SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

My D-Day was 18 months ago. He choose to stay with me and the family. He said he had the affair because he felt unloved, unappreciated and the OW made him feel good and alive and fresh. It lasted only 6 months before I found out about it. I didn't give him the ultimatum, in fact I kicked him out but he said he made a mistake and want me and the family. But he had a hard time forgetting her as she made him feel good about himself and he said beside me he has never felt connected with someone else before in his life.

But to this day I still don't know whether I want to stay or leave. This man who I have trusted ALL my adult life, we were together since we were teens, crushed my heart, crushed my spirit, crushed my soul. Friends and family remember me as happy go lucky person. Now they think I'm half the person I used to be.

He is doing all the right things. Being loving, being transparent with his life, being accountable and generally a better father too. But I am struggling to this day whether this is the right person for me for the next 40-50 years.

To this day, he still attributes his straying to the fact our marriage was falling apart and opportunity came and this person made him feel good and alive again. He said it was a bad choice that he tried to find a solution outside our marriage but he has never done anything like that before. There was no reason back then, he said.

That really upsets me. Can't this person just own up and says it was a reflection of himself as a person in that point in time. That he lacked moral and integrity and he made a terrible choice. The state of the marriage (like every other 20+ years marriage that has ups and downs) was not to be blamed for it. It just makes me see him as a weak, narcisstic person that still cannot be accountable to this day. Will this person run and do the wrong thing by me again if we have challenges in our marriage again eg health reasons, financial stress?

The other thing that irritates me is that he wants to give me a time-line to heal. He has tried that on me a few times but basically got shat upon by me. The fact he does that makes me think he just doesn't get the enormity of what he has done. He wants a quick fix and move on because he has so there's no reason why I haven't. I have told him to just piss off now if he is giving me a period I have to heal.

Another wall against me healing is that he used to be a prolific porn user. He has definitely toned it down a bit but to this day, no matter how much he knows it upsets me and the fact he has promised on his kids that he will never go to porn again, I know he still does. And he is secretive about it. I have told him I don't mind him once in a while as I know it is a man's thing but I need him to be upfront but it is like talking to a wall. He still prefers to hide.

Another gripe I have is that I hate it when he sees an attractive girl, he will look and look. I have told him I hate him doing that as it upsets me greatly and makes me insecure. The girl he had the affair with is a stunning model as well. So much for my self esteem.

I just don't know whether this affair made me see right through him. Things I chose to ignore before but know it is these traits in him that I know made him capable of cheating. I don't think he is a man of high integrity or morals. He is actually quite a narcissist person in some ways.

But my biggest problem is my kids. I just can't do it to them. I came from a divorced family and we struggled emotionally as kids. Plus he has changed a lot for the better minus those few pointers I mentioned earlier.

Any advice? I know I should heal and the marriage has been better than before but something in me just doesn't feel right anymore. This affair just opened my eyes about this man, is he really for me?

I am 8 month out and I feel the same way everyday.I am leaning more to leaving as why do I want this constant reminder of what she did. I know I will have to live with this the rest of my life but If that person wasn't around sometimes I truly belive life would be allot more easier and less painfull.

So true to "funnyguy" but when you throw kids, finances and history in, it all is so much harder to make that decision.

All I know is if there were no kids, decision would be swift and quick.

Jeng---I totally understand where you're coming from---my WH wants me to "get over it" and "move on" and not talk anymore about the A. He was VERY heavy into porn and prior to finding out about his 3 yr A, I thought it was harmless but not anymore. I've asked myself the exact questions you have---- he is better than before the A--cut out the porn, spending more time at home, better father, more dedicated to the family but ---is it enough? I'm ashamed of staying in my marriage ---always thought an affair was a dealbreaker until it happened to me..sigh. It's a no-fault state where I live and he'd get 50% custody. Stay or only get to have my kids 50% of the time...it's hard.

I wasn't convinced I was staying in my marriage for over 2 years after DDay. I wavered constantly between leaving and staying. I was so angry with myself for staying with a cheater that I couldn't just 'stay', and yet something inside of me wouldn't let me leave. I was miserable because I felt like I was in limbo.

I'm not saying this is your case, but once I forgave myself for staying with someone that betrayed me, things calmed down a lot, and I mean a LOT, both in my marriage and in my mind.

