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Feb I think you're on target measuring with skepticism. It's nice to see you dealing with her on your terms. Keep your head up and stay on the course you've set.

She may not "get it" or may not be capable of understanding she needs to be there in person. There may be a lot of other factors we normal people don't understand about being on a bike ride like competition, not quitting, rivalry that may be contributing to her behavior aside from what others are offering up as motive. I'm not making excuses for her decision process, I'm just saying you have a better pulse on mitigating factors then we do. That said, maybe there are a few more hurddles for her to get over before she understands that she needs to be home dealing with this. Maybe I'm just trying to get a view from her perspective to better understand her motives for staying.

I'll be pulling for you today.

I've read this thread and I am sorry for what you are going through. Your wife seems without remorse. She is a serial cheater. There is a good possibility you know the tip of the iceberg.

Does she seem to fit any of the criteria for NPD or BPD?

Feb,

Time to pack lunches, make breakfasts, get kids ready for school...I will check in later

First I must say, you’re a great dad. I also did not let the affair change who I was as a dad. You must be commended for your continued focus and nurturing of your kids. I wanted to give you a pat on the back for this it is reminiscent of my life. I have struggled somewhat with that piece; I have always relished my role as a father, and always put DS first. My WW and I have read several books and had several conversations about the fact that she was not giving enough to the marriage. I think it was in NJF and a few other books talk about this being a common trait of WS's. Not exactly sure what to do with this sometimes, my WW felt we didn’t need her so she felt worthless, etc., because I was a father capable of carrying the family, you get the picture. Balancing this has been a challenge sometimes and doesn’t require more or less from me but rather a whole lot more from her to attach and be as present a mom and wife as I was a dad. Just reading through your post’s brought this to mind today. I think there is a connection to this concept and the whole good guy vs. alpha thing but can t quite put it all together. Your sitch is really making me relive and analyze my WW and our sitch. Do you think your wife has given less over the course of the marriage? Not given enough to the relationship to make it part of who she is? Just something to think about. Just thinking about you this morning. Hope your well and focused on Thursday and outing this affair. Cheers to the good dads!!! Feb, Here’s to you.

LHAP

[This message edited by lordhasaplan? at 6:58 AM, March 30th (Wednesday)]

I received another text from her at about 7:30 this morning...

"Will you still give us a chance?...need hug"

By the way, her phone has a QWERTY keypad, so I too wonder about why she keeps the messages so short.

Thinking about my options...

a) No reply - this will be no reply to 1 e-mail and 2 texts - I want to be and appear strong, not an asshole

b) As per usual, I am doing you a favour...I don't believe you WANT to be married to me. Am I wrong?

c) I have given up on how we are now, and especially on how we were 3 months ago. I did not say I have given up on us entirely.

d) It takes a year of separation before you can get a divorce. This is a logical step given our current relationship. I don't want to live in limbo any longer than I have to.

e) What would you do if you were me?

f) Which us?

g) Kids want to Skype tonight - around 7 okay?

As I understand your position, you've not given up, the question is whether your WW has or will do enough to give your M a chance.

Regardless, option g).

I vote option G too.

Feb,

Option G is necessary if your kids want to talk to her anyway so I don’t see that as an issue. You would be sending that text anyway as you would have to organize the Skype. But do not respond to her comment. Just provide what the Kids need to talk to their mom. Once you out the affair tomorrow you can send her one response, with your list of demands for R. Then sit and watch her actions. If she wants this marriage she will have to start engaging the process and not let you carry the water of early R. Start thinking about what your list of demands for R are. You will need them shortly if you are really outing this thing.

I was amazed that my WW actually pulled her head out of her rear and engaged, and then the real work begins. One step at a time, for now silence about the two of you, only interact about Kidos, I vote G.

LHAP

[This message edited by lordhasaplan? at 7:55 AM, March 30th (Wednesday)]

C and G

C suggestion: I am giving up on how we have been the last three month, I am giving up on the wife who wants an open marriage, I am giving up on the wife who betrayed our family and does not feel guilt for doing so, only sorry whe was caught...I am not giving up the marriage and family we had, nor the woman I married...I hope she is still here.

I vote for H)

"What part of the sentence 'I am not going to stay with someone who has no real desire to have sex with me but wants to sleep with other men so she can be happy but also wants me to be a celibate housekeeper' do you not understand?"

Feb, I vote for G also.

It feels to me like she is trying to get a "handshake agreement" from you--a statement that you will not divorce her--that she can point to down the line and make you feel guilty about: "I thought you said you'd give us a chance!" She knows you're a nice guy, and she knows you're all too willing to play by the rules, so she's trying to drag a promise out of you that she can use for leverage later.

Whether you do want to give her a chance or not is irrelevant. She's trying to draw you out by asking you for confirmation. Don't give it to her. This isn't remorse. She's trying to manipulate you, by using your own best qualities against you. Don't let your integrity and your compassion nourish her infidelity. Don't engage. Even if it feels like lying to refrain from saying, "I still want to fix things." Don't say it.

Feb,

You are too dignified and worth way too much to discuss the future of your marriage via TEXT MESSAGE.

Option g.

She needs a hug?

You need monogamy and a wife who wants you sexually and a mother who isn't checked out.

People in hell want a cold drink of water.

