SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

So your happiness in R is related to the reason you chose R to begin with?

I think so.

Someone with a different reason will have a different outcome?

maybe. but I think the odds are better when you weigh the factors I did.

I get that, but below are direct quotes from SI threads:

I stayed BECAUSE I love my spouse and because our relationship was worth saving

I stayed because I wanted to be able to tell my children that I tried.

I stayed because it was the lesser of two evils

I stayed because he deserved another chance.

I stayed because I gave up my career and had a baby

I stayed because I was terrified I would be alone

I stayed because I realized that I had tried to reconcile alone before

I don't think any of these people were "interested in how it's landing so far" to BS' that are thinking about leaving.

They say these things because they feel good about their decision, and feel people will respect them for it.

How it lands to a BS that's thinking about leaving, who is probably just as scared about their decision as people who decide to stay, probably never occurs to them

So wait, are you truly bothered by members posting those things? Or are you manufacturing feigned outrage to make a rhetorical point?

I’m not trying to be an asshole, I am honestly wondering. Because if those statements bother you then I don’t see how any BS that is in R could give any explanation at all as to the reason they chose to stay without running the risk of offending you. Kind of makes for some pretty short conversations about R.

I am assuming that you are making a rhetorical point to demonstrate how the same argument in reverse stifles discussion of reasons to D. Which I would agree could be a valid argument.

Just making sure I’m getting your meaning without tone or context.

Hellfire

It's a good point that it's not just childless BS's who are being told to run. I have become more sensitive to that since starting this thread. There are some voices who nearly always advocate for divorce. I guess the issue is with minorities. The vast majority of posters on SI are middle-aged with children. Usually the WS has had a one-time A, sometimes had one in the early stages of the M which was rugswept. So the majority of posters have that background. So when there is a case of sex addiction, serial cheating, an OC, ..., there is a lot less understanding and empathy because posters don't understand that background. I get that.

I second what Lowlow said:

Ultimately I would ask everyone on SI to consider that some relationships are worth persevering and preserving even when kids are not involved. Cutting and running is not the decision that is always best for every relationship. Please be respectful of that choice as we childless couples are respectful of your decision to stay even if it is just for the kids

I think posters would do well to remember that prior to infidelity happening to them, they thought they would never stay with the cheater, whatever the circumstances. Possibly they were even a little judgey if they found out that a couple was staying together after one had cheated. Yet now they understand that choice. It's the same with judging childless couples (or young, or old, etc.).

HoldingTogether

I am assuming that you are making a rhetorical point to demonstrate how the same argument in reverse stifles discussion of reasons to D. Which I would agree could be a valid argument.

I strongly disagree. I believe that to be intellectual dishonesty. I actually have no problem with people discussing reasons to D, what is problematic for me is being told to D and that any other choice is stupid and not to be "tolerated". If cheatstroke actually meant what you think he meant, I am withdrawing from this conversation as I don't feed trolling. I can also get cynical, and the thought did occur to me that he might be doing that, but I choose to assume that posters who say they struggle with something ACTUALLY are struggling with that, not trying to make a point.

You can have different reasons for not eating cake that don't mean you don't actually love it.

Exactly. I LOVE cake. I can not eat it, though, because I have celiac disease.

I stayed BECAUSE I love my spouse and because our relationship was worth saving

I am one who gave my FWH a chance at R because I loved him. I have read many many stories here of members reconciling but the BS's claiming they don't love their WS. They are in a quandary when their WS tell their BS they love them and the BS's can't tell the WS that they love them back. I have seen many threads about this in R. "What Do You Say When Your WS Says I Love You". It confuses me. However, I try to be supportive because that is their choice. Although, I ask sometimes why they are with their WS if they don't love them. And, many have their reasons. Keeping a family intact and/or finances, for some, and various other reasons. I get it, but it makes me sad they are in that situation.

I also didn't feel noble giving R a shot. I felt stupid. I felt foolish. Some here at SI reinforced that feeling in me. Having a child at home, I did want to keep his family intact, though, if possible. If I didn't love my FWH I don't know if I would have given him a chance or not. I feel like I think I wouldn't, but I also thought infidelity was a dealbreaker. Period.

So...bottom line. Listen to the member. Support their choices. As long as they aren't being abused or abusive themselves. Try not to project. Meet the member where they are at. Warn of possible pitfalls and obstacles without the absolutism.

