SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Great feedback minnisotaman. Believe it or not, it's not uncommon for WW to tell their husbands sex with the AP was better. I cringe at even typing this, but it's true. If you read enough stories on this site, you'll see for yourself. I recall one WW saying, "she was wetter and more excited with her AP than she EVER was with her husband".

These were her exact words. I just read another one an hour or so ago, where a WW told her husband, his body will never do what her AP's body was able to do for her. Her lack of boundaries, morals, love, empathy and remorse are striking. She has significant issues that need addressed.

The only question you have to answer is can you be happy knowing what you know and do you have enough in the tank for a rocky journey, should reconciliation be granted towards her. I want to emphasize, it's your question to answer, not hers. You decide and go from there.

Add me to that list, Jorge. I had first hand knowledge. That night she was wetter and more open than at any time in our relationship. Even at the very beginning. I thought that for some reason she was really hot for me. Wrong, they had just kissed a short time before. After fucking a lot all over the country and at his place for 3 years I can't buy that the sex was lousy or even fair.

Yes they do.

90% of affairs die of natural causes by two years.

Tired, board, pay off no longer worth the effort.

Eyes opened to see the real person the AP was.

Guilt. An endless list of reasons.

Add me to that list, Jorge. I had first hand knowledge. That night she was wetter and more open than at any time in our relationship. Even at the very beginning. I thought that for some reason she was really hot for me. Wrong, they had just kissed a short time before. After fucking a lot all over the country and at his place for 3 years I can't buy that the sex was lousy or even fair.

No way was it lacking. It was lust. That's a horrific list to be part of. How did you get over it? Why would she say this (other than believing it to be true)? How did she rationalize it away afterwards? Are you still married?

Minnisota

IC can be an important tool for you whether you R or D.

I recommend you find a good therapist with experience with infidelity.

Let WW decide for herself if she needs IC. If I were here I’d have signed up for therapy right away. The fact she hasn’t tells you something about her commitment.

Worry about yourself right now, not her. Get someone to talk to even if you plan to D. The support can be invaluable.

I don’t know if this is what happened with her specifically, but I would believe it.

Loads of things happened during my husband’s A that would have had me heading for the hills if I were him or his AP. Sure they convinced each other they were in love and soulmates and whatever nonsense, but they were also frequently rude to one another, dismissive, unavailable, and conflicted. They tried to change gears in sync whenever possible to maintain the feeling of being understood and sympathized with, but anyone who was honest with themself would have had more than enough of this before they got caught, which was less than 4 months in.

A lot of BSs on here also really struggle with the “why would she go back if the sex was so bad” thing. It shocks me that they don’t know. I once had a rebound bf for months that I hung on to for one reason only: I wanted to feel special. If he had been as cheerful and fun to hang out with by the end of our relationship as he was at the beginning, we might have dated indefinitely. I only ended it because he was sulking all the time at my obvious lack of commitment and I felt guilty for stringing him along. If I had no heart and wasn’t willing to accept that I created that whole situation and made a mess of it myself, I might describe myself as “bored” with the relationship. I WAS bored, but I deserved all his acting out because I was using him and he knew it.

When you mistreat people, you get what you pay for. If she was using the affair to make herself feel something and she wasn’t getting the feeling she was looking for, she might have gotten bored. That could also motivate her to confess, because making you jealous might also make her feel special or prized. When a person only thinks of themselves, they get really bad at guessing what other people are going to do in reaction.

A lot of BSs on here also really struggle with the “why would she go back if the sex was so bad” thing. It shocks me that they don’t know. I once had a rebound bf for months that I hung on to for one reason only: I wanted to feel special.

How can anyone feel "special" when in an A and knowing, without question, you are one of many? That's the part that's hard to understand, an A is the best/purest possible way to tell someone "your not that special" because, if you were, I'd leave.

I have read several times that men feel special when they find someone who is only interested in them, and nobody else is interested in her. That 'only one' thing.

But women apparently feel the most special when a guy can or does have a lot of women but chooses her.

Men want to feel no competition.

Women feel valuable if they beat the competition.

I can say that for many women, if nobody would ever be interested in their man, they think, "Why? What's wrong with him?" They don't think, "Thank god!" And if everybody is interested in him but she gets him, they think, "That's right, ladies! He is the best, and he's all mine!"

Idk.

Can't say this is set in stone as a universal truth, but I've read it several places and seen it in real life.

If an AP is a player, it often means he's got the goods women are looking for: looks, charm, status. If he is putting the moves on a woman, she often times feels flattered because she's the chosen one. Many women would tell the voice saying, "He might be using you," to shut up because . . . he might not be. It's still a lot of ego kibbles in that moment.

ETA: This is in response to Rideitout

^^ It’s a GREAT question and I read months worth of their damn text messages trying to work this one out.

It’s like the whole “hard to get” or fishing analogy. As long as they both kept their primary relationships they could continue to make excuses as to why they couldn’t be together. “Oh we want each other so much but my boyfriend is abusive and my wife will take the kids and everyone at work will judge us so we just can’t.” So when one pulled away a little the other would hold steady and wait for the movement to stop and then reel the line in a bit.

