SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Going to push a little more...your husband knew about your online friendship, at what point did the communication go from things you would be comfortable talking about with this guy in front of your husband to hiding the things you were talking about, or the frequency?

The online build up is, or can be non-sexual, but I'm here to tell you that there is such thing as an emotional affair and it doesn't have to be sexual to be considered an affair. I had an EA only. Never had a PA despite my earlier comment in this thread.

So, if your BH had been talking to another woman as much as you had been talking to the OM before you first had sex, would you have wanted to know? Would you view it better if he had confessed or if you had found out yourself?

Well luckyllama... SI is only the right place for someone who wants to heal honestly with support from others. It is not a happy place for someone who thinks their affair should be kept a secret from their spouse and get pats on the back for saving their feelings. Hell no. Maybe I should mention I found one of those forums too. The sneaky bastard cheating forums that helps you hide affairs. I would point it out to you but that horrible website got shut down because the owner was disgusted by the members. Apparently there are a lot of people out there that flocked to that site to find ways to bullet proof their affair and justify it all. They all supported each other in a bad way. Oh you poor thing, you had a dday. Let me help you find a way to go underground... Blah. I gross myself out for knowing every trick of the trade. Thankfully my confession and honesty to my husband was more important than living a lie.

I wish you well. Your story brought tears to my eyes and I hope you find the strength to save yourself. We will be here for you if needed with no judging. We all had our moments of being there.

Thats really unfortunate LL...I personally think you could gain alot, if you weren't so defensive.

I wish you well on your journey..but hope you decide to stay here.

I'm a fledgling FWW and recently confessed multiple affairs going back from 21 years to 5 years ago. This week I handed over a complete timeline and lurid details that had me cringing as I wrote them, knowing my H would be reading those words.

My H was also disconnected and disengaged. But not anymore. He wanted to know everything, and this is from a man who never ever questioned my old habits of being out till 4am in the morning, and who offhandedly commented during a conversation "well I assume you've been faithful" and quickly moved on to something else.

Yesterday, he made me look him in the eyes as I smashed a bottle of perfume that the OM had brought me 7 years ago. I didnt think he even noticed it as it had been sitting in a cupboard and I'd never worn it.

But now he notices everything.

I was like you Llama. The thought of confessing my affairs was so ludicrous, and my fear so great, that anyone suggesting that it was EXACTLY what I needed to do, would have been guffawed at.

But as it turned out, it was exactly what I needed to do. As our relationship now is showing.

My H now knows exactly who he is loving, and what he can forgive. The fact he is still here and telling me how awful it is that I could debase myself so badly with men who didn't deserve me, is the most loving thing anyone has ever said to me. And generous, considering his own pain at my betrayals.

This site is unique in that the people on here give freely of their time, experience and yes, love, to those of us struggling through the mire of infidelity. And as waywards, we know truth is often missing from our lives, and when given, not always well received.

I hope for your sake, you can feel the love and caring behind people's words on here, because that is where they come from.

Good luck.

Going to push a little more...your husband knew about your online friendship, at what point did the communication go from things you would be comfortable talking about with this guy in front of your husband to hiding the things you were talking about, or the frequency?

Even when the chat conversations were too long, there was nothing said that I'd be uncomfortable with my husband reading. It was platonic but not appropriate because I shouldn't have spend an hour talking online.

It definitely turned into an emotional affair and then a physical affair...and I agree with you that an emotional affair is still an affair.

if your BH had been talking to another woman as much as you had been talking to the OM before you first had sex, would you have wanted to know?

No, I wouldn't want to know. That's probably not the "right" answer but I wouldn't.

Would you view it better if he had confessed or if you had found out yourself?

Given the choices of him confessing or me finding out myself, I'd rather he confess.

Just woke up in my part of the world and caught up on this thread.

I sincerely acknowledge all the efforts that veteran fWW put into fresh fWW, the thing is sometimes it's just too soon to start absorbing these pearls of wisdom because the hurt is too much.

The rate and intensity of withdrawal is different for every person. It hurts like hell. I personally feel like I convinced myself I had withdrew from AP as this is where I "should" be by now and from feeling guilty for still having feelings for him. I wish I didn't but there are mega triggers right now and I can't avoid them (major developments in the country he lives in and it's on the news every single day, people talk about it every day, AP and I used to spend hours talking about it as he's personally involved in it). So, as much as I can go about life avoiding any triggers, some are in my face and I have to deal with them.

