 02/09/09 D-Day#2,#3 03/28/09, 03/29/09....Trickled for months. 10 OW
Updated 6/11. Now Married 18 years, 4 boys, 2 daughter-in-laws, 2 princess's born, and 1 cowboy on the way. And the new dog that saved my life many times tha

posts: 365   ·   registered: Mar. 7th, 2010   ·   location: In a Black Hole just South of Hell
id 4698465
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inabadplace ( member #15721) posted at 9:23 PM on Tuesday, July 20th, 2010

You "get it", wincings_sparkle. You REALLY do.

Sadly, my FWW does not. Simply not cheating anymore isn't enough to heal the marriage. I think your post makes that clear.

[This message edited by inabadplace at 3:23 PM, July 20th (Tuesday)]

Me - FBS 40's
Her - FWW 40's
2 D-days
Married "a long time"
Two children
R'd for my kids, and I had serious doubts of success.

Updated to show that there is sometimes hope.

posts: 420   ·   registered: Aug. 10th, 2007   ·   location: NE
id 4701328
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prayformiracle ( member #22845) posted at 5:24 AM on Wednesday, July 21st, 2010

This is a great post. When I read it I see how far I have come and how much much further I have to go.

Iwantamiracle, you are my everything, I will love you always and forever. Life without your smile, your love is empty and sad.
I will not stop working on me on us, I will not stop caring, will not stop loving you, ever. Faithfuly and commited.

posts: 412   ·   registered: Feb. 13th, 2009
id 4702059
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 wincings_sparkle (original poster member #27129) posted at 5:32 AM on Saturday, September 4th, 2010

bump

"When you hold resentment toward another, you are bound to that person or condition by an emotional link that is stronger than steel. Forgiveness is the only way to dissolve that link and get free."
- Catherine Ponder
Me-FWW. BH-wincing_at_light

posts: 1615   ·   registered: Jan. 8th, 2010
id 4783331
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Threnody ( member #1558) posted at 2:38 PM on Saturday, September 4th, 2010

Excellent post. Thank you, wincings. (((w_s)))

“If you don't like my opinion of you, you can always improve.” ~ Ashleigh Brilliant
"Great love requires determination." ~ tryingtwo
"Don't try to win over the haters, you're not the jackass whisperer." ~ Brene Brown

posts: 14329   ·   registered: Jun. 6th, 2003   ·   location: Middle-of-Diddly, TX
id 4783619
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SierraGrace ( member #24259) posted at 2:57 PM on Saturday, September 4th, 2010

Thank you SO much for posting this (and bumping since I didn't see it the first time)! It is a wonderful outline for WS and BS! Sadly in my situation all I really got was a "get over it, etc."

ETA: Didn't even realize it was from July! Thanks for the bump!

[This message edited by SierraGrace at 8:59 AM, September 4th (Saturday)]

BSO(me): 60-ish! How did THAT happen? Was only 50-ish when I first joined in 2009!
Mom to rescued fur-kids
Formerly joined due to awful WSO and took a long @ss time to work my way out of that, but finally did January 2022

posts: 1578   ·   registered: Jun. 4th, 2009   ·   location: Sunrises to Sunsets
id 4783641
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kdny ( member #760) posted at 3:06 PM on Saturday, September 4th, 2010

I missed this the first time.

Its a great post.

Whether we remain ash or become phoenix is up to us.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Sometimes the fine line between a nervous breakdown and knowing things will be okay is a pair of furry pants~unfound

posts: 81335   ·   registered: Dec. 4th, 2002   ·   location: Slightly left of center, standing on my head
id 4783650
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MomToOne ( member #25022) posted at 7:22 PM on Saturday, September 4th, 2010

This is a great post.

I am gonna copy it out so my FWH can read it. We are a little over a year into our positve R, but there is so much good info in here.

It was good for me to read as it will be for him. Never hurts to go over things again.

Thanks for the post and the bump!!

Married 17yrs on Aug 21st, 2010
Dday #1 3/2007
Dday #2 7/15/2009 (got the whole truth this time, 1 LTA)
Working on R Positively!!!
~Though no one can go back and make a brand new start, anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending.~

posts: 493   ·   registered: Aug. 3rd, 2009
id 4783930
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Lost68 ( member #27515) posted at 8:48 PM on Friday, November 12th, 2010

Bump

posts: 1476   ·   registered: Feb. 9th, 2010   ·   location: Sevilla
id 4903571
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lordhasaplan? ( member #30079) posted at 8:53 PM on Friday, November 12th, 2010

BUMP

BS- Me (53)D-day: 5/18/10, lies and TT till (11/26/10). Currently in R. Don't carry others crap. It's your job to fix yourself, not your spouse.

posts: 2114   ·   registered: Nov. 10th, 2010
id 4903585
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stilllovingher ( member #29959) posted at 2:12 AM on Saturday, November 13th, 2010

really great post, ill be sharing this one with the wifey.

thanks.

The only difference between a butt kisser and a brown noser is depth perception.
I'm sure WAL would agree.

posts: 2427   ·   registered: Oct. 27th, 2010   ·   location: still BFE, but now BFE, CA
id 4903949
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latebloomer45 ( member #18021) posted at 2:51 AM on Saturday, November 13th, 2010

I think much of this is applicable to ME, the BS, in areas in which I have failed or hurt my H.

Thanks for posting.

Me: BS 56
Him: FWS 58
Married 32 years
Son-26 Daughter (Who Came out as trans, so now Son)-23,
D-Day #1 12/11/2007
D-Day #2 5/23/2008 fucking trickle truth!
Whatever Threnody said, I concur.

posts: 4697   ·   registered: Feb. 1st, 2008   ·   location: Midwest
id 4903979
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beenthere2? ( member #28554) posted at 7:08 AM on Saturday, November 13th, 2010

Thank you for bumping this, I will be sending it to my WH.

Me: BW 34 Him: WH 36
Married 10
Dday #1 5/15/10 claimed EA/just friends
#2 9/20/10 (admitted to kiss w/ same OW
#3 11/29/10 admitted to a lot more

posts: 3981   ·   registered: May. 18th, 2010
id 4904222
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need_hope ( member #23989) posted at 4:52 PM on Saturday, November 13th, 2010

I would really like to send this to my STBXWH. There is so much in here that I tried to verbalize and apparently wasn't able to. I don't want to engage with him but this is almost like you went into my mind and pulled out all of the words I tried to say.

Me - happily engaged to a wonderful man
XWS - no longer matters


Tact is for people who aren't witty enough to be sarcastic.
Don't fuck with me, I fuck back.

posts: 1999   ·   registered: May. 13th, 2009   ·   location: East Coast
id 4904598
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Lost68 ( member #27515) posted at 6:33 PM on Sunday, January 2nd, 2011

Bump

posts: 1476   ·   registered: Feb. 9th, 2010   ·   location: Sevilla
id 4989670
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BusyLivin ( member #30165) posted at 3:59 AM on Monday, January 3rd, 2011

STBXW never understood any of this. I sent her similar posts during what I thought was R and she just got angry. I know now that she never stopped the A, only got better at lying and hiding. IF you are a WS and read this, take it to heart. There is a great deal of truth in this.

"I guess it comes down to a simple choice really; get busy livin or get busy dyin."

I'm livin.

"What you do speaks so loudly that I cannot hear what you say." Ralph Waldo Emerson

posts: 325   ·   registered: Nov. 20th, 2010
id 4990640
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