SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I'm with the others in that he picked a fight with you to be with the OW AND he showed her the text. I started noticing with my Stbx the different tones of his texts.

You will start to see things more clearly once you start distancing yourself from him.

One thing that helped me to not make contact is to think of what the outcome would be. I knew it would be more pain. And I was so very tired of my h hurting me.

((Hugs))

As I said before......the more defensiveness and anger you receive from your WH when you bring something up, the more it shows you how close to the truth you are.....

I needed to be reminded of this. Thank you.

Thanks ImEnough... I am going to make a list of his past transgressions to see whenever I want to reconnect. I somehow learned to compartmentalize his actions well enough to want to engage with him. I had to if I wanted to be with him. However, this left me blind and I failed to see the pattern.

He text and asked to see our DD specifically. I have no custody order in place. How do I respond ?

I just cannot stand him thinking that this is my fault. It is important to me for him to realize that he is self-destructing and not living up to his promises. I expend a lot of time and energy trying to explain how he is hurting us

You are a really good person, to the point that it is out of control. I did this too...people pleasing run amuk! It killed me that he doubted me, that he thought I was the one making self destructive bad choices. Somehow, I thought if I told him enough, bought enough self help books and forced him to read them, and acted like a cross between betty crocker and Victoria's Secret he would come to see the errors of his ways.

NOTHING...NOTHING I did could cure this because it wasn't about me. There would always be "something" wrong with me according to him that was a reason for his acting out.

Then once I stopped caring what the fuck he thought or said....the smear campaigns began. Next lessons was for me to learn was "What other people think and say about me is none of my business." I know I live my life with integrity.

My healing began once I got that through my thick head.....

Something is really wrong with that man, and you cannot fix it. This stops when you decide you have had enough and begin to start your new life.

I'd be very cautious. Maybe suggest he visit her at your parents' house or some neutral place with others present. If he wants to leave then he needs to understand that he becomes an EOW dad or whatever the courts decide. He doesn't get to dictate and he doesn't get to use your DD to get to you.

IMO since he hasn't even asked after her until now, he's using her to be sure he's on your mind. That you know he can leave you and you still have to deal with him b/c of DD. From what you've shared I don't see genuine caring in him yet, just manipulation.

The experienced as to visitation prior to a custody order are to be found in Divorce/Separation! I'd start a specific thread with that heading on it down there!!

((statistic))

I also wanted to comment on this push pull act he is playing with you. But only after you consult with the Pro's about his latest inquiry about visiting with DD.

My X did this from Dday on... "You were the best thing that ever happened to me," and then "You'll never forgive me - so why bother?". Do you see what is missing? Do you see where his focus is? Always on himself - his feelings, the ramifications he is facing....

This cycle repeated, over and over and over again!! I am 5 years out from Dday - Divorced 2 years (he filed) and have been NC, with the exception of court, for 3 years. AND STILL he emails/texts..."I love you," and "I'm sorry I let you all down", every so often. I do not engage!!!

Words are cheap - HE filed... then later asked if *I was sure *I wanted to do this. WTF???

When I was engaging with him - I was either attacked, (when I wasn't submitting to his desired plan of action, *read rugsweep, or if I was asking questions, or showing hurt) That was the Push.

On the Pull side of things, I was gushed over (this happened when I showed anger and resolve to move on, or when I went silent).

It has been 3 years now, since I established NC.

I haven't said a word, I do not respond at all (kids are grown). And with distance I realized, his feelings have nothing to do with me - they have everything to do with his own life, g/f status at any given time, and if he is lonely. Period.

For some people - love and marriage are like a prop in a play, or a tool they use or set aside... Your definition of love, and marriage, may not be at all compatible with his true "working" definition. He may not be capable of true empathy. It doesn't sound like he is, sorry to say. Forget his "sweet" words - when they come, as they inevitably will. Your only barometer should be his actions!

