SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Great step confessing. Proud of you.

Haven't waded thru the entire thread but this caught my eye.

He knows all the general info but not the specific. I'm not sure why he doesn't ask.

Because maybe he doesn't want to know. My husband didn't. He said I was cheating, my AP was willing, his imagination could do the rest. He didn't need to hear me say it all. He just knew.

My Dday was November 4, 2011. He just asked me this past Saturday how I actually did the webcamming. He wanted every, gory detail. It took from November 4, 2011 to February 8, 2014 for him to decide that it was something he needed to hear.

Follow your husband's lead. You're only two weeks out. His mind is probably numb and in shock. Give him time to process the new reality. Let him find his footing. You may be surprised as time passes, at what he decides he needs.

And now might be time to start letting go of the illusion a little - that you had two pretty good lives, or that your AP may somehow be a teensy bit better than the garden-variety scuzz-bucket who cheats on his wife. (Can I say that?)

You are still very foggy, my dear. Consider reading "Not Just Friends" and if you keep coming back here, you'll get a lot of support from people who have been there.

Yes I know, that is what I'm trying to do....let go of the illusion. It was "for me" a mostly good time though....yes selfish I know while my husband was at home with the kids. I know. I'm trying to get my head back on straight. I did read not just friends but found it was more aimed at the BS and not the WS. Everytime it's pointed out what a scumbag he is to do what he did does make me a little defensive though because I did those same things and I'm not a scumbag. yes I made some very bad choices but I've also made lots of great choices in my life. I've done a lot of great things for my kids schools, other parents etc. I'm not here to prove myself since I need to only do that to my family and myself but for me, saying what a horrible guy my AP was doesn't work for me yet. Hopefully soon : )

But to suggest I wasn't tough and didn't deserve respect is way off base. It takes an incredible toughness to survive infidelity and come out the other side a better, stronger man.

Warpspeed you are right, and I think it's not so much that I don't respect him, more that I'm not sure how to read his reaction. He says he is so deeply hurt but he's not a very emotional guy. There have been a few tears by him but he keeps himself together. For me I'm normally an emotional mess so it's hard for me to understand but you are right that it's not that he should lose my respect because my gosh, I have a lot of respect for someone that has his head on straight, I sure don't, who says he want's to try to R for hte sake of our family, and can't imagine the trauma of a divorce for hte kids, and he really wants me to be his wife forever and can't imagine anyone else.

Just wanted to counsel you that yes your BH is in shock and denial. It is an automatic response for self-protection. Blaming himself is part of the denial.

An example, I think I remember crying a week or two past dday in some kind of joy that I did not 'lose' my WW and that I was going to be able to keep my bride. Yay!.... Wow, what denial. See, just 4 weeks prior, my bride was having no problem enjoying a valentines dinner with me and the kids the night before getting on a plane to go get penetrated by a man who was not her husband. I had before that lost everything. So yeah, the denial goes away, and your BH will 'see' who he is or was married to. Yep, strap in.

The tidal wave of anger will come. Please do not have him hurt himself with all the self-blame and then throw in the towel when the anger hits just because it is uncomfortable for you.

Good for you in coming clean BTW.

[This message edited by MC_Jack at 7:32 PM, February 11th (Tuesday)]

Everytime it's pointed out what a scumbag he is to do what he did does make me a little defensive though because I did those same things and I'm not a scumbag.

You may not be a scumbag...now, but during the course of your A you were a scumbag. Or at the very least behaved like one.

I spent a lot of time trying to convince myself that I was a good person during my A. It took me the better part of a year digging into my why's, seeing my husband's pain, and learning some empathy and humility before I could finally accept that I was a real (fill in your favorite derogatory term) during that time. I had to come to terms with the fact that I did some pretty horrible things. I had to figure why and how so that I could change the thought processes that led me down that path. I don't expect you to find acceptance any time soon. It's a journey. But you should be "owning your shit" as we like to say around here.

When you are defensive, there is a reason. It's usually something to look into a little further.

[This message edited by WalkinOnEggshelz at 7:26 PM, February 11th (Tuesday)]

You may not be a scumbag...now, but during the course of your A you were a scumbag. Or at the very least behaved like one.

Yes that is true. I do not want to be defined by my affair and I think that is one of the problems i have sometimes with the tone of some posts I read on SI. I think that is absolutely correct that I behaved poorly, like a scumbag low life, but it truly is not who I am. In the book Not Just Friends it does talk about the good people that had affairs, we are your friends, co-workers, doctors/nurses, teacher etc. We are all walks of life, people you look up to and yes we lead this secret scumbag life but we are still able to be good people too. We are lost and messed up and looking in all the wrong places to feel better.

Is it possible this -

I wish I could say I was further along in my mind for remorse

could be as a result of this -

I do not want to be defined by my affair and I think that is one of the problems i have sometimes with the tone of some posts I read on SI. I think that is absolutely correct that I behaved poorly, like a scumbag low life, but it truly is not who I am.

In reality,

If it walks like duck.

Quacks like a duck.

Swims like a duck.

Flys like a duck.

Occums Razor would dictate it is in fact, a duck.

we are your friends, co-workers, doctors/nurses, teacher etc.

So friends, co-workers, doctors/nurses, teachers, politicians, real estate agents, insurance brokers, lawyers, telemarketers and used car salesman can't also be scumbags at the same time?

scumbag

ˈskʌmbag/

noun

informal

noun: scumbag; plural noun: scumbags

1.

a contemptible or objectionable person.

