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and other times she would say nono I don't want an open relationship, I don't want you with someone else.

It's nothing more than selfishness. They are entitled to all the cake from you, from AP, and in my STBX's case from all of the above plus hookers, and we are only entitled to sit on their shelves until they need us.

That belies an incredible over-valuing of themselves and an insane devaluing of us. They see themselves as so special that they deserve a man-servant or lady in waiting, while we should be grateful to be in their service, receiving crumbs.

We get so little - no kept vows or promises, no access to information (i.e. that they are bringing other people into our unions) and no real intimacy from them.

I think we are both worth so much more.

That belies an incredible over-valuing of themselves and an insane devaluing of us. They see themselves as so special that they deserve a man-servant or lady in waiting, while we should be grateful to be in their service, receiving crumbs.

I don't agree with that first part at least w.r.t. to WW - she has low self esteem / chronic depression, thinks she's ugly, and also thinks she's bad at everything she does. IMO it's more she doesn't try very hard, despite encouragement. She isn't going out thinking she can score just with any guy -- her relationship with the AP is different, because it's an ex-BF and she can't stop, I believe, because it makes her feel good and she can run away from mistakes/responsibility.

The rest, 100%. And your WH especially sounds like he over values himself with multiple APs and what he's said to you. With my WW I feel like if she got on anti-depressants or something it might've helped (she informed me earlier this week she quit seeing her current therapist because the woman was pressuring her to go to a psychiatrist as well...WW wanted to continue on just talking therapy to see where that would take her, at least until the new year...I don't blame her being wary of someone pushing the drugs though)

[This message edited by ShatteredSakura at 11:12 AM, December 13th (Friday)]

I wonder if he's different at work or if I'm the only one who get's to see the cluster b monster?

Yes. You are the only one who sees it. For now. Especially if he's a fucking narcissist. That's how WH was. His friends just couldn't believe he would do those things. They couldn't see him as someone who needed help because he was so "strong", so they didn't believe me.

He did a good job of making me look crazy.

Sounds about right.

I got a lot of apologies after his death. I also got a lot of people that couldn't look me in the eye or apologize - because they fucking knew.

And narcissists lack humility amongst other human emotions. The glimpses you see are him trying to show he can be "nice" - when he wants to.

I wish I could give you the strength you need, but that will come from inside you. You can and will survive this. Don't let him take anything else from you - especially your sanity like mine almost did to me.

Stay away from him. Keep as much distance as possible or you will be in for more mind fucks. You can and will do better. He is not the king shit of fuck mountain (I'm sure he thinks he is).

Be you. Be beautiful. AND put those bitch boots on and show that motherfucker who is boss.

[This message edited by CatsNTats at 2:13 PM, December 13th (Friday)]

Be you. Be beautiful. AND put those bitch boots on and show that motherfucker who is boss.

Thanks, Cats. Boots are going on!

Today was ick bc I heard some crap about one of his APs being in town - drove me a little nuts but stayed away from reaching out - then he reached out to me in the afternoon and before I knew what I was doing I was responding - argh.

Anyway, that convo ended before too long but I wish it hadn't happen because EVERYTIME I talk to him I feel like SHIT.

Going out with a friend tonight so that will keep me distracted and hopefully I will be exhausted and go to sleep when I get back.

Hey Sakura,

Yes, sounds like she may have low self-esteem so she's getting what she can from having two men pursuing her.

The devaluing is perhaps even worse than over-valuing themselves. The way they abuse us by cheating and continuing even after dday - is something I wouldn't do to my worst enemy. To devalue someone enough to treat them this badly is pathological IMO. It is not normal to abuse people period - let alone people you say you love.

That's quite a rough patch. Have you sought counseling, at least to get yourself on a firm footing?

Hi Codermom,

Yes, I've been in IC for a few months now - its helpful but maybe insufficient to the cause. I'm contemplating an in patient place or adding another IC.

Your soon to be ex is an extra kind of special. Don’t be ashamed to be here... we didn’t do anything wrong. This is the greatest club nobody ever wanted to be a part of. We are here for you. Mine is a sex addict too, I get how soul crushing it is. Love and hugs

The devaluing is perhaps even worse than over-valuing themselves. The way they abuse us by cheating and continuing even after dday - is something I wouldn't do to my worst enemy. To devalue someone enough to treat them this badly is pathological IMO. It is not normal to abuse people period - let alone people you say you love.

I agree it is pathological. It certainly feels that way. The pieces of myself I have to put back together are many. This kind of trauma actually changes your brain from ‘The Body Keeps The Score.’

This kind of trauma actually changes your brain

There's no question in my mind about this. I have a vague memory of the woman I was before and I know she's never coming back. I know I'll be happy again for sure, but I also know I won't be the same.

We do belong to a club that we never wanted to be a part of of and it's full of wise people who pulled themselves from the ashes but you can't un-know this shit. There are always going to be moments when something triggers a traumatic memory. It's something you carry. My son's father was a full on, clinical narc. I recovered. I was happy again but there are some ugly, deeply painful memories that I just try to keep locked away.

My current asshole is pulling up all of those old traumas along with adding to the pile of shit in my heart. I pray I never trust another man again with my heart.