SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Just wanted to post some encouragement.

I think it takes a lot to post your story here. I have to think the people in the wayward forum are some of the bravest people I know.

I wanted to also give you a heads up. Just from my personal experience.

He'll probably start blaming you for everything, whether he says it or not.

The car won't start? It's your fault because of the affair.

Out of milk? Yep you cheated....

He's going to have some irrational thoughts, but tough it out with him and just be there for him.

God bless.

[This message edited by Wool94 at 4:32 PM, February 22nd (Thursday)]

Hi Wool,

Thank you for both the encouragement and the advice. I appreciate both. I don’t know if it’s brave but I know the more I read, share, and respond to the more the lessons internalize and the better outlook I have. This site is a tremendous tool and I am glad it’s here!

Did you give him a full written timeline of the affair? How its started, when it went physical, how many times you had sex?

Don't underestimate the impact of the sexual stuff. That is huge for men and it will be the biggest source of the anger that is to come. How is your sex life with him right now by the way?

Are you being fully transparent with all your media, phone, computer?

Have you cut off all unnecessary contact with all males unless they are immediate co-workers or family members? You don't need to be having any male friends other than your husband. Seriously.

This isn't going to take just self-reflection and remorse. You are going to have to dig deep, find out your reasons for lowering your boundaries to nothing, and come up with ways to re-build those boundaries. You are going to have to change the entire paradigm of your marriage. The old marriage is dead. You killed it, dug a twenty foot hole and buried it under concrete. It is not coming back.

Do you have the patience and fortitude to build an entirely new relationship with your husband? It will take years. Five years at the least of hard-ass work.

Did you give him a full written timeline of the affair? How its started, when it went physical, how many times you had sex?

Yes, he has everything.

Don't underestimate the impact of the sexual stuff. That is huge for men and it will be the biggest source of the anger that is to come. How is your sex life with him right now by the way?

Yes, I have read a lot about that. Right now it's probably above normal in frequency, I wouldn't say HB, though there was a phase of that, and several other phases. We have always connected there, pretty compatible.

Are you being fully transparent with all your media, phone, computer?

Yes, nothing to hide there. He doesn't check much but he is in the IT industry and very familiar with a lot that I am not, so I am sure if there was something ever he could find it.

Have you cut off all unnecessary contact with all males unless they are immediate co-workers or family members? You don't need to be having any male friends other than your husband. Seriously.

Yes, I don't have any male friends. There was no one to cut off after AP.

This isn't going to take just self-reflection and remorse. You are going to have to dig deep, find out your reasons for lowering your boundaries to nothing, and come up with ways to re-build those boundaries. You are going to have to change the entire paradigm of your marriage. The old marriage is dead. You killed it, dug a twenty foot hole and buried it under concrete. It is not coming back.

I am aware that I have only begun the work. I have worked very hard to even get to the place I am now but I know there is a lot more to learn and much more evolving to go. Part of posting this was to see what I would get back to give more things to dig at.

Do you have the patience and fortitude to build an entirely new relationship with your husband? It will take years. Five years at the least of hard-ass work.

Yes, I believe so. I know I have only begun to understand the hard work in front of me. But, I also know that while that is happening a lot of good life happens as well and I want to share that with him. Holidays, kids birthdays, his birthday, trips away, quiet moments, taking care of him when he is sick, having him there when I am sick, hearing about his terrible day, his good day, fixing and eating dinners, and all the things you share as a married couple. It's been a hard time already but there are all these little things that I am thankful for...things I wouldn't enjoy the same way if he weren't with me. It's worth whatever hard conversation, the therapy, the reading, the answering questions on this site to strangers about our sex life. LOL. Okay that was just a joke...I thank you for your reply there is much here to reflect on, thanks for the time you took to write it.

You say it was an exit affair. Then your AP dumped you. And then you chose your BH due to having no other choice. How exactly is he not plan B? Especially when you say that if your AP would've broken NC, that you would've accepted the contact. That shows that you value your AP over your BH.

[This message edited by GoldenR at 7:24 PM, February 22nd (Thursday)]

GoldenR - that is a valid question. Logic when you are in the midst of an A is lacking to say the least, and I didn't explain that part very well either.

