SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

RuinedEverything...

No one is "ripping him apart"

Members are giving him advice based on what he provided and he seems to be taking things in stride.

Thank you.

FWIW - I have a female friend who "just knew" that her husband was "up to no good".

(Do please read about "gut instinct", especially where BS's are concerned. We get it and we can only quiet it down or rationalise it for so long. It get's louder and more bothersome as time goes by until you just *cannot* ignore and have to act.)

I advised her to call on an expert. For the last 9 months she has been collecting evidence. Oodles of it, all stored safely at the investigators office, with copies in my safe - just in case.

Outwardly I'm a super dad, husband, professional

Outwardly. There is nothing redeeming about being something on the outside. Ugly on the inside is ugly on the inside.

ETA - "how do I stop?" Try this - Stop giving money to women who aren't in your immediate family. That should do the trick by christmas.

[This message edited by Clearview at 9:52 AM, December 9th (Monday)]

Ruined everything, I thought he actually got some pretty good advice so far.

I do not agree that because a man chooses to pay for a younger woman that makes her a prostitute. At 38, he's not old. I was attracted to a 37 year old when I was 18. Ripping apart him and the woman who choose to keep company with him is not going to help. We are all here because we made mistakes.

Actually, by definition it makes them prostitutes. Trying to label it as something it's not, is also not helpful.

I get the feeling that Suspended feels like his affairs are somehow more refined or better than the tawdry dalliances of the rest of us mortals, because: '100s of texts', weekend getaways, restaurants, the ballet and meaningful conversations. But if he didn't spend '$1500 per month plus dates', they probably would not be with him.

So, my advice to you is, although it may be hard you need to break off all contact and come clean.

This I totally agree with. Sadly, I get the impression that Suspended isn't ready to quit yet.

Suspended, perhaps you should try to get some help/counseling for that 'numb inside' feeling. I doubt your agnosticism is the cause of that.

[This message edited by DessieLessie at 10:04 AM, December 9th (Monday)]

I get the feeling that Suspended feels like his affairs are somehow more refined or better than the tawdry dalliances of the rest of us mortals, because: '100s of texts', weekend getaways, restaurants, the ballet and meaningful conversations. But if he didn't spend '$1500 per month plus dates', they probably would not be with him.

Ding, ding, dinggggggg.

Cheating isn't made better or worse by a dollar amount spend or an individual's social class.

Broken is broken, wayward is wayward, and sadly for his wife's case, betrayed is betrayed. Doesn't matter in which light you try to paint the picture.

Bottom line: The issue is not whether he's paying hookers or getting freebies off Craiglist. The issue is the cheating. The lying. The lack of regard for his wife. The entitlement, arrogance, and numb feeling he describes.

You call it what you want, I will call it what I want. I am entitled to my opinion, as are you. I say what I feel and I'm not here to argue with other members about my opinion.

RuinedEverything...

You're correct, you are entitled to your opinion, however, what you are not entitled to is to create an atmosphere that is counter-productive to this forum.

Thank you.

Deeply Scared

Please then explain to me how my opinion is counter productive? So, what you're saying is that if I do not agree with everyone else that I shouldn't be entitled to post because it is "counter productive"? Did I not give him good advice? No, you're not looking at that.

I'll send you a PM to not distract any further from this thread.

Suspended, I am not sure you understood my original post, as I was saying that I am also agnostic but don't buy the "nothing matters" lifestyle.

Anyway , the more important point in my post was asking you if you wanted to change because this life is not true to who ou are.

I am also wondering whether you enjoy the satisfaction of buying and Controlling what you want. You work hard, and want to spend money on what you want. Some guys buy cars, boats, you have this. Is the control as exciting as the sex?

Would you go to counseling ?

Atheist here. Nope, my lack of belief in a God didn't cause my infidelity. The "if there's no God, then what's stopping us from going out and raping and murdering everyone!?" Is really shitty reason.

Simply put, ones lack of religion does not make one immoral, just like ones belief in a religion does not make them moral. I under the impression that morals simply stem from altruism. That is the sacrifice of an individual for the benefit of the entire species. Many animals practice it as well, but given we are cognitive, we have evolved to a much higher level.

Basically, what I'm suggesting is that it's a mere excuse to hide behind the no morals since I'm agnostic spiel. Again, ANIMALS who are in all sense Atheists have some sense of morals. I think the true reason is the same for almost any Wayward here: it was there, it was offered, so we took it.

Good replies thanks!!

