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AAS

I have read all 49 pages of your thread and just wanted to say that you can add another one to your HUGE list of supporters around the globe backing you up.

Your sitch so similar to my brothers in that your STBXWW and his now XWW are cut from the same cloth. He has been where you are, she got him kicked out on false DV charges and moved her AP into the house 2 weeks later, and he didn't see his kids for 6 months, he had a year to wait while the criminal charges went to court on which he was rightfully acquitted, and he has been through the child court system in the UK too, trying to negotiate with women in these mind states without the court is fruitless, and although the child court system is very daunting for dads, it definitely was the lesser of two evils for him to gain and maintain regular access to his boys. He has them now regularly cast in stone in the form of a court order, and has them just 4 days less than her over a 4 week period now. He has had to fight fight fight for it, and there were times he felt like giving up, but he kept going and got more time with his boys by doing so. His divorce was very similar to y

How yours is going with lots of unreasonable and contradictory behavior on the WW part, let her solicitors make a fine £ out of her stupidity.

You are wise to have asked CAFCASS to visit you in your home with the boys present, it's widely advised on fathers forums that are in the court system, otherwise they just tend to visit the mother in the home and not the father, which I feel is wrong. So I'm glad you did that.

My brother had a variety of judges, some better than others, but overall, like I said has been able to achieve almost 50/50 custody via the courts. Both his boys still feel it is unfair that mum has a few extra days than dad, and he has told them that when they are a little older in a couple of years that they can speak up for themselves as they will be older (7&5 currently) and that their wishes will be taken into account more by the important man or lady at the court. He has had his final hearing but I think will revisit in a couple of years when what the boys want will be listened to more due to them being older. I'm sure by then his ExWW will be even more doo lally (if that is at all possible after all that's happened) and that the boys will yearn for the stability of dad more.

I hope you are going for a "shared residence order" and not just a "contact order" . my brother got a SRO on his first session at child court, just 3 days after being acquitted of the false DV charges. What a week that was. He worked out the days he had seen them from DDay to the first court hearing, and it amounted to something like 19 days with no overnights at that time in 365, so it was not looking good for her. He has had to del with his crazy ex WW wayward mother, her affair partner, and all sorts of "Jeremy Kyle" antics (the equivalent of jerry springer for our US friends) but has stood firm in the face of it ALL and has come through the other side, still healing but getting there. He has now moved back into the marital home he was removed from, and having paid off the exWW she's downsized to a rented rabbit hutch with her AP, is fast spending the payoff to try and maintain the unicorn fart land experience but she looks shit on it on the odd times he sees her at the school when she does stalker drive bys on the days he picks them up from school.

Anyway just trying to give some context, and thinking of you in the upcoming court date. You will get there eventually with your boys, it's good already that CAFCASS have noted the ownership factor your WW displays, not good for her.

Easier said than done at times and when your fatherhood is in the hands of the system, but when in the courtroom stay as cool as you can and let her swing and show herself for who she is. I'm sure she'll be getting some smack downs from her perch in the upcoming future, and coming from a judge sometimes is the best way, then they know they can't keep fucking around.

Sending you light and strength in the days to come

MM

Thanks Mountain Momma,

It's reasssuring to hear a positive outcome. My children were handed over to me last night for my regular Wednesday night contact. The boys were happy and excited and immediately mentioned that they had spent some time with 'a lady' who talked to them about mummy and daddy.

The boys were keen to point out that they don't have to tell mummy and daddy anything about their meeting with the lady as it is 'secret'. Inevitably, over the course of the evening and early morning little nuggets were divulged which left me feeling reasonably confident.

I'm also now aware that CSTBXWW has been bad mouthing me to the boy, presulmably in an attempt to gain sympathy with her children or in the hopes they would mention it to child services.

I'm glad that she visits us on Saturday morning.

CSTBXWW reluctantly had to take her bicycle and photographs last night and the look on her face and was a picture. Gru also looked angry.

Deep breaths.....

Sorry I'm late to respond on this (wish I had seen this two days ago to suggest it):

To prevent CSTBXWW getting access to the home I have had to offer to hand over many of our family photos. This meant I spent an hour last night trawling through 19 years of memories. Holidays, relatives, friends, pregnancy, family, pets and wedding pictures. Hundreds of pictures. Such a sad loss. She has no such sadness, it seems.

Kinkos/Fed-Ex has a photo scanning self-service that takes perhaps 30 minutes to scan 100 photos to a CD; I'm doing this with old family photos so that all of my parents' children can have copies of this precious resource. I was able to scan everything from the very large 8x10s to passport photos. Do them one at a time so that each photo can be reproduced at Walgreens or Wal-Mart. It's super-easy to just email the file to the store any time you want a print.

