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So WW and I had another long talk last night, and I think I finally got a strait and honest answer.

It seems that she decided ILYBINILWY way back in early 2012 - but just did not have the courage to say anything.

In her mind, we were already done - so the affairs (I now know about another one in November with someone else) don't seem to be bothering her to much.

Of course, I was bustin my ass trying to save a marriage that was already dead, but that my problem.

She's not even willing to try at this point, and we will be going our seperate ways.

I don't know what I did or did not do, because all I can get is "I didn't feel like I should about us." whatever the fuck that means.

I'm shocked and numb right now, but I am sure I will be raging soon enough.

Just wish she would have been honest with me back when she decided so I don't have to deal with the infidelity.

thanks for listening

I'm sorry, Gr8. Just wanted to let you know that you've been heard and aren't alone.

While I know how hard this is for you, just know that this will get easier, and you will suddenly discover how much happier you are without her, the mindgames, and the drama, and it will no longer seem like a sad ending-- it will seem like a promising beginning.

For now, though, take care of yourself, and know that you're not alone in how you're feeling.

(((Gr8Wht71)))

It sounds like she is still in the "fog". I am sorry but initiating the 180 at this point is the best thing you can do for yourself. Hopefully some of the BH's will be along to help. So sorry, that was a very cruel thing for her to say. It is just justification for her actions.

Hey GR8 – So sorry you find yourself here. I would look at it as a blessing that she doesn’t want to try at this point. At least now you have some truth. It could save you months and months of pain. I am not sure if you have any children together which would make it a lot tougher but if not then send her packing. Read up on the 180 and use it. You will not be able to reason with her nor love her back into the marriage. Infidelity sucks dude. I wish I had some magic words for you but there are none. The only magic is time. Right now it seems like the world is crashing in on you and there’s nothing you can do about it. Just please don’t do anything stupid or anything that you would regret. Have courage…something she was lacking. In time you will get better and have a clean conscious. Something she’ll never have. Stay strong brother.

Gr8Wht71- I am new to SI and dealing with incredible pain myself, but my heart goes out to you. I am struggling with a WH who will not, cannot, and refuses to have any remorse- continues to gaslight- yet still wants to work on M? It's confusing and heart-wrenching, and he says that we can't move forward until "I" owe "my half" in it. He actually has the gall to blame me for his infidelities.

My only advice to you is to read here, find support, and take care of yourself. There is an ungodly amount of mighty strength, love, and genuine care on this site- it helps me with every minute to get by, knowing that there is a place for us to draw strength.

Things will get better - someway and somehow. Try to stay strong, and STOP BLAMING YOURSELF. A poster on here told me recently one of the most powerful comments: You didn't cause it. You can't control it. You can't cure it.

Maybe that can give you some strength too.

Sorry brother. All this shit sucks. It seems honesty and fidelity are becoming rare commodities these days.

It seems that she decided ILYBINILWY way back in early 2012

Probably coincided with an affair. If not the PA, at least an EA. Too afraid to tell you she was f'ing around is more likely. Easier to start a new relationship rather than work on an existing one.

I don't know what I did or did not do, because all I can get is "I didn't feel like I should about us."

Of course not, there weren't butterflies and rainbows served with coffee in bed every morning. Typically it's the endorphine high of an affair that we as the BS have to contend with. The daily grind of marriage and all that entails cannot even come clost to that high. It's when the real world intervenes into the affair that a WS might pull thier head out of thier ass long enough to realize what they are doing.

That being said, have you outed the affair to her family? Does the other BS know? Are you still believing her when she tells you who and how many?

File for D. Give her what she wants. Implement the 180 to the n'th degree. Work on yourself. Discuss kids and finances only.

Don't soften the landing for her with any discussions about what went wrong in the marriage, this isn't about you or even what caused this. That's simple, she chose to fuck another man. There are literally hundreds of other ways to work on a marriage, but her choice was this. If and until she owns this, there is no moving forward.

Of course, I was bustin my ass trying to save a marriage that was already dead, but that my problem.

Time to quit. Work on you. Become a better man, father person in general. Don't let her drag you down. If she decides that maybe there is something to be saved or worked on you can always put the D on hold. If not, you are already that many steps down the road without all the drama.

Sorry that I'm so blunt, and I really don't want to be offensive in any way, but I heard a lot of my XW in what you were conveying.

Strength brother.

SAME HERE.

NPD STBXW is the exact same way. She's still waiting for her POSMOM KISA to show up and sweep her off her feet.

Absolutely pathetic and COWARDLY.

Gr8Wht71,

Sorry you are having to go through this. My WW gave me the LYBNILWY speech as well. It's hard to accept that our WW's checked out with us and let another man check-in like that. It's selfish and really screws with our heads. The numbness will get better and you'll be able to think a little more clearly as time goes on. Do what others have said and work on the 180, not for her, but for yourself. Get back to you and the things you like to do. Stay busy. Vent here when you need to. There are a lot of guys who have been through this and can give some great insight and advice.

Again, sorry you are having to deal with all this. Stay strong.

(((Gr8Wht71)))

I'm so sorry. Most of us got the ILYBINILWY speech either during or shortly after the A.

It has nothing to do with our lovability. It hase everything to do with the excuses they give themselves to betray their partner.

Feel everything you need to feel. It won't always hurt this much.

