SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Quick rundown of the A: I had a 3 month long affair with a man at work my husband hated. I now have the same feeling towards this man. The thought of him literally makes me want to vomit. My BH had known the OM since middle school and always warned me that he was sneaky and a liar. WHY oh WHY didn't I listen? Everybody at the office liked him and I thought maybe my husband was overreacting. We worked together over 3 years before anything happenned. I always thought of him as just a friend. THat's it! He was easy to talk to and a few weeks before the A started, we started talking about our marriages (which i now know and will always know is a NO-NO with the opposite sex). I never considered him anymore than that until he kissed me one day at the office. It got me thinking about how he always listened, took my side about things, gave me compliments, etc. I let myself be blinded by these things. Because it was the devil that had taken hold of me at this point. I turned into a person I don't even recognize. for 3 months, i lied to my husband, my family, my friends... I was a descipable awful person. My husband found out about the A and it was awful. But as crazy as it sounds - he saved me. He saved me by digging enough and finding out what was going on. He brought me out of the tangled web of lies and sin I was living in. This all happened 5 months ago. At first he was adament about a divorce. But after the first few days realized that's not what he wanted (although there have been several occasions since that he has thought again that's what he wanted.) Things have definitely progressed over these past few months. I have been transparent and answered all his questions - even the ones that were unbelievably hard to tell him. Our good days then are now our bad days which makes me feel like we are making progress. And when things are good - they are REALLY good. We are closer than we have ever been, more open about our feelings and depend on each other like we never have before. BUT when things are bad - they are really bad. We used to could only go 2 good days before we had a bad day. Lately we have been able to go a week before we have a bad day. These bad days consist of "reality" hitting him as he says. The reality of what happened sets back in and he starts asking questions again. I try my best to answer them but there are a lot of times that I honestly can't because i don't remember. I didn't count the number of times we kissed, or the number of times we said I love you, or where his hands were while he kissed me, or how long an email was on a particular day. I try my best to remember but I know subconciously, I have suppressed a lot of what happened. When I do have an answer for his questions, I have a problem of getting worked up when talking about it. It's because when I talk about it, it brings it all back and I hate that person I was. I start talking rapidly and with my hands. And I know my voice raises higher than it normally is. I try not to let myself get like that. I know it just makes it worse because it only makes him more mad. But I have a hard time talking calmly about it because it does bring up so many emotions. I don't want to remember all the details. i don't want to go back to where that girl (me) was that I don't even recognize now. I have turned my life back over to God and my family. I want to move forward. I know the healing process takes time. The remorse i feel for what I did is overwhelming sometimes. But I love my husband and will do whatever it takes to make this marriage work. I almost lost him. I almost lost my family. I had a brief flash of what life would be like without him and it lifted the fog faster than I could have ever imagined.

So, I have rambled a lot more than I intended. Sorry about that. My question to all the WS and BS, how long does the anger last? And when I say anger, I mean breaking things, screaming in my face, name calling and awful, awful digs about the A. When my BH gets to that point, I just sit there and say nothing. Maybe that's not the right way to respond but when I try to respond, he finds a way to turn it back around on me or scream some more awful things at me. And I also want to say that before, he NEVER talked to me like this. He was a good husband. I screwed up big time and hurt him like I never could have imagined. I know that he deserves to vent his anger. But I need to help him find a better way to vent or something. The way it is now, it's not good or productive for either of us or our marriage.

ANY suggestions or guidance is appreciated. And also, I am prepared to be hit with any 2x4's if necessary.

(((ashamedWW)))

I have been in your shoes and I nkow what you are going through. There really isn't a precise answer to your question. Everyone is different and heals at their own rate. Keep in mind that anger is the easiest of emotions to show. I'm convinced that my BH shows anger more than any other emotion out there! Not just since the A either. Sometimes thats how the hurt comes out. Hurt and anger go hand in hand.

We are nearly 4 years out from Dday and there are still days my BH is angry. He doesn't express it like he used to (the screaming in my face, name calling and awful digs about the A. I have experienced also.). Don't get me wrong, there are WAY more good days than bad now. When it does come up it's basically just a reminder that I hurt him and that he just can't figure out why.

I guess my point is this .... you are going through the worst of it now. Keep in mind that it will get better. Remind yourself of what you are fighting for. Keep being 100% transparent and keep answering his questions as best you can and honestly. Thigns will never be the same for the two of you but that doesn't mean they won't be good. Your marriage can end up stronger and healthier through all of this. Keep doing what you are doing. I know there were times that I could tell the A was on my BH's mind. I would go to him and say to him "I know I have hurt you in the most horrific way. I know I have put our marriage and our family on the line and I am so very sorry for that. I love you with all my heart and will do all that I can to fix the things I have broken." I think he really appreciated that.

