SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

So here it goes ,

I found out 4/17/14 that my wife had been having an affair with the neighbor . I found out after I came home from work and my daughters told me about their day . When telling me the story of the day some of the facts didn't make sense to me .

They said that after they came back from walking around the lake that one of the older girls went in to get an adult because there was a problem . The older girl comes out and says that the OM will be rite out . Of course I don't say anything to them but why 1. Did your mother stay at his house while you guys were gone for that long and his wife was at work . 2. If they were just on the back deck or talking in the kitchen why not come rite out . Leading me to believe that they were probably in some state of being unclothed .

I confronted the wife the following day and of course like all cheaters she lied and lied . She finally broke down and said she didn't have sex with him but only kissed a few times and when he touched her chest she stopped it .

From talking to the wife she swears that it only got physical that one time . She admits to texting / sexting him for 2 weeks . After looking at the phone bill it looks more like a month .

So now for my questions to you fine folks . This is a woman that I've been with for 24 years married for going on 14 . We met in high school and dated ever since . I know her better than anyone in this world . The fact that I know her so well is part of why I don't believe it was only the one time and stopped at kissing. She has a amazing sex drive, to the point that I was the one saying no I'm tired . She is a master at manipulating people and to be honest she is a pretty good liar when she needs to be .

She seems to be very very remorseful and says all the time that she is sorry and that it was the biggest and dumbest mistake of her life . From our talks she tells me that she thought that I didn't love her and was going to leave her . My thought on that is she was telling herself that to justify her actions . I'm not going to say that we didn't have our problems because we did . She would bring up my lack of sex drive and say that it was because I didn't find her attractive , fat, etc. so I went and got my T checked and it was extremely low . I had been taking injections and had been feeling better until she kicked me while I was down . So I told her after this happened "I don't know what more I could have done to prove to you I love you " . I wouldn't walk by her , get off the phone , leave the room and not give her a kiss and tell her I love her . When we would have sex I always went out of my way to please her . I'm not going to get nasty but she would get satisfied multiple times every time we had sex . I brought that up to her as well in why would you risk losing a man that treated you like I did.

I guess my biggest questions are . To the ladies on here is it possible for it to have stopped at kissing ? How do I get past this and trust her again ? Is it worth all the work and money for counseling ? I have to wonder everyday if something is going on because since we had our second child 9 years ago she has stayed home for them . Am I the only one that thinks that the lying and sexting is actually in some way worse than the actual physical act .

Thank you all for your time .

Hi Coach. Very sorry you find yourself here but you have come to the right place. Welcome to SI.

First, you are going to get hit with a lot of abbreviations and you can find most of the abbreviations here in the upper left corner in the Healing Library. Please check that section out.

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/library.asp

Read up on the 180 so that you can decide if you want to use it later. It is designed for you to detach and can be found under BS FAQ here:

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/faq_bs.asp#FAQ11

And more 180 info under the target thread here:

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=232785

I would also recommend reading these target threads in the Just Found Out forum:

Tactical Primer

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=235051

Great Posts for Newbies to Read

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=361740

Boundaries and Consequences 101 for all new BS

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=385631

Before You Say Reconcile...

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/forums.asp?tid=406548

Please read these as well as prep for any sort of upcoming confrontation that you may have with upir WW as well as sending your neighbor an NC letter:

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/healing_library/confrontation/no_contact.asp

http://www.survivinginfidelity.com/healing_library/confrontation/boundaries.asp

I would be extremely cautious about just kissing. Almost all waywards trickle truth (TT) you and the real truth slowly comes out over time. I'm sorry but my personal opinion is that she was way too comfortable doing that with kids around. IMO, they are past kissing and you did not get the truth. Gently here, you both need to be tested for STDs. Ask her to get tested to STDs and pay close attention to her reaction.

Your WW is NOT remorseful. She regrets getting caught. Most remorse doesn't kick in until the fog wears off.

Also, did you tell your neighbor's wife? She needs to know immediately for several reasons. First and foremost she needs to know. Second, having a second set of eyes will help prevent the A from going underground.

All those texts messages, have yo useen them? If they were deleted there are different software packages that can restore them. But the one that fits your wife's phone (you can google them), then once you have it let your WW know that you are going to restore the deleted texts. See what her reaction is. Many times this is where the rest of the truth comes out.

I'm sorry Coach. Your WW messing around like this with kids nearby is is a special kind of shitty.

Please read those other threads. Keep reading. Keep posting. We are here for you.

yop

I am sorry this happened to you. It happened to me over two years ago and I reconciled, so it is possible.

