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Fidelia,

I'm crying for you in Starbucks. With your FOO, it's wonderful that you learned so much about real love. Maybe from the church. Obviously, you have so much to give and are lovable to the core.

I have to say that my WH did that past-and-future only thing while he was in the A (before d-day). He had stopped rewriting the marriage, so he remembered that we had been happy for 12 years. He knew the A was wrong, and he planned to come back to me emotionally and love me right again when it was over. But he was stuck in it. He couldn't figure out how to get out and couldn't imagine coming clean to me.

Is it possible that your WH hasn't told you the worst of it?

[This message edited by sailorgirl at 12:07 PM, April 26th (Friday)]

I'm so sorry Fidelia. What you're describing sounds very familiar to me and very similar to my husband's "lingering doubts" that he kept using as an excuse to misbehave and jerk me around.

It sounds like he's jerking you around in the same way, and my guess is that he'll keep giving you just enough hope to keep you hanging on. Just don't let him waffle on you. It's hell. ((HUGS))

(((Fidelia)))

Take it one day at a time. Today, deal with today... Don't freak/psych yourself out worrying about the future. We tell ourselves all kinds of things about what we think we will accept from life... We are our own worst enemies, oftentimes we actually create our own unhappiness simply by nurturing our thoughts and having too many expectations. I swore up and down all my adult life that infidelity was an absolute deal-breaker, and automatic divorce, but here I am in R.

He didn't want me to go with him to see the MC (he's there now). He didn't think of what I needed, what we needed, just what he wanted.

Just beforehand we were talking about things upstairs in the bedroom. He kept bouncing from one thing to another, as if testing out reasons to leave:

* I'm too good for him

No, we're both just fallible human beings

* He loves me but doesn't like some things about me

Well he's not exactly perfect either and he knew all those things about me before we married almost 14 years ago

* listing my faults

See above and I didn't throw a bomb into our marriage

* He's a bad selfish person

Yes he has been, but that's all about choices. He could choose to make different choices. Leaving is a selfish bad choice.

* He doesn't feel like he's made to be in a relationship

Umm, hello, we've been married for almost 14 years and were dating for 3 years before that. He did pretty well until the last few years. Slow learner?

* I've not been happy for a long time

See above and if he'd actually talked about it we could have dealt with it. It's not too late to turn things around now, if he's willing to do the work together

These are all things he said right from the beginning when I first began to discover things. Nothing has changed. He has just got better at saying the right things.

And there was no concern for me or the boys. Well he made one comment about us being better without him because he'll just hurt me again. But that was all about him too. Not really feeling hopeful right now. I need an actual miracle.

Oh and he also started pushing against some boundaries we have in place:

* Parental software on his mobile because of the porn thing

* Not going to works drinks because he used that to meet with her etc

These are both boundaries that he suggested, but he was talking as if he was a grumpy teen talking to their tough mum. I told him that he chose them and it was up to him to keep them, but he chose them to protect us and our marriage.

On SI it says to watch their actions over months, not just what they say. All of this conversation tells me that he's been trying to say what he thinks I want to hear, but can't keep it up because it's ot what he really wants.

Well if that's the case, then why keep me hanging on for 8 MONTHS. Why let me have hope? Why keep crushing me? Why not just leave straight away? Then I'd be 8 months further on from healing from this all.

Well, actually, he likes to be seen as the good guy. He's passive / passive aggressive. Walking away from us after having an affair can't very easily be made to look good, can it? Maybe he just wanted me to ask him to leave but I wouldn't co-operate with that. Well, good. If he wants to destroy our marriage and our family, then he can blooming well face up to that.

[This message edited by Fidelia at 11:56 AM, April 26th (Friday)]

But I still want / pray for this M to be healed

((((((((((Fidelia))))))))))

Fidelia,

I've been following your post for awhile and right now my heart is breaking for you. I know that you really want to save this M, but your WH really seems like he is getting ready to call it quits.

You're right, he left you hanging on for 8 months because now when he walks he can say, "Well I gave it my best, it just didn't work out." Which we all know is crap. He didn't give it his best, he half-assed it.

I am going to keep praying for you, that you have the strength to face whatever is coming your way.

(((Fidelia)))

He's just told me that he's given himself permission not to make a decision today.

He also said he's been unhappy for some time. I asked him since when. He said the counsellor asked that too. The time correlates to when our eldest was a baby, he didn't feel respected in his job and when the EA with OW1 started.

