SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

(((FWL)))

You are worth so much more...

You will know this when you begin to find a focus that is centered on you and your life. What things do you like to do? How do you spend your time when you are not thinking of the right way to make him see, or waiting for his text, or wondering what he is or isn't doing? Do you see that he has managed to make himself the center of your world and at the same time chastise you for it?

I am treading carefully because some of his words made me soooooo angry for you. I don't want to seem angry at you or swing a 2x4.

I do know that while living in emotional chaos, everything seems impossible. You can do this, my friend. Many many people are cheering for you.

Caregiver,

I know that you would not hurt me with a 2x4.

Do you see that he has managed to make himself the center of your world and at the same time chastise you for it?

^^^This is so true and yes I see it.

What do I like to do.. I love to read, I am going to start working out, I enjoy shopping when I can afford it or window shopping, I like being alone, I love watching movies, I love cooking. I am not much for going out because it feels strange without him and triggers me that I use to go out alone and he was with her just to get me out of the house for awhile. I enjoy my kids and grandkids. I love crafts and making things, I use to love to be in my yard, I only have a deck now. I love being outside in summer. I like having a beer or a summer drink and listening to smooth jazz or R&B.

Yes and eariler I got a text: that said "release your fear" as to me having doubts or fears when he go's out. I am not sure what that was suppose to me. I never responded back.

I love having my cheering team here for me. Thank you and I truly love you all!!!!

That list sounds lovely and delightful and peaceful! Claim those things and make that your life.

Release your fears... pffft! He makes my teeth hurt. The assumption that he is worth your fear... oh, well, this should not be about him.

Try some strict NC for a few days and see if your head clears. I am serious. I feel like he keeps you on a string. Just remember that like giving up caffeine, it gets harder before it gets easier. But you are worth it!!!

and thank you for the confidence in my kindness. That made my day.

FWL,

First, I think you communicate just fine, You state what you need clearly and with reason.

His answers.. circuitous at best.

Try and look at this situation differently: If this were your Best friend's marriage, what would you advise her to do?

Think about it... Look at this relationship from the POV of an outsider... what do you see?

What advice would you give your best friend regarding her options?

Hugs,

K

Caregiver,

I read your profile. Wow, is all I need to say. Damn your X.

You know what amazes me is that alot and I mean alot of us have a dday in 2009. I have alot of friends also IRL with that. Almost like Satan himself came for the weak in lust.

You are very strong and I read all of your post if you all can do this then I know I can.

And I like how you said it gets hard before it get better. That is truth!

I haven't tried no contact in a longtime. I will try it. I have not responded back to him at all after the text about fear

What I wanted to say was: How the fuck am I suppose to release it if you are not helping and only worsen it by your dating comments! But that would go on deaf ears. So BLAHHHHHHHH!!!!

Kajem,

I would give her the same advice as you all give me. I am great at giving it just really suck ass at taking it for myself.

Like I said I am not blind to what is going on here. I see it with my eyes wide open, its accepting it that is my problem.

But, with added support from you all, it has really started to sink in that this is never going to change until I change it.

We all wanted better for our marriages and families, the problem was our WH's never did. They like the hell I think and the drama. They somehow feel entitled to do whatever they want.

Faithful

He wants you to make the decision on the M so he doesn't appear to be more of a jerk than he already is. He likes his life because he has not consequences for his actions. He can do whatever he wants and then spins it around on you to make it seem like you are being unreasonable.

If he doesn't know after a year, I say he does know. His indecision is a decision.

Give him a firm date and say if you haven't decided to recommit by then then you have decided to end our marriage. I am not an option, I am your wife and I deserve respect.

This stops when you say it stops. Take back the power and move on with your life because he certainly is living his life how he sees fit.

No 2x4's just encouragement for a better tomorrow for you.

Good luck. We are all here rooting for you.

(((hugs)))

I am not an option, I am your wife and I deserve respect.