God bless you in your journey through R and good luck.

[This message edited by Kaitlyn at 12:00 PM, July 21st (Thursday)]

So sorry ya'll are going through this. I am the WW as well and we are 11 mos out. My BH is a very laid back guy so he has never acted out very voilatile to me but I can tell you that the anger he feels is still very much there. We have our good and our bad days as well and from everyone I have talked to that first yr is very hard. Most ppl have told me it takes 2 to 5 yrs to really heal from an A.

I also became a person during those 2 mos that I didn't recognize and that I hate to think about. I almost lost my husband and best friend and my family and it hurts so much to think how close I came to that. Like I said before, my BH isn't a screamer or throwing things type person but his anger and hurt is still very real, just in a calmer way. Has your H gone to IC? It sounds like he could really benefit from some therapy. My H refuses to go but I have made an appt for myself for next week to try and help me deal with all this.

I feel for you and your BH as this is the worst pain anyone could go through. Hang in there!!

Ksitlyn : Thank you so much for the encouragement. This is the first time i have posted after reading through all the different posts for the past 2-3 months. It's good to know there is an end to this type of anger. And it's good to have support and someone who has been there to guide you through.

ashamedWW...

It's important to remind yourself that your H doesn't hate *you*...he hates what you did.

My H yelled ALOT at me...it was awful and like you...I sat there and took it, because really, I didn't think I had a choice. And I highly doubt your H is enjoying any part of feeling so out of control and hurt.

It will pass and it will get better with time...but I know how depressing this stage is. Anger is a powerful emotion.

I'm glad you decided to post

AWW,

I know it can be very difficult to be subjected to angry outbursts. I just hope that you have told your BH the entire truth and have not engaged in any trickle truth. My WW has never once told me the truth about her A although I already know 99% of it and she never has shown any remorse or guilt about either her A or more importantly the most unimaginable pain that she caused me. Because of that pain I would trigger often and would go in into a yelling rage at her.

You sound like you are remorseful and want to work on building a better stronger marriage. Your BH is fortunate. His hurt and pain is what causes his anger and it may take some time. I am 2.5 years from D Day and while I don't have my fits of anger I am still in alot of pain because my WW just wanted it all to go away and never has recognized the hurt she has caused. One of the best things that you can do is tell your husband that you recognize that you have caused him the most agonizing pain imaginable and that you are truly sorry and will do whatever it takes to help him heal. You should do this with some frequency and ask him how he is doing and if there is anything you can do to help.

It would have made a big difference if my WW would have done that because I would have calmed down. Instead she reacted to my anger with equal anger and/or silence which only made matters worse. It showed clearly that the A was all about her and that I was on my own as far as healing goes. She simply cares about herself and not me. You make a point ot show your BH that you care about him and that he is the most important person in your life period.

When he has his fits of anger, tell him you know he is acting out of pain and you will try to answer everything only when he is calm. It is not good for either one of you to be around each other when he is in one of those rages. I know I have had them myself. Simply tell him that you understand why he is angry and that he has a right to be and you want to help him but can only do it when he calms down. Then go to another room and allow him time to cool off.

I get that you may not remember some trivial details such as the length of an e-mail on any given day or how many times you may have kissed. However, let your husband know that while you cannot remember you will try hard to recreate a time line from start to finish and include as many details as you can remember. My WW is the master of providing a non-answer. When I asked how she and her OM came to get naked in bed together, she would always say she doesn't rember what kind of underwear he had on. That didn't answer my question and I don't really care what kind of underwear he had beause he certainly wasn't wearing any when I found them together. The point is to make certain that you are answering his questions truthfully and as fully as possible. Omitting any details is still lying to your BH. You and OM should have no secrets from your BH.

Your BH is in alot of pain but if you make a point to voluntarily tell him you know he is hurting and will do whatever it takes to help him it will go a very long way in helping ease the anger. There will come a point in time that it will stop but it is still early for your BH and you will need to be patient. But I do wish my WW would put the effort in that you are. Hang in there.

PR

Because every personality is different it is impossible to say how long the loud, shouting, venting part of the anger will last. Like Texasgirl's husband, I am laid back and never did any shouting or name calling. But the anger was there and it doesn't go away quickly. You should expect that it is going to dissipate gradually over time but that time frame will be measured in years and not in months. Hopefully as he becomes more in tune with the reality that it is something he is going to have to live with and get past (and understand - he will never "get over it" -- he will learn to get past it and live with it) he will be able to better control the anger.