((Statistic))

Take 2- Your experience is so similar to my own. Thank you for sharing and letting me know what I can expect in the future.it is earily similar actually. This is the longest he has gone without addressing our relationship someho so I'm pretty sure he's done. He usually reaches out by now to talk. I'm ok with it though.

He came, with his parents visiting from out of country, to see our DD. I consulted with a friend of a friend who is a lawyer before I gave him the ok to visit. Essentially, I text him with a time and neutral place to visit. My DD is under the weather so I stuck around in case she grew very fussy, but I stayed upstairs and said I would be available if needed. He never looked me in the eye, ignored me when I spoke, and have me short responses full of anger? Sadness? Not sure. He made it clear that he was very upset and wanted me to know it. His reactions made his parents very uneasy. I remained as calm and cool as possible and refused to meet him where he was emotionally.

I did not engage as I usually would. I would otherwise ask why he was angry and try to work through it. I remained neutral and asked no follow up questions.

As they got up to leave, his mother grabbed me and said through heavy tears- "Im so sorry. You are good wife, good mom, good daughter. I love you." His father thanked me for taking such great care of them despite their sons actions.

I finally listened to what you all have said and I DID NOT engage and guess what?? I have no regrets, did not disrespect myself, make a fool of myself etc and I can sleep with a clear conscience that I treated our family with unconditional love and respect because our foul attitudes will only make things worse for everyone. I'm sure this sense of stillness and calm that I am currently experiencing will not last forever, but I will take what I can get.

Good job! The longer you maintain NC the better you will feel. Just be prepared for the counter swing on his side. Try not to react!

What I started doing was imagining what a truly, honestly, remorseful spouse would be saying and doing given the circumstances -- and when the X was able to even come close to saying the right things - there weren't any actions to back it up. Furthermore, he'd betray his words with 2 weeks.

You can learn a lot staying silent - and watching, and it hurts a lot less! And you know what else - it is wonderful to be free of that cycle: the one where he blows a gasket for no reason whatsoever -- but I'm the one with the problem because I'm not over it.

Hang in there statistic - it is hard as hell, I know -- but truly - it does get better!

His actions now have nothing to do with your decision to give him another chance. You should have the peace of mind that you gave it another shot and it didn't work. He left and is trying to blame you which makes him major NPD. My STBX has those qualities and you should be happy that you didn't give him 24 years of your life. One day you will thank God that it ended with him when it did.

hi statistic,

i just read your very first post in this thread because i am full to the brink of my own crap tonight and just don't have the mental space (now) but i wanted to lend support to the best of my current ability!

you said that he send you this note:

" Happy new year to u ..... What happens about the rest like our marriage, is nothing really important or matters right now for me! I don't want anything to do with you from now on. Good bye!!!! Turning off my phone."

And okay i scrolled down a little bit and saw you talked about how he'd be sweet and woo you back and then this kind of stuff.

I know from scanning that others have given you really great wisdom and advice.

From me I can tell you that my WS pulled the same "cycle" on me and i let it drag on and on and on. In a way, in a way as much as you are crying on the sofa, he's done you a favor by showing his true colors. There is nothing more to know in a way. He has shown you who he is. Now you can start to mourn. And it's horrible but at least you can be free sooner than later and sooner than later put this behind you and start to heal.

i'm sorry if i've not addressed all that you've said and all that's been posted but i am burnt out myself tonight. And I'm so sorry that he's such an idiot and you are so good and kind and do not deserve such unloving treatment.

so sorry.

((hugs))

It's like this, and this takes time and practice, but you can use it in all facets of life: We view life as a tug of war with us facing our troubles as a monster on the other side of the rope. Some days we pull harder and gain ground and some days we can't pull as hard and the monster gains ground. We all believe that our job is to pull harder, to gain more ground. The thing is that isn't our job. Our job is to drop the damn rope.

I so needed to hear this tonight. Thank you Headdesk. Sometimes all there is to do is walk away.

