SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I've included this as a part of previous posts of mine, but it is eating away at me and I needed to just see what everyone here thinks.

Ever see the movie "Horrible Bosses"? Though it is a comedy, in it one of the characters notes that his whole life all he wanted to be when he grew up is a husband. That is how I've ALWAYS felt. I have always wanted to be a husband and father. I have made career moves to ensure that I am around for my children, my wife, my family - that is the man I wanted to be - and used to be proud that I was.

WW had an affair with my total opposite. Oil to my water. She loved that he was: carefree, free spirited, decisive, confident, etc.

She loved his "hot" body (admitantly, I let my physique slip a bit because I prioritized - work, family, husband and didn't make time for MYSELF - that is my mistake, and one I am working on). She loved his ability to say - I'm gonna go rock climbing this weekend and that he would just do it.

Before all this - when things were good, WW was my best friend - we shared EVERYTHING - laughed at EVERYTHING - she was, for the most part, the only person on this planet who I thought made me a better person. I used to KNOW I was an amazing person - and she made me a better one.

At some point after our second child was born - that changed. She started distancing herself from me, picking fights with me, and just being unhappy. In hindsight, she probably needed some therapy - but that's the thing with hindsight, it's always 20/20. Things got better and leveled out - until they got WAY worse.

Early 2014 she completely distanced herself from me and began a full on EA with this guy. I knew it was a friendship I wasn't comfortable with, I begged it to stop - she wouldn't stop it. What choice did I have but to go along with it - she's an adult - she loves me. What is wrong with me right? The thing is, I was devasted, I lost my best friend. Forget losing my lover, wife, and partner. I lost my best friend - I had never heard of an EA until the end. I thought I would just have to work harder to show her I'm way cooler than her new "friend".

Fast forward to November, I spend months feeling furious - we are fighting ALL the TIME. ALWAYS OVER HIM. I felt disrespected over this friendship - every boundry was crossed - and then I find out it was a PA. My whole world crumbled down around me. It is still in pieces.

WW gave me the whole "love you but not in love with you" line. Things are a little better now. WW is TRYING. WW is REMORSEFUL. WW is TRANSPARENT.

However, I'm broken. What kind of a man allows this to happen. Our MC says that I am still being too nice to WW. The thing is - I am a nice person - It's not a facade - I don't feel like I'm being "true to myself" if I don't act that the person that I KNOW I am. I've read the book "No More Mr Nice Guy" - I understand the concept - but I disagree with some of the principals. I know I have a personality flaw of being "self sacraficing" - that aspect of me, I am working on and will be starting IC to work on further. The other acts of my niceness though, that is who I am.

All this makes me think I have no chance at ever feeling manly again. How can WW even look at me now and think that I am manly? I KNOW she still thinks of him and misses him.

Sorry for the super long rant/story. I just need some support.

Read "the married mans primer to sex 2011"

It takes the concepts in no more mr nice guy but it makes more sense.

Do it for you! Become a man women respect and want to be with. Your wife may respond. If not you are priming yourself for the next one.

You can not nice her back!

However, I'm broken. What kind of a man allows this to happen

manwhocantbemove - all kinds. You're not broken; your WW is.

While not trying to sound like some superman ... I'm all those things you say are the opposite of you. My WW met me when I was racing motorcycles. I'm fit. I rock climb. I snowboard. I'm incredibly self confident in my personal and professional life. I tend to think I'm a good guy and a caring H, but at the same time I don't let people take advantage of me and am never afraid of confrontation. In general? Pretty "manly", right?

Guess what? Didn't matter. I have a WW just like you do.

This has about as much to do with being "manly" as the price of tea in China.

An A isn't about you; it's about your WW. There is something broken inside her and *you can't fix that*. You can help her figure it out, yes, but ultimately she is the one that has to come to terms with it and figure out the problem(s).

You can be a "nice guy" ... but not right now. It doesn't work. Trust me on this one, and trust all the other folks here who will tell you the same thing. The only thing that will snap your WW out of this is consequences for her actions, and a slap of reality. Be kind and nice to people when they deserve it, not when they're jabbing a knife into your back.

If you WW is still thinking of her AP then you're not in R. You're playing "pick me" and it's a game you won't win. It's only going to prolong your pain. And MC is a complete waste of time if that's the case, and your MC should know this.

If your WW isn't recommitted to your M, see a lawyer, draw up the D papers. Tell her that she gets to pick - you, or D. In general, that's about the only way to smack a foggy WW off the fence. You can always stop the D proceedings if she comes around and figures out what her choices have done.

I know you don't want to hear this, and it sucks. Stay strong.