No one can make your decisions for you, OP. But when a poster asks for opinions, they're going to get a whole variety of them.

Personally, I have no problem recommending permanent separation to a BS who isn't tied to their cheater forever by shared parenting or to one who is dealing with boyfriend/girlfriend drama. Life is shorter than most people think, and there's a whole world of people out there who are already living within the parameters of their own stated values.

Frankly, I'd have given my eyeteeth for that chance to start over. Instead, I got cheated on 30 years after, when my youth was gone and most of my vigor. My WH and I are in R right now, our kids are grown, and most days we're relatively happy. But was it worth it? Was it worth the pain and the life-changing trauma I experienced?... NO. It most certainly wasn't. If I could have the day I met him back, I'd have run like a scalded dog. You bet I would.

It's easy to view others as being judgmental. But we're all a product of our own experiences, and while I'm typically willing to help a determined BS who's bent on R to explore the options, I'm not going to apologize for being me.

Iris,

I actually have no problem with people discussing reasons to D, what is problematic for me is being told to D

I agree and that was actually going to be my next point.... after I got clarification about the intent of the statement.

Patience grasshopper.

Again, when you post, ask that people not tell you to run because you are committed to attempting reconciliation, and 9 out of 10 members will honor that.

I agree with this, Hellfire, but when a newbie comes into JFO and starts a thread and is childless or in a LTR and not married they are told to "RUN". They don't even have the chance to make this point or know that they need to make this point.

I know you don't believe me, but I'm really not so naive

FWIW, I got the same suggestion. I was told over and over that my H was doing this and that, what it meant, and what I needed to do about it. I, too, said that I am not that naive. I, too, felt like no one believed me. I bristled over it. Then, I learned to take what I need and leave the rest.

WRT the idea that BSes who forgive actually rugswept, that is not necessarily true. Forgiveness is separate from rugsweeping.

I did not initially stay for love. I did not love my fch after I found out what he did. I had no intention to R even though I stayed.

iris,

What happens if you look at your similarities to other BSes rather than the differences?

I'm in a number minorities here: I'm one of the oldest members, in one of the longest Ms, I post a LOT, I'm retired, and my W's ap was a woman. OTOH, the principles I learned from SI and the experiences people share have helped me heal despite the differences.

Differences be damned!

We're all brothers and sisters under our skins.

*****

For the record, one young, unmarried woman joined a few months before I did. She was told to run. She didn't. A few years later she reported successful R. A while later she reported false R. But she also reported great growth emotionally and professionally. She loved life. I just checked her profile - she experienced great sadness recently, but still, I think, loves life.

I think that's what SI is about - thriving despite being betrayed or betraying, no matter how the betrayed relationship resolves.

I think you know that. Just don't forget it.

*****

I stayed BECAUSE I love my spouse and because our relationship was worth saving....

I read those as simple statements by people about themselves. I don't see anything in those statements that cast aspersions on other people who made different decisions.

My sitch is my sitch, and my decisions are based on my sitch. I think most people understand that they don't fully understand other folks' sitches, and what works for one may not work for another, outside of certain principles (for example, there are a bunch of 'almost definites' - the pick me dance won't work, you can't R with a WS who is not remorseful, etc.).

Reading people's statements about themselves as veiled attacks on oneself does a major disservice to oneself.

I recommend instead reading people's statements about themselves to see it what they say fits for you. If it does, great - take it in and use it. If it doesn't, great - ignore it.

[This message edited by sisoon at 12:19 PM, June 12th (Wednesday)]

Reading people's statements about themselves as veiled attacks on oneself does a major disservice to oneself.

I recommend instead reading people's statements about themselves to see it what they say fits for you. If it does, great - take it in and use it. If it doesn't, great - ignore it.

^^^^^^

This. <3

[This message edited by northeasternarea at 12:26 PM, June 12th (Wednesday)]

I was married with no kids when my wife cheated. I initially stayed because I took a vow to stick this thing out "for better or worse". It is a sad fact that for most marriages, the "for worse" are self induced traumas. So I figured I would keep my vow and try. She tried too, and here we are. Who would have guessed.