And I want to comment that not fighting back, at least at this stage of the R process, is the best move you can make. Fighting back leaves the impression that you really don't care if he is hurting and so just staying quiet is best. The only thing that I would insist upon, if I were you, is that he never berate you or call you names when/where the children could hear. That is a fair demand and really as much for their benefit as yours.

The anger phase varies in length and, from my experience, came and went over time.

Have you thought about sitting down and trying to write out a timeline for your husband? This may help him with his questions. He also may be asking the same ones over and over to make sur that you are being truthful with him.

When arguements are getting really heated just try to remember that you are the one who put him in this place and that you MUST do everything and anything HE needs to help him heal.

Are you in MC and/or IC?

[This message edited by sadskittles at 12:35 PM, July 21st (Thursday)]

Hi. It may be a good idea for you to read about the stages of grief. What BS's go through is very similar to losing someone we love. I think that while we can feel angry at the beginning and for many years following the A, there is a period of time (and about 5-9 months is what I remember) that is the anger phase and is completely normal for many if not most of us. The shock has worn off and anger really sets in. The only piece of advice I can give is do not try to defend or justify your actions in any way. Please take responsibility and really listen. Try mirroring what your BH is saying so that he knows you have heard him and understand what he is saying.

The absolutely best thing you can do.... Is what you are doing.

Sitting calmly while he gets it out is so very important. Don't walk away. He needs to get it out. Its a poison, he needs to drain it. Acknowledge that he has every right to be angry, and apologize. Help to clean up or clean up anything he broke AFTER the anger is over. Hug him when the anger is over, reassure him that seeing how much pain you have caused him hurts you also. That you'll never do this to him again. Ask him what you can do to ease his pain. Watch for triggers yourself, don't hope he'll not notice. Go to him on your own and tell him that you're sorry for the disrespect you showed him during the affair. Tell him that YOU think about his pain daily and are there any time any place any where to comfort him.

I know I feel closer to my wayward when he , for lack of a better word "joins" me in my pain/anger. Not saying that I want him angry also, but that he shares the horrible experience of it. It aint pretty to watch, and I guarantee you it is even worse to feel.

I would also like to add. That the times I get like your husband are the times when the enormity/reality of it hits at once also.

There isn't an hour that goes by that some aspect isn't in my head. Much easier to handle. But when all the betrayals (and in an affair the betrayals are numerous not just one) rush in at the same time....... The pain is so freaking much....it overwhelms. I guess anger is the quickest way to dissipate it.

Now is the time to show you will be strong for the both of you. You're right on the money...sit there and take it like a big girl.

It will help if you learn to mentally separate the things he's saying into categories of

1. yes, I deserve that because I had an A

and

2. he just feels the need to hurt my feelings right now...because I had an A

Note that the second category is just a subcategory of the first, but it's important to know what things not to let into your head too much. Thats how you keep your emotions in check during a verbal ass-whipping.

Whatever you do, DO NOT get defensive when he's venting. Let me say that again...DO. NOT. GET. DEFENSIVE.

It won't last forever, but I wouldn't start circling dates on your calendar just yet. He needs to get it out. Let him.

BTW, remember, you deserve it. You brought it on yourself. So did I. So did every WS on this forum. As long as it doesn't become abusive, you deserve to hear and feel every bit of his anger. Use it to reinforce the fact that you will never hurt him like this again.

I don't mean for this to sound harsh, but it's what works for me. I really do wish the both of you all the best as you try to heal from this together.

I am a BS, but you requested responses so I believe this is okay.

First, in response to the stages of grief. Please know, although a similiar feeling of loss is present, when aloved one passes away, usually, they have done nothing to actualy cause you the pain you are feeling. It is extremely difficult to look at a person you love and know that, even though now they are remorseful and wish they could take it all back, they intentionally caused you all this pain.

