SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Personally I see this as a mistake. What I see is ... I'm not getting anywhere with my wife... maybe Ill get somewhere with the OM. Think about it... if he doesn't have the moral compass to see that having a A is wrong, that cheating on his wife and children is wrong... do you really think meeting with you is going to cause him pain or guilt? He is meeting with you because he wants to feel you out to fine out who you've told, how much you know, and warn you against outing the A any further.

So, what...meeting with him wont harm my situation right? Yes it will. I can't tell you how many BS waited to tell the OBS with threats and warning to the OM only to have the OM prep their wife for some crazy guy that is talking trash about their marriage. The best way to hurt him and show him what this Affair does to families is to tell his wife. He will be so busy playing fix -it and throwing your wife under the bus she won't know what hit her.

What WW and OM want is for you to keep quiet about the Affair and to separate. Then you will be pacified they can keep things going for as long as they want.

I hear you, but I don't expect to change his mind about anything. And I'm not going to share information with him about what I've done or what I'm going to do. I think I know in my head that my marriage is beyond saving, and I know I don't want to live the rest of my life with someone who does not love or respect me. This is strictly for me to feel like I'm confronting the issue instead of taking it lying down. If it were a stranger I probably would not do it but since this is a guy we have socialized with many times (I've played golf with his, etc.) it's different. I've also defended him to my mother in law when she thought he was showing a little too much interest in her career.

I haven't kept completely quiet about it. I've told my brothers, and a few close friends. She claims her mom knows and that she told her mom I found out. Who knows what the truth is but I guess I can't really believe anything she says. I told her I haven't decided who else to tell, which is true.

Your wife cannot continue to work there, obviously, if you guys R.

I would not talk to OM. I would go right to his wife. Cheaters aren't like us. Do you expect him to grovel and beg for forgiveness, and apologize for banging your wife? He is going to be like "She is an adult and she opened her legs, buddy." You will get no satisfaction from it.

If you do not tell the wife, you run the risk of them taking the affair underground. My husband and his skanky whore took the affair underground for the next 4years! I only caught them because they got careless and sloppy.

Understand that because of that you are still in shock you are also in a fog as well which is why you've so far done everything wrong (outside of contacting a lawyer). The good news is that it's never too late to turn things around and I should know, I did all the wrong things for a year myself.

Being nice to someone having an affair is enabling behavior and validates the WS in thinking they were justified for the A. See, they cheat because they think they can get away with it and they have lost respect for their BS. If she thought you would have tossed her to the curb the second you found out and would have no problem replacing her odds are she would think twice about having an A.

Which is why your approach should be telling her to GTFO and R is off the table until she comes crawling on her hands and knees begging for you to take her back. Anything short of that will be asking for a false R. The only way to get her to that place is to go scorched Earth on her until she hits rock bottom. Touch Love is really the only things that works in these situations.

If you go all nice guy on her you are guaranteed to fail. A WS cannot respect a BS if they kiss their ass after cheating on them

You are right. Thanks. I needed to hear that.

Telling the OM you don't know who you are going to tell gives him time to put his spin on it to his wife, his boss, who ever.

Never ever tell someone your game plan. Just do it.

And yes....right now you are Plan B, until the OM dumps your wife.

k9

I think it is a purely personal decision as to whether you out the A or not..

Purely personal whether you R or not..

Everybody heals at a different pace..

Someday it does get to a point when the AP dumps our WS...For whatever reasons...In the interests of keeping their own households intact..

By that time many of us DO NOT WANT our spouses back..Whatever bad habits we have had to put up with in these wayward spouses often become deal breakers after they have cheated on us..

Who wants a spouse whom he or she can't trust..Whom he or she has to monitor?

I give advice based on the perspective of not wanting to see people stuck in bad marriages with un remorseful cheaters....

Please make the big and small steps necessary, so that you will ( always ) be in the position to walk away from the marriage without having the worry of being financially destitute in your old age..

Divorce from very long term marriages has that uncanny ability to put one or both spouses into instant and debilitating poverty.

Keep seperate bank accounts..No joint credit cards..

If you R you might be married to your WW for at least a few more years..Maybe even a decade..Or more..