I don't know if I am using the word exit affair correctly for one thing. When the A started I felt it was a fling and treated it as such. The part where I started to feel seen and heard, I thought there was love emerging. And, I continued to believe for months after the A ended that I loved the AP. My thinking was so screwed up and I was so far disconnected from my H that I definitely was considering leaving even well after the AP broke it off. So that's why I think Exit Affair...I should really read more about the types.

I don't really love the fog theory. But, for certain you lack clarity and your thinking is completely emotional rather than based in any reality.

So, here is why I say my H is my first choice. Once truly faced with the idea of losing him, that was it. That was what popped the bubble so to speak. Had it played out in other scenarios, no matter the scenario when faced with the reality of really truly losing him, the truth and clarity of what I want and what I need is him would have emerged. So, even if the A had continued, and eventually I was the one with the first DDAY, at whatever point the reality of that would have hit, I would have known the same information. I don't know if I am explaining this well but I KNOW no matter how it played out once I got to the point I knew I was going to lose my husband there just wouldn't have been another answer.

It's true, the AP ended it, and I didn't want him to even though I didn't protest. I wanted to stay in that fantasy bubble for as long as I could. I was selfish, and wasn't rational in the least. But, I know when push came to shove I wouldn't have picked him and if I had it would have been a terrible mistake.

Oh and I should have clarified, if he had broken NC I would have complied, that's correct. But, there was a period in there that I hadn't confessed yet. So, I hadn't really had the reality yet. And had he contacted me I would have delayed confessing, so it would have gone on longer. Once confessing, and going through watching him in the days that followed, I would not have accepted contact, nor would I now or anytime in the future.

[This message edited by hikingout at 8:10 PM, February 22nd (Thursday)]

Hiking Out - you have three daughters from ages 18=25. How much have you told them? Assuming you have given them the "Cliff Notes" version, what has been there reaction? How is your relationship with your daughters now?

Absolution -

I left that decision to my H. We discussed it twice, the first time was shortly after DDAY, the second was around Christmastime before they came home. In both conversations, I told him that I didn't want him to decide based on protecting me, and in both conversations he said he felt it was about protecting them.

The youngest left for college right before DDDAY. None of them live with us or really near us so they haven't really be subjected to anything they would question. H said that if we were to stay together he doesn't want this to be part of their narrative. I have mixed feelings on it, but I do agree with him for the most part. Two are still in school the other just got married, them leading their lives unencumbered with the worry makes sense to me. I have told H he can change his mind at any time. He said that he felt if we were not to make it we would have to help them to understand that more but right now he wants it to be left be.

First off, I want to commend you for coming on this site and being open to everyone's views. You should know that I am a BS who is 6 years out and fully reconciled with my wife.

Part of what you say - and, really, part of what most WWs say who have reconciled - really bothers me. And I would bet that it's the source of the lingering difficulties that exist in marriages that are recovering from infidelity.

You talk about your husband being your first choice but follow with this:

if he had broken NC I would have complied, that's correct. But, there was a period in there that I hadn't confessed yet. So, I hadn't really had the reality yet. And had he contacted me I would have delayed confessing, so it would have gone on longer.

I admit that I will ALWAYS struggle with this explanation. If you were willing to continue the affair, and if you were willing to risk your marriage for the affair, then there is NO WAY that your husband could be your first choice. It's an oxymoron. And it's unfair to say that you consider him to be first choice AFTER THE FACT. You don't get to live your life in through revisionist history.

Why do I call this out? I'm not really sure. I've had to live these past 6 years that my wife discussed leaving me and was certainly in love with her AP. But I am her first choice? Why? Because her affair was discovered?

Why do YOU get to hide behind that "out?" Why are you (or my wife) allowed to use that false front - is it just another way to save face and not have to look your husband (or me) in the eye and say, "I'm sorry but I loved him more than you?" I get that you may love him more NOW... and NOW you look at your affair differently... and NOW you are discovering things about yourself - but it seems to me to be patently unfair to claim that your husband was always first. He wasn't.

Don't get me wrong - I realize that saying what I just wrote might be dangerous to any recovery. And I might be nit-picking... but it's an issue that really bothers me. After all, we talk so much about "complete transparency" and honesty... and, yet, is that comment really your being honest? Is my wife being honest?

So, I guess, I'm just complaining in general about something that, in the end, may not matter to those of us who have reconciled. But I just needed to add my 2 cents.