You sound like you have a pretty good grasp on things and are just doubting yourself a little. I think everything you are thinking and feeling is completely normal.

Most cheaters will lie and minimize when caught. You already found out she said two weeks and from what you can see with your own eyes it was more like a month.

Just kissing and light touching - theoretically possible but not likely.

Just happened one time - maybe the most overused lie that cheaters tell - theoretically possible, but not likely.

I think many could forgive the cheating if only the cheater would confess the full truth and ask for forgiveness. However, if you read a lot of these threads, you will see that lying, minimizing, only admitting to what you already have found out, "trickle-truthing" (letting you have one small piece of truth at a time) is more the rule than the exception.

Am I the only one that thinks that the lying and sexting is actually in some way worse than the actual physical act .

That is a common thought at first and then again later on. Being lied to is a complete shock. We go about our daily business and have no idea we were being lied to.

We look back on those days now and realize that damn, we were being lied to. It is hard to explain unless someone as been through it like all of us.

As for why they didnt come right out, hard to say. Maybe they were stopped before it could go further by the daughter going into the house.

You could always ask her to take a lie detector and she how she reacts.

But now, you have to make sure the affair does stop, and that can be hard to do.

Has she given you access to all of her passwords and phones and laptops etc.

I know her better than anyone in this world

So, you have answered your question far better than we ever could.

Am I the only one that thinks that the lying and sexting is actually in some way worse than the actual physical act .

No, you're not. For me, the lying, involving our kids, choosing someone I knew and worked with, who I considered a close personal friend, blaming me for the affairs through criticism, and comparing me unfavorably to her AP were far worse, and harder for me to "get over" than the physical acts she did.

Welcome to the family. Sorry you find yourself here, but know you're in the right place.

I just need to say that is one messed up story. There is so much blameshifting it's sickening. I'm so sorry you're going through this.

Every marriage has its problems, as you pointed out. This affair is solely on her and her obvious bad decisions. If she, for one moment, thought you did love her or was going to leave her than it was her responsibility to ask you and open up communication any her fears. Also, if she was afraid of that then why cheat? Don't these people realize that by cheating they are the ones making leaving a possible reality? Makes no sense to me.

To get to your questions.

To have it stopped at kissing? That is a definite possibility. Maybe with all the sexting she thought she could go further, but when it came down to it she couldn't. She knows the truth and will only tell what she feels you need to know which is the sucky part. It could have gone further but she could be keeping it from you to "not hurt" you. This would be called trickle truth (TT) if you find out later there was more.

To get past it and trust her? That's a hard one. If she is truly remorseful then she'll come clean about everything, give you full transparency to ask accounts and devices etc... It'll be a long road. They say it takes 2 to 5 yrs to heal from infidelity.

It's it worth the time and money? I'd say yes if she is truly remorseful. Only you know of this is your deal breaker.

Any kind of betrayal is devastating. It's not just the act itself. It's the time and commitment it takes, the lying and secrets, the emotions, everything. All that effort could have been better spent working on your marriage instead of destroying it.

Sending you strength and (((hugs)))

Keep posting, it helps.

Wanted to add one more thing. Sounds like you may be blaming yourself a bit in your post. I hope you are not because...THIS IS NOT YOUR FAULT!! Nothing that you did or didn't do caused her to cheat. You may be both responsible for 50/50 in the M issues, but the A is ALL ON HER. There are so many other options and it sounds like you were exploring some to help with the M. Her A though...it's all about how broken your WW is. She needs to get to the bottom of her why she thought it was ok to cheat. Especially with kids nearby. What let her think it was ok to do that to you and your family? Again, all on her.

yop

Sorry this happened, but you are asking the right questions.

First of all, from what you described about your wife's sex drive would suggest that the only kissing thing is absolutely not true. I would proceed on that premise if you want to get the truth.

She absolutely is trying to justify what she has done by blaming you. SHUT THAT DOWN ASAP!!! Don't even entertain conversation suggesting that.

Tomorrow morning I hope you are planning to tell the neighbors wife and expose this thing. Her boyfriend deserves a little excitement in his life.

You know she is probably not telling you the entire truth and your life is going to be miserable until you feel like you are not in the dark.

I would sit her down and her she has one chance to come totally clean to you and that if she does that you will consider going to MC with her . But tell her if you find out in the future she is lying to you there will be divorce in her future.

And lastly; her privilege of privacy and secrecy in your marriage is over. Total transparency of her electronics is not negotiable.