The thing is, I didn't even realize that was the problem. I projected everything onto my fWH. The real limbo was in my own head. The anger at loving someone that hurt me so deeply was incredibly strong, but I didn't see it. I was angry that I was even put in that position (that's on him, not me) but I felt like I was betraying myself by staying.

It's hard not knowing after so long. It really is. It will get better.

Honestly, I would not tolerate the porn. It's the porn that got my wh to cheat. We found a good marriage counselor who is well trained in sex addiction and sent my wh to sexaholics anonymous. It has helped tremendously.

It takes a LOOOOONG time for them to own their behavior. I don't think my wh ever would have if he was still using porn, even once in a while. He had to stop the whole fantasy life.....fantasy life breeds discontent w/ current life.

I feel for you. This is a club no one wants to be in.

To this day, he still attributes his straying to the fact our marriage was falling apart and opportunity came and this person made him feel good and alive again.

Jeng:

You know he is blameshifting. You need to set him straight.

Also, he needs to stop viewing porn and looking at other women.

I think you need to tell him this.

Missed Red Flags. ... oh god how true. I used to think his porn viewings were harmless. I didn't like it but he always tells me it is normal for a guy and I stupidly believe him. Living in la la land.

Somebody in some other threads said if he doesn't own up and gives a timeline, we are just asking for trouble again as it shows a weakness in his character.

What do you think?

This person is blaming you and the M for his cheating. He is not even looking at himself and why he did it. He is also still lying and hiding things. These are all huge red flags. He has not changed at all. What did he do after all of this to change himself so that this would not happen again? Read books, go to IC, MC, work on himself? Anything?

he wants to give me a time-line to heal.

wow, just wow. If ever a guy needs to show up in the Wayward forum and have his butt handed to him....

also, you were in the same marriage and didn't cheat.

painfulpast .... thank you for your encouraging msg. Actually everybody has been so helpful. I just can't be thankful enough to come on this site. I feel it has helped me tremendously already.

But I am also a realist. I know now I feel good and inspired but the time will come when it will hit me like a ton of bricks again.

You all have also empowered me to be more upfront with WS. I just told him his porn frequency and looking at girls were all putting him in fantasy land and perhaps contributed to his downfall.

Thanks again everyone

painful past... you hit the right spot there.

Definitely part of me is shameful that I stayed and allowed him to come back to us. The person you hold above all and treasure with all your might knifes you right in the heart and you give him a second chance.

I feel weak and a walk over. The counsellor said it takes a stronger person to stay and fight it. Much harder road to take, by staying. But I just don't know whether I am staying for the right reason.

I just know if kids were not involved, it would have been a straight up easy decision. I would be in a hurry to get rid of him in my life. But things are not that easy esp when he also has changed to be a better husband and father now.

I just feel my heart and mind have no lieuway for the hurt. It has been too entrenched and I'm afraid it will never resurface, the loving feeling that is.

I am close to the same amount of time since dday and am in the same boat as you. I feel like I could have written your post. The next 40-50 years is such a loooooong time and it is a big decision to stay or leave. Limbo is so freaking hard. Some days I feel like I have made my decision on how to move forward and it changes all of the time. My H just got back form a trip with his sisters. Before the trip he agreed to some conditions I am insisting on (polygraph and counseling). I was so hopeful while he was gone that he would return we would be on to recovery and that once the road was well underway and I felt better about things we would renew our vows and get new rings. Now that he has returned he has changed his mind about the polygraph and my hopes are crushed. I feel ready to go file today. I wish I had advice for you, it sucks we are here although it is helpful to know I am not alone.

I wish I had advice for you, but I can relate so much to what painful past said! I know that her reason is why I find myself in limbo so often. It's also a matter of not trusting myself or anyone else anymore. My goal is to learn to forgive myself and learn to trust myself again.

Jeng, I could have written this post, too. If it weren't for my son, this would've been a no brainer. I'm disgusted with myself for thinking that it is ok to stay with someone who has been abusive to me, but recently he is trying to be better and when he is nice to me I start to think I should give it more time. I just feel like it is too hard to go and too hard to stay. I have no good option right now. I know I would be happier if I left, but my son is only 5 and his father has made tremendous strides in that relationship, so does my son's need outweigh mine? I don't know...I am so ashamed of myself.

