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It will make him feel better.

He's also had a half of bottle of wine and a mason jar full of whiskey and coke.

Does anyone else have moments like this?

I'm trying to explain to him that it helps no one. Including himself.

I also might add, I think it may be the Jameson talking. Hopefully.

I said a lot of angry, colorful things shortly after DDay that if I had followed through on would have surely landed me in jail or dead on the side of the road.

These words are less a reflection of our true selves and more an indication of exactly how much pain is bubbling through our veins.

I know that it's hard to hear, and you certainly don't want to condone the actual behaviors, but having compassion for how low he must feel to say or think that will go a long way towards helping him out of the mindset.

He was laughing hysterically about me posting this...

It's not really because I'm angry or upset. I'm more concerned about the alcohol and if he's truly handling everything in a healthy way.

Alcohol also makes it harder to process what he's saying. I know it can be kind of like a truth elixir, but it can also be an exaggerator and numbing agent of sorts too. I felt the need, however, to vent my concern in what he's saying sometimes instead of saying anything directly to him.

I do love him terribly. I will continue to love him and comfort him as I help him up the stairs and snuggle him into the bed in a few moments. I *may* also lightly remind him of what actual prostitutes look when he wakes tomorrow morning... and that they can be as much of a mistake as the Jameson he had tonight.

PS- He just laid on the floor and is already snoring away.

Jrazz, I do see that it's mostly that. He's been hurting a lot lately because he's struggling that he is very co-dependent. He gave me more time than most. I'm very thankful for that because I was so foggy and lost that I didn't know which end was up. The down side to that is that he's now struggling with the damage he feels that he did to himself by not 180'ing me so that there wouldn't of been TT a year later. (This past March)

I told him tonight that I just want him to heal and to live his life in a way that he feels is the best option for him. I will support him any way necessary. It would be beyond painful to loose him. Such a hard convo to have.... then it lead to what he said just a few minutes ago.

Thanks for posting and reminding me that it truly can be the anger talking. Or Jameson.

Jameson fueled anger can be pretty potent. #speakingfromexperience

My BH says that if he should D me he would go f*ck prostitutes.

I'll give him credit for getting the two 'tasks' in the correct order.

Chalk it up to the Jameson giving him courage to express his pain in more colourful ways.

He won't be able to hear you when he's in that state, alchohol and emotional pain make people temporarily deaf. Logical explanations of why those things aren't healthy and won't help him heal will be lost. Just be compassionate and try to understand his hurt.

Glad he's sleeping it off.

OK . no stop sign so hope you do not mind.

It is very common to BH to lash out and seek some revenge. One of the most common ways is to have a revenge affair. Believe me we ALL think about this or similar. The first few weeks I thought about it alot. Eventually this passes and fortunately for me I never did anything. My WW also suggested such a thing at first to ease her own guilt.

It likely is not true and is the anger and betrayal talking with some alcohol to loosen the toungue. If you were to get D..then it really would not matter what he did...it is mor important what he and you do NOW.

No stop sign thank you. Probably he is just lashing out from the pain. We say very hurtful things to each other. The reality is that if we D, most find another person to be with and move on.

I *may* also lightly remind him of what actual prostitutes look when he wakes tomorrow morning... and that they can be as much of a mistake as the Jameson he had tonight.

First, (((wdig))) because that can't be easy to hear.

But, I don't think it would be helpful at all to "lightly remind him of what actual prostitutes look" like. For several reasons. First, if he is hung over from that much liquor, he's probably not in the mood to discuss anything at all. Second, because unless you were using "lightly" to mean something more like "gently", if he is in this much pain, there is nothing funny about this subject at all. And talking about what prostitutes look like, in a joking manner, is fairly likely to lead to a response along the lines of, "Oh, so as long as you are f***ing a nice, respectable business person, then it's okay. Is that what you're saying???"

Does anyone else have moments like this?

I'm trying to explain to him that it helps no one. Including himself

When you say you're trying to explain that it helps no one, are you referring to the idea of revenge sex? Or the moments of anger fueled by alcohol that lead to statements like that?