[This message edited by AnotherOne at 2:42 PM, January 19th (Monday)]

All I could think of while reading your post is the saying "don't mistake my kindness for weakness." So, I guess my question is...are you kind but strong? Or is what you are referring to kindness in the post often weakness. I don't think you should ever stop being kind, but I don't think you should allow yourself to be a doormat either. I think you have to remember that some people will never appreciate a kind person, but that is their deficiency. You don't become an asshole for her, you find someone who can appreciate your kindness.

Also please keep in mind, you didn't cause this or drive her into the manly caveman's arms.

..

..holy crap man!!! your definition of 'manliness'needs to be revised if you think you're not and he is!!??

..he's not manly... he's a piece of dirt!

..

How can WW even look at me now

..how about: "How can WW even look at HERSELF NOW ??"

..i'd have to say that she has a lot of work to do to 'WIN YOU BACK' ..

..and you can hit the gym, whatever choice you make... as said, get buffed for the next good woman in your life!

..good luck to you! remember..

..losing your waistline is not a measure of your manliness..

smy

[This message edited by somanyyears at 9:32 PM, January 19th (Monday)]

Briarrose you wrote:

All I could think of while reading your post is the saying "don't mistake my kindness for weakness." So, I guess my question is...are you kind but strong? Or is what you are referring to kindness in the post often weakness. I don't think you should ever stop being kind, but I don't think you should allow yourself to be a doormat either.

Prior to this I have always considered myself a strong person. I am kind, but had never considered myself weak until this. I KNOW of my personality flaw of being self sacraficing (to the point of being a doormat), and I am working on that. However, my kindness is not something I want to change about myself. WW destroyed me - I can't let her change that.

Anotherone you wrote:

If you WW is still thinking of her AP then you're not in R. You're playing "pick me" and it's a game you won't win. It's only going to prolong your pain. And MC is a complete waste of time if that's the case, and your MC should know this.

I know we are not in R yet - we (or at least I) am trying to get there. However, I agree with you that MC may be getting to be a waste of time. I don't want to start working on underlying issues - the underlying issues that are still f'ing everything up are HERS and HERS ALONE.

SMY you wrote:

..holy crap man!!! your definition of 'manliness'needs to be revised if you think your not and he is!!??

I know. I'm f'd up in the head. Thing is WW chose him. It kills me.

Thank you everyone for the support and words.

You didn't allow this to happen. Your wife did, with her brokenness and her shit boundaries. Don't take her shit on, that's hers to carry.

It's easy for a WS to take us for granted when they think we will always be there. As angry as I got with my H, I kept sticking it out and taking abuse upon abuse, until one day I was just done. I had told him I was done before, but until I had had enough and accepted that I had no control over his behavior, but 100% control over how much more of his shit I wanted to take, he absolutely felt that he could just do any old thing he wanted and I would be there waiting. When he realized that wasn't the case, it shocked the living shit out of him. He went home and cried for hours while I was at work, then when I came home he started telling me the truth. It was a seismic shift in our relationship.

Please stop blaming yourself for her affair. Have you heard of the 180? I think it would be a very good idea for you to pull away from her and focus on yourself. Not to punish her, but to heal your wounds. You've been dealt a huge blow. Try being kind to YOURSELF.

I just realized that your ww posted on the wayward forum.

Look her head isn't right. You can NOT fix her head by being nice. She has to fix her.

Your priority should be to yourself and kids. Do what you need to feel good about yourself. Being nice now means being nice to yourself. You must make your needs a priority.

Are you in ic?

I came to a realization about 2 weeks ago that I was doormat. I am faking it now until it's natural. But I am already feeling the dynamic of my marriage changing. I'm still nice. But now I am nice to myself first before being nice to her.

Mike you wrote:

Your priority should be to yourself and kids. Do what you need to feel good about yourself. Being nice now means being nice to yourself. You must make your needs a priority.

Are you in ic?

I have been focusing on myself a bit more - but it is difficult. Since I work from home I am around and she is 34 weeks pregnant with our 3rd. I am not doting on her by any means, but I am still focused on her needs as the mother of my 3rd child.

I am going to be starting IC this week or next.

manwhocantbemove, not that I want to stroke your ego but what you have typed up about you is all what a good woman wants to be her husband. You are not the broken one and you have nothing to be ashamed of. Your WW, on the other hand, should look into the mirror and ask herself "what have I done to hurt the kind man in my life?". She is the one that's broken.

Nothing you did or did not do caused her A. She made the decision to break the vows and strayed outside the marriage. You were there to be her husband and a father to the kids but she, on the other hand, decided to find some "excitements"!

Are you sure she is remorseful and not regretful? What has she done to show you that she is in NC with the OM? Has she been 100% transparent with you, given you all the passwords to her phone, email accounts, social media sites, etc.? Are you guys in MC and IC?

