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^^^THIS!^^^

For the record, my husband hasn't masturbated (on his own ) for just shy of two years. If he feels frisky, we talk about it. He knows what he has to loose if he decides to go solo.

Hurt2Deeply is expressing her limits when it comes to her marriage and has every right to feel the way she feels towards her situation. If he is self gratifying in place of intimacy in the relationship, it's the equivalent to having an affair with his hand.

The issues lie with the WH in this case, not Hurt2Deeply. I might be reading incorrectly but I get the impression a lot of posters are putting this baggage on her and it's her responsibility to get good with it.

It's surprising to me how many BS's on this thread are ignoring the actions of a WS who repeatedly rejected his wife sexually in the past and seem to me to be minimizing her feelings about it.

Unless your H has a serious sexual deviance (child pornography or sexual assault), I think it would be really challenging to take masturbation off the table.

Speaking as a WS who was diagnosed as a SA, I find statements like this very offensive. As myself and a few BS of SA stated, abstaining from masturbation is a common practice in recovery. There is no reason to link it with "serious sexual deviance". These attitudes are not helpful for a recovering addict or their spouse.

There have also been a few women on this thread speaking for men and the male perspective in general. I haven't masturbated for going onto 2 years now and my sex life has never been better, more intimate, passionate and fulfilling.

I really liked the idea of him doing it in front of you if he feels the need.

This is a deal breaker for us. This whole disaster spiraled from WH watching porn and masturbating. The porn use started very slowly and escalated while I was pregnant with our first child. It became so obsessive, that his brain essentially was "rewired" into quick hits of dopamine where sex was nothing more than self gratification.

Enter porn style, over-sexualized OW, and two years later I discovered I had the answer to why WH could no longer even get an erection with me (if I could ever even get him to TRY and have sex with me). He had himself so twisted, that he no longer even associated intimacy or love with sex. He actually mentally deleted our entire sexual history... I have to remind him very specifically about hot sex we used to have - he literally has no memory of it.

It has been a very painful road to recovery and it is far from over. With the work of our MC and his CSAT, masturbation is off the table for him. It is too much of a slippery slope. The only sexual gratification he currently indulges in is healthy, intimate sex with me.

Hot topic for me, as I never understood anyone's issue with masturbation or porn before this mess. It's great for those of us that have a healthy outlook on sex overall, but now I totally see the other side as well. I hope that you are able to work through this!

My husband told me he thought he was a Sex addict when we started counseling. I do not know that the therapist called him one.

I took him seriously when he told me that. I still do.

Is your husband reading Patrick Carnes? Going to a 12 step group? Finding help online or with a therapist? Abstaining from getting high doesn't mean anything. Alcoholics have the term dry drunk, where you aren't drinking, but still talk, think, and act like an alcoholic.

My H is a recovering SA, acting out with porn and compulsive masturbation.

My husband was 32 when masturbation was taken off the table. Assuming he lives into his 80's, that's a good 50 years of not spanking the monkey.

So far, DH has gone 5 years without it. He's still breathing. His testicles have not spontaneously exploded.

If my husband wants to remain married to me, there is no masturbation. I have no intentions of living with an active addict. I've BTDT and have the t-shirt. I don't have another recovery in me.

Consequences can be a bitch sometimes.

I thank you for your help here. The support has been what I needed. I appreciate hearing from people that get it.

Things have been going well in our marriage. My H did more things to R than I have mentioned here. I know faithfulness to our marriage is the life he wants to lead.

I believe if he lets himself get started on his former destructive behaviors he could get to a very bad place again. As I said I will not be his wife if he goes back. I would much rather hold him to a higher standard than him go back to his depraved lifestyle and we lose our marriage. We are actually very compatible when he is not acting out.

I especially thank those of you who understand my feelings and position on this. I think it depends on the circumstances. Sexual/intimacy anorexia is very painful.

I have to way in on the no masturbation in your situation. I was in the same situation with my H. He would self gratify himself but not be intimate with me.

I only feel masturbation is acceptable when a spouses sex drive is very high compared to the other or during a time a long dry spell due to physical issues(ex. illness, apart, injury).

You need to be firm with your spouse and stick to your boundaries.

This porn issue ... is a problem with me as well. Every day in the morning, he gets up early to visit his porn videos. At first I used to get upset, turn it off, maybe a small argument. After a while, I stopped arguing about it, just turned it off. He says it's nothing, it means nothing. I say he is obsess with it.

Now that he confessed of having 3 sexual encounters, when he gets back in 4 weeks, that will be a deal breaker for me. No more porn. Period.