This sets me off and I get very sad. I've started crying again this week, when I haven't even done this for weeks and weeks. I thought I was getting stronger but it would seem I've had a set back and perhaps this is ok as long as I deal with it in a healthy way.

What I've realised is I'm not in a good emotional space to start working on things with my H. I'm taking out my anger on him that's actually directed at xAP for throwing me under the bus. I still haven't dealt with the rejection and abandonment related to that. Both the issues need to be separated. I need to heal and get stronger before I start dealing with my M as the issues are getting blurred and it's actually making issues in my M worse. There's too much transference, and as my H isn't ready to start talking about the A just yet, I need to figure those things out internally and with my SI friends.

It was a thread I started on SI that helped me understand that I'm mixing up the issues and need to chill for a while.

llama and I and people like us need tough love (especially me as I tend to fantasise alot). We need perspective and reality checking BUT we would also benefit from a little bit of nurturing from fWW's who KNOWS how withdrawal feels (even if their withdrawal was instant they still had to withdraw).

I wish I could have a virtual version of sitting around with gf's, eating ice cream, being depressed, after all that's part of the weaning process of any break-up. Just for a few vents to be able to hear, "yes, it's fucking hard and it sucks, but now let's focus on how you're gonna make things better". Self-pity? Perhaps. But that's where I'm at right now.

I guess what I'm saying is I'm no where near the indifferent stage that I'm aiming for. It's going to take time and I'm inpatient. I'm doing the whole rubber band thing, avoiding reading or watching the news, posting regualarly but I'm still very bruised and hurting at the way it all ended. I'm still trying to process it. I need friends who I can talk to about this as IRL I have none.

Sorry LLama, don't mean to hijack your thread. Maybe I'll start one of my own.

No Contact isn't just physical. It's mental. What is withdrawal? Getting rid of and getting over something that is bad for you right? People deal with withdrawals from sugar, cigarettes, alcohol, drugs, shoes, poor spending habits, Beanie Baby obsessions, people, the list goes on.

The difference is these are not taboo topics. If I was withdrawing from the above I'd have a number of people I could talk to about them. I wouldn't need an anonymous forum for support. I could talk to the post-man about how I'm craving a cigarette and wear my nicorette patch. I could talk to my mum, dad, husband, sister, friend, colleague, kids about how I need their support in me not somking anymore. I can't do that when I'm withdrawing from an AFFAIR partner hence why I come to other waywards. Not for sympathy but for support and venting and of course for some gentle reflection.

And as for not letting go of spouse whilst withdrawing from xAP being selfish, well I have said on many occasions, that's been my hugest failings. I have selfish tendencies and I'm trying hard to be a bit more selfless. My H and I share a dynamic where he fuels my selfish behaviour and we have talked about this together. I call it boundaries, he calls it selfishness. Anyway, we are addressing it together. Needless to say, selfishness is one thing most WW's have in common otherwise we wouldn't have affairs in the first place.

I get where people are coming from and I appreciate it. It's from a place of "Please woman, I've been there, I know what you need to do to heal, just do it and you'll be fine, benefit from me so my pain and hard work is not in vain"

I feel the same when I'm telling people to go NC. Encouraging them, telling them they'll be ok, because I know that was the right thing to do and I can start the journey of not being a wayward anymore. But it took me a while and I did it when I was ready. I had the goal in sight, but was always just too scared to do it.

I am benefiting from this site. Thanks to everyone.

The fact he is still here and telling me how awful it is that I could debase myself so badly with men who didn't deserve me, is the most loving thing anyone has ever said to me.

This brought tears to my eys, ophelia. I remember thinking that exactly during my own gut wrenching talks with my husband. This is true love, not shallow affair fantasy, but real, "I value you" love.