Take a moment to think about what you want in this relationship. Is this relationship even reparable? Does she want to R? If both of you want to R, then you need to lay down some ground rules with real consequences if she breaks any of them.

You are manly enough to get through this trauma. You are a kind man who has a shitty wife. Let her know there are consequences of her actions. R means lots of work on her shoulder. She needs to proof that she is worth given a 2nd chance. Let her win you back, Mr. Nice guy.

Hang in there. We are all here to give you the support.

I am still focused on her needs as the mother of my 3rd child.

Think of it as focusing on the needs of your 3rd child; any serving of her needs is incidental. You can be kind but you should not serve her. Faithless people do not merit service.

Hard question: Are you sure the child she carries is yours? Her word cannot be trusted.

Her betrayal is not your fault. Nor is it your job to try to change yourself to get her back, or to fix her. I strongly doubt she is truly remorseful at this time, and she may never be, so take care of yourself and your children and work on yourself. MC is pretty useless until you've met your own needs first. Get your own counselling and move forward yourself. She is not the woman you thought she was, your relationship with her is vastly different from what you believed it was, and it will take time for you to come to grips with that fully. This place can help you do that.

There's a Betrayed Men's thread in "I Can Relate" forum. Check it out if you haven't already. The manliness you truly have is far greater than that which you feel you have lost.

It sucks to be us, but this site is a good place to be in this situation.

I'll put it very simply, unless you held a gun to her head and FORCED her to have an affair - you didn't cause this!

Her choices led to her affair. At any point, she could have said 'no, I don't want to hurt my husband or my kids." She didn't, is that the example of who your kids should become/marry you want her example to be?

Hopefully, she does the hard work needed to uncover her reasons for cheating. And works toward rebuilding and regaining your trust.

K

Bro, your seriously putting OM up on a pedestal like your WW has. Want to know why OM can live that type of life ? Because he is a scumbag who poaches other men's wives, he lives the life of a fucking bum. Of course his life looks exciting from the outside, he has zero responsibility to anyone but himself. He is vermin who lives off the hard work of others. One day his lifestyle is going to catch up with him and he is going to have to answer for his behaviors. Dudes like him need to put up a good front and have all of these hangers on like your WW to validate his shitty existence. Fact of the matter is they never live up to their own hype, they are basically cowards who will run under some rock once confronted, their perceived sexual prowess is actually selfish attempts at sex acts that cant get their partners off. In real life they are hardly the legends they portray themselves to be. Seriously bro, this fucker couldn't make a life, family, career for himself so he attempts to steal another guys world.

You have more manliness in your shit then that guy has in his whole body. Don't sell yourself short buddy because this prick is nothing but smoke and mirrors. I know exactly who he is because he is the same type of hump who my XWW had an A with. All fucking talk and little if any action. I used to be you pal and it took me some time but I realized that the OM was a fantasy just like the A was. I had the displeasure of reading thousands of sexual communication between my XWW and the OM. This shit would have made Hugh Hefner blush it was that dirty. Turns out OM liked to jerk off to dirty e-mails, chats. texts phone calls etc. When I first read those fucking dirty things I though that OM had to be this sexual Hercules, he worked out daily, talked himself up like a politician, and claimed to be a better lover than Don Juan. When I reread the communication I realized that OM never got my XWW off sexually. After building up himself up sexually after they finally screwed he was always apologizing for not being able to last more then a few seconds. He covered that up by telling my XWW that she was so hot he couldn't help himself. Turns out the actual sex was over with before it started. But like most WW my X was in for the attention and fantasy. The sex was just a trade off for what she perceived as a better life. As soon as his W found out of the A he threw my XWW under the bus and ran for the hills. He crawled back under the same rock he crawled out from and the last communication I had with the pussy was him cry to me to stop fucking with his life, asking me to think of his disabled children. I backed off because I had gotten my desired affect and as it tuned out the cowards lied about his kids being disabled. But sadly the one thing I couldn't change was that my XWW was in love with the fantasy that the OM portrayed. That's why she is my XWW not my FWW. Keep in mind that if your WW is like mine you cant compete with a fantasy. Your only recourse is to toss her to the curb and try and start over. Don't allow your WW to idolize the OM, if she does you gotta give her the boot because its simply never going to work.

Don't let this shell of a man make you think he is better then you. He is a punk who couldn't wipe you ass in the manhood department. Any guy who needs to hide behind a larger then life persona is simply a scared little man who cant or wont allow himself to live in the realm of reality. Any man who needs constant validation and attention is nothing more than a pussy. Real men are like you and me, the type of guys who do the right thing, sacrifice their own happiness for the sake of their families. The type of men who get up everyday and earn an honest days wage to support their families. They type of men who are secure in their manhood and don't need to fuck other men's women to make ourselves feel better.

that is the man I wanted to be - and used to be proud that I was.