Since your WW is already a proven cheater , do some divorce planning....Take away her ability to pull the rug out from all areas of your life.. We BS's tend to do this as a way to protect ourselves..Some of us do it for life

One major (pragmatic/practical) goal might be to take away or minimize your WW's ability to make claims on your future earnings, especially at retirement..

To R you might want to require that the WW has to keep her job..And build her own retirement savings..Stay self supporting..So that a divorce has the two of you walking away from each other on equal footing vs one spouse taking the other to the cleaners..

Many paths out of this shit storm involve careful thought, being proactive for one's future, and not trusting the WS any more than one would trust a snake..

[This message edited by doggiediva at 8:54 AM, March 8th (Tuesday)]

Your wife cannot continue to work there, obviously, if you guys R.

I would not talk to OM. I would go right to his wife. Cheaters aren't like us. Do you expect him to grovel and beg for forgiveness, and apologize for banging your wife? He is going to be like "She is an adult and she opened her legs, buddy." You will get no satisfaction from it.

If you do not tell the wife, you run the risk of them taking the affair underground. My husband and his skanky whore took the affair underground for the next 4years! I only caught them because they got careless and sloppy.

I don't expect him to grovel - actually I'm going to tell him I have no interest in anything he has to say. The affair was underground anyway. I only found out b/c I accidentally ran across some emails.

I 100% agree that the wife deserves to know - still torn about what that will mean financially for me and my kids. But maybe if in that discussion I point out to her that getting them fired will hurt me and my kids she won't do anything rash -- and obviously it would hurt her financially as well since he's the main breadwinner. I would think that would have an effect on her.

Yes, what K9 said. Don't reveal your plan. They will spin it. Minimize their actions and make you out to be a crazy, jealous lunatic who is probably bipolar and has a drinking problem. Or some variation.

Hello Frk963, and welcome to SI.

Please take a gander at "The Healing Library." You'll find a link in the yellow shaded region at the top-left of this page. In the "Articles" tab are great essays to help you get started in the process of recovering from the shock and trauma of discovery.

Your WW (wayward wife)--a "adult," married with children--thinks she's in love with her boss--also an "adult," married with children--and wants to separate because she needs time to think?

If you heard this story from a friend of yours, what would you say to him?

The marriage has been on the rocks for a while

Marriage's don't cheat, Frk. There is no justification for infidelity. I've read plenty of stories here that start out with: "I thought we had a great marriage." Marriage counseling isn't going to help, because it's your WW who need counseling, not the marriage.

Affairs are lies, brother. They are built upon lies that each wayward spouse tells him/herself. They are kept secret because each affair partner knows full well what they are doing is wrong. Just flat out wrong, as in there's no truth or righteousness or honesty in the affair. But it doesn't register. They betray themselves, their beliefs, their values, their integrity and honor, debase themselves in the worst possible manner. Somehow, of course, they over-look these glaring flaws within themselves and each other.

Your WW is deep in the proverbial "fog." Read the article in The Healing Library entitled: "Communicating with a Foggy WS."

I feel like an idiot since I said I still loved her and wanted to work things out.

So do I, oddly enough. My first reaction was much the same. I hated the idea that my marriage could have ended the way it did. But, it did. For me, my marriage ended the moment I discovered my wife had been unfaithful. Realizing that your marriage is over, Frk, that nothing will ever be the same, is a big step in the right direction.

It's good that you've already contacted a lawyer. Now, I would highly suggest that you file for a divorce, sooner rather than later. I understand that's not what you want. I don't want a divorce either. I never did file, but at one point, I was a phone call away. My wife knew this. She knew I had been talking to a lawyer and saw the firm's website on our browser history. That woke her up!

You'll read it often here, but the surest way to save your marriage is to risk it's utter ruin. At some point, IMHO, you'll have to lay it ALL on the line. No separation. No "time to think." Either your WW is all-in, or she folds.

It sounds counter-intuitive, I know. However, you cannot nice her back. You cannot do a "pick-me" dance and hope she comes to her senses. It won't work, brother, because, as should be obvious by now, your WW isn't thinking clearly at all.

I know you're hesitant to expose this affair to the boss's wife. You think it's his problem, none of your business. You fear consequences at work, that she might lose her job, etc.. Well, brother, you didn't create this situation and there's no reason you should have to bare this burden for their sake. If your WW is never going to have any contact with this man ever again, how is that going to work if they still work together?