Oh for Pete's sake, lighten up. He got drunk and said something silly. You fucked two other men. He's gonna feel like shit about that for the next 2-50 years. Hopefully he'll eventually choose to cope with the pain in healthier ways, but that's on him to do, in his own time.

Sorry, but when WW come on here complaining their BH got really drunk, obviously looking for sympathy, I find that just the height of hipocracy.

I'm trying to explain to him that it helps no one.

Yep, cuz you're really the authority on what helps people feel better. Get over yourself, and find a little sympathy. Instead of rubbing his nose in ugly prostitute photos in the morning, fix him his favorite hangover breakfast, tell him what an amazing man and fantastic husband he is, and thank your lucky stars he didn't kick your lying, cheating ass to the curb.

BW here. 20wrongs is exactly right. It is hypocritical of you to explain to him how it will make him feel worse when you are the cause of the pain for sleeping with another man outside your marriage.

I told my fWH that I was going to sleep with others after I divorced him. What finally laid the matter to rest was when he replied that he deeply regretted that he was the reason why I needed to explore this avenue, that he understood why I felt sleeping with others was an option I was considering and it devastated him to know that he had hurt me and shaken my self esteem fundamentally. He promised that he would spend the rest of his life building me up instead of tearing me down. Hearing these things helped immensely.

Your BH is hurting, his self esteem has suffered a grevious blow and your advice, no matter how well intentioned, is not welcome. He is pain and is looking for some relief. Acknowledge your role in causing him to feel this way, show him how much you need him, tell him you love him and accept responsibility for the state of your relationship.

It's morning. He's sober and he's still saying he meant it. I know deep down he's angry and wants to hurt me.

When he said that he had told me originally was that I'd he should D me, then he'd never remarry again. He'd only have his feel of "life" and sleep with as many women as possible.

It hurt because he knew I did something like that after I was betrayed by my xwH in my first marriage. I was lost, didn't know how to date (I had married my xSANPDWH straight out of high school), lived and grew up in a college town (known for its bar life) and was newly divorced at 23. I was a confused broken girl who thought she had to have sex with a man to continue a relationship. My "number" grew quickly. It wasn't until I met my BS now that I realized that there were true gentleman out there. He was different. Never pressured me.

He knows saying that would hurt me. It does. Terribly because I know the pain I've caused him. I also know the pain and damage it does to sleep with multiple people and it would be terrible if he did that to find solace from what I did. His statement about that also scares me since this conversation spawned from us talking about him having a co-dependent personality and that he wanted to change being thay way.

I told him I would support him in his journey, but was honest that I was worried he might think that the answer of not being co-dependent meant divorcing. This is when the convo continued down the path that brought me here.

I shouldn't of said I was worried about him divorcing me, but I truly want to be honest with him. What I said must of struck a chord with him... What do I do to comfort him now? I just want to let him know I'll do whatever to help him. Sometimes I feel like there isn't anything, but to keep treading forward and gently let him know I care and love him.

[This message edited by wheredoigo at 9:37 AM, July 27th (Sunday)]

BH here.

I am not a drinker. At least I wasn't. I liked a beer before supper. Now I consume several. I think that twice my WW has helped me to bed since DDay 1. Leading up to that was pure anger and vitriole coming out of my mouth aimed at her and her POSOM but mostly her. It was up to her to protect our marriage and relationship.

I talked about it with my IC. I said that I had done a lot of drinking as a young single man but was always happy and never on the prod when I was drinking. I was a "happy" drunk. My IC said that the alcohol only intensifies the emotions currently being felt so drinking now intensified the pain, the hurt, the anger. I have broken chairs (oak dining room chairs) and seriously damaged the floor doing so. I have punched a wall and seriously damaged my knuckles. Alcohol does not help in the long run. Some seems to soothe but too much seems to have the opposite effect for me.

I wondered about a revenge affair. Why shouldn't I. But I cannot. It would not be the same as what my WW did. She did not really know the extent of the pain and destruction that would result. I do know. I could not do that to another person, I don't think. It certainly would not be fair to who ever I committed adultery with. I couldn't unless there was some emotional connection, I think, and why would I want to destroy someone who I was attracted to. And deep down inside, I don't think I could live with myself.

