SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Where do I find 180 ??

I'm a very loyal person and I almost feel responsible to make sure everyone else is happy. I don't even want to see him sad. I know I sound terribly wishy washy but this is all I've known since I've been a teenager. I'm a little worried because last time this happened and I did react- it was not a good situation at all. I know I can't fix anyone but if this is the end, I am worried about his reaction. Right now he is sad and keeping his distance. But I'm a little fearful of what comes after sadness.

Alex,

I see your frustration, but you can't go on living like this. You need to take some time to reflect your feelings. If you think he might do something to physically hurt himself try to get him into therpy, but if you think he will be sad and depressed. This may be what he needs to stop treating you like this or his next partner like this.

The 180 can be found BSQ&A: Here is the link:

What is 180 and how does it work? Submitted by Making It

It's in the Healing library to the left.

Good Luck, my friend.

We work together and today he is lashing out and told me he is canceling an event we were suppose to attend, and canceling a trip with kids cause he doesn't want to go with me or without me. A customer came in today and he started saying - oh there's your friend, now u can be friends, I know you talk to him. Then he said he is leaving and not able to work. He also said in not leaving early because I'll go to the gym and he isn't staying at work so I can go to gym. I take care of the kids from 330- bedtime. I just feel like he is trying to manipulate me. He said I've made him always feel irrelevant and that it's not his excuse but that's how he has felt. I still don't have any feelings. I feel like he is going to wear me down. I try to explain that we've been through this before and it's not fair to me. I feel like I'm suppose to stand by him although I don't think things will change. Our lives are SO entwined I don't see how this will ever end well.

Tried speaking at work which was a bad idea. He became very upset, crying, slightly mad- said he thought we were going to finally make it official by getting married now that it's legal- and he messed up, he said now we'll be lucky to even speak. Made me feel very bad. I am hurting but I hate that he is hurting. It still hasn't sank in. I feel like I don't even care and that I should just forgive and forget to make all this drama go away. But that isn't fair to me. He has cried and felt sad but with if he would have given me a disease or something. He didn't think if the consequences. Why do I feel bad. I should just have left and said screw u. Why am I so stupid. It's always drama anymore. I don't know how to escape it.

AlexFL, he is manipulating you with his immature tantrums. Don't let him do that.

I should just have left and said screw u.

From what you describe, yes you should have. Why haven't you? Why haven't you taken care of yourself instead of focusing on him? He doesn't deserve your empathy, so stop worrying about his feelings and focus on taking care of you.

I have no family here, financially I can't and that I always try to see the good in someone. I know it's terribly stupid and immature but I hate this and it scares me. I don't think its rational for me to think I could walk away and that world war 3 won't break out. I still care deeply and love him but enough is enough. Right ? You're absolutely right. Why am I worried about him. He wasn't worried about me. And I can already hear his insecurities coming out almost accusingly as if I'm the one that cheated. It messes with my mind. He said stop being a victim. I said I am a victim. I'm entitled to my feelings. I think I should not have to worry about where he goes when he leaves the house. I've never been in another relationship to compare. How do I know. Maybe I'm suppose to say " he's good in all other aspects but this infidelity thing" Should I accept that in my life. I don't make decisions alone. I've always had him to bounce off of. Now I'm being filled with guilt like its my fault for not keeping it together, or giving up on him.

Still feeling lost, not really sure what to do. I feel guilty although I didn't do anything wrong. I feel like I'm giving up. I don't want to live wondering everytime he leaves the house if he is being faithful. Everytime I checked, I found something. Makes me believe that there were many times I just didn't find out. Kinda feel in limbo.

I am feeling really down and worthless tonight. I'm starting to question my purpose. Been speaking to him and he has apologized but I just feel so down. I realize I am alone In this and I should stop feeling sorry for myself but it has affected me deeply. Still not allowing myself to really believe it.

