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I may have implied to one of the OW that my WH had told me about their pathetic sex life and that we had laughed together, in bed, about it...

ok it wasn't true but in my defence I was having a bad day

I have to assume the sex was, in fact, great

I use to think the sex was probably great, why else would he go back for 2 yrs. However, we had a long talk one night with his hand on his late grandfathers bible, a man he worshiped. He swore to me that it was the most boring sex ever. She laid there completely emotionless, never had an orgasm and it was over within mins and there were many many times that he couldn't get hard. He would leave her and either drive around for a couple hours or go sit by the river. He felt guilty and selfish. She begged to see him more often than once a month, sometimes he would give in and see her a second time sometimes not. Why did she want to see him more if the sex was boring? She wanted him to leave me so she could have my life. Do I believe him now? Simply put, Yes. I know what he was like in bed at that time, and that is NOTHING like he is now. When they say that the OP gets the broken, most awful pieces of our WS it is true. Nothing they could do together could ever be as special as what we have done together. When we make love and he looks me in the eyes, I know he is seeing ME. I can see the love for ME there. All she ever seen on his face was his longing for me. He told her that he still loved me, that he would never leave me for her. She never stopped trying to get him to leave me though. Which just goes to show how pathetic she is. She was willing to have sex with a man that was never going to treat her like more than a blow up doll.

How can anything like that have been great, earth shattering sex? How can anything they did ever compare with what we have? How we make each other feel? It can't!

However, we had a long talk one night with his hand on his late grandfathers bible, a man he worshiped. He swore to me that it was the most boring sex ever.

I hate like hell to tell you how many betrayed spouses here have ALSO had their spouse 'swear' on the lives of their mothers, fathers, grandmothers, grandfathers, their own CHILDREN, the family dog, and love of their country.

Cheaters lie.

Sad truth.

But truth.

I agree with NA2013, most everything your WH said to you regarding sex with his OW is right out of the WS play book.

I have never ever believed this.

I have had BAD sex before, and it was not something that I decided to continue to do with that person for weeks, months, or years on end. Sorry, but bad sex is a one thing for me, and not something that I am likely to repeat.

To me, that is like your spouse saying, "I hate Indian food," and yet continuing to eat at an Indian food restaurant for months and months. Or saying, "I hate vacationing in California," and yet choosing to go there every single vacation. It just doesn't add up. If you go to a restaurant and don't like the food, you won't return there. If you go on a vacation and don't have any fun, you probably won't hop a plane to go back there every chance you get. If the sex was bad...they wouldn't continue to have it.

Yeah...."dogs in heat"....can relate to this image....no doubt in my mind my wife and her AP were as giddy and aggressive as teenagers. My wife tried to resist her urges but that just added to the intensity of their A. Wish I could relate to a WS feeling sex was just okay. Maybe it is just okay if the WS has no guilt or sense of holding out during their A....they just get right to sex.

Fact is my wife enjoys sex, always has, she enjoyed sex w AP like I would enjoy sex with a doting new woman. Even if sex was just okay....a person involved in an illicit affair would have a heightened experience because of the forbidden exotic feel surrounding this.

Ultimately I see the soul damage adultery does, the lifetime of living with that decision would be extremely tough, the families it destroys,...but my own sinful nature has fantasized about sex w another woman since my DD. it is wrong....I know it is....I pray for the courage to continue to recognize my own selfish, sinful urges and not act upon them.

My best friend who. I have consoled in since my DD, has repeatedly said his wife has initiated sex twice in there 17 years. I also get the sense she more or less lays there. I am hypersensitive to M issues now. But I am concerned that they are vulnerable to A now. He doesn't see any danger.

My wife and I had regular sex, she initiated it plenty...it was fun and aggressive at times....and she still choose to commit adultery: my friend desires more but says "that's just how it is".

He has since told me of a cute blonde he worked with....felt temptation....was grateful when she left his place of work.

Great sex does not = great relationship. But if satisfying sex is missing.... It takes a strong individual to stay the course.

Our desires for sex in our marriage is at a record low.....a concern for both of us. We have a rule of no sexual gratification outside of us together.

This sucks.

Just feeling bad right now.

God help us all.

[This message edited by blakesteele at 3:53 PM, October 13th (Sunday)]

Oh, yes--I heard it. The first OW I learned about practically raped him, and it was awful. The OW he loved, it was awful. And I imagine if I'd ever learned enough about the others to ask, it would have been "awful" with them, too.

What a stupid man I married, doing things that are so awful over and over.

