SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I really understand, Southern Gal. And it bothers me, too.

I do understand where you are coming from and how you feel. Let me start by telling that you are much prettier than you think, and that the OW's looks didn't matter. There are some OWs that are unattractive and some that are. As others mentioned, the affair wasn't about looks.

That said, I'll share why I indulge in bashing the OW's looks (and other shortcomings).

My OW took so many things away from me. She violated my life, conspired against me, called me names behind my back and so on. I could go on, but all of you know what I mean. When all this happened, she had never even met me. And, she has never even shown remorse.

So, I take what satisfaction that I can. In my case, the OW is fugly. Not to be vain, but I consider myself above average.

Knowing that I am more attractive, more interesting, make more money and am a better person are things that I have that she never will. It doesn't make up for the things she took from me, but it is something.

It's interesting how being betrayed make us look at ourselves. I don't know when, but somewhere in the years of being married I stopped thinking of myself as either unattractive or handsome, and I'm not sure I cared. I looked at myself as married, and I thought I had the love of beautiful woman, so I guess I was content with how I looked. I probably let myself go too much, got complacent, put on a lot of weight, didn't exercise as much as I had in my youth, but I was reaching my late 40s and was complacent. I was 5'8 and around 195ish on DDay. It hurt, and I mean really hurt, when I saw the photo of my wife's AP on her laptop. He was around 6'2", 200ish, fit, ex special forces, 5 years younger than me, and he was very handsome (rugged good looks I think they call it, the kind of guy that might make a episode of Sex and the City as one of Samantha's conquests as a fireman). Of course, she had a lot of men to choose from in looking to find "her guy" on AM, but all the men she was interviewing to be the lucky one all were taller, fitter, and better looking than me. I don't think it was a coincidence, she was going for the hottest guy she could find in the looks department. If I'm honest with myself, I'd say she did real well. Other than the fact he liked to screw married women, he was the type of guy that every girl in the bar would want (generalizing, but there's enough studies to show that in general, women prefer men like him over men like me). So as much as I'd like to bash him about his looks, that avenue just isn't open. I can talk all day about how internally he was this and that, but the fact is I can't compete with him in looks. The main issue is I shouldn't of had too, but it's not like I don't look in the mirror and hate what I see. Affairs rock your self esteem know matter how you compare yourself to the AP, and I'm sure he isn't crying himself to sleep every night because he thinks I'm funnier or smarter. We live in a looks dominated society, and it's reinforced in just about every medium we are exposed to daily. Someday I hope that I'll get back to the point where I'm happy with the best me I can be, and that I'll be with someone compatible who thinks that's good enough for them. That's life I guess.

I agree with you, SG, I do. I can empathize also in that I know for a fact that many assume I must be butt ugly in order for WH to do what he did to me (for so long)-most of which have never seen me or met me. I have to also agree with the fact that their (OP) ugliness is truly from inside far more than the outside-in that sense, these are truly, truly ugly people. Maybe some of us are being immature by name calling or nit picking physical details, I have been guilty of that in the case of OWs. I apologize if I have offended you or anyone. Now, keep in mind that I am not at the peak of fitness and am overweight myself, not to mention that many of my best friends have severe weight issues and I find them to be absolutely beautiful-and not just on the inside.

That being said, WH (by his own admission) deliberately “affair’d” down for several reasons. 90% of his Craigslist, AM, AFF, etc activity was focused on the BBWs. His PAs were with obese, revolting women because (his words),”Neither ToG, nor anyone else of importance would ever believe he would involve himself in such trash.” He figured they were perfect targets because if found out there’s no way anyone would believe their words over his. He is vain and arrogant. I (immaturely, I know) believe that I probably complain about their looks to reiterate that they are the epitome of what he claims to dislike. All of them, not just the BBWs. ….I do it to indicate what a hypocrite he is-not because I have an issue about their appearance.