If she is remorseful and committed to you she will have no problem doing anything you ask. If she gets angry and defensive you will also have an answer. Don't listen to the standard line"don't you trust me" ? The answer to that one is NO? And it's her job to earn that trust back, not your job to get over it and rig sweep it.

As things happen , keep posting. The advice you get here is free and better in most cases than you can pay for. No matter what she says or does someone on this forum will have heard it all before

Thank you all for your comments so far . On one of the replies you mention that it's not remorse for the cheating but for getting caught . I have had that thought a lot . She has been on me like a cheap suit . With the non stop I love you and I'm amazing stuff . I'm the same friggin guy I was before all this crap , but yet you cheated on me is what I want to say to her .

I haven't the told other wife yet and I know I need to . I'm just worried about the fall out in the neighborhood with the kids involved . One of the worst parts about this is that I grew to like their kids as my own . I look back at all the times he'd help "us" out and what a fool I was .

I'm a guy that honestly doesn't trust many people in my life . I have a close circle of friends from school days and when I mean small circle like 5 guys I trusted since childhood. I let this ass in and look .

I also want to say thank you for not attacking me . I posted on another unnamed site and got corrected on everything from sentence form to I was a p...y because I didn't go kick the guys ass.

I'm a 6'2" 225 former semi pro hockey player . If I wanted to hurt the guy I would . I've matured and don't see the good from ripping this guys head off , don't think I haven't thought about it however . The way I see it I'd only look like a monster to not only my angels but the other kids as well . Thank you all again and I will be in touch .

Sorry another thing I forgot to ask . Has anyone used any of the software to recover deleted texts on an iPhone and if so what one and did it work . I have also caught her lying about texting the other wife because they were "friends" at the time and I said when she moved back in that I want no contact with anyone down there. She swore she hadn't but again the phone bill says that she did .

Will she ever stop lying??????????

Violence is not advocated here. Healing is. This site has changed my life for the better.

Don't let you wife know that you are going to tell the other BS. She may warn the WH and he may try and do damage control before you get there.

Also, your WW needs to see consequences for her actions. I'm not talking revenge, but she needs to know the damage and pain she has caused. That includes messing up the relationships with the kids. She did this damage. I know you are trying to do damage control and keep it to a minimum, but her actions need to see consequences. After you talk to the other BS, you may want to have your WW send an no contact NC letter.

And yes. She just regrets getting caught at this point. Doubtful she has seen the damage and pain she has caused to so many yet.

yop

Coach

I understand kids are involved but the quickest way to blow up an affair is to expose it. The other wife may become a second set of eyes and if this is more than you know now the OM may dump your wife cold turkey in an attempt to save his ass.

There is no way you are going to maintain a nice neighborhood friendship. You can thank you wife for that.

As far as anyone blaming you that won't happen here. Whatever problems there were , YOU did not choose to cheat.

She did, and it is highly likely you don't have any idea what is out there yet for you to discover so be prepared.

Coach, sad to say, but your wife is your least reliable source of information right now. The phone bill doesn't lie, so if you saw the texts only began about a month ago, I think you can safely assume that the affair started either a little before that or a little after that.

One thing I learned is that when you are getting a story that doesn't make sense, it is because that story is a lie. When you get the truth, it all will make sense. On the day you first found out, why did it take them so long to get outside, it makes no sense, right? Probably is a lie. I think it probably safe to evaluate her story on that basis.

Another thing I learned is that the simplest answer is usually the right one.

Another thing I think you can do is to put yourself in your wife's shoes. Get an hour or so to yourself, sit down, and try to think like your wife. You know your wife pretty well after all these years. She says she thought you didn't love her and were about to leave her. If that were true, what would be the best course of action? Try to fix things up with you? Have a heart-to-heart with you? Seek marriage counseling? Try to plan for divorce? Or go "kiss" the other man? It makes no sense. Even if you were in the process of divorce, how does "kissing" him make any sense, how is "kissing" him OK? He still is married, he is your friend, he is your neighbor, your wife is friends with his wife, and your kids are friends with his kids. A romantic/sexual relationship with married neighbor other man who is your good friend would be off limits and inappropriate even if you and your wife were divorced and dating other people.

From my experience, these affairs don't usually start on a dime and they don't usually stop on a dime. There is a lead up to the affair, and there is a wind down as well. Even when caught, they usually don't just end cold turkey. In your case, they live next door to each other. It also sounds like maybe the other man is around during the day when you are not and his wife is not. Unless you have some pressing reason not to, I recommend telling the other man's wife about what you've been told, and also what you really believe happened. Be ready that the other man may already have prepared his wife by telling her that you may have gotten the wrong idea, your wife was the aggressor and he fought her off, etc.

