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That was great that you booked him a hotel so he can have time alone. Now it is time to focus on you. What are things you can do that are relaxing, pampering, or comforting? My wife would go to a spa or something like that, or invite some of her close friends over and watch movies, eat popcorn, and talk. That might not be for you. What are the things you like to do?

He was out of town for 3 months right before d-day. I sobbed everyday for 3 weeks. It stopped when I sold my soul to cope. I also worked out 2-3 times a day and dropped a ton of weight I’m 5’7” and I got down to 119 pounds. In short I fall apart. I have no idea how to do this.

[This message edited by Root at 1:14 PM, February 8th (Friday)]

An AP would fix this. Ugh. The OM was married but his wife is like my husband. They both prefer to go out. He and I then would email or talk on the phone for hours while our spouses were gone. It was never romantic we both just wanted someone to talk to. He’s bad I know. I just can’t pull it together. The trigger was last Sunday when BH said I didn’t want him to leave for 5 minutes. This after I’ve worked my ass off for 6 years giving him anything he wanted. To the best of my ability that is.

An AP would fix this.

No, an AP would just make everything much, much worse.

You need healthy outlets, not ones that would lead to the ruin of your marriage and family. You are looking at the easy way. Exercising is good. You can continue to do that. Maybe crossfit training. If I am right, you are looking for someone to talk about life and whatever is on your mind. This is why I suggested group therapy or a support group.

I think this would work for you.

The reason I had an EA in the first place was to cope with BH being absent. I knew he was tired of me and despite my best efforts to be nice he wasn’t interested. I found this board where I had so much in common with everyone. It was a modern day lonely hearts club. I wasn’t there 3 months before I met the OM. Within days we were chatting all day long. I’ve said before it wasn’t romantic. He wanted to take it to phone calls and I drug my feet here because I feared this would be the way I’d get caught. My fears turned out to be unfounded as BH didn’t notice. He appeared to be happy that I wasn’t bothering him as much. The EA lasted 2.5 years.

Want to know how I got caught? BH had that training that lasted 3 months. I was distraught as I always am when he’s gone but this time it was a lot less. BH then had an ah ha moment where he figured out I was getting attention elsewhere. He came back and started snooping. I assured BH that he was just a friend and then I went kinda underground. It would be another 7 months before I went NC. Not my choice but BH was screaming at me so the OM had to go.

As I look back on those days I think the EA was a good solution. BH was happy. I was happier. It was win/win to me. I know people say how would you feel if BH did it to me. I’d be livid because I was here still trying to get his attention. I asked him what was wrong. I wanted to talk about it. BH didn’t want to.

D-day was bad and the TT made it even worse. BH dug into my past and I stupidly admitted to cheating on while we were dating. I should have taken that secret to my grave. BH got over the EA within I don’t know a year or so. The ex boyfriend not so much. Then BH said I lied about how many partners I’d had. Again I should have lied. It was 6 btw but BH was 2 and this enraged him. It would be 3 years before he stopped screaming at me. Another 2 before the shaming stopped.

We are in year 6 and if you’ve followed my timeline things got better after I got on meds. I think it opened his eyes to how fucked up I was. Getting this explanation for my behavior made him stop taking this personally. He was also in IC for a year. He quit because we couldn’t afford it. The damage lingers in our 16 year old daughter. She kinda figured it out but sided with me because she blamed BH for me being bedridden with depression. To this day she jokingly calls

herself a ho and says she wants to be a stripper when she grows up. I haven’t been the same since d-day so there is that. She still blames him.

I haven’t yet learned to keep my thoughts to myself and this is why he’s in a hotel right now. I realize that stuffing my thoughts and feelings isn’t a solution. It’s looking like he’s going to move out for a while. Not sure yet. “It’s 2am and I’m lonely” isn’t this a line in a song? I woke up at 2 but now it’s 3.

I envy BH. He’s probably sleeping soundly. He appreciated me getting him a hotel room (that was a blow). He is ok alone and I’m not. He will thrive living alone. I will not.

I have no idea how I’m going to cope but clearly I will have to. The question is will I self destruct or try to get better. I want to self destruct. I can’t think of one good reason not to.

[This message edited by Root at 3:21 AM, February 9th (Saturday)]

Root,

I'm sorry your in so much pain. It sounds like you have an unhealthy dynamic going on at home, hopefully I can provide a little of what might be going on and some experience.

As I look back on those days I think the EA was a good solution. BH was happy. I was happier. It was win/win to me. I know people say how would you feel if BH did it to me. I’d be livid because I was here still trying to get his attention. I asked him what was wrong. I wanted to talk about it. BH didn’t want to.