I wish I could have a virtual version of sitting around with gf's, eating ice cream, being depressed, after all that's part of the weaning process of any break-up. Just for a few vents to be able to hear, "yes, it's fucking hard and it sucks, but now let's focus on how you're gonna make things better". Self-pity? Perhaps. But that's where I'm at right now.

trying, this scene is for a single woman after a break up and mourning the loss and loneliness of having no partner now. Your reality is you HAVE a husband who loved and valued you enough to marry you, and make you the only woman he wants to spend the rest of his life with. While you are sitting there romantisizing about the man you degraded yourself to have an affair with, your husband is choking on pain from the knife you stabbed into his heart when he trusted you to keep it safe. He just found out that when he thought you were his trusted partner that he adored as the most special woman to him, you were actually lying to him and sneaking behind his back to go have sex with another man and humiliate him. In llama's case, the BH doesn't even know he's been utterly disrespected and humiliated by the woman he still thinks is his partner. Have you thought of how much your husband hurts or will hurt? I've seen first hand my husband curling up into a ball of tears for days after I confessed, the pain and anger in his eyes crushing. How well does this soul breaking pain on your BH fit into your self pity?

I've been where you are, trying to end things and stop thinking about the OM on my own while hiding everything from my husband. It led me to go from an EA that lasted years to a PA, all while telling myself "I won't see him again". When the PA happened, I was shocked at what I did, and angry that the OM could disrespect me so much to help me dishonor my marriage. Even then I didn't cut off contact when guilt was eating me up. I waited 5 months to confess, one night when I couldn't face my husband looking at me with such love anymore. The pain that registered on him, the following sleepless, soul crushing painful questions about details of my affair - all this from a man that was always strong, that snapped me out of it like nothing did before. It made me realize who REALLY loved me: my husband. Not the OM who cared nothing about my honor or his. It's been almost three years since dday, but it still makes my heart constrict at the thought of what I put my husband thru.

I hope you wake up to realize the real love you are taking for granted before it's too late, the husband that honors you with faithfulness. He is the one worthy of your heart, not the shallow affair fantasy.

[This message edited by burntashes at 1:42 AM, May 9th (Thursday)]

We need perspective and reality checking BUT we would also benefit from a little bit of nurturing from fWW's who KNOWS how withdrawal feels (even if their withdrawal was instant they still had to withdraw).

Every WS on here KNOWS how withdrawal feels. We were all hooked on the same drug, craving the same with the same highs and lows. It hurts and it's sucks. That's the price you pay. Its the price weve all paid - and a minor price compared to what our BSs went/go through everday. We chose that drug and chose to have that high. We therefore chose the withdrawal by default. They didn't get a choice. We chose for them. And you're still chosing for your BS.

Both of you (T33 and LL) spend a lot time on here talking about how ready and prepared you need to be before dealing with your BS or confessing. That's still selfish wayward thinking at its finest. Your still making unilateral decisions about a relationship that is supposed to involved 2 people equally...that's you and your BS. Instead you and your AP are actually making the choices.

LL, so you don't believe you should confess until you're emotionally and mentally ready. You also are adament you won't get found out. Fine. So how does your plan work for when you do tell him? Because here's the thing - when you tell him, he's going to want to know when, how long, who with, all the gory details. He'll want a timeline....and then you have to tell him you stopped it x time ago and chose not to tell him - in his own best interests....

You see how's that going to go? It only gets worse - you'll be lying for longer and he will look back and all those times you were together as one great big F8*&$ing lie. His life has been a lie from that first illicit message on FB until the day you decided it's right to confess.

Aubrie couldn't be more right - she confessed because HE had a right to know who he was married to. If you had any respect for your BS you'd afford him the same courtesy. Hiding behind getting "ready" to confess is bullshit. It's another wayward excuse. If you actually put yourself in his shoes and want to save the marriage (pr give it the best shot anyhow) then confess - sooner rather than later.

Sure you may well reconcile after the delay, but damn sure you're just delaying the inevitable and hurting your BS with whom you wish to now reconcile with more and more every day - one of those days will be his breaking point; his dealbreaker. Only you won't know because YOUR chosing for him, you'll only know when it's too late.

I know you don't want to hear it from the WSs. That's ok, nor did I when I got on here. So go and read the JFO forum or general where BSs do post about the pain of discovery and how they felt about the lies and delay. SO often you'll read words to this effect "It wasn't the A itself; its the continual lying - the unilateral decision making...." THEN decide on whether holding out's a good plan.

I didn't confess. I was caught. I lied and cheated for a good while afterwards. I was made to post here and a term of R. I hated it because I was "bullied" with stuff like this. Then I tried to take te advice and found the "bullying" was actally support. It's not bullying here - it's incredibly well moderated and protected as it's a very emotional place. It's your mindset right now that makes our posts seem like bullying. We know you'll only do what you want, which is probably why DeeplyScared posted what she did - it's just disappointment and frustration. We're pretty sure we know how this' will play out - it's just the details that'll change. YOU can change this path. YOU can be a better person, but your chosing selfish everyday.