[This message edited by LifeisCrazy at 11:30 AM, February 23rd (Friday)]

Hi LifeisCrazy,

What you are saying is valid. And as a BS I can definitely see where you are coming from. And, I think it's hard for any BS to understand this, because that would mean that you understand what some people (not me) call the "fog".

While the affair is active there is nothing rational about it. And, you are right during that time I don't think any wayward could claim their spouse was their first choice or that they were putting their spouse first.

But, just like the fantasy bubble-land relationship they are having, nothing is real. Everything is about fueling the fantasy. And, when you leave the fantasy and realize what you have done, and realize what you would lose...your rational real thinking starts to return and you begin to understand your truth.

In essence, an affair is almost always going to end, that is the nature they can't keep existing under the circumstances from which they are born. So, I was trying to say no matter how it ended, no matter at what point the rational thinking came on, the truth is my husband would have been my first choice. You are right, it's hindsight thinking and that I wasn't considering him at all during or in the immediate time after the affair ended. But, when you return to reality, realize what has been done, you know the truth...you affaired down. You had a relationship with someone who had the same broken morals as you did, you were with someone who didn't know you yet praised every little thing you did, that person doesn't know really what you look like in the morning, or when you are sick. Doesn't have to deal with your bad moods, or deal with your individual flaws. That person "loves" the person they are projecting you to be.

My husband has seen me sick, give birth, succeed, fail, hangry, dealing with difficult relatives, and even have an affair now...and he still loves me. My husband has stood by me through thick and thin. He is honest, funny, loving, focused, and many things I will really never know the AP to be.

The reason that it doesn't make sense is because it could never make sense to someone who never stooped so low as to walk out on their marriage and experience the fantasy-bubble, have that bubble burst and then say "OMG, what the heck have I done?". But, I assure you, no matter how the affair finally ended, he would have been my first choice or I wouldn't work so hard to try and earn him back.

In reality there is always another choice. My AP or my husband are probably not the only two men in the world who would have me. So, I could get a divorce and eventually meet someone new. It could in some ways seem like an easier path. But, that's not the path I want. I don't want someone else, I want the wonderful man who married me and who puts up with me and loves me anyway....yes, I want that...whether I deserve that I guess remains to be seen. But, I will keep trying!

Hikingout I like what I'm reading from you. I think you and your husband may just make it.

Boundaries, boundaries, boundaries... Strong boundaries are the key to your recovery.

As for the sex talk, if you stick around here you will be asked some tough questions about your sexual activities with the OM. It is good practice to answer these questions, because your BH is going to have the same questions himself.

Livingwithpain,

I hope you are right about that.

I was only kidding about the sex questions. I think in a forum with this subject matter it's fair game.

Well, if you stay around as a steady participant (which I hope you do) you will have to run that gauntlet eventually, and some of the BHs here are merciless.

Hi hikingout,

Can you elaborate a bit further on your confession to your H?

I did not fear being told on, I could have kept it a secret. And, for a while I thought that I would. My IC even suggested that it would be better believe it or not. But, I listened to folks on here and I took the plunge based on the sage advice that you have to be willing to lose the marriage to save it. I knew after a while that my bid for emotional connection would be pointless without the confession.

Are you feeling it was a good choice? You could have kept it under wraps. Can you get more granular on how that conversation went with your H? What did you say? I'm amazed at how brave that was. I don't have the guts

After rereading your post again I laugh at how similar your story is that to my AP. Wow.

Lucky. I am not sure how granular I can get with it, some of it was a blur afterward because it was literally the hardest thing I had to do. Probably by the time I did it, I already knew I wanted to keep the marriage if he would agree to work on it and not ask me to leave. I had the benefit of some time in IC and while wasn’t completely out of the fog we out enough to be logical.

I waited until a long weekend in which neither of us would travel the following couple of weeks. And I just told him basically the stuff I said here. It took two days though to get through that much of it because he needed us to stop. Then he unexpectedly had to travel And elected to stay through weekends so he could have time to think. The rest of the dtetails probably were covered in the weeks that followed. i let him set the pace for that. We almost separated at one point but he kept saying we wouldn’t be happy either way. It was a very painful and confusing time.