Lay it ALL on the line, Frk. That includes telling the OBS (other betrayed spouse) everything you know! That includes exposing this affair to their work place, insisting your WW quit her job. Don't be an accomplice to infidelity, man. There's no justification to keep this shit a secret yourself. They made their choices and they need to face the consequences of those choices!

In my case, I sent the OBS (who lives out of state) a letter (by restricted mail) explaining everything I knew and how I knew it, providing her with my wife's name, work place, and all of my contact information. It did not enjoy doing that, Frk. I fucking hated that I had to do something like that. But I knew that I would never be able to live with myself if I didn't do everything in my power to tell this woman what I knew about her husband and her marriage. She deserved to know that truth. Now, there was no fall-out. The OBS did nothing to endanger my wife's job and I did nothing to endanger the OMs. There will, however, be some fall-out at their workplace. People with such poor judgment and unprofessional boundaries (not to mention unhealthy ones) should not be in managerial positions!

So weird that I can't bring myself to be madder at her. Maybe I'm still in shock... Emotions change day to day

This rollercoaster of emotions and all the crazy thoughts going through your head are perfectly normal, unfortunately. It will get better with time. I know that doesn't help much now, but, you will start to regain your focus, eventually. Much of that depends upon how your WW behaves, the rest is up to you.

If you truly want to save your marriage and begin the process of recovery, the following books are the "Surviving Infidelity 101" reading list. Both of you should read these, preferably together.

"How to Help Your Spouse Heal from Your Affair," by Linda J. MacDonald.

"Not Just Friends," by Dr. Shirley Glass

"After the Affair," By Dr. Janis Spring.

Also, google "No More Mister Nice Guy." There's a pdf version for downloading.

Take care of yourself, Frk. Focus on you and your recovery for a while. Eat. Sleep. Drink lots of water! Avoid alcohol and drugs (they won't help).

Surviving infidelity is going to test you to the core of your being, man. It's hard, painful, crazy-making shit! But, it is possible to save your marriage.

[This message edited by Unhinged at 9:06 AM, March 8th (Tuesday)]

I agree with you that finances are a big consideration..

Things aren't always so black and white in what one should do or shouldn't do when one has been cheated on..

I'm not advising that you sell your soul for a roof over your head..

Getting out of infidelity is a priority no matter what decisions are made..

I am saying how we get out of infidelity, out of being plan B, can be very creative and should be based on what is realistic in our lives..

I would put your WW in the guest room if being in the master bedroom is more comfortable..

I would stop doing anything for her that a polite stranger wouldn't do..

If I were you, I would go about my day as if you don't need her..

Enjoy your own friends, activities without consideration of her schedule..

Let childcare be her problem at times, let her feel the bite of being single..

Not for manipulation..Purely because every way of life has its pros and cons..Your WW needs to know what it is like to be single because this status may be hers before the year is out..

[This message edited by doggiediva at 9:14 AM, March 8th (Tuesday)]

You've gotten good advice here and not much I can add.

First of all, do not tell others your plans. Do not mention telling the OMs wife to him, let him wonder. If he asks, say I dont know.

Most likely he is already doing damage control with his wife setting you up to be a nutcase or something like that. I don't think meeting him in person is a great idea, just call him and let him know that you know and then let him do the talking.

Do not tell others your plans.

Has your wife answered any of your questions, like where they meet and when they meet privately?

You should view your wife and the OM as your enemies now and this is war. And anything either of them tell you, you can use later on. Act as if you are on a fact finding mission.

Your wife tells you she is in love with this guy, ask your wife what her plans are then.

You mentioned you are afraid to tell the OMs wife because of the job situation, your wife already ruined her job situation.

If there is to be R between your wife and you, she most certainly cannot continue working there. Her workplace seems to condone affairs and it will never be fair to you if she continues to work there.

At this time, you cannot really control your wife, only your own situation. Your wife is in some idiotic fantasy land, just like all WWs get into during an affair and say ridiculous things.

She says she is in love with him. Well when the OMs wife finds out, there is a very good chance he throws your wife under the bus, and then where will you wife be, what will she think then.