I was on my phone yesterday when I responded, so I wanted to go a bit deeper.

My husband was a compulsive masturbator. Yep, there is such a thing. He would do it 4-5 times a day, in addition to sex (regardless if it was with me or one of his AP's). He would do it to porn. He would do it in his car to and from work. He would do it AT work. He would do it in the driveway at home late late at night (think midnight) before coming to bed with me. He would do it anytime, anywhere essentially. He'd surf his porn on the computer, on his phone, on our kids computer.

When DDay#2 happened, all of that came out. He was I denial about his SA (we'd seen a psychologist 6 months prior) for quite some time until that day when all of his affairs, and the above came out.

He went to an intensive SA therapy workshop for 3 days, and SA 12-step meetings 3 times a week until he was employed again, and now it's once a week.

Again, in the SA world, masturbation is highly discouraged as it contributes to the compulsive thoughts and compulsive behavior. It takes away intimacy from your spouse, and it desensitizes them to real intimacy. In fact, often it's encouraged to go 3 months without sexual intimacy at all (solo or together) in the beginning to rewire the brain so to speak.

My FWH WANTED the no masturbation boundary for himself. I encouraged and supported him with that. In show of my support, I chose (my choice) to not fly solo either. We reserve that for each other now. Now, what we do together...no limits on that. Well, we do have one "rule" no sex where we can't look each other in the eye. We need it to be emotionally intimate as well. And not being able to look at each other can contribute to that "fantasizing" that he used to do. So, no doggy, etc. for us. Again, that was something he decided. I support it fully. We still have many many positions available for us though and make good use of them. Our sex life is much more fulfilling than it ever has been. WITHOUT all of the addiction stuff between us.

Sorry, wanted get back to this thread but, ya know, real life needs to be dealt with. I already expressed that the agreement that WH & I have agreed to is masturbation by either one of us, includes each other. I love the ideas about pictures/ videos to be shared if we are apart because WH does travel for work but they are usually short 1-3 day trips. He will go out of town soon & I will send him some pics/videos as a nice surprise and we have never tried phone or Skype sex, so I am all for trying something new! I will also freely admit that there have been some early mornings when WH woke with that morning stiffy, that while I was in the bed while he took care of his needs, I prolly wasn't very active, if ya know what I mean! Still, I knew it was my breasts and lady bits that he was looking at while he did the deed! Best of luck to all of us while we negotiate the masturbation equation:) Welcome PM's from anyone that needs a friend. All the best Jamie

[This message edited by JamieMc at 2:34 AM, May 12th (Sunday)]

Lots to read and contemplate on this thread. Thanks to all.

We talked about this Saturday. He said he was sorry and that he felt badly he let himself down too because this is one of his own commitments in R.

As I said he has avoidant behavior so he has not initiated sex with me since. When I mentioned it to him tonight he said I was upset with him so he didn't think I would want too.

I believe he needs to bring up a discussion of it with me rather than avoid me. He can not stand conflict so he will ignore me to avoid it.

Sorry more of my long-winded take on this issue. @ Hurt2deeply, sounds like our WH's are quite a bit alike. Mine will do almost anything to avoid conflict & that has caused many problems during our M that had nothing to do with sex. Finances, children, splitting up chores, you name it, we have had problems because he won't discuss concerns and then is resentful after the fact. I also struggle with the masturbation issue in that we are both at least 50 years old and if he masturbates, he was "good" for a couple of days, meaning if I wanted to make love he wasn't willing or able. We try to be intimate 2-3 times per week, if we are on vacation/ free from stress, we can usually make love every other day. So, if he were to masturbate twice a week, you can see where that becomes a problem. We have reached the age where we both agree that quality over quantity matters most and we have a firm agreement to be intimate twice per week, unless illness or travel interfere, and at least half the time we have sex 3 times per week. I think at our age, he is in no way deprived. When he was acting out sexually with porn and strippers, we would go weeks without because he was "too" tired, stressed etc... In reality he was masturbating every other day and had little to no interest and/or ability to achieve gratification with me. Sorry so long but this has been a major problem we have had to work through. All the best Jamie

Communication! I think the no masturbation alone boundary is doable. And I think it might be worth the time and energy to explore whether he is a sex addict, in order to understand how important the no-masturbation boundary is. But it is okay for it to be a deal breaker for you regardless. But it would be better for there to be discussion, communication. He should be comfortable coming to you to tell you when he wants to masturbate, and involving you in it, if that is okay with you. A skilled marital counselor could really help at this juncture. This is hard stuff to talk through, especially depending on how you were raised and socialized.

Thinking of you. Stick to your needs and desires. Don't settle.