It sounds like your wife and the other man both are home while you and the other man's wife are both at work. Have you considered putting some type of nanny cam or spy cam or voice-activated recorder in or near your house to monitor things for a short time, maybe a week or two? If they still are in contact, they probably know better than to use texting again. And you probably wouldn't have to monitor in that way for very long to see if they still were in contact. If they are, at least you know the truth and can act accordingly. If they are not, then at least you have some peace of mind that your wife is telling the truth. Also, if your wife has any close friends she confides in, you may find out the truth from overhearing her talking to one of them about it.

Coach, below is "Joseph's Letter." It is something I found after I first discovered my wife's affair and it helped me a little.

This is a copy of a post by Joseph, a member of the now defunct BAN Message Board. He wrote to this letter to his wife to explain why he asked for details of her affair.

To Whomever,

I know you are feeling the pain of guilt and confusion. I understand that you wish all this never happened and that you wish it would just go away. I can even believe that you truly love me and that your indiscretion hurts you emotionally much the same way it hurts me. I understand your apprehension to me discovering little by little, everything that led up to your indiscretion, everything that happened that night, and everything that happened afterwards. I understand. No one wants to have a mistake or misjudgment thrown in his or her face repeatedly. No one wants to be forced to 'look' at the thing that caused all their pain over and over again. I can actually see, that through your eyes, you are viewing this whole thing as something that just needs to go away, something that is over, that he/she doesn’t mean anything to you, so why is it such a big issue? I can understand you wondering why I torture myself with this continuously, and thinking, doesn’t he/she know by now that I love him/her? I can see how you can feel this way and how frustrating it must be. But for the remainder of this letter I’m going to ask you to view my reality through my eyes.

You were there. There is no detail left out from your point of view. Like a puzzle, you have all the pieces and you are able to reconstruct them and be able to understand the whole picture, the whole message, or the whole meaning. You know exactly what that picture is and what it means to you and if it can effect your life and whether or not it continues to stir your feelings. You have the pieces, the tools, and the knowledge. You can move through your life with 100% of the picture you compiled. If you have any doubts, then at least you’re carrying all the information in your mind and you can use it to derive conclusions or answers to your doubts or question. You carry all the 'STUFF' to figure out OUR reality. There isn’t really any information, or pieces to the puzzle that you don’t have.

Now let’s enter my reality. Let’s both agree that this affects our lives equally. The outcome no matter what it is well affect us both. Our future and our present circumstances are every bit as important to me as it is to you. So, why then is it okay for me to be left in the dark? Do I not deserve to know as much about the night that nearly destroyed our relationship as you do? Just like you, I am also able to discern the meaning of certain particulars and innuendoes of that night and just like you, I deserve to be given the opportunity to understand what nearly brought our relationship down. To assume that I can move forward and accept everything at face value is unrealistic and unless we stop thinking unrealistically I doubt our lives well ever 'feel' complete. You have given me a puzzle. It is a 1000 piece puzzle and 400 random pieces are missing. You expect me to assemble the puzzle without the benefit of looking at the picture on the box. You expect me to be able to discern what I am looking at and to appreciate it in the same context as you. You want me to be as comfortable with what I see in the picture as you are. When I ask if there was a tree in such and such area of the picture you tell me don’t worry about it, it’s not important. When I ask whether there were any animals in my puzzle you say don’t worry about it, it’s not important. When I ask if there was a lake in that big empty spot in my puzzle you say, what’s the difference, it’s not important. Then later when I’m expected to understand the picture in my puzzle you fail to understand my disorientation and confusion. You expect me to feel the same way about the picture as you do but deny me the same view as you. When I express this problem you feel compelled to admonish me for not understanding it, for not seeing it the way you see it. You wonder why I can’t just accept whatever you chose to describe to me about the picture and then be able to feel the same way you feel about it.

So, you want me to be okay with everything. You think you deserve to know and I deserve to wonder. You may honestly feel that the whole picture, everything that happened is insignificant because in your heart you know it was a mistake and wish it never happened. But how can I know that? Faith? Because you told me so? Would you have faith if the tables were turned? Don’t you understand that I want to believe you completely? But how can I? I can never know what is truly in your mind and heart. I can only observe you actions, and what information I have acquired and slowly, over time rebuild my faith in your feelings. I truly wish it were easier.