Has your wife said she wants to get divorced now?

Does she really think the OM is going to get a divorce for her?

His boss who cheated who your wife thought was scuzzy is different in her mind because she is a really good person and she is in love, so that's OK.

I don't believe this started around Thanksgiving. Can you check the phone logs and emails?

If you maybe want to reconcile, then take some steps. Tell her to break off the affair and allow you to have full access whenever to see her accounts and devices. Get a voice-activated recorder in her car for a week and see what she really thinks as opposed to what she is telling you. You will see that she is still talking with other man.

She has an idea of how she wants this to go. If you were in her plans, she would have let you know loud and clear. It looks like she wants to separate. Then tell everybody your marriage has been bad for a long time and on her side she will tell them all your contrived faults. She does not want anyone to ever know she cheated, others may think it was tawdry and not realize how they were soulmates destined to find each other, stuck with terrible spouses. Then she will be free to be with other man. In the meantime she will work on getting other man to divorce, too. Understand, if she is in love with him, her goal is to be with him. Then when both have divorced, she will be able to tell everyone that they were just good friends in terrible marriages who supported each others and their friendship bloomed to love after both divorces were over.

What makes us fall in love? There are a lot of factors, and it can change. So that does not prevent you from reconciling, she will fall out of love if certain assumptions about him become false. You could do that by pushing on it with asking her to quit, telling other man's wife, telling their place of work, telling her parents, siblings, and friends.

There are psychological and behavioral patterns at play. Cheating is a behavior that is fairly predictable. Think about 4 year olds and 2 year olds, their behaviors when you say "no" are fairly predictable and you can talk with other parents and your kids' actions are very similar. Same is with cheating, the behavior is predictable. Betrayed spouse behavior, too.

Part of why you want her is because you can't have her. You want to "win" her back. It is a common feeling. You probably feel it more since you found out she cheated, while you would think it should be the opposite, you would want her less now. It's a psychological phenomenon that is common.

The affair usually works in a "bubble" of fantasy, sealed in from the outside reality. In the "affair bubble," there are no financial problems, there are no kids to bathe and diaper, no chores like laundry or vacuuming. In the affair bubble, there is sex and "I love you's.". It is a nice place. Some may even see unicorns wandering around.

The way to go forward to reconcile is to bust the affair bubble. If you want yo divorce, the opposite, best if they stay in the bubble where life will be happily after as long as they are together. They will be more pliant to accede to your demands so they can be together because they only need their love together to be happy.

[This message edited by wk55hn at 9:19 AM, March 8th (Tuesday)]

First of all, do not tell others your plans. Do not mention telling the OMs wife to him, let him wonder. If he asks, say I dont know.

Makes sense. Either that or I'll tell him I won't - I'll certainly have no guilt if I then decide to tell her.

Most likely he is already doing damage control with his wife setting you up to be a nutcase or something like that. I don't think meeting him in person is a great idea, just call him and let him know that you know and then let him do the talking.

He already knows I know. My wife told him after I confronted her. No big surprise there.

Has your wife answered any of your questions, like where they meet and when they meet privately?

She told me when it started. I didn't ask locations. Not sure I care.

You mentioned you are afraid to tell the OMs wife because of the job situation, your wife already ruined her job situation.

I'm really just looking out for myself and my kids. The less she makes the more child support/alimony I need to pay.

If there is to be R between your wife and you, she most certainly cannot continue working there. Her workplace seems to condone affairs and it will never be fair to you if she continues to work there.

True, but she's been interviewing in other school districts already to get a principal job. He's also trying to be a superintendent in a different district. So next year there's little chance they'd be in the same building. Not that it would keep them apart...

Has your wife said she wants to get divorced now?

Yes but not "now." She was waiting until she gets a better $ job.

Honestly, typing this all out is making things very clear. Not sure what I was thinking when I thought a R was possible. I'd have to be crazy to want her back.

Does she really think the OM is going to get a divorce for her?

So she says. Says they're probably not going to be together much longer.

That is a great post by WK55HN. It is worth reading slowly and thoughtfully.

Great advice from Unhinged. I wish i followed advice like that when i was in this situation (might have saved my marraige).