ETA: The swearing on a Bible, swearing on a child's life, swearing on his dead mother's grave....Textbook bullshit, too.

[This message edited by solus sto at 4:01 PM, October 13th (Sunday)]

I, too heard about how awful their sex was. It makes no sense to me - let's possibly blow up my 33 year marriage, lose one of my jobs, and at least half of my money for crappy sex? No sense at all.

And since we were each other's firsts, (still my only) it chaps my hide when he tells me in bed that I'm the best person in bed he has been with. Uh, thanks for drawing attention to that, FWH. I have nothing to compare you with.

And yes, he literally did swear on his dead mother's grave that he wasn't having an affair. Liars lie.

This is for everyone who is sure that the WS's who say their affair sex was awful are lying.

You may be right--in fact I'm sure you are right in many cases. But it would be weird if they were all lying. Even the ones in solid R who are completely remorseful? Even the ones who have told all kinds of ugly, heartbreaking truths about the A?

It seems like there could be a double standard going on.

Could most of us agree that there are women in this world who will keep having sex even when they don't enjoy it? I think there are plenty of women who will willingly have sex even though it's unpleasant, boring, gross or risky, for all sorts of reasons.

Maybe it's easier than saying no. Maybe they were manipulated or coerced. Or they think they don't deserve anything better. Maybe they're trying to pacify the guy. Or they're using sex to get something else that they really want.

It could be that they're just stuck in an unhealthy situation, going through the motions because it's too scary or difficult to end it.

Is anyone still with me? Now, switch the gender. Are men and women really so different that the above situations could not happen to a man, too?

Could most of us agree that there are women in this world who will keep having sex even when they don't enjoy it? I think there are plenty of women who will willingly have sex even though it's unpleasant, boring, gross or risky, for all sorts of reasons.

This was certainly true of my FWW. She was so in love with OM, she would have done almost anything for him. I'm confident that the emotional aspects of the affair were far more important to her than the sex. She claims the sex with OM was bad, but in the end, does the intensity of the orgasm really matter?

[This message edited by HardenMyHeart at 6:05 PM, October 13th (Sunday)]

I agree Sailorgirl.

IF my FWH had TT'd me. If he hadn't of told me every detail I asked for. IF he hadn't of told me of his A, even though I had no idea and he could have kept it from me forever. IF he hadn't of gotten help and fixed his broken self BEFORE telling me everything. IF I didn't know how horrible our sex life was because of his selfishness right before the A. IF I didn't know that he still wanted sex with me even though it was horrible then. IF he wasn't honestly remorseful. Then Maybe I would wonder if he was lying. But none of that is true. He told me everything when he didn't have to. He has told me things that have hurt, things he didn't have to be honest about to me. So why exactly shouldn't I believe this also?

Saying that ALL WS are lying about this is wrong. Just because this was the case in your M or someone you knows case, doesn't mean it is true for every case.

This kind of negativity is why I hesitate to post anything good anymore. I read another thread about SI making you trigger, this is the kind of thing that makes me trigger on here. Unless you know someone personally, know for a fact that their spouse is lying you can't say for sure that ALL are lying.

Also, like I said. Even IF the sex was wonderful, crazy monkey sex...for a remorseful spouse it will still be horrible sex.

And for the record, I had horrible boring sex for over 10 yrs with my first H. But, it was sex. I didn't love him for years. But it was sex and bad sex was better than no sex.

I never actually asked FWH if the sex was good or bad. They had one night together, and at the time, I do believe that he really thought he was totally in love and thus it was the greatest night of his life.(it had been ea before then, intense)

Now, two and a half years out, he knows it was the worst night of his life. Whether the sex was great or not.

I do think that ws who tell us that the sex was bad, are just placating us and minimizing. We want so badly to believe that it was terrible, but, really, we are in denial. Of course it was good, at the time, and of course that is painful to think about

People are asking: Does it really matter whether the sex was good or bad?

It's betrayal either way and it's hell for the BS either way.

But it certainly does matter whether the WS is telling the truth or not. To me, it matters most of all, and that's why I'm trying to get people to open their minds to the possibility that some WS's who say the sex was bad are telling the truth.

We want so badly to believe that it was terrible, but, really, we are in denial. Of course it was good, at the time, and of course that is painful to think about

Actually, no. I wanted to believe that the affair was about temptation and sex because that made sense to me. I wanted to believe that H was attracted to OW and got caught up in a rush of lust. I could understand that.

The alternative was worse--he was a kind of f@cked up that I had no experience with and I did not want to go there.