Those were my exact word the other night. Told him if he needs to date then go ahead but he will not have me also. That is when he gets in a tizzy.

I told him I would NEVER EVER be place in a situation again with a 3rd party. And if he is dating then we have nothing more to talk about.... He said but we are seperated... Yup we are but it is still cheating... we are married and I am your wife... HE said Do I need to file papers in order to date?? Yup you sure do if you don't want to be commiting adultery again. But, then you won't want to be my friend and hang out... Yumm no I would not... But, you won't date because you already told me you don't want anyone else.... True, I won't date until I get myself right... But, if you do than your a liar and I will look at you like a liar and have no respect for you....Ummm You don't have respect for me now, look what you just told me, Look hon, I don't have time for this so I am leaving...

He called me the whole way home and when I got in the door. Talk about saying one thing and doing another...

makes me laugh now actually after typing it out..

Today has been very therapuic (misspelled)... Thank you all again.

Everyone else has given you great advice. I just wanted to let you know that I went thru it also. We were truly separated - no dating (lots of hating) for almost 7 months.

Mine kept saying "I'm not ready to divorce. Let's wait until all of us are stable with the situation." The day I stood in an amusement park with my baby crying because his daddy wasn't there to see him ride a big coaster for the first time - and I found pix of the dinner Dad was cooking for some chick at that same time - I was done. I got my ducks in a row that week, spoke to a lawyer, and then told him that Saturday that I was ready to divorce.

At that point, he cried. He started to wake up. We started dating and eventually having sex again but he was still saying "I like my life just the way it is - no responsibilities." It took me saying "whatever, I'm going to have my fun too then" before he finally recommitted to the marriage.

R has had its ups and downs for us but the only way it's working is that we're both all in.

Even if we had divorced, I know I would have been ok. I had finally started taking care of ME for a change.

Listen to Jana - she really helped me get thru the mess too.

(((lots of hugs)))

Just a word to dispel a myth.

The one to file for D is not the "bad guy".

The one who files first is the one who is heard first in mediation, arbitration, or court. They are the complainatnt, the other side is the defendant. They get to pay their lawyer's hourly rate to listen to the complaintant's case for hours or days before they can respond/defend. They are the one in the disadvantageous position in court/mediation/arbitration.

Not to tell you you need to file, per se, just give up the notion that to do so makes you bad. If you ever believe he actually is gonna file - race like hell to beat hi to it - just sayin'

Faithful,

In the interest of disclosing, my ExH is an alcoholic!!

I just wanted to chime in that I have / am going through this exact same thing. Started mine in '08.

I really liked the OP who said that we BS's can also be broken. It took me along time to realize that I was just as broken as he was. Just in a different way.

I truly believed that if I could just say the right thing at the right moment in the right manner that he would understand. I tried for FIVE LONG YEARS!! It never did work. I tried while we were married and let's be real even after the divorce last year:)

I could never get a straight answer from him as to whether or not he wanted to be married to me. Any time I asked for his thoughts he would say yes and change his mind, say no and change his mind or say "I don't know what I want" It was like that thing you do with a flower, he loves me, he loves me not, he loves, he loves me not. I finally realized that while yes I did love him, he did not love me the way I needed to loved.

I did become his caregiver. I had actually written in my journal in Jan of 12 abut how every time he got back in contact with her, he made me realize that they were lovers and I was his caregiver. He loves what I can do for him. I actually for a long time made alot of his responsibilities go away. All he had to do was drink. I took care of everything else. Kids, bills, cleaning, grocery shopping, working (you name it, I did it) I did not want to stress him too bad.

I well remember lots of conversations where he would just shut down. ( totally remember the one where he said "I am done talking" just like that and nothing would ever get resolved. And I do mean ever!! I truly have been through all of the circular talk and the no talk.

The reason I had to chime in was twofold and I say this with all of the compassion in the world as I am still learning it myself.

1: Step back and really look at everything, are YOU stringing you along waiting for a different answer? I did, I tried my absolute best to make myself believe that he really did not understand what he was doing and did love me for who I was!