It looks like she wants to separate. Then tell everybody your marriage has been bad for a long time and on her side she will tell them all your contrived faults. She does not want anyone to ever know she cheated, others may think it was tawdry and not realize how they were soulmates destined to find each other, stuck with terrible spouses.

Her parents already know she's been unhappy for a while and was close to divorcing me anyway. According to her they have consistently taken my side and tried to convince her she's being ridiculous. She claims that she and her sister are now barely talking b/c of it. Her mom has, in the past, referred to my wife as "her royal highness" when speaking to me. I get along great with her parents, btw.

I 100% agree that the wife deserves to know - still torn about what that will mean financially for me and my kids. But maybe if in that discussion I point out to her that getting them fired will hurt me and my kids she won't do anything rash -- and obviously it would hurt her financially as well since he's the main breadwinner. I would think that would have an effect on her.

In truth she has much more to lose by outing the A at work then you do. I believe you said that your wife was a subordinate... I don't know where they work but having an affair with a subordinate could get him fired, and/or sued. Her first reactions (unless this is a common in their marriage aren't to expose the Affair to work. She has kids, she is going to worry about providing for the family.

The truth is, if they had planned to "run off together" they would have done it when you found out. He would not be planning to meet with you...he wants to save his marriage. You've both got kids to provide for... he isn't going to leave them for woman with another set of kids.

I think your talk with him would go much better if you told his Wife prior to the meeting. That would really tell him he shouldn't be F--- with other men wives.... The meeting you have planned seems so ..."nice". Think about it... your meeting with him to tell him it wasn't cool to sleep with your wife. Yea! That will show him who's boss...that will teach him a lesson...

It will do nothing for you, are you going to believe anything he says?

Her parents already know she's been unhappy for a while and was close to divorcing me anyway

Have you explained the true situation to your Inlaws?

I 100% agree that the wife deserves to know

This is good progress

Please do not confront the POSOM, he is not the one that you took vows with

Has your wife said she wants to get divorced now?

Yes but not "now." She was waiting until she gets a better $ job.

That is a cold attitude.

I think there are several things you need to do now.

I don't see any need to call the OM now, you will have plenty of time to tell him what you think of him.

You should get out in front of this now, when you got married and had kids, you did not sign up for an open marriage so your wife could go out with other guys whenever she feels like it.

File the divorce papers now, give her what she says she wants.

Tell her parents right now, this moment what is going on. Get out in front of that before your wife gets into damage control and makes you the ogre.

And I do think you should tell the OMs wife as soon as possible. You are friends with her and she has a right to know what is about to happen to her life.

You can tell her what your wife told you, that the OM told your wife.

I think the OMs wife has a right to know what is about to happen and she has a right to be able to get her future figured out.

You wont be telling her to hurt the OM, you will be helping her so she can start to figure out the rest of her life.

In truth she has much more to lose by outing the A at work then you do. I believe you said that your wife was a subordinate... I don't know where they work but having an affair with a subordinate could get him fired, and/or sued. Her first reactions (unless this is a common in their marriage aren't to expose the Affair to work. She has kids, she is going to worry about providing for the family.

She's a teacher and unofficial VP at a public elementary school. He's the principal. It would be very ugly for both if this got out, and maybe public. While it would not be rational for her to get them fired, I don't know if she will react rationally. For that reason maybe me being the one to tell her makes more sense so I will give that more thought.

The meeting you have planned seems so ..."nice". Think about it... your meeting with him to tell him it wasn't cool to sleep with your wife. Yea! That will show him who's boss...that will teach him a lesson... It will do nothing for you, are you going to believe anything he says?

It will be anything but nice. No, I won't believe anything he says and I'm not going to even listen to any fake apologies. I know him well enough to know that this will make him uncomfortable though.

I'm seeing my therapist today at 4:00 so I'll ask him what he thinks about this.

Reread my post and I got a little snotty at the end sorry.

If you want to save you marriage you still can. I have three boys similar ages to your three (twins with one 1.5 years older) so I know how tough this is. Please read the string of posts I bumped (I am so crushed) he went through the same though process you are going through but is much further along...but still only a week or two from D-day.

Therapist normally say don't tell. They assume it's out of revenge and arn't thinking about the OBS.