I asked him so many times and so many ways whether they flirted, whether he felt excited, whether he wanted her. He would finally say, "I know you want me to say yes, but I can't because it's not true."

Guess what? There's all kinds of messed-up. One of them is messed-up to the point where you will have sex with someone you do not fancy, and it will be really bad yet you will do it again.

Please allow for the possibility that things can happen that you do not personally understand.

Most BS's when they ask this question seem to be "overalling" all over the place. It isn't how they touched, tasted, felt, moved. It's were they better? Where they (as a whole) different? More special?

In my case, I asked all of this. I am quite specific with my questions. WH says it seems like I will only be happy if a video were to show up. Probably.

WH says it wasn't better, just different, that every woman is obviously different, and that even sex between us isn't the same every time either.

Edited typo

[This message edited by SoVerySadNow at 7:22 PM, October 13th (Sunday)]

Why would they tell you the truth.

Maybe I am cynical. I just think they tell us it was not good. Then we ask why they went back for more.

Because it was good, and they liked it.

My WH said that it was initially exciting and new but it was awful once they did the deed. It was a ONS. He said he couldn't climax, but she said that she did 3 times. Knowing what I know about my husband she must never ever have sex because 3 times is hard to fit into 30 minutes total. Just saying. I don't think they all lie. I didn't believe him either. He said he wishes he would have kept the condom. He hasn't lied about anything else so I don't know why he would lie about that. He didn't have sex more then 1 time with her, so that makes it a differnet case also.

[This message edited by heartbrokeninaz at 7:35 AM, October 14th (Monday)]

Oh yes, apparently the sex was bad. OW has had 4 children vaginally...one only 4 months prior to the affair.

Apparently her vag felt empty/loose, it made a lot of noise which in turn bothered her enough that whenever he thrusted and her vag "farted" she got a weird facial tick. He says he didn't notice it the first time. But it was very obvious and distracting the second time. They only had sex twice.

He didn't go down on her (his favourite activity) and didn't use any lube when they did anal. He took what he wanted and used his fingers to make her O when he was finished.

Sounds like something out of a porno.

[This message edited by Zayda1 at 8:20 AM, October 14th (Monday)]

My fWh said that the anticipation was the best bit. Sometimes the o was good because he was concentrating on himself. And he always hoped the next time would be better.....so he just had to keep trying, and trying, and trying.....yawn....

My FWH early on said that the sex was good--and I believe that at the time they had it, it probably was (how he could be sexually attracted to such an unattractive person, inside and out, is another question, but I digress. . . ). Now, looking back on the whole thing, he is disgusted. He doesn't think of it with any fondness and would certainly tell you that it was not worth the price he paid for it. "Good" is not a word he would use in the same sentence with her name (except perhaps "good riddance").

He wishes that he hadn't done it--not because the sex was awful, but because it was wrong, hurtful and destructive to our M and to both of our psyches. The physical act itself was not awful, but just about everything else related to her and the relationship was awful.

He does say that, towards the end of the relationship, he wanted out so badly that she had to be very "proactive" in initiating sex with him. He was trying to avoid it. But he still didn't say that the sex was awful. Just the consequences were awful.

ETA--he does say that sex with the OW did not compare to the sex that we had (and continue to have!). She might have been good, but I am better : )

[This message edited by hopingforhappy at 10:28 AM, October 14th (Monday)]

I agree with those of you who say that we should avoid generalizations. My H was one for whom the sex at the beginning was "adequate" because it was different and then became a compulsion. He was getting something out of it initially that he has worked hard to figure out, but great sex wasn't it. Neither was love.

And I believe him. As I have come to understand all of his issues, with CSA, etc, I know that this wasn't about her, and in many ways not about sex. He often would have an orgasm, but it was not the satisfying kind he has with me, but more like masturbation, except with shame. (rather like abuse, actually) He was certainly not a giving enough man at the time to care about her needs or how she felt. He never felt negatively about me, but did feel badly about her and himself.

He also has absolutely no fond memories of that time and never uses the words fun, excitement or passion; in fact he consistently corrects me any time I do. What we share now I know with absolute conviction is nothing that he has shared with anyone ever before.

The fact is that all As are not the same. These kind, like sailorgirl's H, etc, can have a whole deep psychological component that is very hard to understand but can often stem from childhood. Not that this excuses anyone, but just that people can't just claim to know that the WS is lying in these cases. The fact is people can do things that don't make them feel good, that don't make any sense, even to them. And people can get caught in toxic, destructive situations that they aren't equipped to deal with. All kinds of things.

The bottom line is what they do afterwards.