Facing your shit NEVER gets easier. In fact it's the dredging through the past deatils and trying to explain WHY you did't tell that is really shit.

Pays your money, makes your choice.

Of course, this advice is only valid if you are GENUINELY planning to tell him. If not, then life is easy. You'll get over the OM, throw yourself back into your marriage, he will never know. It will get easier and easier NOT to tell him and harder and harder to face telling the truth. Because you'll think "why rock the boat". Except your life will be bullshit. A fallacy. As make believe as any other made up story. any work you do on your marriage will be false, because it will all be based on lies. And then one day you might just do it again. After all, none of us INTENDED to have an affair when we got married. Or maybe one day he actually does find out. Then as everyone has pointed out, everything you do up to that point will be seen as lies, wasted time.

It boils down to a simple question. Do you want to live a life of honesty, and look at yourself in the mirror knowing you have made some terrible decisions but have had the courage to face the ramifications of those decisions, and have dedicated yourself to being a better person, and a better wife. Or do you want to have a marriage based on lies and deception, and look in the mirror knowing that you are the cause and that one day it may all just come crashing down around you. It's your life, and only you have the power to pick the path.

[This message edited by OktoberMest at 2:29 AM, May 9th (Thursday)]

Hi again luckyllama,

I have quite a bit to say but I'm exhausted, so I'll be back tomorrow with more but wanted to say something quickly. Please, please reconsider going elsewhere for advice/guidance/support instead of staying here at SI. Before I found SI, I was posting on another message board that does have a separate section for waywards (both still actively in A's & those not), however, there was no "protection" from the moderators/admins on what was said & by whom. I was called every name in the book, told I should do my husband a favor & jump in front of a train and so on. Thankfully, I found SI and I've never left, 8 years after DDay. You may not like what's being said to you, but rest assured, no one is saying things to hurt you, make fun of you, trying to make you feel worse about yourself or anything of the sort. We've ALL been where you are, though our stories may be different in some ways they are alike in one way, we all had an affair. Everyone here posts in the hopes of helping someone else, at least that's why I'm here. It's been 8 years since the day I confessed & I'm still here to help others the way I was helped, even if I didn't want to hear what people were saying to me.

There is a wealth of information here and an overwhelming amount of kind, intelligent, caring posters who want the best for you. Please stay, continue to post, take the advice you want & leave the rest..I promise it's worth it.

llama and I and people like us need tough love (especially me as I tend to fantasise alot). We need perspective and reality checking BUT we would also benefit from a little bit of nurturing from fWW's who KNOWS how withdrawal feels (even if their withdrawal was instant they still had to withdraw).

Trying, I went through withdrawl for a year. Poor me. Pity party. I was also thrown under the bus, like you.

There is a wonderful old thread by Maia about this topic.

There is no way to "properly" mourn the AP because it's like mourning when the villian in the blockbuster dies. Everytime you are crying for him, think about what your BH would think if he knew. You say he is disconnected, try telling him the truth about why you are crying.

You have to logic your way out. Force the mental NC. There's no easy way.

Reliving an experience thhat should be shameful, not a-ma-zing, is something you can make a conscious effort to avoid.

You think about the AP? Go for a run. Clean something. Snap a rubber band on your wrist (this is is great). Organize a closet. Watch a movie. Call your Mom. Occupy yourself. Time and deliberate attention to stopping mental contact is key.

We don't get to cry and watch the Notebook and eat ice cream. It's not a breakup. It's cheating.

Nurturing is for kittens and babies. Time for us to grow up.

Trying (and llama too), the deal is that you are wanting to stay where you are at, mourning the loss, until you are ready to move forward. We all get that, but what is frustrating is that you seem to think that you have to finish that process before moving in any other direction. That is where you are both wrong, and it doesn’t change at all with the fact that every person has to do things their own way, at least not with this one thing.

Trying, turn off the TV or the radio or whatever it is that keeps the OM triggers coming at you daily. Yes, there are going to be triggers that are unavoidable, but as long as you are actively working on dealing with them, the source, your reaction, your sharing these difficult emotions with your BH, then you are heading in the right direction. I guess the question is, what is your idea of dealing them in a healthy way?