2:Do you honestly believe that you are part of his equation? I really wanted to be on (let's be real either side of the equation would of been nice)the good side of his equation!. I came to realize that I simply did not exist is his equation with the exception of the fact that as long as I took care of him, he did not have to worry about reality.

I begged him to tell me what he needed, I told him exactly what I needed numerous times in a variety of ways. Nothing ever worked.

I finally after five long years went ahead and filed for divorce, not to wake him up (Disclaimer: I really wanted him to) but because I could no longer stand to be married to someone who at best saw me as an option and at worst did not see me at all!!

I and YOU are really worth more than the crumbs they are handing out.

FWL, you are beginning to really *see* your WH.

If it's any consolation to you, I also spent a kabillion of my life-hours having the same types of circular and stupid conversations with stbx that you are having with your WH. And hindsight being 20/20, it really was 9.99/10 kabillion's too many.

For whatever reason (FOO, personality disorder, just a dick, whatever), he is a self-serving cheater and he believes that he deserves a different set of 'rules' than the rest of the people in the world.

Your WH is a blamer and he has a *victim* mentality. You are not going to win this war. You can't. Unless you are willing to live the rest of your life in a 'not-right' relationship.

Here's a little recent backstory (since it isn't in my profile):

Stbx cheated again a little over 3 years after Dday. Not a big surprise, really, since he had been remorseless throughout that 3 years. I got 'snowed' by his "I'm 100% committed to YOU, Gonna" bullshit.....which is why I was still giving him 'chances'. I ignored his actions and chose to trust his words. My bad. Anyway. He confessed because OW was going to tell me (which she did end up doing). He refused to be honest and transparent, so I filed for D. One month later he recontacted that OW. According to him it was to find out why she was acting so 'crazy' (gee, I wonder ). 3 weeks after that...he was chasing some chick around a convention in Vegas trying to get her to sleep with him. A month after THAT he took up with yet ANOTHER OW.

The whole time he was engaging in these shenanigans, he was insisting that HE didn't want the divorce and that the demise of our family was *my* doing.

And he was the exact same type of twisty-talker that your WH is. He throws a bunch of smoke-bombs into the conversation so that you end up having some conversation that really amounts to jack-shit. Lather, rinse, repeat.

But break it down and look at it.

WS cheated and 'blew up' the marriage.

BS says 'fuck this' and separation/divorce ensues. Even if BS is still engaging in hours of explanatory-type conversations. You know the ones that you have with an 8-year old, right? Cheating is wrong. Marriage is made up of 2 people. Yada, yada.

First of all. WHY should these very basic concepts have to be 'explained' to a grown-ass adult? If that person doesn't *get it* by now....well, the odds are that they won't unless they really, really want to because that is just basic *Human 101*.

Secondly, how does it make any sense for a WS that wants to 'save' the marriage and is separated/being divorced due to their cheating.....to continue in wayward behaviors? And then to use the "well YOU don't want to be with me, so *I'm* going to date* as a justification? The answer is that it DOESN'T make any sense. It's obfuscation.

FWL, your WH tells you to 'release your fear'. Really? Why should you do that? He's still wayward. He hasn't done jack-shit to *earn* his way back into the fold. And yet he expects YOU to make this right? He expects YOU to just *be there* at <whatever> time he 'decides' to choose 'you'?

I hate seeing how your WH is treating you. But it's only because I've BTDT and heard all of the same things and I know how it ended for 'me'. I am still the one that is blamed for the end of the marriage. I am getting the divorce that *I* wanted and am now the 'greedy' wife that wants to suck him dry. According to stbx, I am judgmental and unforgiving. I received a text the other night that said "you are truly a different person. And that is not a good thing." NC be damned...I responded with "me being 'different' is most certainly a good thing. That wouldn't be a problem if you weren't the *same*."

Detach, honey.

Hey....me. Again. You mentioned that he's been stringing you along for a year now and I want to share this with you. Lyrics from Rent.