Not only that, but BBWs on AM, AFF and the like are deliberately targeting married men (or women). They use their weight to seduce MARRIED men (and women). It’s not their weight that offends me, it’s them….using their weight as a selling factor. They are predators in the same way WH is. I have no sympathy for them.

WH, in my case, is a tall, skinny, geeky-ish guy who was raised by 2 people with severe NPD issues. Both of his adoptive parents and 2 siblings were about 200+ pounds heavier than him-each. His entire childhood flip-flopped between them hating him (and vocalizing it) for being a skinny, intelligent kid to the parents playing him off each other by boosting his ego from his appearance. His first sexual encounter – he was raped by a morbidly obese babysitter who was 5-6 years his senior. So, one can sort of see where his obsession came from…not a healthy place. He claims his obsession with this genre of people comes from feeling inadequate and wanting to punish himself. I don’t know. I do know that this is a problem that I have with THEM and not their appearance.

I probably made no sense as usual and this will probably come across entirely unlike I intended. I just wanted to say that I appreciate this thread and all of the replies I have read on it. I appreciate being reminded that it’s not traits or characteristics of OPs that have hurt us, it’s the messed up people that they are/were.

I get it, but BS bash because they are suffering some of the lowest self esteem we will ever suffer.

I mean honestly, why do we tease people or make fun of anyone for looks,personality, etc? Either we've been hurt by them, we're jealous, or they are Kardashians.

I'm sorry you've been insulted by some of the OP look bashing. I would hate to think the forum was providing more hurt instead of support. I can't say I won't be doing some OP look bashing myself (although in my defense they are of the opposite gender)

It's much easier to tear an OP down than try and start rebuilding ourselves.

[This message edited by follyandsuch at 4:49 PM, November 16th (Friday)]

I NEVER said that OP in my case is unworthy of love. I NEVER said that. Like the same poster said, she should be looking for love in the right place.

We are all entitled to a mate, someone who will love us and treasure us, and put us first.Everyone on earth: regardless of weight, beauty, smarts. etc.

I simply mentioned that in my case, the fact that the OP is ugly, is true.

Another poster mentioned that after the affair we look at ourselves differently. Our self-esteem suffers.

I will only speak for myself: This would have probably been the case had I not known who she OP is. I would have been wondering if she is younger, thinner, more beautiful, more successful, smarter, etc. Since I know who she is and what she does best ( which is going after men to validate her worth as a woman) my self-esteem never suffered. I never asked myself whether she was smarter, more beautiful etc. On the contrary: Like I told H, I feel offended that he picked HER to have an EA with. He knew better than I did who this woman is, what her reputation in their circles is, how low she is regarded in those circles ( he had even told me so himself sometime before he started seeing her)and the only thing she knows how to do well is chase men. Yes, I am still offended that he picked a low life like her and I even told him that he should have picked a woman of substance.

Oh, sorry everyone....I forgot that a woman of substance has self -respect, morals, and integrity; a woman of substance doesn't go out with a married man, and esp. a married man whose wife had always treated her with respect and the best way she knew how.

I do know that some posters may say that I am overstating how she acts in their circles, but they do not know her. Everything I have stated is true. I knew of this woman's reputation long before I met her. That says it all. Still, my H overlooked it all and fell for the compliments ( he admitted to that ); in return he was doing all the work for her.

When I discovered he had cheated, I wanted to know who the person was, and although I didn't ahve an exact image of what she might look like, I knew the type of woman he found attractive and imagined it would be someone that looked like that.

Exactly this for me. How could I not obsess or question the OW's looks when my husband did something so baffling with someone so baffling. It's not about judgement or insecruity, it's about dissecting the affair inside and out and that includes the two cheaters and everything about them--physical apperance of the OW/OM are naturally part of it especially for someone that has been hiding in your life and marriage trying to destroy it. In the beginning most BS's are seeking the big WHY--I looked frantically everywhere for the magic reason--focusing on the physical appearance good or bad is part of the process, well it was for me anyway. If there are people that can totally set that aside then my hats off to you and you are a much stronger soul than I could ever hope to be. However, do I read or participate in the threads that are started to bash the OW/OM's looks and can sometimes be shockingly immature and beyond mean--NO WAY. But, I'm also most likely at a different place in this healing process than those hurting and damaged people and have moved on from that particular focus. Hopefully they find that place someday too.