You might as well have taken that, word for word, from the WH's I know. "Wife didn't want to have sex". "Wife was happy I left her alone for sex during the A". "I was happier". "Where's the harm".

Except, I suspect when you think about it as your H having women he sleeps with on the side, it's a very different feeling that what you feel looking at your "win/win" situation. Of course you were happier, you were scarfing cake. Everyone likes cake!

The problem is, it's a temporary state of being. First off, it's unlikely your relationship wouldn't have gone PA at some point, they usually do, and then you would had hurt your H much worse. For at least some people, and I would be one of them, an EA is a speedbump, a PA is hitting a brick wall at 100MPH. I suspect your H is one of those people because of his reactions, not too mad about the A, livid about you having sex with someone else before you were married. I'd feel exactly the same way, if my W, at d-day, had said "we never saw each other, it was just e-mail" I doubt I ever would have found this place. Probably would have asked for MC to get to the bottom of it, but, honestly, I'm not even sure I would have done that. An EA just was not a big deal to me (and, if I'm honest, still wouldn't be to me if I'd never been to SI and see the destruction they caused to some people). So, in your case, I suspect your "big dark secret" (the EA) was a minor blow to your H, but your "PA" from years ago, that blew his world apart. We never know how we'd react in different situations, but, if my wife had the same story to tell, I suspect my reaction would be more similar than not to your H's.

She kinda figured it out but sided with me because she blamed BH for me being bedridden with depression. To this day she jokingly calls

herself a ho and says she wants to be a stripper when she grows up. I haven’t been the same since d-day so there is that. She still blames him.

This is unfortunate. Your children shouldn't be "siding" with either parent, they shouldn't be involved in this at all. But, since it's done, IMHO, the right thing to do is explain to her "It's not your Dad's fault, it's mine". Because this would be a major issue for me. My W's family all sided with her (because she told them bad things about me and conveniently forgot to mention, oh yeah, I'm having an A) and it was a big problem for our R. I didn't make her tell them about the A, but I did have her talk to them and explain that it was not my fault. Having people around who are blaming you for something that you didn't do is really, really hard. But they don't need all the details, my W's parents still don't know about the A, but they know that it wasn't "just me" being an asshole. And that makes things much more comfortable for me to be around them. I suspect your H is dealing with the same issue; you cheat, and my daughter is mad at me? How's that work..

I'm sorry your in this spot root. Lying is never the right answer for how to fix things. Be honest, be authentic and let the cards fall where they fall. I know, easy to write, hard to do. But strive for that.

It’s 2am and I’m lonely” isn’t this a line in a song? I woke up at 2 but now it’s 3.

It is actually 3AM by Matchbox 20. And now it's completely stuck in my head, lol.

On a more serious note, I feel like you are getting stuck in a loop here. The more you cling, the more space he needs and the more you cling. Does your IC include any behavioral modification? Talk therapy? Art therapy? Sometimes these other techniques in addition to your meds are beneficial in providing alternate strategies for you to employ. There must be research you can find on self-soothing techniques that can give you some new ideas. Because a new (or old) AP is not going to make anything better - even in the immediate.

I wouldn't want either to spend much time with someone who enables my daughter to blame me for the negativity it brought that they cheated on me.

How can you have let that be and still pretend you gave him anything? Not allowing this is literally the first thing to give.

Nor would I want to spend time with someone who thinks they should have kept to the grave the truth they owe me so that they protect themselves and nobody else.

Your husband is not a lone wolf. He'd be happy in a home where his wife didn't make his daughter blame him, and to whom their relationship is a priority. But you're refusing to give him that.

Root, do you have any hobbies? Have you considered taking some classes and finding a passion that you can pursue at home?

It may sound silly, but after dday, I discovered sewing. When I started, it was one of the only things I could get lost in that would take my mind off of what my WH did. I’ve never been crafty or anything in my life. It’s one of the best things I’ve ever done for myself.

I’m trying to find a balance in my answers to you. I would not be happy in the marriage you describe, but I am not lost when my WH is not around either. I have a lot of things I like to do and sometimes I enjoy the peace and quiet.

It isn’t up to your spouse to keep you happy and entertained, but you shouldn’t have to keep your thoughts and feelings bottled up either. Why are you staying in this relationship? Self destruction is not a good option. Cheating is never will be a healthy option.

I really think you need a new therapist to talk to. I understand your hesitation, but it seems like you are in a really bad place right now.

Prissy I think about you saying I wouldn’t be happy if he bought me flowers every day. I read recently that people like me refuse to be happy because being miserable gets me the attention I want. For example if I took my parents anger and shame, if I were miserable that made them happy. I expressed their feelings I was rewarded.