The core really is the God/Church/Afterlife piece that may be hard for non believers to believe, but it's how I am.

Before being a church goer I cheated, partied, drugs, exuberance, lied, me, me, me all the time a true POS.

Then once born again and the belief meter pegged I lived a model life for a long time almost 1/2 my life. Practically a Ned Flanders from the Simpsons just much wealthier.

Once that came crumbling down I slowly over the course of YEARS started to be more secular. It was a progression it was like being a teenager again. Watching R rate movies, a little porn, websites, and finally culminating with this lifestyle of lies, illusions, tricks, emptiness, and utter selfishness.

Some have asked about my day or the family. A typical day is up at 5:30 make coffee, wake the kids up make breakfast, be silly joke with them. My wife usually get's up too and we hang out for about 45 minutes. I leave for work.......install my phone apps for communication purposes.

Work from 8-4/6pm, wife and I txt, flirt, talk about the kids, her days are filled with volunteering or work. She works part time doing something she loves. Kids come home we do basketball, soccer, Karate, homework, etc. I will leave work about the time they get home uninstall my apps and come home doing the aforementioned. Dinner, I go to the gym, and then it's just a night doing whatever we plan as a family.

The wife and I generally have one date night a week out and about except the weekend I fly out.

Next day is repeat.

I handle all of the finances I make about 98% of the income, so she has a debit card linked to a discretionary spending account. I buy all the cars, trips, set her budget, retirement, everything. She doesn't even know what we have as far as assets just that we are well off.

My life is a great one by all outside measure it's my internal struggles that are obviously a mess.

I travel to one of two sites every 4-5 weeks and fly whoever I am with (girl on the side) to that area when I am there.

That's the cliff notes version. So, tomorrow I'm going to try to not install those apps and see how that goes. Maybe immerse myself in a book, workout harder, and do some Christmas activities with the kids.

Again thx

I got a bit of the suspend that I can relate to in that post, thank you.

It was good to hear about your family. I think one step is to realize that you are not giving them what they need to make the decisions in their lives, by virtue of your secret life. Does that really feel good? You are with holding facts to benefit yourself. A man (or woman) of integrity does not do that.

I know it is very hard to think that your wife could very well take a lot of your assets if this every came out. That is a given by the length of your marriage. However, if you don't tell her, even if you stop all of this selfish behavior, she could one day find out, by means that you and me and anyone else are not wise enough to realize. I won't go into them here.

It must be hard to realize that if told your wife may not decide to take you to the cleaners, but would want nothing to do with you and your children could hate you.

I perceive you are looking for answers that will keep your marriage intact, get you off from this selfish behavior and to live happily ever after. Am I correct in that assumption? I doubt you will find anyone who has done the hard work of R to give you any sort of advice than to fess up, take the consequences and beg your wife for another chance. To do anything else would be to help someone stay on the path of self delusion.

It is hard and I didn't tell my wife all the details at first. I wish I could go back and change that. You will have no integrity until you face your demons and the consequences of those actions you have taken. It will eat you up.

My life was a lot like yours (prior to your high flying prostitute lifestyle. Im sorry it is so delusional it warrants degradation)I was a drunk and a carouser and didn't give a shit about anyone else. I went to AA. I got a little bit of that higher power stuff. I prayed. I did a lot of things. Today, I realize that it was me that made the changes. No god. No incantations. Just me trying to change my life. Despite your incredibly devious and "reasoned" actions to live your double life, I believe you are easily manipulated. You came to believe the "born again" lifestyle was your salvation. When you couldn't believe the stories they told you anymore, you dropped it completely and went the opposite direction. Highs, lows no in between.

My wife told me that I lacked a higher power. Something outside of myself that made me not feel I was god in my life. (understand god has no meaning to me other than a thing that keeps me in check.) So, after a lot of soul searching I found human kind to be my "god". I try to live my life as people we talk about all the time would (Plato, Lincoln, the people on this board) It has not been hard for me to do. I simply don't buy any of the stories of any of the thousands of gods man has envisioned. But I can relate to people of honor and integrity.

Stop doing what you are doing. Tell your family and face the consequences, whatever they are. Do the hard work and find yourself once again. These are the only ways in which I could tell you that you will find peace. Also, we are here for you, to help with those long nose dives that are part and parcel of living a life of integrity.

All the best of luck suspend.

Highs, lows no in between.

You have to remember in regards to church I was 19.5!! Having no family or anyone at all, so I believe it met a need in me at the time. Being so formidable it was all I knew for a very long time.

