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I'm not absolving any one who cheats of their accountability like HO and Cocoa have stated as well.

At the end of the day, we're supposed to be adults and have the ability to say "no" and enforce boundaries, unfortunately this doesn't happen.

I can see what HO is saying about the signals as well. My WW's AP while a true predator in my mind (after all hes been fired for sexual harassment), I do think it starts out with "feelers", casting a net a mile wide to anyone person that won't shut it down. for every five "you crossed a line", there's always a "HMM". My wife was a hmmm. His approach was to reach out and get to know her under the guise of our kids playing. They talked about the summer, school, his pool, vacation all 'harmless stuff". Until one day he verbally told her "You look sexy in those shorts". Her brokenness didn't see this as a flag until I pointed it out her (kudos for telling me) it was inappropriate after all her 8th grade teacher told her the same thing. WTF. THe door was opened at this point, as she didn't shut him down until after we talked. Then it was "do it again and your being blocked". He went silent for a month and resurfaced with pleasantries and then started in. Guess who didn't block him? She "deflected", that worked well. Sorry, I've gone off the rails on this one. The point being, I think some men/women can groom and prey as HO indicated, but at the end of the day its still our spouses responsibility to be a grown up and shut it down. So it can be subtle or obvious (at least to us BS'). A WS preys on the weakest of the herd. Both are broken and when signals/lines are crossed there is no threat of rejection. If one is looking solely for an easy lay, there is no rejection or conflict in the situation as the approach is so subtle, it truly takes a lot of work IMO to "wait" for the prize. It's like a small business owner, let me pass out my business card and watch ten people throw it in the trash. I don't take it personal, they are interested but boy that one person who slips it in their pocket. I"m going to apply all my sales skills to get them to buy.

Cocoa, I see the conflict avoidance in my WW as well. As I reflect her entire family is like this. Her grandmother is from a 1950's norman Rockwell. She never speaks up against her husband, she's totally subservient, never raises her voice. I see her father and aunt like this too. part of this was learned for my WW. I literally went off the first time we were at her family event and she tired to "serve" me my dinner like the other woman. She never did that again. But must like all relationships prior to me, she had no voice, never said no (physical abuse didn't help btw). So guess what happened in the affair? Everything was a no, until it became a yes. I think she too was afraid she'd lose the ego kibbles or whatever she was getting if she didn't say yes to his requests. If fact early on, when I'd question "why did you do/say x, it was "its what he expected and wanted". Not, its what I wanted to do, or didn't want to do or whatever, just a "it was expected".

A sad pitiful life, if you ask me. Okay, T/J over... Sorry

Probably only works for WW. Can't say no.

+1

This is what I have observed in others and myself.

I was the BS, didn't cheat but I had "offers" while I was married. Strangely I couldn't just say "no, I'm married" which would be the obvious response. I would have to make some excuse and then avoid the person forever after. This was in my 20s and early 30s. I'm in my mid-40s and as I approach menopause I am completely different. Now I'd probably deck the asshole. But of course, there aren't as many offers these days

HO, we agree, I just see conflict in that situation because your interests (as the AP trying to find a new sexual partner) aren't in alignment with most of the people you'll try with. But, you did a great job explaining it, and that's exactly what I'm talking about, I just feel that's a "conflict" situations where you do not. The semantics don't matter, we're talking about the same thing. I see it like selling, I want you to buy my product, you might want it, might not, and you want the price lower. So it's a "conflict", not necessarily a bad thing, but we want different things. And if I start casting a net for new AP's, most of the women I will talk to will, in fact, not want to have sex with me. So our interests aren't aligned, I want sex, they want a friendship/business relationship/etc. No necessarily contentious though, and, as I mentioned, I think you did a great job describing the typical progression.

I do think it starts out with "feelers", casting a net a mile wide to anyone person that won't shut it down. for every five "you crossed a line", there's always a "HMM". My wife was a hmmm. His approach was to reach out and get to know her under the guise of our kids playing.

If he's getting 1 AP for every 5 feelers, he must be one of the Jonas brothers. Now, I've never been an AP, but I did a lot of dating, and I can tell you, if you told me that you could teach me to "bat 200" (1 out of 5 would say yes), I would have paid you a lot of money to teach me how. My "batting average" when dating was probably more like 1-20 or 1-30. It took a ton of feelers/attempts to find someone who wanted to have sex with me. And I was a decent looking guy, good job, in shape and, most importantly, NOT married! My W's AP wasn't rich, wasn't as good looking as me, not in as good shape, and of course, is married (with little kids at home). How many APs do you think he put feelers out with before he found my W (or any of the other APs)? A lot. A whole lot. 100's wouldn't surprise me at all. And honestly, I'd be surprised if many male AP's (absent, of course, actors/rock stars/famously rich) could do much better than that.