I can apply this same logic to BH. If I act out when he leaves he won’t leave. If he leaves he knows I will punish him so he stays as much as he can to avoid my anger. It works. On the flip side if I’m having a good day he runs away. He wants to take full advantage of that good day by leaving. Being happy makes him leave. That doesn’t work. I get more of what I want from being miserable. Crazy right?

Think about troubled kids. They act out to get attention. Once they improve even slightly the parents revert back to the original behavior that triggered the acting out in the first place.

I don’t want this. I don’t know if I’m ready to be happy but I know I don’t want BH to stay just to placate me.

[This message edited by Root at 8:13 AM, February 9th (Saturday)]

I’ve been up since 2am alone with my thoughts. I could pop Zanax and I’d sleep all day. I do this when I spiral. Sleep is one of the few times I’m not tortured. I don’t want to sleep. I want to type here and cry. I want to figure this out. I’m tired of feeling this way. I haven’t taken an anti anxiety pill since Thursday. They sedate me and it works until it wears off. Lather, rinse and repeat. Drinking makes me feel worse (I tried that this week for kicks and giggles). If I could die painlessly that option would be tempting. I can’t do that to my kids though. I’m not a great mom but I’m the only one they have.

I’m on my iPad still in bed and its too much of a pain to quote and respond. I’ll pull out my laptop after I’ve eaten breakfast. Typing here does help. I’m trying. I don’t have a therapist or BH today so this is all I have. I will eat well because I know junk food makes me feel worse especially if i start my day with sugar. I do emotionally eat and I’ve gained 40 pounds since d-day. I’m going to try not to do that while BH is gone. The other risk is i am more likely act out if I eat sugar. I don’t want to drive BH further away than I already have.

I want to find the will to live. Can anyone relate???

[This message edited by Root at 8:21 AM, February 9th (Saturday)]

You have to take this one day at a time. Even break it up in chunks in you have too. "This day I will make it." Schedule you day. One day. Repeat the next day.

Your relationship dynamic sounds a lot like WH and I used to be. I would cling and he would pull away. I couldn't stand to be alone and he would want to be alone. One thing that seemed to really help us was the book Hold Me Tight. I'm not sure if your husband would be willing to read it, but it gave us both insight into what the other was feeling when we got like that.

Other than that, maybe try to find something just for you. I went back to school, write, and workout. I have also been working on my ability to self-sooth (which is hard because I have anxiety issues).

I hope things get better for you.

William I did that to get through BHs rage and the debilitating depression that followed. I’d consider the day a success if I took a shower and got dressed. I’d been depressed before for days maybe weeks but this was different. My whole life I’d think I’ll be happy when. When I graduated college, when I got a job, when I got married, when I got fit, etc. One by one I did these things and was once again dissapointed. During R I began to realize it was all crap.

I still chase things yes but the potential list has dwindled. I was once an overachiever so I pretty much got everything I wanted.....except love? Happiness? Peace? My parents disowned me 20 years ago and for a decade I clung to the notion they’d realize their mistake. Never happened. I clung to my sister as a surrogate but she’s more fucked up than I am. I made friends but they too were more fucked up than I was. Epic fail.

This left BH. I struggle now to find the words to describe how it feels knowing I have to back off. I imagine what he’s doing right now. Still sleeping? Did he get up early to eat breakfast? Does he think of me at all? Does he wonder if I’m ok or is he just thrilled to be free even if it’s for a day or so?

I read this board for people who love someone with BPD. Most consider us abusive monsters. A few get we aren’t malicious on purpose. The overall advice is to leave. It’s hard for them to leave for a variety of reasons but the ones who do are happier (ok not true some struggle to move on especially if they were dumped). They have ptsd and it takes them years to recover. Hard to live with this knowledge of what I’ve done. There are stories of what its like when they get time alone. At first it’s blissful sleep. Freedom to choose without fear. At some point boredom sinks in and they are just as lost as we are. They too have abuse in their past which is what drew them to us in the first place. They too are broken. They didn’t deserve to be abused though.

BH won’t be bored for quite some time I imagine. If he moves out it will happen faster. Weeks maybe. I don’t know. I want him to be as miserable as me but I know he isn’t. He is happy today.

Hopscotch BH doesn’t read books. I wish he did though.

Edited to add. I take this back. After 30 years with me it’s highly possible he would be happy to be rid of me forever. I think he’ll miss seeing the kids everyday but that’s about it.

[This message edited by Root at 10:18 AM, February 9th (Saturday)]

Root, I asked you previously, and I apologize if I missed your response.

Have you tried DBT therapy to help you with your BPD?