I will never confess and fail to see how that helps anything or anyone (maybe me), but that's it.

No one likes to feel as if they have been lied too, are part of a facade, let alone a cover up as big as mine.

My utopia is exactly that (except for my own demons) bringing utter destruction to their world is not a option.

Regardless of what many like to believe in the real world, real life, living in a real reality not a principle based one Ignorance truly is bliss.

If you have any upper level military you will vehemently agree. Often things that are seen cannot be unseen things that heard cannot be unheard the benefit of these things is NIL.

My plan is to continue to read the BS side. Really be empathetic with the "what if" of discovery let that cut deep. The pain of the mirrors reflection looking back at me.

Then bury this until the end. Worst case I'll see a therapist lol.

Then bury this until the end.

The problem with this plan is that your conscience will get the best of you. The lies fester inside and come out in different ways. Avoidance, compartmentalization, addiction, abuse.

Love aside. It shows great disrespect to your wife to carry this to the grave.

And it will never allow you to be whole again.

OK....been reading & needed to say something.

I understand the " I will never confess & take it to my grave" shit.

All religión aside & without doing a T/J.....I had an affair on my current husband 5 years ago. To this day, we have never addressed it. He recently said something to the effect of......"if there was an affair that happened & was realized to be a mistake & you regretted it & knew it would never happen again.....I wouldnt want to know."

So yes, I will never tell even though by his remark, I know he knows something.

So my advice to you then would be to not push it, do whats right, & quit NOW. Then work on putting all that money, energy, & time into your marriage, family & your continued recovery to be the best husband, father & man that you can be.

NOW...to continue how important my above words of advice are...from my BW side......stop now because I agree with another póster that we all have that "gut instinct" & I have read a post on the BS side, where a BW believed her WH was cheating when he went out of town & it was advised to them to hire a PI even to follow out of town & I remember thinking that $$ must not have been an issue because she liked the idea & did it. How sure are you really that it wasnt your BW?

Plus, you know what really tears at my heart strings in your post? Is that you said you still had a great sex life. It just makes me really sad for your BW. All factors aside, such as, disease, danger, prostitution, etc. It would just crush me as a wife, knowing that after you went & did all the glamoury trips, óperas, monkey-sexcapades....that you think so little of me to just go home & fuck me like it is all OK!!! KWIM??? And come on, be honest enough with yourself that you do.

Would you not care that she had a lover who she was having an A with while you were gone, would it not bother you to find you were being treated as the sloppy seconds where some OM had just shot his load? (Sorry.....just keeping it real here)

One other thing.....do you have a little girl? Would you want your 18-20 year old little girl fucking a 38 year old man involving any mind of money? Or would you want your daughter being treated this way by her husband or BF? It just aint right dude. You know it isnt, plus as a mom myself.....I would hunt you down for involving my daughter in something like that. And her father would probably outright hunt cha down & kill your ass, so yes, there are all types of danger involved.

So I wouldnt push it if you are wanting the "quit-takeittomygrave-bethebesthubby/dadicanbe" kind of life. Something brought you to us.....maybe your own "gut instinct" telling you that you are pushing it or your conscience, either way, you found us for a reason, so welcome.

Sorry.....forgot to add that while, yes, to this day, approx 5 1/2 years later, the guilt still eats at me, but it hasn't festered or taken over my life.

It is my secret to keep & I live with it every day but he will never know at this point.

I also will never do it again!!!

And you can do it to......as long as you stop playing the double life.

OMG6886, Good post I relate to much of it!!

The only part I'll reply to is the

Would you want your 18-20 year old little girl fucking a 38 year old?

As you can probably tell I compartmentalize, justify, and detach really easilly. Because of past hurts I have many walls to protect my heart and while I seem real, honest, open, far more than most NO ONE knows the real me inside.

21 and up btw 18 is too young must be older than my daughter

You may find this inconsiderate, but I don't really care what my oldest does. She already didn't follow the plan I WANTED her to follow. Granted it was my plan not hers. So, aside from being a drugged out stripper IDC.

She is 20 has dated guys her age all the way up to 27 slept with at least 6 people that I know of. Again, isn't living the way I would want her too at all. She was 3.8gpa student who played volleyball and flute. Who decided that living for the now, being free, and just finding herself was more important than going to college. So, you can say we have a rift. She is 100% adult!! Instead of dating idiot musicians who live on scraps probably finding someone like me may help her I don't know (not married of course). At this point I believe she will just meander in life hanging out with musicians until someone makes it or she realizes she has to do something else all while asking me for help from time to time.