My WS is a Serial cheater too and it's very hard to know what the right decision is. I can relate to what you are saying. You almost become numb to it. I sometimes feel like "everyone cheats, so I might as well stay with what I know". Isn't that a terrible way to feel? I'm not sure what to tell you because I'm going down a bad spiral myself and not sure what to think/feel anymore. I just wanted you to know that you are not alone. Definitely not alone. ((((Hugs))))

So sorrythatyouhave to be here. You are not alone. You are still n shock probably. Take care of your self and your kids. You will know when it is enough, and when you are ready to go.

Are you in counseling? I think it could really help you heal and sort things out.

You are not alone. You don't need to make him happy. You are also not responsible for his past choices. You are responsible for your own happiness, and for the health and safety of your kids.

Keep reading and posting.

I am definitely in shock - after last time and all the emotion and anger and sadness for him to do it again. I just want to say FORGET IT. There's nothing that I can do to change your behavior. Not consequence makes you think before u act. If he was a report card he'd be all A's and a big fat F. And that's why I still feel like I'm holding on. I honestly don't think he is a bad person and I do think that everyone probably cheats so why bother moving on. I'm not afraid to be alone. It's not fair. After last time it was so hard for me to forgive but I did. I dove back in, I let my walls down and BOOM this happens. Why do I feel bad for him. Does he have that much control over me

I realized tonight that I felt guilty to go to the gym... He was at the house with kids and I felt guilty leaving. Why do I feel guilty to go to the gym for an hour and he didn't feel guilty to have unprotected sex with someone for an hour. I'm stupid

Hi Alex,

I am terribly sorry for what you are going through and I went through something similar in a straight relationship. What I am going to suggest is only food for thought. It is not meant to replace the process of resolving your feelings but rather to perhaps draw out a structural map that might make sense.

I begin with a story about a visit to a friends home. They have a 6 year old and a 4 year old. I asked the 6 year old, "do you have a brother?" "Yes," he answered nodding towards his little brother. I asked, "does he have a brother?" He paused and answered, "no." And that makes perfect sense given the way that this little guy makes meaning in his world. He can't yet put himself in his brothers position to reflect that he is his brother's brother. Perfectly normal - developmentaly speaking.

Alex, I was like you in that I was developemntaly at that point (Robert Kegan calls) called interpersonalism. We make meaning in our world in the space between ourselves and the other - the relationship is more important than our sense of self (and boundaries).

You partner seems caught in the "imperial balance." The selfish adolescent who has difficulty with empathy and makes meaning based his "needs" being satisfied.

This is oversimplified for the purpose of an interenet message board of course. I would also urge that you read a bit on attachment theory.

In any case, it is time - even if it feels unnatural - to find you anger and let him worry about the relationship he has trashed - to take care of Alex. Damn serious, Sir. He is not taking care of you so you need to. Be gentle with oyurself, but be firm with your need to be healthy.

That sounds like something I need to read up on. This site is very helpful. Your post makes sense. I think reading up on attachment is what I need. We've been together so long. Do you have any suggestions on what to read so that I can separate his emotional needs and work on my own. (Detachment ?? )

Alex, what you are feeling is very normal. It is a roller coaster. Your feelings will go up and down at any given moment.

Detaching will help you take care of yourself and your children. You will be able to get stronger and stand up for your rights. Sometimes we get so bogged down taking care of others we forget our own needs.

Your ws is acting like he has the right to do this. He needs to wake up and make some changes. Please don't have unprotected sex until you are both clean. Drink water, eat healthy foods and by all means make time for the gym. It is easy to think that if we take care of ourselves our ws will turn even further away from us. Usually not true. We need to take care of ourselves even more when the shit is hitting the fan.

Hang in there. Hugs

Not only are the emotions a roller coaster but I'm having flash backs of other times I thought or suspected but now without a doubt I know. It makes me feel so dumb. Like when we left vacation and he stayed behind for 3 hours to have a few "quiet moments" on the beach. Or when he was gone 5 hours and said he got stuck in the sand and had to wait for a tow. Even if they seemed remotely believable I would not trust it was true. I know I turned a blind eye bc I convinced myself I didn't need to be a detective. I don't want to spend time or energy "figuring it out". We fought for it last time. We both cried and sober months working on it. And when I thought I finally could put my guard down I immediately find out I'm a fool. I have to go to a work event with him tonight. I am trying to not be angry but I want to scream.