She's still manipulating you. This is VERY low stakes stuff. She wants cake. If she can get cake with the total investment of a couple text messages to you (hey, you're cool, right? I need hugs. Remember this is all about ME!) -- she'll do that.

Don't let her. Kids only. Be VERY brief. Wait before you send it.

Not what you want to hear, but I agree with above poster -- consider that she might be NPD. Consider that you've only just discovered who is really, actually IS. You miss the figment. You miss what you thought you had.

This person is really fucked up. She clearly does not get the seriousness of her situation.

BTW, you wrote to try to say "we saved the marriage." There is no we here. It's only

you

. She very much is not trying to save the marriage. She's trying to save CAKE. Big difference.

Good Morning FEB:

It sucks to get hit with this kind of stuff, this early in the day, HUH?

Stay strong. You are still dealing with a woman who is in Peanut Butter land. (really foggy). Thre is nothing in any of her actions, her SHORT texts, emails or anywhere that says, I want my marriage, my husband and my family. Sorry.

I totally agree with LORDHASAPLAN , SHERMAN and SQUIFFLE.

Get your R requirements ready, for tomorrow, but also, please prepare yourself, that when you out her, for her to be ROYALLY pissed at you and the blame will be all about YOU. She has to blame someone and you will be the target. It is going to be a brutal few days, at least, and you need to get your support system ready, know your requirements, your responses in your head and know how you will respond to certain scenario's.

It is def. worth outing it tomorrow, and what you need to do. I just want you to be prepared for it mentally and emotionally. This is not the woman you married. I am sorry for that.

Good LUck

D+H

Keep it matter of fact and don't bother responding to her bullshit manipulation. D makes it clear that you are looking out for your own best interests. H makes it clear that you are a responsible parent. Nothing more is required.

Get your R requirements ready, for tomorrow, but also, please prepare yourself, that when you out her, for her to be ROYALLY pissed at you and the blame will be all about YOU. She has to blame someone and you will be the target. It is going to be a brutal few days, at least, and you need to get your support system ready, know your requirements, your responses in your head and know how you will respond to certain scenario's.

It is def. worth outing it tomorrow, and what you need to do. I just want you to be prepared for it mentally and emotionally. This is not the woman you married. I am sorry for that.

I will be ready. If she is willing to end the marriage because I told OBS, then so be it, it didn't have a chance anyway.

My conscience will feel better I think. I cannot imagine how I would feel if I found out in a few years that he did it again, and that I could have done something now.

Maria_2011, I like your rewrite of C, but for now I'm thinking nothing for awhile and then G.

I think option G... Let her feel what it's like to be ignored. She certainly is thinking of only herself, isn't she?

Needs a hug?

If any response at all, G is the ONLY one that should go out.

And on that call, the kids should be the only one that speak to her...don't YOU DARE!

Seriously, if you can follow through with the plan to inform other BS, and don't engage with her while she's on her trip, I really think some things will start to shake up.

Her recent communication seems a fairly clear attempt of her seeking the best 'heart-strings' to pull...she isn't actually DOING anything to warrant anything from you but an assumption that nothing between you two will change.

SOMETHING on her end might change if she starts scrambling from the fallout when you get rolling on this next step you have planned.

Will you still give us a chance?...

Give us a chance to do what? See if we can adapt to living in a platonic marriage for the sake of the kids??

Realistically how long would that last?

If it were me, I wouldn't be willing to sacrifice the rest of my life to live under those conditions.

If it's for the sake of the children then it would cause them a heck of a lot more harm then good.

Children need a healthy loving relationship modeled for them so when they grow up they know what love looks like and can find it for themselves.

Your wife is delusional to think that this is a good plan for the kids. They'll know.

Besides the fact that they'll know, her plan to fool the children is the same thinking she used with you when she had her A's.

She's not a woman who knows how to live an authentic life. She's got too many layers of problems piled high on top of her authentic self to be an effective parent whether you R or D. When you get yourself healthy you'll see this more clearly.

IMO, she needs serious therapy. If she's already been seeing a therapist, she needs a new one.

(((WW)))

There. Now that's done.

So many texts I'd like to send...

i) I saw your facebook photos this morning. It doesn't look like you need a hug. I saw several.

...just group shots in the middle of a MTB ride with arms around each other, but still...

j)Of course, I haven't given up. If I had given up, I wouldn't have just told OBS about your A. (to be sent tomorrow about a minute after leaving her house)

But I won't send either...don't feed the drama, don't give her warning..

You are too dignified and worth way too much to discuss the future of your marriage via TEXT MESSAGE.

Hmmmm, yeah, but I did confirm our separation via e-mail.

(((Feb)))

I think you are just starting to feel the power of NC. You now see her codependency on you being her caretaker.

"she needs a hug?" What is she, 5 yrs old?

Let her Skype with the kids but don't you get involved. Be unavailable.I would always let my WS when we were separated see the kids any time he wanted. What he did not like is that he did not have me in the same room or talking to him or taking care of the arrangements for him...THAT made him mad, that I did not want to be around him, I "made" him uncomfortable. So what?! He fired me from the job of being his wife when he chose to cheat, not going to be your mommy any longer.

But it took a long time for him to unfog, so be prepared for her to come back and lay it on thick for you. This then becomes the hard part, holding your boundries.

But I think so far so good. And letting the other BS know? Good job on that too. All part of being treated how you wish you were treated.