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I have been feeling very disconnected lately because I don't feel like WBF and I talk enough. He has changed a lot in the last year and a half, he doesn't go out with the guys, he does things around the house, etc., but I don't feel like he has done much self-examination. I still see the anger surfacing here and there. He says that "maybe some people don't need counceling to change, maybe some people can just do it on their own", and he says he's done it. We talk about everyday things, but not really anything deep, and not about his A. It's not entirely his fault-I have a difficult time talking about it too. Most of the time when I'm needing to talk about it I will write him a letter and hope for a response.

We are in A season, so I don't know if that is making things worse or not, but the other day I was frustrated so I wrote him a letter and gave it to him last night.

See, the other day I came into the bedroom and he was standing on the bed fiddling around with stuff on top of a cabinet. When I asked what he was doing he said that he was just putting these arrows away up there (arrows that have been sitting elsewhere, not put away, for about a year). (during his A he bought a second fone and sometimes had it hidden in the house right under my nose, so the first thing that popped into my head, was that while he was just in town, he bought another phone and is hiding it up where I never look) It seemed odd to me, but I let it go. I kept thinking that it was weird, that he didn't put any of the other stuff away, but whatever.

Then later that night, I was still feeling just kind of crappy and a little anxious, I don't really know what, and he tried to kiss me. I kissed him, but only a peck. He asked-you don't want to kiss me? I said no. He laid there for a couple minutes, then fell asleep. 20 minutes later, just as I was falling asleep, he wakes up and starts trying to touch me and says that he was in the mood and wanted to have sex. I blew him off and said I'm sleeping. He was a ittle pissy, got up to go have a cigarette, and I fell asleep before he came back to bed.

So the letter I wrote him asked why he would wake me up to have sex after I had said I didn't even want to kiss him (I have told him many times before that when I am not feeling emotionally connected to him, I do not want to have sex), I wrote that I thought that was selfish and rude. To help explain why I wasn't in the mood, I mentioned that we haven't talked much lately, that I've told him all kinds of things that he could talk about (he always says he doesn't know what to say), I mentioned the arrows and that during his A he could come up with any excuse to cover his ass, so I just don't know if I should believe things now.

His response to my letter was to tell me that he really was just putting those arrows away and that he was sorry that he didn't say that I don't need to be suspicious of him, but that he thought it was implied that I don't have to be suspicious of him. I asked why it's implied, that he hid things from me before, and he got mad and said "so obviously you think I'll do it again". He then told me that it makes him feel bad that I see him like that. I told him that I can't just believe every word that comes out of his mouth-I used to, and he ruined that. Then he was just mad that I don't care how he feels. It made me feel like I'm the one who's being selfish because I just thought, too fricking bad! Sorry if I'm a little leary on ignoring things that I find a little odd, I ignored those odd things once before and found out later that I shouldn't have!

So I don't know, I don't even know if this will make sense to anyone, I didn't really explain it very well, but what do you think? Am I being selfish by thinking that I have a right to be suspicious and to ask questions, even if it makes him feel bad?

This dance we do so often about caring that they feel bad when they abused us is nuts sometimes. No, you are not being selfish... you are reacting to the hurt and anger at being betrayed. I understand... and so does almost everyone on this site unfortunately. You have been heard and are not alone.

Thanks, I guess it just irritates me that I don't feel like my emotional needs are being met, but yet he still expects me to meet his sexual needs. That was the whole point of my letter to him because it really makes me mad that I keep saying I need him to initiate some discussions and that when he doesn't I don't feel emotionally connected-but he still doesn't, and he still wants to have sex all the time and then gets pissy when I don't want to.

I do care how he feels, I don't want to make him feel bad, but isn't it unreasonable of him to expect me to just blindly trust whatever he says and not question it? I really don't want to be a fool again. It's not that I really think he was hiding something, but just that it was odd and I had to question it because I now know that he IS capable of betraying me like that.

It also really bothered me that his reaction was just to defend himself and then get pissy at me when I didn't just say oh, ok, sorry I asked. I didn't feel any understanding or empathy from him. (but then that's what he says about me when he said it makes him feel bad that I think he would do it again).

I completely understand where you are coming from. I have the same concerns. I told WH (not sure now if he is fWH) that I feel used if he gives me no affection (or words) outside of sex. I am now feeling empty and really done with not having my needs met. Read Five Love Languages. Maybe you WBF needs to feel love through TOUCH. Yours may be word, or service, or gifts. Worth checking out the book!

I'm trying to hang in there to the 6 month mark. I think I owe my 20 yr marriage and children that much. I've learned though, that I can not single handedly save our marriage. Until they own what they've done and that includes doing everything to restore trust (not getting defensive about asking questions), and actively work on the relationship, there is nothing you or I can do but work on ourselves, and decide if we are ok with the outcome...either way. If too much time passes, the strong ME may not want to wait around for this!

I don't get the feeling that he 'gets it'. You say he refuses counseling. That's a shame. Has he done any reading? How to Help Your Spouse Heal from an Affair? If not I highly reccomend it. It's very short. Very informational; What a good remorseful spouse acts like and what a non remorseful spouse acts like and how those actions are perceived by, and affect, the BS. Not all psychological at all.

No. You are not being selfish or too touchy or too grouchy or too anything, other than maybe too patient and too willing to let him carry on without making ALL the necessary changes.

It's his job to prove himself now.

Thanks, yes, he has done a bit of reading-how to help your spouse heal is the only book he's read and whatever posts I save from here on SI he will read.

He says that I'm trying to mold him. I look at it as more growth than molding, but whatever.

He says he's very happy with who he is and that he doesn't want to have to try to live up to my unreasonable expectations. He says he's a good person, although he's never really thought about what exactly a "good person" is because he doesn't judge people by what they do. (like I do, because I say a good person is someone who is nice and doesn't lie, cheat, or steal)

So I guess that's it. I will just stop pushing for him to look inside himself, I won't mention counseling again. I will continue to go to counseling and work on myself to be the best that I can be.

Sounds to me like it's time for you to make your list of R requirements and set the consequence for failing to meet them. Do not allow him to treat you that way. He sounds very self centered and entitled with strong gaslighting tendencies..

(((jost1125)))