I don’t know whether I had DBT or CBT therapy. I know what to do I just don’t want to do it. Excuses I’m full of excuses. I don’t see the benefit of any of this. BH is going to leave anyway right? It’s too late.

[This message edited by Root at 10:44 AM, February 9th (Saturday)]

More fun. My girls made plans to leave and didn’t tell me. I’m assuming they told BH. I suspect he warned them about me. When he came home to pack all 3 went in there with him (that never ever happens). I don’t think now he wanted to leave because he was afraid of what I’d do. I’m the one who booked the hotel room. It was my idea not his. He went along again out of fear. I could be completely wrong of course but when they leave without telling me it’s because they are afraid of me. To be clear this doesn’t happen often. Last time was thanksgiving.

See this is what I don’t know how to fix. Well that’s not true. I know what to do I don’t know HOW to do it. They want me to be ok. I’m not ok of course. I was about to walk on the treadmill and now I think there is no point. It’s too late and I can’t fix this.

Oh Root, I don't know. I just feel your pain coming across the internet. I only ask because I long suspected my WS was bipolar (especially given his family history w/ bipolar dad and uncle), but since the A, he/we suspect BPD. Have been trying to find a therapist that takes our insurance and specializes in DBT with no luck yet. And we can't afford $250/session out of pocket.

But... things you say remind me of things he says. And I, like your BH, am quite at peace being alone.

For example, one night about a week ago I wasn't feeling very good (a little under the weather). He was watching a comedy act on TV and the comedian started joking about infidelity. I triggered, but feeling crappy already, just rolled over in bed and tried to fall asleep.

He tried to talk to me about it, but I just said, "I'm going to sleep." He knew I wasn't feeling great, I told him earlier I felt kind of chilled/like I couldn't get warm. Anyways, the next day a huge fight ensued because he accused me of leaving him.

We were in bed together! I wanted to go to sleep! He was the one that left me, repeatedly, every time he met uo with his AP instead of being home with me and the kids. Yet, lying next to him in bed, I'm accused of leaving him?!

Long story short, he was *way* more upset about me rolling over in bed and "leaving" him than I was about the A trigger. And I was also very confused, because as far as I was concerned, the trigger happened, my anxiety/hurt/sadness passed, and all I wanted to do was focus on making the kids breakfast and enjoying the day.

I don't know your whole situation. I can't see your everyday interactions. But when your husband was running errands, I identified with that... with being helpful and with my partner misinterpreting it as me trying to not spend time with them.

Anyways, in the research I've been doing, DBT is supposed to be one of the most effective ways to help BPD.

There are four main types of skills that are covered in DBT skills training. These are:

Mindfulness Meditation Skills. These skills center on learning to observe, describe and participate in all experiences, including thoughts, sensations, emotions and things happening externally in the environment, without judging these experiences as "good" or "bad." These are considered core skills that are necessary in order to implement the other DBT skills successfully.Interpersonal Effectiveness Skills. The focus of this skill module is on learning to successfully assert your needs and to manage conflict in relationships.

Distress Tolerance Skills. The distress tolerance skills module promotes learning ways to accept and tolerate distress without doing anything that will make the distress worse in the long run, for instance, engaging in self-harm.Emotion Regulation Skills. In this module, patients learn to identify and manage emotional reactions.

[This message edited by ibonnie at 11:37 AM, February 9th (Saturday)]

Bonnie you must be completely frustrating. I’m where your WH is because yeah same. BH had to come home to get ready for work. I’m lucid and mostly calm (I’m exhausted) so we talked. He described his parents marriage and said that’s what he wants aka we are still on the alone time topic. Until I fix it this is what he will bring up if I complain. As long as I say nothing negative about him, to him or act out he will drop it (his pattern). In his defense this time he offered to give me something I want in return. This is new behavior. I suspect it’s because I didn’t argue with him (reward)

Anyway he wants someone who happily does chores and raises kids. Someone not needy or clingy. Someone who won’t complain when he has to travel, work late or spends time on a hobby. .........Aaannnd there it is alone time. During R there have been similar “change this” requests that feel like ways to shut me up. As long as I don’t complain he’s fine. I am however (now) allowed to ask for things if I’m respectful. Complaining or negativity (that’s aimed at him or the kids) is mirrored back to me ten fold. I still haven’t recovered from last Sunday’s zingers.

I wonder do I need DBT or duct tape? I think it’s the latter. Any thoughts on how to stop being moody, negative and whiny? This sucks. I need a lobotomy just to stay married and not have pain reflected back at me which makes me want to drive my car off a cliff. Ugh I hate my life.

[This message edited by Root at 4:12 PM, February 9th (Saturday)]