I took a vow to stick this thing out "for better or worse"

This. This is such a good point, HOP. Just because my FWH broke his vows or promises didn't release me from my vows or promises. I take them seriously. That is another one of the many reasons I gave my very remorseful FWH a chance at reconciliation. This is the same reason I don't feel that having a "revenge affair" is acceptable. I made a vow, I am not released from it just because someone else made the choice to break theirs.

Sisoon

I just cried a little bit reading your response. You have a way of making people see things differently while still making them feel supported and respected and cared for.

How do I deal with the "experts" telling me I should go one way when I know at a very core level that I need to at least try the other way? It's overwhelming. I just need to have strength on top of strength on top of strength and I'm so tired. I'm upset, and confused. It's hard to focus on the similarities when it's the dissimilarities that set me apart from belonging to a group in which my life choice would be much more accepted.

For the record, one young, unmarried woman joined a few months before I did. She was told to run. She didn't. A few years later she reported successful R. A while later she reported false R. But she also reported great growth emotionally and professionally. She loved life. I just checked her profile - she experienced great sadness recently, but still, I think, loves life.

Thank you for sharing that. It both saddens and inspires me. I think this is *my* path towards loving life, if I have the strength to follow it. I have a lot of feelings about this, but can't find the words. Need to think.

How do I deal with the "experts" telling me I should go one way when I know at a very core level that I need to at least try the other way? It's overwhelming.

For me, the easiest way is to keep in mind that no one here knows really knows your situation or your relationship. You know yourself and your relationship better than anyone else on this planet. We know you are relatively young, your husband had an affair, and you are here looking for support. That's like 0.001% of the facts and circumstances surrounding your husband and your relationship.

IMO, as long as you make your choices based on honest introspection, maintain strong boundaries, and accept that you cannot control the outcome then you have nothing to worry about as far as whether you took the "right" path. I think it gets dicey when people try to convince themselves that they want to pursue a path for "x" reason when the truth is really "y." Honesty with oneself is the path to healing no matter which road you travel.

[This message edited by KingRat at 1:52 PM, June 12th (Wednesday)]

This. This is such a good point, HOP. Just because my FWH broke his vows or promises didn't release me from my vows or promises. I take them seriously. That is another one of the many reasons I gave my very remorseful FWH a chance at reconciliation. This is the same reason I don't feel that having a "revenge affair" is acceptable. I made a vow, I am not released from it just because someone else made the choice to break theirs.

That is your personal choice. To include adultery in "for better or for worse", a generalized vow common to all, is not fair.

This thread is full with claims of "they" advising people to "run." This is just as bad. I'm sorry, it is. It is elevating R at the expense of D in a general sense. That is wrong. R is a choice, D is a choice. They are equally valid choices. Even the Bible allows for divorce in case of adultery. Marriage is an earthly institution to specific ends.

Someone choosing to R is not fulfilling their vows better than someone who Ds. The vows are to each other, and are no longer intact when adultery occurs. If the BS wants to renew through R, that is fine, but they are not "keeping their vows."

@Striver, I used the word "I". I am not speaking for anyone else or telling anyone else how to feel or how to uphold their own vows.

How do I deal with the "experts" telling me I should go one way when I know at a very core level that I need to at least try the other way?

You can thank them for their input and move on. You can explain that, while you appreciate their opinions, you are following a different path. You can just scroll right past it.

There's a lot of stuff that I scroll right past. If I replied to everything that struck me, I'd be here forever. I especially scroll past comments that bother me (most of the time).

Thank you, striver.

for better or for worse", a generalized vow common to all,

My vows did not include this phrase, or any other common, traditional phrases.

Shoot! Keep forgetting my funny.

HT, do you ever have to try?

[This message edited by cocoplus5nuts at 2:06 PM, June 12th (Wednesday)]

How do I deal with the "experts" telling me I should go one way when I know at a very core level that I need to at least try the other way?

Everyone has their own path to follow no matter what anyone else says. You know what you need to do in order to move on. There are many people that need to try something, anything. Only you know what you need to do. Use what you learn to move forward with your eyes wide open. Your time might be wasted, and you might get hurt again. You might be able to fully reconcile and be happy together for the rest of your life. None if use can say with any certainty which it will be.

Do what feels right to you. Keep your eyes open. You'll get your answer soon enough and be able to know you did what was right for you

HT, do you ever have to try?

Not very hard. It’s kind of my factory default setting. Whenever I get too nice WOES just does a hard reboot and I’m right back to asshole.