Seasons of Love.

Five hundred twenty-five thousand six hundred minutes

Five hundred twenty-five thousand moments so dear

Five hundred twenty-five thousand six hundred minutes

How do you measure, measure a year?

In daylights, in sunsets

In midnights, in cups of coffee

In inches, in miles, in laughter, in strife

In five hundred twenty-five thousand six hundred minutes

How do you measure, a year in the life?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hj7LRuusFqo

You have to make a conscious effort to listen to this and focus on what your life should *really* be made up of.....and push away the thoughts of 'that could be my life if WS would only'.....

Bottom line is this....is your current life how you want to spend your minutes?

Oh my. Does he need to get divorced in order to date? Is he serious? Wow. Unbelievable. Is it okay for you to date? Somehow I bet the rules for you are different...

He won't get it. Ever. He can't. No matter how much of yourself you sacrifice, no matter how much time you put in, no matter how much you suffer -that pig won't sing. Ever. Pigs can't sing.

And just keep this in mind. A person can only reject you if you put yourself in a position to be rejected. If you stop allowing him to reject you then you will not continue to feel rejected and hurt.

180.

He's currently got the best of both worlds, and no incentive to make a decision.

Show him what separation really means. It's not daily togetherness and family time. It's every-other-weekend with the kids, and split holidays. It's, "no, I'm sorry. That doesn't work for us. You can pick the kids up next Friday at six, as scheduled."

Yes, it will be difficult for you, at first. But it's time for some healthy detachment.

(Forgive me if this has been said 100 times; I haven't yet read the responses. And besides,this woman---who's detached pretty well but is only now X-ing out "family" portions of holidays--needed to hear this about forty million times.)

[This message edited by solus sto at 8:31 AM, July 12th (Friday)]

I went through the same thing with my xh. Almost word for word. I bet your WH gets it, and is doing it on purpose. What he is counting on is that you don't get it.

This is not a 2x4. This is with love and empathy and hugs and a wish of being there to pull you out of the situation.

Due to how long ago your dday was, due to how long you've been separated, due to the dialogue between you and your WH that you've posted, it's clear to me that you've lost your ability to see the forest for the trees. There's nothing remarkable about that because matters of the heart can do that to a person, especially when infidelity is involved.

You post a lot of encouraging things that sound as if you have somewhat of a handle on the situation. But in reality they're just words because it's clear you're deeply stuck in the mud.

You're hyperfocused on him, on analyzing his words, his actions or lack of them, what he's doing, what he's thinking, if he'll come back to you, why he won't come back to you, what your next move should be or if you've made a wrong move. And your hyperfocused on yourself with every reaction you have to his actions, and how it makes you feel.

You've left the objective reality, the real world outside your brain and you've entered your own reality, a version of Alice in Wonderland. There are many examples throughout this thread of your reality vs the real world, this is just one:

I think I was trying to be a good influence on him with how to treat people and mostly treat me.

You've influenced him and he treats you accordingly. But more importantly, at the same time you've been influencing your children on how to treat people and how people should treat them. And whether or not they're showing it or how or to whom they're showing it, your continuous attempts to influence him is being done at their expense.

Your WH has cheated on you, has left the home and continues to torture you. I don't know if your children are his biological children or not, but regardless, this isn't the definition of a parent or step parent who cares about protecting the emotional wellbeing of your children. He's hyperfocused on himself. And so are you. Another example of your reality vs the real world is that you don't see how profoundly your inability to take a stand and disengage with this man once and for all has impacted your children...and their children.

I know what has to happen and I know I will be the one to do it completely. I always have been that one.

In the eyes of our children- glorious, magnificent, awe-inspiring is the mother who says this might be good enough for me but it sure as fuck isn't good enough for my children. It's enough. I'm done.

It doesn't matter where you find your strength. It can come from inner strength or it can come from your children or you can find it behind the refrigerator. Just find it. Your strength is there and this I'm sure of.