SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I wish I had thrown him out. Toomanyregrets has it right. WH should have had to try to win me back.

With WH out of the house I could have healed myself without him making me feel worse.

I wish I would have walked away every single time his tone, action or words conveyed any degree of disrespect.

I wish I would have taken a backup copy of everything on his computer before he started deleting and NOT have been intimidated by his false indignation.

I wish I would have outed the MOW to her work peers.

I wish I would have taken out a billboard in her hometown

I wish I would have told my children so they would know that Dad hurt mom and not just think Mom is being mental from her Lupus.

I wish I had had more self respect

i wish i would have kicked him out and not let him come back until he agreed to all my terms.

i wish i respected myself more...rather than let him run the show during that time.

i wish i would have made decisions with my head, rather than my heart.

i wish i had worn my bitch boots back then.

Don't issue ultimatums. Even those you think you can absolutely stand behind. They end up just being threats. And threats don't work, hence ultimatums don't work. And who the hell wants to threaten someone to get them to stay in an M anyway? Boundaries are fine. "I will not tolerate acting out sexually." Period. End of story. A child needs to have consequences verbalized. An adult should respect boundaries on their own accord, not because of threats. And if they can't/don't respect boundaries, they ain't gonna respect threats anyway - so may as well go the safer-all-around route and state boundaries only.

And, god forbid, you change your mind on an ultimatum (almost 100% of us have, I'd say, given that we almost everyone said pre-A, "I'll leave if you cheat!") it plain sucks to renege on an ultimatum. It makes you feel like crap-ola, a doormat, a person with no held values. So I say avoid it and stick to boundaries instead.

Like many I wish I had of thrown him out. Even for just a few days.

In my sitch...he confessed even though I knew deep down inside. I had been making plans to leave the following month.

Rocky, I am not sure I understand the difference between boundary and what you are saying is an ultimatum.

I am dealing with an addict, I don't kid myself I have any hope of controlling his behavior! But, I know in my heart and he knows too that further sexual acting out is the end of our marriage. I don't think I have belabored the point but I mentioned it and he assumed it anyway (the man knows me well after all).

I *personally* wouldn't even be able to think about R unless I knew I could leave. And I do know that. I have done a cr*pload of really hard things in my life (a few probably worse than this), I am blessed with what must be a gene for emotional resilience, and I am financially independent. I think there are "lesser" relapses -- like viewing porn again and then promptly returning to treatment-- that I would tolerate. But, as I said, if it turns out he has been with multiple prostitutes or he acts out sexually again it is over. That is more dysfunction than I personally care to deal with and I have to look out for my kids' interests.

I don't see any reneging on the core boundaries. As I said, if that was at issue (lack of boundaries, paralyzing hope, etc) I wouldn't consider myself ready to think about R.

The very first time he LIED to me when we were dating...I wish I'd told myself:

"Dare, you don't tolerate LIARS - dump his ass and walk away!!!"

Just think of all the pain, hurt and turmoil I would have saved myself.

WOW!

I wish I would have scrolled through all the emails, copied the texts. I hate that he quickly erased some stuff that I'm still not sure he's 'fessing up to. He says he can't remember but an email might have jogged him memory a bit. I wish I would have left him before we had kids. I wish I never had to suffer this heartbreak.

If only life could come with do-overs. Wouldn't that be nice? If I could do it all over again, I would leave. That is what I SHOULD have done, instead of sticking around for months and months of lies, broken NC and other setbacks. I would have made him earn the right to be with me. I made it too easy, and now, two years later, I am still surviving, one day at a time.

If you are not yet 100% committed to R, ask yourself, what is it that you really want, for yourself? This is a time when it is ok to be selfish. I wish I would have been more selfish then.

By nature, I think ultimatums are meant to control other people. They are usually rooted in anger. Which, you know, we're allowed to be angry! But since the question was, what would you do differently...I wouldn't necessarily issue "control statements" from a place of anger. I, too, was slammed with addiction issues on D-Day 2 (alcoholism) and I think a lot of my feelings about ultimatums are rooted in that they don't work on anyone, but especially not addicts. So, what's the point?

Boundaries are - stating clearly what you do/don't want. And if you do XYZ that I have asked you not to do, then I will make my decision about how to respond. I guess I just don't see the need to say exactly what the decision will be. If you really, really want someone to know that you'll hightail your ass out of there - doesn't it become a little bit of a threat? Ensuring they know the consequences will be severe? Shouldn't they respect your wishes without the "scare" of consequences? Simply stating a boundary puts a firm line in the sand AROUND YOU and leaves control out of it.

Ultimatums may work for some people - and I'm not even saying you issues one. They made me feel like shit. Made me feel like an angry babysitter at the time AND it made me feel like shit because I didn't keep my word after the fact. No one thinks they are going to renege on ultimatums. I, too, am emotionally resilient and financially independent. Leaving would be a cake walk compared to what others might experience. And I reneged on the ultimatum that if he TTed, I would leave (TT revelation was my D-Day 2). I was desperate to get him to tell me the whole truth. I REALLY thought I would leave. Truly. But I also liked making sure he knew the crazy worst consequence was on the table. I thought it gave me the upper hand. Really, I felt it was sort of an insurance policy/denial. "Well, if he knows I will leave, then surely he is telling me the truth!" False sense of security - ultimatums can create that, too.

You know, I have't issued an ultimatum since D-Day 2. Not one. I know in my head what consequences will be - but I keep them to myself WH knows the boundaries. I don't care to control from a place of anger/righteousness by stating exact consequences to him. He can either respect my boundaries or not. Choice is his - and my reaction is my choice. And, interestingly, his understanding of my boundaries and complete desire to know them and respect them are far better after D-Day 2. All the ultimatums in the world after D-Day 1 didn't produce that! Then again, it might be the sobriety

[This message edited by RockyMtn at 7:18 AM, June 6th (Thursday)]

I would have started MC right away.

