SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Here's my theory. The person that WSs are in lurv with is themselves! Not sure they really can love someone else.

For me, physical intimacy requires, and leads to, emotional intimacy. Apparently there are people out there for whom sex is just sex. I do not want to be married to someone like that.

So, for me, it doesn't matter if APs meant anything or not to WS. The fact is that I didn't mean enough to STBXH for him to be faithful.

(edited to correct typos, grammer, etc...)

[This message edited by Gemini71 at 8:39 AM, October 28th (Monday)]

FWH admitted there was a brief 2 week period where he felt he had fallen in love with OW which was just before Christmas around 2 years into their (almost) 3 year A.

After DDay he told DD he wanted OW and that I wanted him so nobody was going to get what they wanted (sorry- just remembered this and really have to add... what a piece of motherfucking shit -excuse my language )

After IC he realised his 'love' was glitter sh**ting unicorn fantasy lorve that was nothing about love and all about him not understanding what real love felt like (FOO issues).

With this in mind he realised he equated sex with love so... the fact she was ready to screw him each and every time them met... confused him.

He treated her appallingly so she has a skewed perception of love also as she bent over backwards to be a 'compliant' OW yet he still treated her like a whore.

Oh- and the wanting OW after Dday? Apparently that was not because he loved her- it was because she took control back and he had lost all control and that was what he had wanted throughout... or one of the reasons (so his IC said).

I don't believe she meant NOTHING to him as he railroaded over me and our family to accommodate her for a long time.

Se meant nothing in the real world but in their fantasy world- for a short time.... she meant everything to him as he couldn't handle the real world's love... not then.

Now? Now he knows what love feels and looks like which is why I have no fear he will go back to her as she cannot offer him the love he needs and craves

What man wants love to look like drama and arguments and screaming matches and accusations and being able to then ignore the OW for days on end when compared with the genuine respect and adoration and sensual, passionate (without the dramatic extremes) love that he now experiences?

One is true love and one is wafts of fake glitter farts

I am one of those who believes that once a person cheats you can never truly believe what is said. I think people who cheat operate on hidden agenda and personal motives therefor, if you are to survive a relationship with a cheater you must stay halfway disengaged.

How many here have gone through the hell of reconciliation, the joy of 5 years no affair, and then WHAM! there it is again. I think cheating is a part of the narcissistic personality and can not be separated from the person anymore than alcoholism can be. They can go into "remission" in terms of not engaging their drug of choice, but every waking moment they are only one touch, one look, one thought away from falling off the wagon and back into their sex mentality. Even love addicts use sex to get their drug of choice. Narcissism is the sign of ugly ugly damage to the psyche at an early age. Some people can forgive the cheating aspect while others believe child abuse is not an excuse for victimization of others. I think we are most healthy and HAPPY when we rid our lives of the narcissistic people we come to know.

Thank you all so much for taking the time to post.

A lot of u game me different insights I wouldn't have even thought about.

It's true I have to trust my gut and I really believe if u stay with one person that long there is way more to it.

I don't know if he believes his own lies or he just doesn't want to hurt me.

When will some ws' realize the obvious lies hurt way more:(

My H is a LTA guy. IMO we both mean something to him (his W and his OW), but only in terms of himself. He has feelings for us because of what we give him, if we stop giving it to him, the feelings stop.

He told her he loved her pretty much from the start of his A. She gave him everything she could, sexually, emotionally. She made the relationship fun, made him feel wanted, whatever he desired sexually, etc.

I gave him the stability of home, financial support, taking care of the children, his partner, the life he built etc.

He was so quick to throw her under the bus on DDay because she became more trouble then she was worth, she caused a problem to Our relationship, which he was unwilling to give up. He went back to her because she went back to kissing his ass.

Does it matter?

I know mine said I think I love Her?

Really I laughed in his face! I said go ahead walk around town with that old shriveled up thing! IDIOT!

And a lot more was said.

But today you tell him he said that he would declare you the biggest liar!

His memory of what transpired is all different now then what really (supposedly) happened.

So years later I take comfort in the fact his past actions embarrass him and sicken him that he did what he did to US! He pays dearly he says. Whatever that means.

I know at that time he thought he cared about thingy just like the other thingies he has KISA complex.

I read the emails between my husband and OW declaring they loved each other. On DDay, he said he never loved her. He told me he loved me also, during the time of his EA. So what's the lie? I don't trust him anymore so it doesn't matter.

No. I don't buy it. She may not have represented anything healthy or good or even, ultimatelym desirable.

But she meant enough to destroy our family and, after d-day, she meant enough to take underground, completely destroying ANY possibility of R.

If nothing else, she was a ticket out.

I do not believe a LTA can exist sans emotions.

If it is possible and a WS can weave that web and make the AP believe there is love, when he/she feels nothing and is simply using the AP; that would be a terrifying person to continue a marriage with.

I wouldn't want to love and share a life with a person capable of seeing others as "usable" and then "disposable". What a sick fucking monster.

[This message edited by Kierst13 at 5:14 PM, October 28th (Monday)]

Somebody does not have an LTA without having strong feelings for the AP.

I feel this is a generalization and definitely not true for many situations.

In many cases, it is exactly the lack of "strong feelings" that enable an LTA to last so long. Especially if they are both married. It is just "a little fun on the side" and nobody's going to get hurt. It is when the feelings start to come into the picture that can cause the LTA to end.