As soon as she finally believed she had him (because the affair was exposed and he and I were separated), she started talking about them getting married and stuff and spooked him, and within days he had run right back home. Then she showed her true colours for like a day, and went right back to the program of trying to undermine me and get his sympathy and pity about her terrible relationship. He has said himself if he didn’t believe I was really done, he would probably have played that game out for a few more rounds.

They’re delusional and it’s gross.

[This message edited by moralhighground at 8:32 AM, August 1st, 2018 (Wednesday)]

I think she may have taken everything she could from him and ended it. Then she confessed to me to clear her conscious.

So...she had her fun for 4 months straight, and SUPPOSEDLY when the thrill wore off for her and the risk was no longer worth the reward, she stopped the affair and THEN decided to 'confess' to you to supposedly clear her conscience?

Oh boy.

The chances that her 'confession' was 100% authentic are just about zero. We rarely get truly authentic confessions from a cheater. Rarely.

It's highly likely someone was about to tell you about her extra-curricular activities and she needed to beat them to it. Is her boyfriend married? I can't find that information in your posts. If he is, then it's likely his wife caught them and she's afraid his wife is going to tell you about it. Or a coworker or a friend found out and she knew she had to come clean.

But having her fun for 4 months, becoming BORED with it and then having a sudden bout of conscience? Not likely.

She's done her very best to make this affair sound as unemotional and mechanical and cold as she possibly can. There's a reason for that.

Trust me, there's a reason.

I don't think you've gotten the truth out of her at ALL. You'll likely find out down the road it was a full blown affair that also probably was a lot longer than 4 months. And I also fully believe you'll find out that 'confession' wasn't authentic at all, it was forced.

You want the truth or at least something a lot closer to the truth?

Book a poly. And don't take no for an answer.

I have read several times that men feel special when they find someone who is only interested in them, and nobody else is interested in her. That 'only one' thing.

Speaking for myself, it's not that. It's "everyone is interested in her and she only has eyes for me". That's what I always wanted/liked in a woman.

But women apparently feel the most special when a guy can or does have a lot of women but chooses her.

That would be me. :)

If an AP is a player, it often means he's got the goods women are looking for: looks, charm, status. If he is putting the moves on a woman, she often times feels flattered because she's the chosen one.

Here's where it all breaks down for me. A man who's a "player" is going to put the moves on everything that walks by. That's pretty much "player 101", cast a big net and see what gets caught up in it. And this is the thing I don't understand; the guy with the big net is happy when he catches a ton of fish at one time. But are the fish happy because their buddies also got caught in the same net? I'm guessing, "no, not so much". A married man who's "good with women" means he's a skilled liar. How is that something that people want to select for?

It's still a lot of ego kibbles in that moment.

Do all those kibbles evaporate on d-day? This isn't to you necessarily, more a general question. Do people realize on d-day that "I was caught in a net/played/used" when they enter an A for "love"?

Men want to feel no competition.

Women feel valuable if they beat the competition.

The sad part, I know your right. What you just described is a "dark art" of seduction called "dread game". Basically, making the target feel "off kitler" and insecure to elicit more bonding/interest/more extreme sexual acts. It's similar to the 180, but used for a much more nefarious purpose. So, I know your right, but I still don't understand why; why would anyone knowingly put themselves in that situation?

As long as they both kept their primary relationships they could continue to make excuses as to why they couldn’t be together. “Oh we want each other so much but my boyfriend is abusive and my wife will take the kids and everyone at work will judge us so we just can’t.” So when one pulled away a little the other would hold steady and wait for the movement to stop and then reel the line in a bit.

The amount of lying to yourself it takes to have an A for "love" is truly staggering. An A for sex, sure, you can do that without lying to yourself (except, of course, the whopper, my W won't care that much!!). But the "love based" A, wow, that takes some mental judo.

[This message edited by Rideitout at 8:40 AM, August 1st (Wednesday)]

I will wear my WS hat for a second (but as it was retaliatory, my BS hat is much essier to feel and identify with).

Are we talking a serial cheater? I know those, but I am not speaking of that.

Are we talking vulnerable time in life and had this one time affair? I am speaking to that type of A.

No, players do not hit on every single woman. There are only 24 hours in a day. Players, especiaaly the narcissist, love bombing type, choose one target for a while and move on after boredom sets in. A married woman CAN AND WILL fall for these types during a vulnerable time.

I had a bestie going through a difficult post-baby time. She had been with her husband since hs and he could not possibly fill her self-esteem bucket then. She needed IC, real help.

We worked with a grade A npd jerk, complete with a cold, cruel ruinous father and a series of failed relationships. Red flags galore. He began pursuing my friend. I tried to talk to her, but she kept dismissing me. I was in distress. At one point we were walking to lunch and she saw him up ahead. She literally but subconsciously pushed me physically out of her way--shoved me--as she charged at him to catch up and catch lunch, full of smiles and giggles. I was forgotten. Nothing would break through her ego kibble trance. He was funny, charismatic, ugly in a very interesting, intentional way. And he wanted HER!