Sending big hugs.

So, so sorry,Gr8. It is really a shame she put you through a false reconcilliation. By being cowardly, she hurt you twice as much as she needed to. I think all of us could have accepted an hones declaration of wanting a divorce, but the betrayal is what is so hard to swallow.

You sound like a great guy. Start looking forward and take care of you. You might check the new beginnins forum. It might give you hope that everything will be OK.

Hugs, and I am so sorry.

Yeah...I noticed her age...its like an epidemic with women (and men) at that age. Its seems that somebody magically comes and plants their heads up their arses. Oh, and self absorbed...yes that too. It is not about you, so stop wondering what you did wrong, because it is her who is runnig from the responsibilities, committment, and decided her feelings are what really matter. I have seen it too many times.

This answer won't make you feel any better, but it is just a society thing, where family unity does not mean squat anymore.

For GR8,

I'm a betrayed wife and recently I actually asked my WH why we couldn't have ended twenty years with dignity and started our new lives with the same...he speaks of how important our daughter and child to be are, but he had affairs and was all over the internet on us anyway.

He has promised a reply and supposedly is writing one to send, but I have chickened out lately and asked him not to send it, thinking I may not actually not want to hear it, in the long run. My pain is still acute-it's only been two months since D-Day, the day before New Year's Eve.

He claims "I could never talk to you honestly or open up", and "you're the only one who ever made me feel that", but he's passive aggressive and extremely narcissistic and also chose that route...then he began his affair with lies, too!

And for Windy, the gas lighting is really something. It often leaves me shaking my head. On stronger days, now that I am losing feelings for him, it makes me snicker to think he still thinks he can put one over on me.

I wanted to ask as a p.s., does anyone have any ideas for coping with the grief, besides the usual platitudes and "get a hobby", when you can hardly get out of bed and change clothes in a day?

And, when there is no remorse from WS, are there ever triggers that may cause any at all?

Thank you everyone for the support. I don't really know any of you, but somehow it helps.

Sometime soon I will have to put the whole thing down in my profile, but I'm just not up to it right now...

Still trying to absorb and process.

What is really tough on me right now is WW has already come to terms with all this mess, while its all news to me. Not just all the fallout, but everything I have to handle to go forward:

Kids {} Finances {} Mortage {} Insurances , etc etc etc

Oh well, I'm not the first, and unfortunately won't be the last

Again, thank you for the support - it means more than you would believe.

[This message edited by Gr8Wht71 at 3:16 PM, March 5th (Tuesday)]

What is really tough on me right now is WW has already come to terms with all this mess, while its all news to me.

Yep, she had a nice long head start of fairytale life to devalue you, villainize you, believe her own blameshifting gibberish lies, timed everything to her selfish needs, her selfish desires, what made her feel best, and I'll bet she was extra,extra bitchy and mean well before D-day, right?

Like my STBXWW, and so many others, they are fucking cowards who talk a good game, but have no soul, and will gladly suck yours dry. Good luck Gr8!

Hi!

I am so sorry. It is such a cowards way out. At the very least you should get some honesty. But sometimes it doesent happen. My ex still trys to make me look crazt. No proof of cheating is real. He tries to turn everything on me. Hes cheated in the worst nastiest ways. I doubt i will ever get any real closure. I hope that you get yours. I really wish you good luck!

So sorry for your pain GR8. If she is not willing to try at this point then all yo can do is take care of yourself. Kick her butt out of the house and tell her to go f**k one of her other guys. I'm sure they will run when they find out they have to put up will all of her bullshit (and bills) now. Letting her go may be just what she needs to realize what she has done to her life.

Gr8Wht71,

I'm so sorry. At least WW finally came out & said it. Her loss, and you will be able to move on rather than being held in limbo. (((Hugs))) I know this is hard, but WW obviously has other things on her front burner right now.

Stick with us here, see an attorney, and remember- life does get brighter! (((More Hugs)))

It seems that she decided ILYBINILWY way back in early 2012 - but just did not have the courage to say anything.

In her mind, we were already done - so the affairs (I now know about another one in November with someone else) don't seem to be bothering her to much.

Of course, I was bustin my ass trying to save a marriage that was already dead, but that my problem.

She's not even willing to try at this point, and we will be going our seperate ways.

Just so you know, and not like there is anything you can do with the information, but...

Quite often such decisions are made retroactively after the affair is full blown. I know my STBXWW made such decisions retroactively, because I have seen all the period documentation in her own words. Even though the decision was made later and became retroactive, it still stands as of the earlier date in her mind, so that is the reality you must deal with going forward.

Gr8,

So sorry to hear this. I feel your pain bro. You have a lot on your plate in not only dealing with the betrayal, but also trying to quantify the wasted months of working to save something already dead. I know it's really hard to get straight in your mind... but it will get better now that you know the real truth. Lawyer up a.s.a.p, then 180 her ass so she can't infect you any more with her whacked out bullshit.

Also, please do yourself a BIG favor and get into IC (if you already haven't done so). You need someone now to help guide you on how to shake loose of all the negative toxins your WW laid on you... that includes falling prey to playing the blame game.

ETA mini t/j

@aesir, as usual you are spot on with your analysis. stbxWW has done (and is still doing) the same thing. I'm amazed how they can rewrite the whole M to their advantage... and even more that they can believe it as true in their warped little minds.