As far as anger, for me, sometimes it does appear just because things are good and it doesn't seem fair that a WS is getting away with it (and I do know you suffer your own demons, but for us it seems hard to imagine that life can go on). I screamed and yelled and threw things, and once in a while I still do. I told him I hated him for what he did, that he ruined my life and many, many other horrible hurtful things. I did and said this because I love him and I am angry (not an excused). If I didn't I would be angry and I would have just left. I couldn't tell you how he reacted during the fights, but later, when I apologized for being so irrational he would always tell me that I had nothing to be sorry for because this was all his fault. Even though I didn't believe this and repeatedly told him that his bad actions and choses do not justify mine, it did make me feel better. I am not a negative person and I believe bad circumstances and bad choices got us all here. I wasn't innocent in the circumstances that led us here, but again, that doesn't justify what he did. Being sorry, admitting you were wrong and that you made the worst mistake of your life goes a long way. Let him know that you respect and love him for the gift he has given you by giving you this chance. I believe one day he will realize that if you are truly remorseful, you pain is no less than his, in fact maybe worse because you did this to yourself and to the man you love.

I hope this helps and did not come across judgemental because it was not meant to be.

I am a BS. We are 3 weeks away from our first antiversary. I went through the rage phase for a few months. It started about 5 months in and lasted until about the 9th month. I was furious. By the 5th month my shock had worn off and I was just starting to realize the depth of the betrayal. I was ANGRY. I said some terrible things. I broke things. I regularly had mini bonfires in the garage where I torched a shirt he wore in this pic,or a hat he wore in that pic,etc. I have never,in our 12 year relationship,ever been that angry. Actually,in my entire life Ive never been that angry. And for the most part,WS took it. All of it. My anger has subsided. It is still there,sometimes,but not nearly as bad as it was. I know it's difficult to hear him say the things he says,but it's important that you do HEAR him. The worst thing you could do is get angry back,or defensive,or walk away.

[This message edited by confused615 at 3:22 PM, July 21st (Thursday)]

I will share with you, as someone who speaks from your husband's point of view, that the anger felt is one of the most profound types of anger available to humankind.

Expect that he will never love you as deeply as he ever had, nor will he ever care for you the way he used to. Just looking at you will bring him disgust. Imagine having to live with someone you can't stand to look at, let alone lie down next to? it's horrible.

Everytime he looks at you, makes love to you, laughs with you, --even during the good times-- you will trigger his memory. And the pain will re-ignite instantly and without warning.

Realize that it may it never work out. You gambled and lost. There may very well be some long term consequences.

You have a long, long, arduous uphill road to walk. I hope you have a thick skin, endurance, a good pair of boots, and a helmet.

(We're 3yrs out and still struggling. I've reached breaking point, and it no longer hurts me to think that it may very well be over).

Much luck to the both of you....sorry you had to learn the hard way...

BTW, remember, you deserve it. You brought it on yourself. So did I. So did every WS on this forum. As long as it doesn't become abusive, you deserve to hear and feel every bit of his anger. Use it to reinforce the fact that you will never hurt him like this again.

I agree with LRH. Every WW here made their choice. Now it's time to deal with the consequences of that choice.

As for how long the anger will last - that is very dependent upon your spouse, the level of honesty (and perhaps detail) you have provided, how transparent you are, how you are interacting with your spouse when he becomes angry and whether there has been TT (and if so, how much). Being defensive, snippy and getting angry yourself only adds fuel to the fire. In essence, he is venting, you react to his venting and in turn he reacts to your reaction.... it becomes a circle.

The fact that you can recognize how you are reacting to your BH is a step in the right direction. Now you need to figure out how to keep yourself from responding in your typical manner. It is your job to do whatever you can to help your BH heal, to feel safe... to give him whatever he needs. That would include letting him vent. My BH never threw things or called me names (although he wanted to); he did throw jabs (daggers really). I sat/sit here and take it. That's my job. I made my bed and now I'm laying in it.

Have you considered that this is his way of distancing himself from you ... in an effort to push you away because he may be fearful of getting hurt again? He needs reassurance that he was not second choice and that you are capable of hanging in when things are tough - and will be there for him.

(((AWW)))) Things will get better.

(sorry, slight t/j - CBH: I'm not going anywhere )

BS here...

Anger is really a secondary emotion...it is a cover for something else. I am willing to bet, that your husband's genuine feeling behind the anger, is sadness...pain. It is easier to express anger because it doesn't show what could be considered weakness. Opening up to you and expressing his sadness may be very hard for him. We often think showing our sadness is a sign of weakness...of vulnerability. Yelling and throwing things gets his point across without being vulnerable. It is probably very hard to show you his vulnerable side because you hurt him and he doesn't feel safe with you anymore. Try to show him that you are a safe person to talk to...that you are incredibly sorry. My husband helped me heal the most when he cried with me...that was like glue that helped stick us together.