[This message edited by ddame23 at 3:21 PM, July 1st (Tuesday)]

I am around the same timeline out and am feeling a lot of the same things of staying versus leaving. I am not dealing with porn but am dealing with the kids factor. I feel the same way about if it was just me, I feel like it would be a no-brainer to leave but the kids are what make me think twice. I felt like we were doing very well and then slowly I have been feeling like I am moving towards not staying, but haven't.

I haven't thought of "forgiving myself for staying with someone who betrayed me." but I am going to give it some thought now...

I don't have any advice, as I am in your same place, I just wanted to let you know you are not alone.

WOW...Jeng...most of your post could have been written by me.

It sounds like your WH could use some sex addiction counseling. More and more, I am hearing about marriages that are impacted very negatively by (usually the husband's) porn use. My own certainly was...even before the affair occurred.

My DD was 3/2013, so I am just a few months behind you in the context of time. Has your WH read any books? Have you received any marriage counseling or individual counseling? IMO, you cannot expect to recover from a devastating blow like this by "winging it." We've had MC together, IC (WH has had 2 ICs going at the same time) and my husband has given up (or says he has given up) porn and changed his lifestyle a lot (drastically changed his social patterns) and I am still in a state of uncertainty re: the future of our marriage.

Most books I've seen say it takes 2-5 years to recover from infidelity and that the second can be worse than the first year. Probably because the shock has worn off but the weight is setting in.

Don't rush your healing on his account. His rush for you to heal is really about him wanting your forgiveness and he hasn't earned it if he hasn't self examined to the core.

My own WH, despite his IC, hasn't gotten to the core of his issues (seems to think his family issues don't play a role in his issues even though evidence/researchers say otherwise - apparently he is the exception).

Be wise.

Definitely part of me is shameful that I stayed and allowed him to come back to us. The person you hold above all and treasure with all your might knifes you right in the heart and you give him a second chance.

I feel weak and a walk over

Ok - first, you're anything but weak. You're here. You're passionate. You're not ignoring his actions, your feelings, or the trauma this has caused. You're definitely NOT weak.

I'm glad some of my comments resonated. It took me so long to even figure out why I couldn't decide. I would read posts from those that were 5 or 6 months out discussing R, still hurting of course, but confident in their decision. I was jealous, and felt like a complete basketcase. Why could others move forward and I was just stuck??? It sucked, to be blunt. It really did. My entire world was consumed with 'stay or go', which of course made the affair my constant focal point. After all, that was why I was so conflicted, right? It was awful.

Yes, the person you hold above all and treasure stabbed you in the heart - or as I would say - gutted me. How on earth did I still love this person? Why was I such a fool? Why was I so pathetic for feeling anything but rage at the betrayal I was subjected to, at HIS hands?

I wasn't a fool. You aren't a fool. It's hard to accept this, but it's true. That man you're married to, that you treasured above all, that fathered your children, he is much more than an affair he had. He is the man that made you laugh, smile, feel safe, and fall in love. That's why it hurts so deeply. We remained faithful and in love, and for that, we were blindsided and crushed. That wasn't because of us - that was because the person we love has (or had at the time) some real issues going on and did a piss poor job of dealing with them. An affair is a really easy and cheap way to feel better. After all, how hard is it to find some other desperate, miserable person and tell each other how wonderful you each are? The problem is, when the contact with AP is over, reality sets in. Guilt, shame, disgust, and just feeling like scum are now mixed in with all of the issues that got the person to the A in the first place. What's the quick fix? Why, more of the AP and the bullshit tales of how amazing he is, right? It's really an ugly, pathetic circle.

Unfortunately, for us, the answer is simple - we were here all along? Why did you choose to do this? Why did you say the things you said to her? Why did you do the things you did? How could you forget about me? It's incredibly hard to separate the two. It really is, I know.

So, this man that you adored, that you loved and trusted with every intimate detail of your life and body, had broken your heart by a betrayal so deep, so traumatizing, that you can't imagine recovering from this and actually wanting to be with him. Worse, when those feelings creep in, and you do want him, and you're enjoying his company and feel happy - BAM! You remember, and now you're angry. You're angry that this memory has ruined this happy moment, and then you're angry that his actions ruined your fairy tale soul-mate true love story, and then, you're angry that he's sitting there, smiling, enjoying life as if nothing happened.