Your thoughts of dealing with the anger toward the xAP and the rejection/abandonment of being thrown under the bus are also wrong. You want to work through that? Tell your BH about it. That will be the best way to get through those emotions, because at the end of the day, you aren’t really mourning the loss of the AP, you are mourning the loss of your source of the high, which is actually the A, not the AP.

I used to think that the A was unique to the AP, that it couldn’t have happened with anyone else, and that made it seem special in some way. Well, I’ve done a bit of work over the years, and eventually came to realize that the AP really could have been anyone. It was just a weird circumstance that led to me having an EA with an xHSGF. It took a long time to realize that my wayward behaviors started a long time before the actual A, which is why I’m asking some basic, pointed questions of luckyllama.

Llama, you say that you would not want to have known if your H was talking to OW before leading up to a sexual encounter. There are BS’s here who wished they had never known, at least to some degree, but once the A is out, there is no going back, and most of those BS’s who would have been happy never knowing realize that they never knew their spouse who was capable of inflicting so much pain. EA’s are a bad as PA’s. Sort of depends on the individual. Also, as you see in your case, EA’s are often just a precursor to a PA. So, you not wanting to know, well, it isn’t a matter of right or wrong, it’s a matter of what would have happened differently if you had known. Would the PA have actually happened? Would your BH have realized that he was about to have a very different life than what he thought he had? Would things have changed before they got worse? See…he never had a chance to make any kind of decision about that. And, in the case of PA’s, the BS is know exposed to the threat of STD’s no matter how “careful” the WS and AP are with protection, nothing is 100%. Also, What would have happened had you become pregnant?

Anyway, I feel like I’ve gotten off-track…

You don’t have to be indifferent today. In fact, you can’t be. You’re right, it’s just too soon to work through all of this shit. But you can’t let yourself sit in this mourning the AP phase, because that is just a way for you to hold onto the dregs of a failed relationship which is the most hurtful type of experience that you could ever push onto your BS. And instead of owning up to that, you want to sit and eat ice cream and “process” all of those strong emotions associated with the A and the AP. You can’t continue to do that to your BS. And, from experience, the best way to work through those emotions is to expose them to your BS. Seeing what kind of reaction your BS has will put those emotions into a new reality where you start associating the lovey-dovey stuff from the A with the heart-wrenching pain of your BS. That will help get rid of some of those triggers…

Trying, back to the NC/withdrawal/addiction subject, those other things are as much a taboo as an A. Really, how many people talk openly about their addictions? For the person collecting Beanie Babies to the alcoholic to the sugar addict, those folks who actually have those problems are no more open to talking about them with others than you are talking about the A. Don’t diminish others problems.

So, being ready vs. doing it now. You know what? You guys are right. A WS is only going to be able to work at their own pace. Some hate the AP right away, others mourn. Some throw the AP under the bus, others are thrown under the bus by the AP. We really do get that everybody works on their own timeline. If you look back at all of these posts though, and not just on this thread, but most new WS’s, the frustrations come out when those new WS’s start saying “well, I may not know what to do but you need to convince me that your path is the correct one.” It’s bullshit and we go through it again and again trying to break through that barrier. No, you aren’t going to suddenly “get it” today. But the resistance and justification as to why you’re situation and process are special and unique is beyond frustrating. Yet we still try. Definition of crazy anyone?

Trying, you should start a thread of your own rather than rallying with llama.

Llama, the one line that stands out in this entire thread is “be humble.”

Both of you have it within you to change so that you are doing the right thing, both for yourself and for your BH. You’re both smart. Take your time. But listen. Even if you don’t agree, just listen. The cumulative years of experience of those posting to each of you is pretty awesome. If you’re not ready to “agree” with us, that’s fine, but don’t try to argue with us that your way and your situation is any different than what we’ve been putting out there. We’ve seen so many others come through the SI doors trying to do things differently than what the general consensus says works best, and they either disappear or they come back with their “well, you guys were right” post. The same thing actually happens on the BS side too. All the time.

Oh, and trying33, you telling people to go NC is actually a great way to reinforce those things that you may not be 100% ready to do. It feels hypocritical sometimes, especially early on when you are having problems with NC yourself, but the practice of saying it out loud (via keystrokes) is a good one. It shows you know what to do even if you have a hard time doing it yourself right now. It will get better.