My DR friend's wife used to be a stripper while a undergrad and 1st year med student. She did it to pay for school. Driven as a hell!! It's a great story nowadays people always get a kick when they hear it.

My daughter had a free ride with me at the helm, but chose her artsy life instead. Finding someone like me who is established, wealthy, driven, and would push her for the same might actually be very very good for her. Of course that's not what I would want. I would want her to quit her current life and enroll in school fulltime which I have made clear will still pay for...not for much longer though.

Again it's a life you do not understand and try to break it down black and white which it's not so simple. Just like all affairs while by definition they are the same, in reality they are really all very different with there own set of variables, conditions, and causes.

To somehow take what the elite SB/SD world is and say it's "Wham bam thank you ma'am" is like saying Glenfiddich is just whiskey or Wagyu No Sumibiyaki is just a steak. The amount of time, coaching, screening, advice, that occurs borderlines a real relationship with less facetime. It some ways it as real as it get's no games skips the bologna of traditional dating.

I could argue the sematics of the lifestyle with you all night and we can, but as far as stopping I believe I'm there. Tomorrow is a new day!!

It doesn't mean I won't look at these experiences fondly even if bittersweet.

The portrait you paint of your daughter, let's call her Electra, sounds familiar.

Who decided that living for the now, being free, and just finding herself was more important

Tree, may I introduce Apple?

I find these two ideas a bit contradictory.

I don't really care what my oldest does.

...yet

we have a rift

If you don't care, why the rift? Why not love and accept her, no matter what (or whom) she does?

Not to go all Freud on you, but are you looking to be a surrogate parent to your APs, since you (may feel that you) failed Electra as a father?

Instead of dating idiot musicians who live on scraps probably finding someone like me may help her

Finding someone like me who is established, wealthy, driven, and would push her for the same might actually be very very good for her.

suspended, keep up the introspection. Ditch the demons. Love and accept yourself, your life, your daughter.

Just like all affairs while by definition they are the same, in reality they are really all very different with [their] own set of variables, conditions, and causes.

They're all different, but yours isn't superior to anyone else's.

To somehow take what the elite SB/SD world is and say it's "Wham bam thank you ma'am" is like saying Glenfiddich is just whiskey

Glenfiddich or Canadian Mist, my cheating friend, no matter how much you pour into your leaky bucket it'll never fill up.

20WrongsVS1, sounds like psychobabble to me buddy.

I'm a firm believer once 18 you are a adult! I was on my own at 18, put myself through school twice, worked my way up through 2 Fortune 100 companies, so yes my daughter's choice and my own are vastly different.

As far as everything else I obviously don't see the world as black and white as you do!! I would argue most of my life experiences are vastly different and arrogantly say BETTER too ;)

Have a good day!!

[This message edited by suspended at 12:37 PM, December 10th (Tuesday)]

I'm in a agreement with Aubrie that you have to want to stop, but it sounds like you are not ready. If you need convincing to stop, you're not at that point. I think you get to that point when you realize what you're doing is wrong, that it's not authentic, that you are manipulating everyone around you and are getting a kind of sick thrill about it. That you acknowledge the damage you are doing to yourself, and your family. They may never find out, but what if they did? And if they never do, you are robbing them of a husband and father who is fully engaged. You put a lot of effort and resources in leading a double life, whether you realize it or not, you're cheating your family in many ways. You are right that your wife deserves more, you lack remorse and a sense of empathy, not trying to offend, just a fact. I feel very sorry for your wife who's in the dark. Can you imagine if the tables were reversed and she were doing this to you? How would you feel?

I'm not trying to convince you to do anything or believe anything about yourself. You asked how to quit when not forced. It takes a lot of introspection and deciding on how you want to live your life. You, on some level, know what you're doing is wrong, but you don't feel as compelled to really stop your behavior, to give it up. Whatever you're looking for is only going to come from you and why you are doing this. Maybe get into counseling? Maybe confess to your wife? That'll put things into perspective real quick. What I see is someone playing with fire, and you are bound to get burned. Your choices, ultimately, are yours to own, and yours to determine whether right or wrong, you are also choosing your own consequences.

Whatever is going on with you, I hope you can figure it out, whether it be a mid-life, entitlement, foo issues, chemical imbalance, I don't know. Healthy people don't do this kind of thing. Good luck, keep posting.