I am not perfect at all, not skinny, not perfectly dressed, not a beauty queen,most days i dont do my hair also i have rosecea.

Even with all this I am still better looking than OW. Im prettier and 12 YEARS YOUNGER!!!! She is in no way , to anyone pretty or WH's type.

I believe its more of a refference point thing and not based on movie star beauty.

It hurts me that she is LESS than me but it would hurt my self esteem also if she was better looking/younger than me.

For me it just sheds light on the fact that WH obviously CANT DO BETTER THAN ME..that boosts my self esteem.

I believe that for us BS when we think we are being cheated on we assume/imagine this amazing person that is way better than us and when thats not the case its a big shock.

As a BW I personally love the OP bashing! It just helps me with my anger for OW and gives me a little laugh. When my WH told me who OW was I first laughed in his face because I knew her, we went to school with her and she's trash, always has been always will be. I think the more I found out about how she went after my WH and the way she used her kids, she became uglier and uglier to me. Not having anything to do with looks but just the ugly manipulating sick person she was inside. I don't think that saying the OP is ugly is saying eeewww to all of us who don't look like super models it's saying eeewww to the ugly people they are inside! None of the OP's out there can compare to a BS who is hurt and fighting for our M, we will always be stronger and more beautiful, isn't that why they want our lives!?

Thank you SG ffor raising this. I have stayed quiet but been uncomfortable for a ling tume on this issue

I understand un early stages, or were there is continued harm, BS may fwel some relief through venting in any way they can.

I find these threads pajnful toi. Ans think they jst reinforce that a womans physical worth outweighs her humanuty.

BUT my Hs AP was also v attractive by external judgement and ine if things that hurt me deeply is that at the end of the day, everyrhing I am didnt count for anythung against her physicality. I dont hve big issues with my physical appearance , i just thoughty humanity mattered more.

[This message edited by MegM at 6:45 PM, November 16th (Friday)]

I was a model when spousal unit #1 cheated and still wearing a bikini at 47-48 when I discovered #2 was a cheating pig. I have some absolutely GORGEOUS friends who have been cheated on. It has nothing to do with looks. Now I'm rather plump and I don't like it, but I like being single and plump better than married, thin, and miserable.

This is a good thread, and I am so sorry for the self-esteem hit that everyone has been given because of this.

Looks are a touchy subject for me also. I told a male customer at work about my WS, and he felt the need to comment profusely about how insane my WS was for cheating, what the hell was he looking for because it didn't get any better than me. And you know what, I've heard that from several men at work, and NONE of it made me feel better. It just kind of made me angry....because apparently they felt that since they thought I was attractive, no guy should cheat on me, but if I were unattractive (in their eyes) I guess that would be understandable.

But this shit has screwed me up enough (between WS and psychoX) that I've gained a bit of weight and don't dress the way I used to, because I've got it in my head that in order to find a decent caring guy, I need to be an average type of woman. Because being an attractive woman only attracts the type of guys that will cheat or use me as an object, and I am comfy now with the extra weight and sweat pants. I have no interest in attracting guys with my looks anymore because I haven't been getting very good ones.

I think I am probably still a bit f*cked up over all this.....

H met OW in a chatroom. He only ever saw a small head and shoulders pic of her before theymet. He even wonders if that pic was actually her.

In chat, and the telephone, she described herself as tall, neither stick thin or fat, big breasted. She talked about never wearing make-up because she didn't need to.

Whn he actually met, and the photos I hae seen of her (FB and Myspace), she is nothing like the description of herself.

When I discovered he had cheated and I asked about her, including what she looked lie - he pretty much gave me the description she had given him.

I knew he was lying about her, (he lied about so much) - it wasn't until I found her Myspace that the truth began to emerge.