Hi again Alex

I hope you are doing well as I type this and that you are finding some measure of peace amidst the chaos and pain.

When I wrote about attachment I was refering to attachment style as opposed to whether or not to remain attached. Nonetheless it is probably a good idea for you to stop viewing yourself in the context of the relationship for now and instead view Alex in the context of a supportive and basically good commuity of friends. e.g. detach. Here is an overview of the concept:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attachment_in_adults

One of the most common reports of people who are involved with a partner embedded in the imperial balance (an adolescent "selfishness") is to feel manipulated. The way this person makes meaning of the events and relationships in their life is something like; "This feels good and my needs are being met - he/she/it is good. That feels bad and my needs (as I perceive them) are not being met - he/she/it is bad." When Alex is angry, then I feel diminished and/or guilty, that means Alex is bad. While that stranger meets my need to feel attractive and powerful, so he is good. Just as the 6 year old I described could not see that he is his brothers brother, the partner in the imperial balance does not see the other person's "human-ness" and has rtouble with empathy. He IS his needs instead of HAVING needs - it is a subject - object difference.

Adults transition into an ability to feel empathy and hold both the good and the bad of someone in mind at the same time.

Can you two find a counseler or therapist to talk to? If so, I recomend it. If not, then protect Alex for now.

You totally make sense and I am so happy to see your response. It makes sense. I know there's something more to this and that it all isn't blk and white. I just don't want to be any ones counselor. He said to me tonight that he wishes he could make it right as he was holding back tears but we've been down this road. Last time it was 9 months of separation. I don't want to go thru this to end in the same place a year from now. I don't think I will ever want sex again and if I do I will never trust another person without a condom. I feel I've become hardened and without emotion. I obviously can not satisfy what he needs and at this point I don't even care to try. I love him dearly but I feel I've had enough. I'm not looking to be on a road to recovery. Been there done that didn't work. I know he isn't bad but I just don't think we are good I guess. I tried last time. I really gave it my all. He says I don't see him. I dont give him the attention he needs. So I say go find someone that will. I don't want to bend over backward anymore. I am a good catch. A very good catch- he was the love of my life since teen years. Now I am angry, sad and numb. He could have been honest. I know in dealing with someone who truly feels bad for their actions but he did before as well and it didn't stop him. I'm lost cause our lives are SO entwined. I actually like being with him but I can't try to convince him of that anymore. I'm not afraid to be in my own. I don't have the financials to support myself and the kids but I can. I'm a hard worker. I just feel so bad for him. I don't want to but I do.

I'm headed for a few glasses of wine with friends but I am glad I saw this. First, Alex, I am not trying to convince you of any course of action. What I offer are a few simple insights - and insights alone are fine but not "enough." No smoker lacks the "insight" that it is not healthy, right? But they are going to continue to smoke.

He says I don't see him

Utter bullshit. You have lived for him (based upon your posts) People like us feel "your pleasure is my pleasure. You have beeen manipulated in the past but establishing new boundaries.

I dont give him the attention he needs

People trapped i the imperial balance have a void in their center. Because they canot validate themselves they seek external validation. But there will never be enough. His work is to re-connect with the wounds that created that void. You cannot do that for him.

He said to me tonight that he wishes he could make it right as he was holding back tears

When they say, "What he doesn't know won't hurt him," they most often mean, "what he doesn't know won't hurt me." Right now you are separating, and I respect your decision. You may change your mind. My advice is that the decision to try again should be predicated upon his desire to grow up and accept your needs as equal to his own. His tears are likely (at this point) owing to the idea of losing his biggest supporter (and source of validation) rather than your hurt and pain.

Good luck Alex