But, what your BH said was that if you divorced he would use prostitutes. See SlowUptake. At that point it won't matter. If my WW and I split I will not even date until after the D is official. Anything else is some sort of adultery. I doubt her standards are the same. We are in R but often only in limbo. Some days D is very possible. I have the forms and a written confession.

I think your BH was letting go of anger. Perhaps he was trying to hurt you. I know I did try to hurt my WW - still do. Perhaps it was something he was thinking about. Do not make to big of an issue out of it. Do not throw fuel on the fire. So what if prostitutes do not look the best in the morning. Do not explain to him that doing such a thing will not do anyone including himself any good. If it were me I would turn that back on you so fast. It would be fuel on the fire.

Work on you. Peel the layers away. Why were you capable of crossing the line? Why was it easy for you to do so? Be safe for him. Show him that you are committed. I want to gently say, at the risk of being chastised, that I don't think you are fully remorseful yet. Keep at it. Do it for yourself. Become the person you want to be. He may be there with you when you finally find her.

When you say you're trying to explain that it helps no one, are you referring to the idea of revenge sex? Or the moments of anger fueled by alcohol that lead to statements like that?

HFSSC, I was referring to going around and sleeping with women and prostitutes to self soothe. It doesn't help in any way, but feel good for a few moments only to come back down off of that high and feel worse. Also, what influence does that have on our children to see or find out that their dad is behaving this way? I worry every day about the residual effects of what my insane choices made

Hi 20,

Thank you for your response. I understand what you are saying. I really value your responses and follow your posts. I guess I am coming on here to cry/vent about it. I didn't post it on the General or R board, I posted it here in WW to get constructive feedback. I apologize if it makes you angry or if I hurt you by posting. I feel terrible if I did.

There have been plenty nights that we've had like this where I didn't even think about posting it. This one was different. It hurt that he knows that I made the mistake of sex with multiple guys after my first marriage when I was a BS. It is a pain that is deep and can never be taken away. I just can't see the justification of him telling me that he wants to make that mistake that I did. I've stood in his shoes as a BS and made those mistakes. It kills me to know that I've done this to him and he would not respect himself in this way.

meplusfour,

Thank you for the direct response.

I know I'm a hypocrite. Probably the biggest one that ever existed! I was a BS in my first marriage and now I'm a WW to the man I truly love. It's a lot to face when you've compartmentalized everything your entire life that scares the sh*t out of you. The difference now is that I'm facing it. In the past I would of said last night was water under the bridge, but it wasn't. It hurt. Instead of pushing it under and hiding it, I posted about my pain and why it triggered a reaction. Yeah, it may be selfish, but I'm trying to change who I am so that I am no longer the broken person I was before. That includes facing pain head on and making myself accountable for it.

SlowUptake,

I needed a chuckle. Thanks.

Steadychevy,

Thank you so much for your response. I have a lot to take from that. I think it was anger, my concern is whether the anger is growing into hate and resentment and how he's dealing with it by soothing with alcohol. I am concerned.

He may be there with you when you finally find her.

I'm working hard. I just don't know that when I find her that he will be a healthy person. He's always been a person who runs away from resistance or difficulty. Unfortunately, this is one of the most significant incidents in his life that he can't run away from. Or can he? He's a co-dependent, conflict avoid-er. This is his worse case scenario and I'm not sure he's dealing with it in a healthy manner.

[This message edited by wheredoigo at 11:08 AM, July 27th (Sunday)]

It is only my opinion but I do not think his anger is growing into hate. IMO, if you are wanting to reconcile, don't fear anger fear indifference.

I hadn't read your 2nd post on the thread before I sent mine. I hadn't read your profile. I have now. FWIW, here is my take. The reset button was hit on DDay 2. Go back to Go. Start over. It is old news to you but brabd new pain and devastation to your BH. He is reprocessing, IMO.