He never looked me in the eye, ignored me when I spoke, and have me short responses full of anger? Sadness? Not sure. He made it clear that he was very upset and wanted me to know it.

This is actually funny if you think of it. He's likely acting like this because he thinks if he withdraws, you'll start sniffing after him like a lost puppy.

Little does he know that you've realized an unrepentant cheater who emotionally abuses you isn't worth the effort. What a rude awakening he's in for.

TheAgonyogIt-Thank you for taking the time out of your own struggles to help me with my own. I don/t know what I would do without this forum.

WH sent me a text saying that he knows he made a mistake and I have every right to be angry, but I do not have the right to make threats about divorce. He is right, the texts I sent him the day before threaten to continue separation and/or divorce if he refused to be honest about his whereabouts during the affair based on his work schedule I just now received. It was stupid of me to make such threats. I was angry, felt like I uncovered something new, and starting thinking that what is the point in trying to R if he won't be honest.

I did not respond to his text and don't plan to... I post here instead.

I met with MC today (alone) & he said I need to stop digging for things that happened in the past. I dug because I wanted to know how many hours, if any, of work he missed to be with her since his work schedule is the primary reason he gives for going to therapy sporadically. I also wanted to know if he was at work on his birthday (2012) like he said he was when he arrived home late that day, only to get into a fight with me because I was upset that he was so late, we were going to miss our dinner reservations. He left the house that evening at returned very late that night. When I checked his schedule on his birthday, he was "unavailable" since 1pm. Yes, the occurred ages ago, but all the times I questioned him, he said he was at work & now he says he was, but was doing inventory and checked himself off bc he could not meet with clients. I know, I am making myself crazy and I shouldn't keep digging.

I do not have the right to make threats about divorce. He is right

No. He isn't right.

You aren't *threatening* him. You are telling him that you cannot remain married to a person who you can't trust to be honest with you.....and rightly so.

Stat, this guy is not the least little bit remorseful.

He is right, the texts I sent him the day before threaten to continue separation and/or divorce if he refused to be honest about his whereabouts during the affair based on his work schedule I just now received. It was stupid of me to make such threats. I was angry, felt like I uncovered something new, and starting thinking that what is the point in trying to R if he won't be honest.

No he is not right. You have every right to let him know being dishonest will lead to S/D.

He is trying to suck you in...don't fall for it.

I met with MC today (alone) & he said I need to stop digging for things that happened in the past

Your MC is wrong as well. You will dig until you have the truth...period. Its your life and you deserve to know what you are dealing with. An MC that tells you to stop will encourage you to rug sweep....find someone that has REAL infidelity based experience.

Trust your gut, you KNOW you are not wrong or to blame here.

180, 180, 180 your husband is being an ass-hat. Don't let him guilt you back!!

Holly- Perhaps he did expect me to follow him around and figure out what was wrong. I was too tired & knew how it would end.... with me in tears trying to make him understand.

The worst part of it all was watching his mom cry over what is going on between us.

I reread our text message trail from the day before & saw that he said he cannot return to a marriage where I threaten him with divorce and attacks him with questions whenever I want. It's annoying & there is no point to put himself through this is I want to leave him anyhow. He said I can leave, its not a problem and he is not afraid.

He's made the "not afraid" comment before, sometimes days after telling me he can't imagine his life without my daughter and I.

Sorry for the long/numerous posts. I'm resisting the urge to defend myself any further.

You're right... he's not remorseful. I guess I don't know what remorseful looks like/feels like.

I was not intending to threaten him- I wanted the truth so I had a reason to stay and I can't stay when all I get is what I find on my own. He doesn't see that.

He is wrong and abusive. Your counselor is also wrong. It's time to go through with your threat. Seek the divorce, he is a toxic NPD and move on.

By the way. You are doing a great job with the 180. Good luck.

How sad for him that you are "annoying" him after he HAD A FREAKING AFFAIR AND BROKE HIS MARRIAGE VOWS.