In my FWH's case, they agreed this was strictly a FWB's situation. However AP started saying it was in llllluuuuuurrrrrvvvvvvv with FWH. AP was looking to make a confrontation between it, FWH and I. Driving drunk in our neighborhood, crying because it couldn't find our house. Showing up at FWH's mini family reunion, hanging out in the hall in front of our room at the resort. Nephew asked FWH who that creepy woman was in the hall. (Wasn't aware of any of this until D-day)

That was when FWH knew he had to end it. Not because he felt guilty. No, he didn't want his comfy little world blown up. He probably figured he could find another AP pretty easy as this one just told him it would fuck him anytime he wanted. He didn't have to work for this AP at all. Easy peasy. If AP didn't start all the lllluuuurrrrrvvvvv stuff, he would probably be talking on the phone to it right now making plans to fuck it on their regular Friday nooner.

I wouldn't want to love and share a life with a person capable of seeing others as "usable" and then "disposable".

That's my wife's AP. She kept telling herself that it was just a NSA fuck buddy, but she was just lying to herself. After 17 months she cared more for him than she would admit to herself. It was obvious in her texts, messages, and Skype conversations. Undeniably. It really hit her how much when she found out that he was fucking several women, not just her. If you don't care you don't cry in my opinion. He couldn't of hurt her if she didn't care.

Same story here sadly. My gut knew better but I TRIED to believe he didn't have feelings like he claimed. It took 13 months for my WH to admit the one sided "lurv" he had for his AP. It's fake, unicorn farting rainbows bullshit "love" but at the time for him - yeah it was real.

Your gut KNOWS. Trust it.

Unfortunately I have to raise my hand too. I am 20 months out and only now is he admitting to having had feelings for MOW. I always knew in my heart, it ended up being true.

[This message edited by crazyblindsided at 5:38 PM, October 28th (Monday)]

People do not risk the lives they built for someone who means nothing.

Yes, they do. Not all, but some. Many are generalizing. Maybe some did develop "feelings", but that doesn't mean all WS's do.

The thing is, most people enter the affair being absolutely positive their BS isn't going to find out. Many feel they aren't risking anything because they are smarter than the average bear (Yogi reference.) FWH said I was never going to be hurt because I was never going to find out. He truly, deeply convinced himself of that.

Many can fuck with no emotional attachment. Because maybe you (general "you") can't doesn't mean that is how all people are. FWH felt like AP was a good friend. That is it. Never more than that. I do believe him. Even if he did have feelings, though, what does it matter? He fucked it anyway. With feelings or not, hurts the same.

[This message edited by SisterMilkshake at 8:00 PM, October 28th (Monday)]

Five year LTA with an OW in another country and I believe she did mean nothing EXCEPT he felt desired and admired ....Also he enjoyed the new sex...that's what he told me ....it was exciting because it was new sex.

Of course they didn't see each other often so the sex stayed new longer than if she lived locally, but the moment I confronted him, he threw her under the bus.

Now I live with the knowledge that not only did H cheat on me thinking he could get away with it because she was in a different country, but he also used a woman who had no idea I existed....and used her until it didn't work for him anymore....it was all about him.

Yes I believe they can really not give a damn about the AP ....it's part of their selfishness .....about what they want and the hell with everyone else.

I think WH was in love with the fact that she was available to him 24/7 (she was unemployed), was in love with the shameless ego stroking, and in love with the escape hatch from reality. Then he got to know her a little and all "love" vanished while he looked for an escape hatch from the mess he created.

I know my husband. He's a very private person. He only trusts a few people and even then His guard is always up. He doesn't want friends. He doesn't have a lot of free time so he's very selective about who he spends it with. If he doesn't like you, he doesn't go out of his way for you and he definately doesn't spend time with you. He had to have had feelings for the OW. It annoys and hurts me so much that he trusted her to keep secrets from me. I don't think he loved the OW but I think he really enjoyed spending time with her. I think he liked her. What makes me angry is that he denies having any feelings for her!!! That's rediculous. Not friendly feelings, not sexual...nothing. He won't even tell me what qualities he liked about her. He said there aren't any. So I said you betrayed me just to betray me then....and that makes you evil.

My FWH had a 7 year LTA with a whore from AFF. I saw plenty of emails where she begged him to say "I love you". He never did. Still, it became a friendship and he shared way too much with her. It sickens me that I would tell him something about our kids and he'd turn around and tell her what I said.

He claims he was trying to get rid of her for a few months prior to my finding out. He actually thanked me for bringing it about. Why yes, I'm just thrilled that I was able to help you with this....you stupid fucking asshole.

One thing that I'm 99.9% certain of is that he doesn't have feelings for her now. (Let's face it, total trust isn't happening.) I guess I have to be content with that.

Scubachick

When I read that I thought I had posted it. My H is the same way... Very specific and is so picky about friends. It erks me to no end that he claims no feelings none. I can't believe it either

Ugh

t/j:

I know my husband

I used to think I knew my wife. I was wrong. It took a long time for me to understand how much that hurt. And that even if R is successful, I will never really know her like I thought I did.

end t/j

I don't believe that OW meant nothing. I do think he had some feelings for her at the beginning. They were fantasy, new relationship feelings though. She made him feel good at a time when he felt very bad about himself--and he liked that, so he liked her. But it was very short-lived, because he came to realize that she was crazy. By that time, he was stuck. He realized that he could not break it off with her, because she would tell on him (which she did try to do early on, I just didn't believe it. Stupid me!).

So, he was forced to stay in the relationship because he didn't have the balls to end it and face the consequences of his actions. I am sure that he told himself he loved her, to try to live with himself. It didn't really work, which is why he was suicidal by the end of it. He did end it with her before I found out. Of course, she then told me the whole story, which he always knew would happen.

This is a long way of saying that every story is different. I do think it is possible to have a LTA without real feelings for the AP. I also think that it is good that the WS looks back on the relationship and realizes that the feelings that they had for the AP were not real. I could not R with my FWH if he still had "real" feeling for his OW. I am with Gemini71 in believing that the WS can't really love anyone when they are in the throes of an A--I would say not even themselves.