If you haven't already turned photos over to you, you don't have to suffer any loss at all. Just do it, and give her ALL the photos. You will have a digital storage of everything anyway.

If you've already turned photos over to her, you might request at your hearing that you would like the photos back long enough to do this so that each of your children can have this legacy. Do this with the remainder of the photos you have and as a gesture of good will at the hearing, tell the judge you have already prepared a copy for her of the photos you kept as part of your share and you're willing to do the work on the rest so she doesn't have to do anything but return the photos she took last night.

I did 5 CDs for my family in a matter of a couple hours. The hard part was labeling and naming the photos once I got home from Kinkos. It cost me less than $30 to do all five CDs because the scanning was self-service. It would have cost me less if I had remembered to take a USB card with me.

[This message edited by k8la at 6:29 AM, January 30th (Thursday)]

Thanks K8la,

When my CSTBXWW demanded access to the house to get the photos it was one of her more transparent acts of provocation because she took a hard disc full of photos the day she moved out. She had no urgent need for them.

There were only a few hard copies that weren't on the disc and they were her pictures from school that I wasn't interested in. I also gave her some books and a few bits of wedding memorabilia that I didn't want.

I won't miss those pictures and I've kept her out of my 'safe harbour', for now. She has started threatening me that she will force me to sell the house. She's getting desperate and I will sell everything I've got to keep the home, if it even goes that far.

I'm feeling confident today.

[This message edited by allatsea at 12:15 PM, January 30th (Thursday)]

I'm feeling confident today.

Good! What a difference a day (and a visit from your boys) makes.

This?

I'm also now aware that CSTBXWW has been bad mouthing me to the boys

Mis.Take. That's a bad move by the CSTBX no matter what way you look at it. She shouldn't be laying that on the kids, the social services won't like it, the judge won't like it either, but worse for her, the boys won't like it. I've said to you before, kids grow up. They start to see things for themselves aas. They get to feel comfortable and secure when they're with you. They get to do childhood things and relax without having to worry about you griping on to them about adult things and what a bitch their mum is. You just carry on as you are aas. Give them that peace and normality because I think they are going to need that going forward. Leave her to dig herself deeper into a hole of her own making.

CSTBXWW reluctantly had to take her bicycle and photographs last night and the look on her face and was a picture. Gru also looked angry.

Aww. Shame on you for spoiling their night aas! Why didn't you just give them the keys to your house.. there might have been something else they would have liked to take... you are such an old spoilsport paving over their paradise like this....

AAS, were they angry because their ultimate goal is to get possession of the house? Or angry because they had to take the items thereby not having a reason to antagonize you?

k9

[This message edited by k94ever at 8:33 AM, January 30th (Thursday)]

Just wanted to pop in and wish you mojo for Feb. 1! From everything you have written, I am feeling very confident for you, but I know how anxiety producing all this is when the stakes are so high for you and the boys.

I have long work days today and tomorrow so I wanted to make sure I let you know there are many people who will be thinking of you and your family, even if we are not there posting.

Thank you all. I almost feel co-dependent on this site for support.

K94, She was angry because she didn't get to enter the house, she didn't get to control the situation and Gru had to load the car with a bicylcewhilst the rain was coming down hard. Not to mention that she had received a 'do not communicate directly with me' letter earlier in the day. She demonstrated her 'power' yet again and texted me last night. Nothing heavy but spitefully worded just to show me that she will not obey my instructions whether they be through solicitors or otherwise.

I can definitely tell that she is escalating in advance of the hearing. She must be getting anxious. I seek the comfort of my SI family whn I'm anxious whereas she starts to fight like a caged animal. How different we are

[This message edited by allatsea at 9:06 AM, January 30th (Thursday)]

Thinking of you and your boys...

...Knowing you will pass your 'inspection' with flying colors!

Aas, wow have you grown since page 1. Impressive stuff brother.

Good luck 2/1! I'll be praying.

Just popping in to send mojo and strength for your visit this weekend, it will be good. Your WW I feel is feeling like she's beginning to loose the control which they HATE so just keep carrying on as you have been with your head held high, outwardly calm and together when dealing with letters etc. I'm sure you are but photo all txt messages and file so a trail is able to be shown should yOu need it with regard to her ignoring the no direct contact request letter you sent. She's desperate to get a rise out of you, as you know the more u ignore the more she'll dig herself into a hole!. Nice!. Your doing great. Keep us all posted, were rooting for you.