He needs help. Help from you. I read on another thread that I was just on (Ithink it was Dr. Jekyl.) that the BS cannot do all of the heavy lifting by themselves. They will break. I can attest. You hurt him (again), maybe destroy is a better word, and he needs you to help him heal. The ironic thing about adultery - the enemy is the doctor, too.

Again, IMO fear indifference not the anger. He is going through the anger phase again. My anger reappeared and was worse around the 5 to 6 month mark after DDay 3. It is still lurking just below rthe surface ready to erupt with any excuse and it has.

I wish you and BH true healing whether together or apart.

HFSSC, I was referring to going around and sleeping with women and prostitutes to self soothe. It doesn't help in any way, but feel good for a few moments only to come back down off of that high and feel worse. Also, what influence does that have on our children to see or find out that their dad is behaving this way? I worry every day about the residual effects of what my insane choices made

Thanks for answering. If you had meant the other interpretation, that was going to be a whole other conversation.

You've taken some pretty big 2X4s already, and as a madhatter, I don't swing them here. (don't even carry them, lol). But I am going to encourage you to let go of the outcome and quit worrying and planning for "what if" situations. "What if we divorce and then what if he really meant it and goes out and sleeps with a whole bunch of prostitutes and then what if my kids are affected and what if.......?" And at the bottom of it all is "And I'm the cause of all of that." And you'd be right, to a certain extent.

But here's the thing. You CANNOT control the outcome here, except as it directly relates to your choices. You can't convince your BH that f*ing a bunch of prostitutes won't help him and would actually hurt him. (Even though that is likely true). You can't prevent him from D'ing you. You can't prevent your children being affected in some way by all of this.

What you can do is work on you. Discover why you chose to have an A and then make changes to the parts of you that allowed that to happen. Be consistent, remorseful, transparent and honest with your H. When he tells you things that hurt, do what you did...come here and tell us. We understand and can offer you the comfort that he simply cannot offer you right now, nor should he be expected to. But that needs to come only after you have said to him something like several other posters have mentioned. "I am so sorry that I brought you this pain. My actions were awful and wrong and I am so sorry that I hurt you. What do you need me to do right now?" And his answer may be something like "Make it not have happened." Continue to speak your remorse to him.

As you are discovering, probably one of the least helpful things a WS can do in moments of horrible pain for the BS is try to tell them what will make them feel better, or how they need to heal. Even if you are right, he does not want to hear that from you at that moment.There were times early on that I would have probably done the opposite of anything JM suggested, just because it was his suggestion.

Finally, you mention the fear that when you find the person that you want to be, he won't be healthy. That's a valid fear and real possibility. I had a LOT of work to do on me after JM finally started becoming the man I'd always dreamed of and wished for. I am very glad that I did my work too, because our M is truly blessed now. But that's another outcome you need to just let go of for now. Because regardless of what your H chooses, don't you want to be that woman anyway? The woman who has integrity, who is real, who is the woman you always wanted to be?

No stop sign

well, my first thought on reading your post is that he is lashing back at you for the pain he feels. Of course in these moments (and when drunk) feels he has little obligations to the relationship, since the covenant between you is fractured, he could go do a few hookers now, and while you or anyone couldn't stop him, he likely will not, its a bluff, but does indicate an attempt to show you (by a sort of retaliation) that he is wounded.

I suspect he can't see enough remorse from you (you acklowledging his pain and showing regret for what happened), perhaps there is something you do to help him see where you are at right now. Write him a letter, this helps me when my WW writes, it allows me to read the good parts over and over again so I really get the message. And if you send him a message that works, it will work over and over again as he reads it many times.

respectfully

[This message edited by steppingup at 10:14 AM, July 28th (Monday)]

BS here....I am inclined to believe that the liquors certainly contributed to the things he said to you! And I say this from experience! In the first few months after Dday, I did the same thing. Even though I knew better, I would drink too much & start blabbing away! And later, I would feel like a fool because this was not me & NOT how I wanted to handle things! But I was hurt beyond reason! And angry, resentful, sad...every emotion you can even imagine. I hope this helped to explain his possible behavior & for you to understand what YOU caused! Please be patient & help him through this no matter how long it takes. Best wishes!