It ended badly. I am pretty sure she had sex with him once and he discarded her. She would never admit. He then moved on to three other women, each witnessing the one before! But because he pursued obviously needy and vulnerable women, he rarely struck out. (Except with me. I find players gross.)

While in my very vulnerable state prior to my AP showing back up in my life, I felt so unhappy that my misery was making me stupid. I had thoughts that were so overly pessimistic and self-accusatory. My hopeless thinking exaggerated every aspect of my life. Attention from someone that had once mattered in my life was simply more distorted thinking because my problems were not as great, and my solution was not actually a solution. I look back on this time as fog--fog caused by unhappiness I had no idea existed (lying to yourself is real) and a "solution" that represents some of the most messed up reasoning of my life. It was a crisis, no two ways about it. I could have done heroin or got a nice percocet addiction going, but I had an A instead. All kinds of strange and dark reasoning.

When your brain is unhealthy, avoiding and minimizing and resenting and depressed, it is stupid. And players can move in on otherwise wise women (and men honestly) because they are not thinking clearly during this vulnerable time.

Not.

An.

Excuse.

Geeze, it's an explanation for the disaster. There is NO excuse, but there's always a reason.

[This message edited by OwningItNow at 9:15 AM, August 1st (Wednesday)]

Thanks OIN, that's a great explanation, and I think pretty similar to my W's experience. It's just hard to understand how some people can so clearly see the person for who they are (as you did with your friend) and then be so totally blind when that person turns their attention towards you.

I totally agree with No Mercy. It is very likely that it ended because they were found out,possibly by OBS and he dropped your WW. This would cause her to come lean to preempt being exposed.

I’m really surprised more have not come to this conclusion with how common that happens. How much of that sadness you’re seeing is due to missing OM? Or more likely the dopamine high she got from sneaking around being OMs sex doll.

I think we men don’t realize that the actual sex doesn’t have to be that good. It’s the feeling she gets from being a bad girl . The escape from being a wife and mother.

I do feel some can end an affair because they get bored or it ran its course. I feel most end affairs because of fear.

No one ends an affair because they realize they are still in love with their spouse. They end an affair because they are scared. Scared of taking it to the next level, scared of being found out, scared of ruining their life. ~ Rick Castle, from TV program Castle

I ended it. I did not like who I was, did not like my behavior, felt guilty all the time, and did not think the other spouses or children deserved any of this crap I was heaping on them. My shame was deep. This is not uncommon. I read a lot of people say that the WS felt relief when it ended. It's true. I am not sure bored is the right word for many of us, more like exhausted.

Running from whatever you are running from by having the A is exhausting. The ego kibbles create a high at first, but eventually the new kibbles wear off (like any relationship) causing many to say, "WTF am I doing?" That's exactly what happened to me.

I'm not a wayward but before I was married I had ended relationships because I was bored. They were what I now recognize as codependent and every conversation or choice of date activities was "whatever you want"

It gets really boring quickly and I could see someone's affair taking the same path. Especially if the wayward is doing it more for the taboo thrill and isn't actually interested in the AP.

OwningItNow

Thanks for your response.

My wife said the sex was average at first then got boring like the entire affair after four months.

Do you think it is possible for affair sex to get boring in four months ? Isnt affair sex supposed to be amazing since it is taboo and also a new person ?

[This message edited by MinnisotaManInWi at 2:18 PM, August 1st (Wednesday)]

Do you think it is possible for affair sex to get boring in four months ? Is t affair sex supposed to be amazing since it is taboo and also a new person ?

I've had sex with someone new get boring after the first week, so, yes, I can absolutely see that happening, even more so for women because sex is more hit/miss for them. The right guy can make them feel really good, the wrong guy and they are bored and counting cobwebs waiting for it to be over. Sex for me ranges from "good" to "great", I'm going to have an orgasm, every time, something that's not at all true for a lot of women. And even with that, in past relationships, I've decided "juice is not worth the squeeze" and gotten "bored" with the sex (because it was too much effort for too little payoff).

Short version, yes, I can totally believe that. Does that make it better for you? It would for me, but I'm not sure it should.

There are all kinds...I think my STXWH will dump any new supply, pretty quickly...we are newly separated, and Ding...hes whoring...If anyone of these new OW, give him any trouble, he will move on...life is too short....its a candy store out there.

Im sure he has several...and play them against each other, while always looking for more...he has never been committed to anyone...Does he get bored? Yes...bored with sex? bored with the drama? bored with spending to please? there is lots of boredom... I think he gets bored with trying to impress...as long as its involves sex, he can keep interested.

Hes 60...I always imagine him with "one of those that speak in a baby voice"...Keep in mind, hes fighting ED...

I agree with nomercy...I think WH left me (ran away) because someone was about to tell me of his A, and his relapse...He knew it was the final straw...He is on full blown self destruction...He has nothing to lose at this point.

[This message edited by cancuncrushed at 5:41 PM, August 3rd (Friday)]