That also was part of my shock at seeing her photograph.

and he felt the need to comment profusely about how insane my WS was for cheating, what the hell was he looking for because it didn't get any better than me.

Why do you assume he was talking about your "looks"? He very well could have been talking about the total package of you. And, he was right! (((NaiveAgain)))

First I want to thank everyone for weighing in with their thoughts on this and for sharing their stories.

Second I want to tell NaiveAgain - Oh honey, even us average (or below average) looking people manage to attract cheaters. Be comfortable in your own skin no matter what that means!

Third I wanted to point out what a doofus I am.

I was reading through the thread and on page 4 Carey quoted my first post. I read her post and thought, "Wow that quote is really good. I should use that sometime."

DUH! I was my own quote. LOL

My brain is so fried that I actually didn't realize it was my own comment.

SG, I agree with you wholeheartedly. I am short, some overweight, and also have very short hair and rosacea as well. (BTW, none of these thing, including my weight, have changed since I met my late hubs). It was truly devastating to my self-esteem when my H took up with, and even put me out of our home for, an OP who is 15 years OLDER than me, 75 pounds heavier, and had boobs that would have been knocking her knees without some serious underwiring. But hey, she had been casually dating H before we met, lived right around the corner so she was convenient, and baked a great blueberry pie. Oh, and she would ask H all the time to come do little things around the house for her, like tightening the screws on her flagpole (that was a classic - I about peed myself laughing when he told me that one!), while I worked full-time with a heavy travel schedule, as well as handling all the cooking, cleaning, laundry, and yard work. You know, he told me on our second date he liked women with long hair and big boobs - neither of which I possessed - I wonder why he even bothered to pursue and marry me. I'll never get over his choosing her over me, at least until he got sick again and needed someone (me) to nurse him. Don't need looks for that, I guess.

I was reading through the thread and on page 4 Carey quoted my first post. I read her post and thought, "Wow that quote is really good. I should use that sometime."

LOL! Like sometimes I am reading through a tread and see something I totally agree with and I'm all "dat's right!!" And then I look to see who said it and realize it was me. LMAO /TJ

I understand this thread completely.

I am guilty in that I bashed OW's looks initially... but it was because my first instinct was to look at how attractive she was before I thought about how attractive (or otherwise) she was as a person.

I think we are all (or maybe it IS just a quirk of mine?) guilty of looking at someone and making a snap judgment based on how they look if we don't know that person.

I try to say now- it matters not what THEY look like as it is the WS who has a brokenness and THAT is why they cheat.

I also do think that if I put a pic up of me and pretended I was the OW I would be judged more harshly lookswise.

Perhaps we know it would hurt someone dreadfully if we said, "Now SHE/HE is actually very attractive looking!"???

I am rambling a bit but I hope what I am trying to say made sense??

I think in some sick, nonsensical way it would have been better if WH had cheated with someone prettier than me. Better in that it would be easier to make sense of. But he didn't- he said she was ok pretty, not ugly certainly, but not beautiful like he thought I was. She was just different, he says.

She was available and EASY. Maybe easy

makes for rose colored glasses.

It's not about us, it's about them being broken.

Having said that, it sure is hard to not take it personally. And at 3am, I don't believe that myself.

Southen Gal

I just want you to know that your concerns about this, I have heard, and share.

I find it astounding that a member has posted about something that causes them pain and others have continued the behaviour within the very same thread.

I understand some posters have reflected on the behaviour and attempted to offer you some insight as to what motivates it, what comfort they receive from it. I get that.

But I don't get how others could come on here and just vent all over again and feel justified to argue the validity of doing so right here in your thread.

When threads are started in the vein of the issues you have raised I have not thread jacked and jumped in with my issues about it. I have attempted to resect the original posters pain and that it is General Forum and left ppl to it. Despite that I feel wounded by it, and also feel anxious that I have not spoken out.

thank you again southern gal for the spirit and issues you have raised. Thank you for finding a voice for many of us who have been silent on this matter.

best wishes.

Meg