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Trying33... Thing is I really don't care what is on her FB. I didn't even friend her during the A. But there is that word Curious... such a bad word.

Hardlessons... that is exactly what my wife said. I think the second time was curiousness. I still would not have clicked if it was not there. Still not an excuse for doing it. Then not telling my wife. As far as she is concerned, it is the same as breaking contact.

Here's the thing July, being curious would indicate there are still feelings or interest or concern, whatever you want to call it.

For me, there is now a clear distinction between giving a shit about what he's doing (xAP) vs not caring and being indifferent.

I felt compelled to check before as it was still a connection. I know, for me, I'm getting closer to indifferent as I don't even want to know what he's doing. I don't want to pollute my mind with the ongoings of HIS life.

Why were you curious????

I still would not have clicked if it was not there.

So did you do the exact same search as the first time? Sounds like you went exactly where you wanted and then got busted. I feel that would be breaking contact too.

Trying33... Yes I thought about that as well. At first I thought maybe I still cared about xAP. But I really don't, that is why I just left the page as soon as I went on. But looking at my actions I can see how it would look for my BW. Being that I have lied so much in the past just proves to her that she can't trust me. I just want to get myself better so I can help her.

Hardlessons... The second search I was searching my last name and I put in the first 2 letters. Which are the first 2 letters of xAP's FB name. I know, I deserve to be questioned, hell I would question it to.

just fyi, you can block someone from YOUR FB page. You do not need to go to your xAP's. It is under your privacy settings.

I know exactly that feeling of doing "xAP research" when it is simply madness. I hate that I gave her, an empty & broken vessel, some sort of magic voodoo power over me, due to constructing a fantasy realm so warped it replaced reality. If it wasn't her, it would have been any of 1000 other potential AP's. Whoever it ended up being, I ended up creating my own special, secret drug and found my own special, secret addiction. Sad thing is...I did all this eyes wide open. And my low self esteem and need for external validation have never been lower than during this twisted charade.

just fyi, you can block someone from YOUR FB page. You do not need to go to your xAP's. It is under your privacy settings.

JD is right, I forgot about this. It has been over two years since my wife and I blocked the OM and a whole slew of other people that we also cut out of our lives. Thanks, JD.

Yeah, thanks guy's figured it out. Just googled it. I am still trying to tame the shit storm I created from a couple moments of weakness. When you feel so low, why is it that we crawl lower than digging up and out. So much work has been done and now we are back at square 1 because I decided to click on and click off twice. I mean sometimes I don't even understand my actions. I just feel so foolish and wish I had a real reason for this. Keep digging I will. Thanks for every ones replies.

When you feel so low, why is it that we crawl lower than digging up and out. So much work has been done and now we are back at square 1 because I decided to click on and click off twice. I mean sometimes I don't even understand my actions. I just feel so foolish and wish I had a real reason for this. Keep digging I will.

I can relate to the self-loathing that follows weak thinking, poor decisions, and even poorer actions. And no one is harder on me than me. Just the fact you're admitting a mistake, owning it, and rededicating to self-reflection and growth IS a positive sign. I f^cked up big time recently, and as much of a setback as it was, it was also a catalyst for admitting some things that hadn't made it into my recovery path, and might never have made it there. So my screw up ended up being a difficult, but very good and important thing. Just admitting some things and bringing them out into the light gave me hope. And sharing the burden here, 2x4's notwithstanding, makes me feel not alone. Much of my affair behavior, and my post affair wheel spinning, was due to my penchant for isolation and trying to figure out things in my own head. That's usually NOT a good idea!

Thanks for sharing your struggles, and keep your chin up. JD

Why lying seems to better that hurting my wife

Think of it this way....your lying IS what is hurting your wife. You aren't saving her from any pain at all.

You love having a secret life (in whatever form that takes). It's probably something you enjoyed in your childhood (having secrets from your parents, hanging out with "bad kids," rebelling against authority).

Also, are you Sex Addicted? Do you view porn? Do you try to avoid having an emotional connection to your wife? Do you avoid having sex with her? My SAWH is BIG liar and this is one of the things that lead us to realize he's got a Sex Addiction.

Bottom line, if you are trying to reconcile, you are either IN or you are OUT. Only YOU have control over where you stand. It's NO ONE's decision. Take responsibility for your actions.

I'm offering some food for thought......

You clicked on the page not one time, but twice.

You really don't seem to be interested in what was on her page.

You immediately clicked away from the page.

Is it possible that there's an element of rebellion or spitefulness involved? Kind of a *push* against feeling controlled or that someone else (your BW) has *power* over you?

I'm just thinking....and throwing out another angle for you to consider.

Because your healing still is not as important as whatever you're deriving by breaking NC.

I am in the block-her camp. Once you do this, it takes a little more conscious thought to access.

It's not a cure, because you'll still have to figure out what's making it okay, in your mind, to break NC. But it's an obstacle to contact, and early on, that can be helpful.