What you were was a real Man. The OM you describe isn't a man. He's still a boy. How would you feel about yourself if you were those things?

I know what you're feeling. It really sucks, but it will get better. Keep being yourself and do things for you. It will get better.

You sound like a great man, and NOT unmanly at all!! There is a woman out there looking for you, if you and your WW do split.

My 2nd H is self sacrificing too, but I am the same way. You need someone who sees it and will appreciate it.

Hang in there!

Stronger08 - although it wasn't directed to me, your speech could have been at one time, and I just wanted to say I think it was AWESOME! Gave me a boost too, so thanks man!

MWCBM - imagine I was exactly like you, except 4 kids instead of 3. I discovered a nightmare, like you - involving a creep similar to yours (smooth talker) - except for the 'hot body part...

I did the same thing, thought the same thing you did - 'that is not me' 'I can't be the 'bad guy' - I love her too much'.

THIS is where you have to get to - Read Stronger's post. You have to get a bit angry. You have to respect YOURSELF. If you are a good man, and a good father, and a good husband - dammit RESPECT YOURSELF FOR IT. Don't allow yourself to be disrespected for doing the right thing your whole life.

Put yourself and your kids first now. Take care of your needs - emotionally, psychologically - so you can be healthy for your children.

Be strong, and set the boundaries that you KNOW are fair and reasonable - and enforce them. Say what YOU need, because you have earned it, trust me. We all paid for it in raw, horrible pain. Do not allow yourself to be sidetracked - stand tall and be proud because you have faced the worst thing that a spouse can do to you and you are STILL HERE.

[This message edited by jobin at 5:07 PM, January 19th (Monday)]

Listen Manwho...I'm not someone who was born yesterday, I've been around the block a time or two, and I'm ALL woman! So believe me when I say I know "normal" women...and ANY normal woman would find you very manly and appreciate the traits you have and your faithfulness and devotion!

You want to hit the gym & beef it up...ok...but do it for YOU! Trust me, at the end of the day, that's NOT what us normal, real women want!

My FWH has always had a slim build, average in height, dark complexion, dark hair (well...a little grey mixed in now...ha!) Was & still is very good looking. His A was 26 years ago...but my point is...he was not a "body builder" by any means, but I fell in love with his personality at the age of 18. I believe that's also what attracted his AP. Her H had a much more muscular build. Get my point?

STOP letting her make you feel this way! Manly comes from the inside my friend...it really does!

And don't change for her, whatever changes you make, make sure YOU are happy with them!

Sending prayers for strength & courage to just be YOU!

I capitalize to emphasize, not yell..

ManWho...

As a man, I understand only too well where you are coming from. It is so painful, and unfair. The facts are that you placed yourself last, and family ahead, because you care.

The POS OM, however, placed himself first, naturally. Why it is that women sometimes are drawn toward this bogus appearance of the dashing stud, I will never understand. Its the stupid old "bad boy" syndrome. They always see that he's a selfish jerk in the end, but not until they've trashed their marriage, degraded themselves, and destroyed the man who actually cares for her. Its damned disgusting.

Unfortunately, for some women, "nice" comes off as weak. You'll probably hear "your can't nice her back".

I don't know if its possible to get over the wound. I haven't. I think you have to learn to live with it.

One thing you can do is think, feel, and act like a man. You're smart, you know what the best way to handle most situations. Put that into action.

Take her to counseling. Get this thing out in the open in front of someone, and get your feelings heard.

Cheating is the ultimate sign of selfishness. The OM doesn't give a crap about anything but his wants. He's no man.

The harder part is to realize your wife is also selfish. She wouldn't have done this if she weren't.

You, are not. You take care of your family. That's manly. The OM is nothing but a POS. Take consolation in that.

Now, its YOUR game. You call the shots, you make the decisions, and you dictate the terms. She must face that she is a selfish person who betrayed her husband. That is low. She effing betrayed you. She is incapable of carrying the family forward. Its you, or no one. That's a man's job.

[This message edited by jcanada at 5:51 PM, January 19th (Monday)]

Get a lawyer. File for divorce. Get a paternity test on that kid to be. Don't sign the birth certificate without a DNA test. Buy a new truck and get a pretty new girlfriend. Put it all behind you. You are a man and you deserve honor and respect in your home and your relationship.

Stronger- everything you wrote was amazing - thank you, I needed that.

Everyone else who commented - thank you as well.

It's unfortunate that my niceness was considered a weakness and that my willingness to put my family, and my wife, before myself can be thought of by anyone, especially my WE as a weakness and unmanliness.

I agree that what I've always done to provide and take care of my family is manly. I'm just struggling with it now that WW pulled everything that I thought I knew out from under me.