So...he starts an EA and ever since then he's been unhappy. I reckon it's self perpetuating.

So sorry for you Fidelia.

(((Fidelia)))

Two points. First...

Right now, you are too good for your H, Fidelia.

To be a good partner again, he has to look inside, accept that he doesn't like what he sees and feels, and find the courage and strength to change. Until he does that, he's useless in an M. You deserve better - and you will have to get it for yourself.

I hear your sadness. I hope your H finds himself again and works with you to rebuild your M. But staying in this sitch, without changing it, is taking the life out of you.

**********************

Second, based on your profile and posts, I assume you're C of E. Wasn't the founding principal of the C of E that a person can divorce and remarry? Are you really prohibited from remarrying by your Church - or are you just so far down that you want to eat worms?

I'm not making light of that. I've been there during R, and it's awful. But it's temporary.

You're smart, loving, insightful, full of life (which may just be a synonym for 'young') - you'll feel joy again. I hope it's with your H (since that's what you want), but if he won't get on board, choose life for yourself. Choose life.

(((Fidelia)))

Our timelines are very similar, and I know how devastated I would be if my WH started acting like this after 8 months. He is back to Dday behavior, right down to the blameshifting and trickle truth. How incredibly hurtful and selfish. Even if he isn't cheating again (it sounds like he is at least on the road to it) this kind of mean spirited selfishness is not what you deserve.

He has left our marriage.

He tried to say that he was leaving because he had messed me around so much and didn't want to hurt me anymore.

I feel that he was lying to me for the first 4 months about the PA. The last 4 months he's been doing the minimum, saying the right things, but his actions have often not followed through.

Just before he left I asked to look at his phone. Two of his self chosen boundaries are:

1. No texting/phoning women for social reasons

2. No discussing our M with women.

He had called a female colleague and told her our marriage was in trouble. Then they exchanged some texts. And he only told me when I saw it. Well that explains the boundary pushing.

I feel that he really just wants to live as a single man. He actually almost tried to ask if he could cake eat. Saying that he wished there was some kind of halfway house between staying and leaving.

I also discovered that he'd told his parents he was going to leave, before he told me. He also bad mouthed me to them.

I hope that he's not going to try and make me look bad so that he looks like the good guy in all this. I'm not going to play these games.

I'm not looking forward to the boys waking up to find him gone. He'll be back about 3 hours after they wake up so that we can break it to them.

I did not want this. Why couldn't he face himself and his actions? Why is he running away from it all? He can fool himself that he's doing us a favour, but he's broken apart our marriage and family and broken all our hearts.

Sisoon - people can remarry, but clergy have to get the bishop's permission. I'm from the low church / evangelical wing and they're not exactly welcoming of remarriage, let alone remarriage of clergy. Plus, I'm praying that he makes the changes and comes back to R

I'm so sorry, Fidelia.

(((Fidelia)))

Oh my gosh, does this hit home. I think the best thing we can all do is take care of ourselves, realize we are lovable, and love is a choice - a mature, adult choice. You will know what to do. Take it one day at a time and realize, maybe today you don't need to make a final decision. You made a lot of REALLY hard choices today - confronting something you don't want to hear, listening to your gut, listening to your husband. The most important thing is you spoke up. Give yourself a lot of credit. When we are hurting that takes a lot of courage. Hugs your way!

(((fidelia)))

I'm so sorry.

(((Fidelia)))

I came back to edit that comment out of my post, but too late. Thanks for the info.

I'm glad to read you're not giving up hope. My comment that he's not much use in an M relates to now. He can change, and I hope he does, for his sake as well as yours.

Thanks Sisoon.

I'm praying for change too. But if this, and me pursuing divorce doesn't motivate him to make changes, I don't know what will.

The counsellor said that he kind of created a second persona who could do all this hidden stuff. I feel like he's shut the real him away in a box because he can't face up to his actions, because he hates his real self. And so he's let this new persona take over. He learnt all the right things to say and even made short term changes, but they never lasted and he never fought for our marriage, only did things passively, never did anything I hadn't asked (and didn't do all of that).

Each time counselling got too close, he stopped it for a new type. But our new MC wouldn't let him try to blame me etc and I think it shook him, she might see through him. I think that's why he suddenly became so very distant this week straight after MC.

As long as he lets the A persona take charge, nothing is going to change. It's the easy option for him. Easier to break up our marriage and family than to face himself and own what he has done and actually work on making changes. It's so very sad.

Even if he decides not to R, I want him to become whole again, but I don't know if he will.