So, there it is, as best as I can put it. That is why I ask questions. That is where my need to know is derived from. And that is why it is unfair for you to think that we can effectively move forward and unfair for you to accuse me of dwelling on the past. My need to know stems from my desire to hold our world together. It doesn’t come from jealousy, it doesn’t come from spitefulness, and it doesn’t come from a desire to make you suffer. It comes from the fact that I love you. Why else would I put myself through this? Wouldn’t it be easier for me to walk away? Wouldn’t it be easier to consider our relationship a bad mistake in my life and to move on to better horizons? Of course it would, but I can’t and the reason I can’t is because I love you and that reason in itself makes all the difference in the world.

Joseph

Why all this intense remorse if they only kissed?

Consider the facts:

1] She has a very high sex drive

2] she justified her cheating with 'I thought you didn't love me' which can be paired with the unspoken accusation 'you are not showing me you love me'. Now we have some resentment.

3] She also justified her cheating with 'you don't find me physically attractive anymore'

3] She is a consummate manipulator and liar.

From the above I would say they have probably had full sex a few times. Now she is in damage control [more lying] in an effort to save her marriage. You might threaten the neighbor with disclosure to his wife if he doesn't come clean. Claim your wife has confessed to going all the way and see what the neighbor says..

Hello again , so I'm sitting here at work just thinking about things . I wanted to ask you fine folks a question . Am I the only one that sits and thinks why ? Why this guy/girl that's not as attractive as I am ? Why would she/he do this when I make him/her orgasm so hard she begs me to stop so she can breath ? Does it make it worse when the other person literally has nothing on you ? I mean not looks, money , love , work ethic , good father/mother ? I know some people might say that I'm just being spiteful about the other man , but I'm just confused , Do you ever get your self esteem back ? I never thought I was a model but damn . HELP !!!!!!!

Clearly having a bad day

Am I the only one that sits and thinks why ?

No, I think the vast majority of us ask this question. And, I think most of us come up with

an answer that really has nothing to do with us.

Why this guy/girl that's not as attractive as I am ? Why would she/he do this when I make him/her orgasm so hard she begs me to stop so she can breath ?

Of course, I did sit and wonder. For quite a while, but then I began to understand that the affair is NOT ABOUT ME. It's not about attractiveness, and it's not about sex.

It's about STROKES. It's about the exhilaration that comes from clandestine meetings, being told how wonderful you are, the brain hormones which flow.

Do you ever get your self esteem back ?

If you had some to begin with, then, chances are you will.

Does it make it worse when the other person literally has nothing on you ?

No, it was made worse by her comparisons of him to me which made him seem like a "porn star".

It would have been far less damaging to me if she had not done this. Because, like you, I had it all over him. He was a grungy, green-teeth, beer-bellied, 5-8, blue-collar factory worker. He could not compete with me in looks, earning power, education, or ability.

That's why she had to lie about the size of his genitalia and his skill in bed. She would have looked like a total idiot if she tried to compare me in other ways. She had to pick something I didn't know about him.

I understand that many people affair "down" like this, too.

[This message edited by tfkeel at 2:38 PM, July 20th (Sunday)]

Coach

Please stop worrying about why right now. You need to worry about and find out what happened . You do not know the extent of it and as long as you sit there and stew in your thoughts instead of blowing it up you are going to be in limbo.

You MUST tell his wife if only out of decency .

If you read other posts here you will see clearly what happens and what you are asking for if you put your head in the sand.

Before you can ask any more questions you need to know what you are asking about and right now you do not

Your wife is acting right out of the cheaters handbook and you are being manipulated.

Get yourself together and out some real pressure on her

Thank you bad , I think what you said is what I need . I need a swift kick in the ass . The problem is it's to damn embarrassing to talk to friends about this , so nobody has kicked me in the ass yet and got me going . Yes when I confronted her I was out I front , but since I will admit I've let her take control again and manipulate me . Why the hell do I do this ? I manage people all day long and don't take any crap . If they mess up I call their bullshit out . Could it be just that ? I deal with being the alpha all day that when I get home I just allow myself to be controlled instead of being the controller ? Or is it that I don't want to believe that the woman that I thought I had for 24 years and trusted more than anyone on this rock we live on isn't that person at all ?

Or is it that I don't want to believe that the woman that I thought I had for 24 years and trusted more than anyone on this rock we live on isn't that person at all ?

This is why you need the truth. You need to know what you're dealing with. You already know that your wife has crossed a boundary you never would have believed she would cross. To have any chance of Reconciliation, she needs to provide you with the whole truth. A lie detector is sometimes used to help clear the air. Would she be willing to take a lie detector test? Her answer to that question might be illuminating.

Telling the other betrayed spouse will put the brakes on the affair. It's the right thing to do. You'd want to know.