When I was going through that phase, I really thought I was angry. I was steaming angry for about 6-9 months. But it wasn't really anger so much as sadness and disappointment that I expressed as anger. I would get in a "oh poor me" mood and then I would sink into a pit where I expressed my sadness as anger.

Perhaps you could tell him how sorry you are yet again. Tell him that when he cries or talks calmly to you, it gets his point across better than when he yells. You would have to approach that subject carefully, because he may just want to scream that you can't tell him how to feel. Perhaps you could tell him that you don't know how to respond when he yells and that you will start going to the other room...but if he wants to talk about his feelings in a calm manner...you will stay and listen for hours. You know your BS better than I obviously, you would have to judge how receptive he would be to this idea. But it is not okay for him to scream and yell...no matter what you did. A few times is understandable...a habit is not. Just because you made a mistake doesn't give him a free pass to be mean.

WOW! I am overwhelmed by the responses. Thank you all so much for the advice and support. I feel so alone in this situation sometimes. It gives me hope to hear many of your stories.

I have been honest with my husband. no trickle truth. There are times that he has asked questions as we have gone through things (esp. the first 2 months or so) that I would answer and he would get furious because it was something I hadn't told him. These type things he would ask would be details I never even thought about until they came up. But I always answer and I always answer truthfully when asked. I understand that I made my bed and I now have to lie in it. Right now we are going through a spell where he is disgusted with me. Heck - I disgust myself. Nothing new has come out - I think just the reality and gravity of the awful things I did come rushing back all at once sometimes. That is usually when he has his once every 1-2 week rage outburst. It happens that way to me too (not the rage - the reality and gravity of all that I did hit me at once). But the problem is, when things hit me like a ton of bricks and I feel like pond scum and want to curl up in a ball in my closet and cry for the next day or so, I don't. I feel like i don't deserve to have these feelings. I need to be strong for him and my girls. Because I DID THIS - not him. And I sure don't feel like i have the right to put my hurt on my husband. He is going through enough as it is. But here is where we run into another problem. He feels like because I don't talk about my hurt, that I don't hurt. The time I reveal my pain the most is when he's hurting too. He feels like that I only hurt when he's hurting. Now, let me say this - that is NOT the case. There is not an hour in the day that doesn't pass that I don't grieve the loss of the innocence in our marriage. That i don't feel like a rock is sitting in the pit of my stomach when thinking about the pain I caused my husband and my family. There is not a day that goes by that I don't think "I don't deserve my husband after what I did" (and i know that i don't). I hurt but it's a different kind of hurt than he's feeling. i know that I could never even begin to grasp the pain he's going through no matter how hard I tried. But God only knows that if there was a way to take that pain I put on him and put it on myself - I would do it in a NY minute.

We are seeing a MC and the MC also does some IC when we need it. We live in a small town and the nearest counselor that is worth anything is 1 1/2 hrs away. So it makes it hard to do both. Sometimes we set up a two hour appt and split it up where we both meet with him for 30-40 minutes individually and then together the remainder of the time. This is our second counselor and we really like him.

I am going to try and do a better job of not getting so worked up when he starts asking questions. But let me ask this - if I sit there and calmly answer them in this monotone voice, i feel like he will think it was all insignificant? Like I have no feelings toward the situation. When in fact, it is something that brought me to the lowest point i had ever been in my life. So it's hard not to let my emotions get the better of me. BUT i know i've got to.

Showing emotions is a good thing. But.....sorry about the but.., If you say things like "i'm an idiot, I destroyed everything, why did I do this". It can come across as you being concerned about how this is making you feel, and taking the focus off of his pain. It's such a balancing act, it really is hard. You should be able to express those feelings to your husband. Its just more appropriate to express them when you are down, and ask for his support.

I know that is when I turned a corner. When I was able to see his pain seperate from mine, not a reaction to mine.

Try to be strong when he is hurting. And be strong enough to lean on him when you are hurting. For myself, having my husband reach out to me for support meant that I was the most important person in his life.

But let me ask this - if I sit there and calmly answer them in this monotone voice, i feel like he will think it was all insignificant? Like I have no feelings toward the situation. When in fact, it is something that brought me to the lowest point i had ever been in my life.

Handling it calmly does not mean showing no emotion. It means not getting defensive. It means expressing an understanding of why he feels so hurt/angry and telling him how sorry you are, and how you wish you had never allowed yourself to do that to him.

I don't know if this will help, but my IC believes my difficulty expressing my anger is holding me back. The fact that your BH is able to do so (when it is still early days) may be a positive for your recovery in the long run....