MM

AAS, I will be thinking of you tomorrow and hope all goes well. FR

Just read the full thread. I'm so impressed with how you've dealt with everything for you and your boys. I hope the visit this weekend went well for you

Thanks Devoted, You're very kind

Well, it all went very well on Saturday. It's quite an awkward situation because no matter what you do it can't help but feel contrived. If I make lots of effort it looks obvious and if I let the kids do what they normally do on a Saturday morning the woman from CS would have to be in two places at once. Fortunately the boys were on good form and we built lego and played a board game. Then we went out onto the street to play with pedal karts and scooters. The CS lady told me she had no concerns whatsover and could see no reason why I shouldn't see my boys.

She did make reference to the interview she had with the boys in the previous week where she said that the boys said they didn't like to be smacked. To put this in context, they are normally very well behaved so they rarely need smacking so it might happen once every three months or so when they've stepped out in the road without thinking, for example. Even then it's limited to a clip round the ear or one smack of the bum. Either way, CSTBXWW has sown the seed into the boys that smacking is wrong on all counts (despite condoning it when we lived together) so it's now at the forefront of the boys mind and they mentioned it to her.

I suppose it's inevitable that if a child is given the opportunity to complain about a parent they would cite smacking, being told to tidy their rooms, doing homework, eating their vegetables and going to bed as things that they wish parents wouldn't do. In and of itself, this won't influence the decision of the CS and judge.

Overall she left perfectly happy. I'm quite confident that I will see my children a reasonable amount of time.

Phew!

Having read this entire thing as once, I just can't help the feeling that WW isn't happy with OM, and now sees what a mistake it was. She has somehow transfered that anger towards you. However I also get that she would never admit that and will stay unhappy just to prove she was right. Its the only thing that makes sense. Its almost like your WS and she is BS the way she is acting out.

Just my opinion for whatever its worth.

2yrs,

Yes, the behaviour's are totally reversed. If anyone should be bitter, angry, sad and using the children as a weapon, it should be me.

CSTBXWW even calls me a narcissistic sociopath. It's like she's looking in the mirror and sees my reflection

She did make reference to the interview she had with the boys in the previous week where she said that the boys said they didn't like to be smacked. To put this in context, they are normally very well behaved so they rarely need smacking so it might happen once every three months or so when they've stepped out in the road without thinking, for example. Even then it's limited to a clip round the ear or one smack of the bum. Either way, CSTBXWW has sown the seed into the boys that smacking is wrong on all counts (despite condoning it when we lived together) so it's now at the forefront of the boys mind and they mentioned it to her.

Aas, as (hopefully) your friend can I offer an opinion with only your best interests at heart? Smacking is such a very hot potato and causes so much debate and bad feelings between people who view it differently to each other in general, that I'd advise you to be extra cautious about this one going forward. In the interest of honesty and so that you know where I'm coming from I must say that I was never smacked myself as a child and didn't smack my boys either because I emulated my parents in disciplining them - but I also don't claim to know what's right or wrong for anyone else other than myself or what's right or wrong in every instance either - I'm not talking about anything other than this specific case... but I just want to say to you that in this specific case, because you do have a very vindictive ex who's not above using low tactics and defamation of character in her determination to paint you as the 'baddie' and bring you down, (think of her accusing you of rape) that I'd be cautious about using smacking as a future method of punishment if I were you because I think this has the potential to get a lot 'hotter' from this point forward - especially as it seems she's already raised this issue with the boys themselves and the social worker. She agreed with the discipline before but now she's with Gru says she doesn't - that all just spells out potential for future trouble to me aas - Trouble that you don't need. (and I hope I haven't offended you saying that aas)

Anyway.... on a much brighter note...

The CS lady told me she had no concerns whatsover and could see no reason why I shouldn't see my boys.

and

Overall she left perfectly happy.

This sounds great and very promising. Roll on February so that you can get this custody and divorce all legally determined and binding so that you can start moving on.

Hi Sins,

Yes, smacking is very contentious. It will divide any room in two.

Even though I am 'allowed' to smack my if it is done with the right intent, I have reassured the CS lady that I won't do it anymore. However, the judge cannot penalise me.

But I personally think that children need the threat of it, on occasion, in order to curb their behaviour. You only need to look at the state of our school system to see that children don't fear anything anymore!

Sounds like it all went well. Good job. Try not to overanalyze after the fact. (I know, easier said than done.)

(despite condoning it when we lived together)

I can count on one hand the times I have had to smack my kids, smacking in my case defined as a quick spank on the rear-end.

But I clearly remember back when we were a family and DS totally out-of-control, STBX screaming, "Do something! Hit him! I don't care!"

I am not even criticizing STBX for this. There were some hard times with young children and no help. But I am thinking that if she pulls this card--as yours has, AAS--how ironic that the rewriting continues. Misleading statements and lies. It's all they've got.

This thread is now closed.

I've opened a new one in divorce and separation

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=521799

Thank you for all of your support

[This message edited by allatsea at 2:53 AM, February 7th (Friday)]