Also, are you Sex Addicted? Do you view porn? Do you try to avoid having an emotional connection to your wife? Do you avoid having sex with her? My SAWH is BIG liar and this is one of the things that lead us to realize he's got a Sex Addiction

No I am not a sex addict. I have never avoided or turned down sex with my wife. Porn never used to be a problem in our marriage, but post D-day internet porn is. Many reasons for this as far as web cams etc. My wife has made it clear recently that she does not approve of internet porn so I have stopped. Porn never was more important than my wife or marriage. But thanks for your thoughts.

You love having a secret life (in whatever form that takes). It's probably something you enjoyed in your childhood (having secrets from your parents, hanging out with "bad kids," rebelling against authority).

Secret life not so much. I did keep secrets from my parents but really, I don't think I know anyone that does not keep secrets from there parents. My mistake was keeping secrets from my wife, that started the lying pattern and thought process thinking by lying I was protecting her. Growing up I was never called on my shit, which made me feel powerful because I was getting away with it. So when my wife started calling me on my shit, I rebelled and started the power struggle, this in turn made my entitlement issues go rampant. Yes pretty messed up.

July73

Some of may be confrontation avoidance, not wanting to keep hurting my BW.

This has been absolutely my biggest failure over the past few years and has caused so much more pain for my wife. Conflict avoidance by lying to your spouse will be the death of your relationship. I have done so much more damage with trickle truth and conflict avoidance than any pain I thought I was sparing her. I now know that the this was all about protecting myself and saying that I was trying to keep from hurting her more was complete bull shit.

@isles: I'll remember those words.

I'm going to give you essentially the same answer our MC gave JM when he asked that question, although I will say it more nicely. And when I got honest with myself, it's the same reason I lied and messed things up over and over.

We sat in our MC's office,JM with his head in his hands. He asked "what is wrong with me? Why do I keep hurting my wife? Why do I keep lying"

And the MC said, "there is nothing wrong with you except that you're a selfish jerk who is used to doing what you want to do. You want to stop lying? Tell the truth. The way to stop hurting your wife is to STOP HURTING HER. Stop doing things that have a guaranteed result of hurting her."

And ultimately, that's the bottom line for us. JM and I both lied about everything. I lied when the truth would be better. It was habit. I lived in a constant state of turmoil and anxiety. When I got sober, I became committed to a life of integrity. It wasn't easy and telling the truth was scary and sometimes sucked. But it got easier. Now, if I catch myself slipping toward a lie, the brakes are automatic.

My experience made it a little easier when JM started his journey, because I knew how hard it was. I had to learn to give him a safe place to tell the truth. I couldn't demand the truth and then freak out and go ballistic on him for telling the truth.

But ultimately, it was his responsibility to choose integrity and kindness over dishonesty and selfishness.

As it is yours. I promise it is worth the effort.

HSFFC... Yes, it seems so easy, sitting right there in front of me all spelled out. All I have to do is not lie, therefore I won't hurt my wife. I understand it yet, I keep doing it. I need to figure out what makes my knee jerk reaction to lie in the first place. Thanks for your comment, it really makes me think. I believe some of it is a self protection mechanism, it goes way back to child hood. I figured out that by lying and when it worked I gained power and control. It was never the secrecy, but all about the power and control knowing I could get away with things through manipulation. I never did this in my marriage or even when I was dating or living with my wife. I never felt the need to control or have power over her. But then, about 5 years ago I believe I thought I was loosing control over her, and she started calling me on my shit more and more. I believe at that time I allowed the old thoughts to seep in and the lying started up again. Creating a downward spiral that went out of control. I am terrified that I have really messed it up bad enough this time that there is no recovery. All the work I have been doing on myself over the last 8 months, still positive and has helped me, but is to no avail for trying to help heal my wife. I need to except that is her decision for what will or will not her. I have to except that because of my choices and actions she has to make her own decision to leave me or give me yet another chance at R. This is where I realize it is no ones fault but my own. That is a scary realization.

This is where I realize it is no ones fault but my own. That is a scary realization.

Scary? You bet your ass! But, guess what? When I lived my life as a victim of all the horrible stuff that had happened to me, I had NO power to change. When you can look in the mirror and recognize that the one person with the power to solve your problems is staring you in the face, it's a relief.

I love the Serenity Prayer. God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change (that's everything that is not inside my skin), courage to change the things I can (that's ME), and the wisdom to know the difference. If you don't believe in God, then just omit the first word. You can be speaking to the universe, to your inner self. It's really just a way to remind yourself of your goal to be a better person.

And it's a daily commitment. You will mess up. And here's where the scary part . really starts. As soon as you catch yourself in a lie, fix it. Right then. Don't wait to be found out. If you tell a lie, get caught and then admit the truth, that's not honesty.

Eventually, you will become quicker to recognize the emotional responses that lead up to your impulse to lie, and you'll be able to stop that as a thought process, before it becomes an action. And it is SO much easier to tell the truth than to admit to someone, "What I just said was not the truth. The truth is XYZ" That shit gets old FAST, especially when people look at you like you've just defecated on the floor and showed it to them.

You sound a lot like me. I was not able to learn healthy methods of coping and relating to others without serious IC. You will probably need professional help to learn healthy skills.

Try it out, just for today. Commit to an honest life and make amends immediately for anything that trips you up.