[This message edited by BaxtersBFF at 7:35 AM, May 9th (Thursday)]

You don’t have to be indifferent today. In fact, you can’t be. You’re right, it’s just too soon to work through all of this shit. But you can’t let yourself sit in this mourning the AP phase, because that is just a way for you to hold onto the dregs of a failed relationship which is the most hurtful type of experience that you could ever push onto your BS. And instead of owning up to that, you want to sit and eat ice cream and “process” all of those strong emotions associated with the A and the AP. You can’t continue to do that to your BS. And, from experience, the best way to work through those emotions is to expose them to your BS. Seeing what kind of reaction your BS has will put those emotions into a new reality where you start associating the lovey-dovey stuff from the A with the heart-wrenching pain of your BS. That will help get rid of some of those triggers…[/quote]

Absorbed this. At present unable to expose such emotions to H, he is not ready to hear them.

Both of you have it within you to change so that you are doing the right thing, both for yourself and for your BH. You’re both smart. Take your time. But listen. Even if you don’t agree, just listen. The cumulative years of experience of those posting to each of you is pretty awesome

I'm listening and registering to every single word people say. It is not in vain. Thanks for all your input everybody.

At present unable to expose such emotions to H, he is not ready to hear them.

trying, how do you know this?

I usually try to respond to each person individually but there are so many responses this morning and not all of them are directed at me so I'll just say, I'm making progress and I'm moving on. I'm not an overly emotional person. I'm the last person to want a pity party. When I told the other guy that I couldn't continue and that there will be no contact, I cried a little as I walked away but after that, I haven't cried once. I miss him but I'm doing fine. I'm a problem-solver by nature.

More than anything I think I was looking for someone to talk to. Like trying33, I have no one IRL I feel comfortable sharing this with. I got it out here and I'm not sure if it was the right place or not.

Maybe I present myself poorly, or I misinterpret what is said, but I feel things are being attributed to me that aren't accurate. I'm conflicted as to whether I should clarify because when I try, I come across as defensive. Communication obviously is not my gift so working through this on a forum most likely is not the right thing for me.

I'm introspective and I like reading the threads. If I had been able to find a forum "search" feature, I probably wouldn't have posted at all.

[This message edited by luckyllama at 11:23 AM, May 9th (Thursday)]

Yeah, there is not a search option because this site needs to be kept as anonymous as each individual makes it. There are some not-so-nice people who come on here from time to time with the intent to seek out certain individuals.

You communicate just fine. But defending a position is not really necessary, and that is where I think most of the issues have come from. Like has been said many time, take what you need and leave the rest. That includes reading something and not responding if you feel that defensiveness creeping in. Even if you don't mean it as defensive, obviously that is what is being perceived.

In most of our opinions, there is no better place on the internet for a WS than here. Believe it or not, it is safe. Now, if it is something you aren't ready to hear, then that is a different matter. That doesn't mean it isn't a safe place, it just means that you aren't ready to hear it, and that is when backing away from a thread is an option, rather than digging into a particular viewpoint/perspective.

I do hope that you see the healing possibilities here. We all wish for the best outcome for you.

BaxtersBFF: I tried to send you a PM but you are at your limit. I apologize in advance if communicating with one member within a thread is frowned on here.

I wanted to say thank you for taking the time to respond. Your questions were thoughtful and I can tell you sincerely wanted to help me. That's not to say that others didn't. I guess your approach was better suited for my personality. You certainly are a good "guide."

That makes sense; I can see why a search feature wouldn't be a good idea.

Hahaha, my communication must suck because I didn't mean defending a position. I'm just going to let it go because I hate being overly wordy.

Thanks again.

Whoops...I didn't know I was at the limit. I've cleaned it out. PM or here, either way is okay.

trying, how do you know this?

Because he's told me. His last comment to me regarding the EA was "I'd rather draw a line under this and forgive your slip of guard and move on"

He's not ready to talk about it. He tends to allude to it but when I try to elaborate shuts down again. It's obviously on his mind and he's trying to deal with it internally. I've recieved some great advice and guidance on this on other SI posts, namely, let him be until he's ready and when he is, be ready for what's to come.

I'm respecting his wish as when I've hounded him in the past it's backfired. It only made him further withdraw. In the meantime, I'm working on me.