Here's the thing, as I said, he's more than his affair, just like he's more than his hobbies, and more than his job, and more than his childhood friends, and everything else that, in total, comprises him. Yes, he now isn't as shiny. You don't feel as special, and your marriage sure doesn't feel like anything but a big ole' compost heap. One giant lie, acted out by one liar and one fool. It isn't, and wasn't. This affair, as ugly, hurtful, wrong and rage-inducing as it was, is one piece of this marriage. Even when it was happening, it wasn't all the marriage was.

OK - a bit off track there - you are NOT a fool for staying. You have built a life with this man, this person you love. Yes, love. You didn't fall in love with him because of one action or series of similar actions, and as much as we BSs might wish otherwise, we don't fall out of love because of one action or series of actions either. Even a betrayal as deep as infidelity doesn't shut that off in most people. Because of this, because we've almost all always felt that 'if you cheat, it's O-V-E-R', and yet here we are, sitting in this house with the person that cheated, we feel like we're weak. We feel like we are unable to stand up for ourselves. We feel like we're just nothing, and we're proving it by staying with someone that did something so heinous to us. But we aren't weak. As I said - we aren't ignoring the issue. We aren't rugsweeping. We aren't accepting whatever scraps are put out for us. We are demanding remorse. We are demanding change. We are demanding that we find our own boundaries, and that anyone in our lives stays within those boundaries. We are demanding transparency, and honesty. We are NOT weak, not by a long shot.

You are not weak because you are with your H. In fact, that's almost irrelevant. You are strong because of all of the things I just listed. Whether or not he's there is a sideline. YOU have changed. YOU have become stronger. YOU are no longer willing to just accept and blindly trust. YOU know that if your needs aren't met, you will leave. Maybe not today, or tomorrow, but you will, and you know this. You aren't the same person you were the day before DDay. You're much, much stronger.

It took me so long to realize this, and to 'forgive' myself for going against what I'd always believed - cheat and you're out! Well, sorry, but I had no clue what betrayal really felt like, or did, or why it happened. I was just saying what everyone else said. I meant it, but only because I was clueless.

You've said your husband had made a lot of changes, and to you, he's a better husband and father. If that's true, and keeping in mind that this is the man you have loved for so long because of who he is, then why leave? Why throw everything away, including someone you love and have loved, because it's what you're 'supposed to do'? Is it? Why? If this man has changed, and you believe he is remorseful and will not cheat again, and if he realizes how truly lucky he is that you are still a large part of his world and appreciates it now like he should have all along, why give that up?

If you truly don't love him, or if you truly cannot get past the affair and continue to be haunted by it and heartbroken, then yes, leaving might be the best option. I don't see that in your posts. I see you feeling like you shouldn't be with him. If that's true, and you can honestly say that despite the pain he's caused, and all that comes with it, you do still love this man, and he's changed for the better, why are you supposed to leave? It's your choice. That door is always there to walk out of if you decide to.

Yes - I can get way too wordy - so in a nutshell - leaving or staying isn't the answer to whether or not a person is weak. It's how the situation is handled. You ARE handling it. Please - with everything else that's been thrown at you, please don't be angry or disappointed in your choices. Love isn't logical, it's emotional. There's nothing wrong with not leaving someone you love, even if they've hurt you, despite what you've always told yourself. What the hell did you know when you were saying that anyway?

Stay strong jeng. It really does get better. Stop being angry at yourself. Anger, I'm told, is a secondary emotion that only shows up to mask another emotion that we don't want to let out. So try to figure out what that emotion is - are you disappointed in yourself? Are you afraid to be hurt again? Are you embarrassed for being with a man that cheated? Once you get to that emotion(s), you can deal with them. Staying angry only brings misery. Please trust me on that. I was undecided for just over 2.5 years. It's not worth it. It just isn't.

Painfulpast thankyou for this response....just thank you

Hi Painful Past

Thank you, I have been reading your post over and over again. So encouraging and soothing.

I do hope it will be worth it at the end of the day for all our sake.

Gotta give it another try at least so I can say I did try for all of us but it takes two to commit to a great marriage, it is too much a burden for one to take on.