I am wondering what you all think worked well

1) Never begged...leave that to the WS

2) Made it clear to WH that I did not care if he stayed of left. If he stayed and did not like living with the rage, emotional roller coaster, the daily "interrogation", the sadness, the pain...he could get the @#$! out. He caused it.

3) Never allowed my WH to be anything but 100% accountable for the affair, which he was.

4) IC for both, immediately.

5) Told only the IC about the affair ~ it was difficult dealing with this alone but it was my choice and I NEVER had any regrets.

6) Book: Not Just Friends.

7) Never lived in fear of what my WH would do if I:

~said this,

~asked that,

~behaved like this...

I was true to myself, always. Again, I would just tell him, "If you don't like it get the %$& out" ~ He never left.

8) Let WH know that there is no "3 strikes and you're out" with infidelity.

ETA: 9) Purchased a VAR and secretly taped our discussions about his affair. I have him on tape detailing who, what, where. Saved anything and everything that proved an affair. I still have it all, in multiple places on multiple flash drives and cloud storage. I will destroy it when he dies, not a day before.

10) I wish I had listened to my mother.

[This message edited by RidingHealingRd at 12:06 PM, June 6th (Thursday)]

...it was like the 24 hour, 7 day a week SA Recovery Show in my house and it got hard for me to take. His IC and my IC both started rec'ing we start to see the MC. Their view was that the focus was still primarily on H's recovery but we would benefit from a space and some professional help to talk about how to cope at this early stage and to begin in a modest way the process of R.

Makes sense. I think it is VERY important that the MC talk with WH's IC so that MC understands the dynamics so that he or she can call your WH out on anything that is wayward or SA thought rather than healthy. I would hate to see you justifying normal and healthy behavior on your part only because it is being experienced through the clouded filter of a wayward or addiction thought and perception.

[This message edited by atsenaotie at 12:06 PM, June 6th (Thursday)]

Atsenoie, that is a great suggestion. Thanks! I am going to bring that up tonight as I think we might need to sign something for them to info share.

The MC was recommended by H's IC who is a CSAT (certified sex addiction therapist). I can't recall if MC has the full certification but she has training and a lot of experience doing couples work with SA -- she works a lot in tandem with H's IC. Knock on wood it will be on OK fit tonight. The therapists we need are so specialized that there are not many of them to choose from.

Thanks again everyone for the good advice and also Rocky for the explanation and advice!

[This message edited by cds22 at 1:46 PM, June 6th (Thursday)]

I wish someone would direct the newbies to this thread....

What worked:

I copied the DAT and main.db file for his skype chats and have them in no less than 6 locations, including at my brother's house.

I have never deleted any of them despite his badgering me for the last 13 months. And like RidingHealingRd, I will never delete them.

WH is rewriting affair history and he will say things that completely contradict what I know was said and done based upon his skype chats. I keep those logs to remind me of what he is doing and I call him on it all the time.

Some very good advice here. I, too, found this site well after DD...I, too, would have done things differently.

BUT, even if I had done things differently, we would still have ups and downs.

Find a way to regain your confidence and trust your instincts...two things that take a direct hit upon finding out about your spouses affair. Much of what is stated here speaks to how to do that again.

Prayer is something I HAVE done from the beginning...it really does work.

God be with us all.

i wish i would have kicked him out and not let him come back until he agreed to all my terms.

i wish i respected myself more...rather than let him run the show during that time.

This, for me^

I feel I was too easy on him, that he never really "bottomed out" and got hit with the consequences of his choices.

I found out when I was in our second home taking care of HIS elderly parents for a week vacation. He was in New York for business and then two nights of fun with OW. Saturday, he and OW flew back to vacation home town together. I knew something was up...he refused to let me pick him up at the airport. I should have followed my gut feeling. I found lots of evidence when he was out for a run. The first time I checked his phone, I found everything I needed and when confronted with evidence, he immediately confessed.

It all exploded on a Saturday night and the next afternoon we all flew home together. In retrospect, I would have stayed in our second home and not come home with him. The OW lives not far from our second home and I would have set up some sort of meeting and let him know about it. It would have been great.

I also would have checked the phone bills sooner so I would have had a better idea of the scope of the affair. By the time I found them, most of them were not online.

I also would have put a restraining order against her as she kept harrassing us at home as well as the office.

I would have told my H's secretary and boss. She wound up getting fired for poor performance, but I'm sure the exposure of the affair would have sped that up.

I would have been a better detective and put a VAR in his office and car.

I'm just saying...cause you can't believe a word the liars say.

[This message edited by crestfallen at 11:27 AM, June 8th (Saturday)]

I should have kicked him out after DDay#1, instead we tried to R with MC and he continued the lies, the A's and the escorts for 2 years. He actually got worse, he was like the energizer bunny. I should have insisted on being there when he was supposedly ending the A's (which he didn't)

I wish I had found SI before that.

Sometimes, I wish I had Divorced.

I would have been more selective in who I told...telling a couple of good friends was a good idea and they have been awesome, but I told an acquaintance and now it just feel weird to see that person. I was just in so much pain, I didn't really think about what I was doing. Also, on the night I discovered the affair, I immediately called my in-laws and they rushed over...my husband was out and the look on his face when he came home and saw his parents there...priceless! (Can you believe that he felt "betrayed" that I told his parents?) Anyways, be very choosy about whom you tell...because things can get weird!