I don’t know if I am glad for telling or if I regret it. That feeing is changeable. On one hand we are working hard on things but on another hand I may have had the same result without putting him through it. The decision to tell is a difficult one to make and I am of the belief it’s not one size fits all situations. In my case I simply couldn’t have moved forward. But the affair forever changed our marriage either way.

Thank you for that. This is all so hard. I found myself next to my W in church yesterday feeling a 50 lb weight hanging from my neck like a plow horse just wanting to free myself. The pastor tried to convince me that I was absolved from my sins and I said "ya right". I want to be care free like I used to be. It might be time for me to get to IC. I've feared it mostly. Thanks for sharing your bravery.

How is your H's healing journey lately?

It's up and down, as you might expect from the other posts you see around SI. We have periods of times that I feel like we will make it, and then there are stints when I feel his anger, distrust and it feels like we won't. We've just come through a pretty good month, with just a few meltdowns/triggers. You just kind of get through it day by day. There isn't a day that goes by that we don't discuss it, and I have learned sometimes my bringing it up instead of waiting for him has been helpful to him. I didn't think we were going to make it the first few months at all, it was a very dark time.

When we were young and before we were serious we had some circumstances that helped him know things that other guys on here struggle with. He isn't as hung up on comparisons sexually, etc. When I tell him that the physical part wasn't better, he gets that and most of the time believes it. I think a lot of BS's struggle with that. He knows that there is a different comfort level with long term relationship sex and knowledge about the other persons "buttons", nuances, that someone can't gain in a short period of time. I can honestly say we've had a great sex life, so for that reason I think it's clear that wasn't what I was seeking.

So with all that said, he hasn't really asked for a lot of sexual details. He knows it was a few times, and that we planned it. He knows there were lots of sexual and conversation texts, a couple of facetimes, and exchanging of pictures. Many of the pics were PG, but not all of them. When confessing, I let him take the lead on what he wanted to know about those details and descriptions of the acts themselves. He doesn't seem to want the nitty gritty details. There were a few things he did ask if we did but the answers to those were no. We did have a period where he didn't want to be intimate with me and when we tried it was unsuccessful, but that seemed to pass, we also had a period of HB, but that passed even more quickly. We've gotten back to normal in that area, maybe a little more adventurous/experimental in some ways.

Yes, there were and are things to work on in our relationship, but he's not felt blamed or that the inadequacy lies with him. Rather, I think he now understands my inadequacies and knows I am capable of lying and hiding for months on end...that's the crux of what we are having trouble moving forward on, understandably. He will ever trust me 100% because he used to, and I crapped on that. I actually never lied to him before, or hid anything from him but he does question that now. Sometimes when he digs on some things non-affair related it hits me that he is trying to figure out if I am lying about it, and I have started to recognize they are his version of triggers. They were hard to recognize at first.

The emotional aspect is what he asks for a lot details about and the area we cover over and over. I think he wants to know how I got so wrapped up, and I don't think that is something he can understand, or how I could jeopardize an overall good marriage for it. And, I think he knows that the emotional was the part that was important to me and that I was seeking so his pain lies in those details. His anger is in complements he knows I gave the guy, the fact I told him I loved him, secrets the guy knows...the emotional intimacy.

All in all, my advice to you is to get in IC. I can't advise you to tell or not to tell, I do understand why there are more on here that will encourage it than discourage it. It's definitely toothpaste you can't put back in the tube. I don't know if I would have come to where I could be at peace with not telling, but he suspected something already. I know if he would have asked directly asked me, I would have confessed at any stage he would have asked and knowing that he could still ask hung out there for me because I would not have been able to lie at that point.

I will say that there was some benefit of not having done the immediate confession...and that is I would have been a complete tool about it. I would have said a lot of things in the fog that would have been way more damaging. Yes, it was damage I didn't tell right away, but when I was completely mixed up in it I would have said a bunch of things that would end up really not having been true or rational. So, there is a double edge sword there. Because I went to IC before telling, he at least saw that I was committed to getting better even if I didn't tell him right away.

Basically, my telling was because our relationship was in the toilet, he didn't understand why, I was depressed and he didn't know why, and so the lying was still going on and there just was no end in sight. So while I never really worried about being "outed", what we were going through would have been cruel not to go forward with a confession. I don't know if that all helps, but I thought more about it and wanted to try to share more details if I could.