Confused,

Every time I read your posts, it pulls me back to how I felt a year ago. Missing the "fun" and mourning the loss of something that was special for me and ONLY for me. The way you talk about your H is very similar also, although I DID lose respect for my H as I felt he didn't man up. He took all my bullshit and wasn't "man" enough to throw me out on the curb and teach me a lesson, after all that's what a real man would do right?? A Real Man being my XAP who often proclaimed if he ever found out his wife cheated on him he would divorce her in a flash. Yep, my idea of a "real man" was a man that was cheating on his wife

It's taking me time to realise, perhaps a real man is my H. A man who takes his kids and family seriously and will do what it takes to keep it in tact. I think our H's are afraid to really share how they feel about us in case we leave.

There is something deeper in this however.. why is mediocre not enough? Why do we need excitement in order to feel alive? If what we've always wanted is a family then why is it not enough? Why are you so torn?

The only thing that has kept me sane is really figuring out what voids AP was filling. It wasn't sexual as we never saw each other. It was emotional and mental. The biggest thing I've done is stand up for myself and insisted I re-start my career as that used to give me a sense of achievement and fulfilment and pride. My H has always discouraged me to work as he felt I needed to support his career and raise the kids. This led to huge amounts of resentment and low self worth. He said the finical contribution I would make was insignificant and therefore I should be a SAHM and serve everyone around me. I am now asserting myself and things are gonna change around here.

What is your void???

Confused43

BS here (no stop sign)

I applaud you for taking that first step and confessing. Continue to post often and you will continue to receive a lot of support here from those that have went thru the same.

I agree with many of those that have commented already but there is one thing you said...that i take issue with.

He did not ask to see the emails which is good because if he were to read them I’m not sure he could get over what he would read.

If he asks for the emails you give them to him and then deal with any fallout and support him in every way you can with his pain that you and only you created. What you said above that you are not sure he would get over what he would read is the same thing my WW said to me.

In MC, our C told my WW...that is a very selfish, stubborn, "its all about me" statement anyone can make. MC continued to tell my WW that only me the BS could answer that question and WW cannot answer any questions for me. This was nothing more than another avenue to "issue avoidance" ...a justification not to dig deeper within herself.

If WW wanted to know "can you get over this...or do you think you will be able to get over this" then ask the question and let me answer.

Do not answer for me...like she did when she decided to fuck a married man. In her mind, she asked me "can i fuck a married man at hotels and go on vacations with him" and she answered for me "yes".

Never never answer a question that the answer is owned by your faithful spouse. Because it can get you into a lot of trouble and you will not be on the right path to R.

So to that end, that's my mild "2x4" in the hope you will never answer any questions that belong to your faithful husband

me: 59

her WW- 58

7 yr LTA (PA & EA) with her former boss (I knew him)

one d-24 yrs old- former eating disorder now OCB

married 26 yrs

in "R" and its been roller-coaster

D-day 3-13-12

confronted 6 wks later(dropped 35# in those 6 weeks and was hospitalized for 2 days with severe chest pains-thought i was having a heart attack)

I contacted AP's faithful wife and we both kept tabs on our waywards

Fog, denials, blame shifting, rub sweeping, TT you name it and she did it but things are finally getting better very slowly

its a long road....and painful

I do not want to be defined by my affair

No one does. There are a couple of ways you can handle that. One, say you learned your lesson, rugsweep, don't do anything to change the behaviors and thought processes you currently have only to have it all rear it's ugly head again in the future; or two, do the hard work to find out your why's and work to change the current thoughts that just aren't working for you.

Doing the work will most likely mean that your life will revolve around your A for a long time. There will be talks about it and fights with your BH, IC, reading and posting on SI,sleepless nights, maybe some missed work days so you can work through it all. Working through this will consume your life and probably feel as if it is defining you at the time. You will feel shame, distress, grief, panic, sadness, hope, empathy, and humility just to name a few of the emotional roller coaster coming your way. It's absolutely the most difficult thing I have ever been through in my entire life. It takes years.

It doesn't have to define you when you are able to say you have done and will continue to do the work to make yourself a healthier, safer person. I guarantee you, that as much as you don't want your A to define you, your BH will be fighting the good fight to not let it define him.

Good job on confessing

I have posted that you are still in your affair. I don't mean physically, but mentally you Still have some hooks in it

You still think fondly of a man who agreed with you to cheat on her husband and family. There is nothing wrong with admiring someone. However, admiring Someone who can participate in the destruction of a marriage is not honorable. He wrote explicit emails to a married woman. If this man was doing this to someone else, would you think he was so grand?

For you to pursue him and he responds, knowing that you are married, that is not so honorable. I was that man. I knew my actions were wrong. I knew my actions were despicable, but I was being selfish. Your AP is not a victim who succumbed to the wiles of a married woman, but he was a willing participant in the disrespect of your husband and the possible destruction of your marriage.

The anger will come for your husband. Be prepared. He may say some things about you he never said before. He may not, but anger will come as soon as the shock wears off.

I hope you are staying NC and I really hope you see how bad infidelity truly is.

I was fortunate..I saved my family from my horrible destructive actions.It took a lot of hard work. I am sure you can do the hard work, it would be wise to really take a look at who your AP can be when faced with a decision whether or not to have an affair with a married woman. An honorable man would have told you to work on your marriage.

Your AP may be a good guy who made a bad decision

But to your BH, he will just be the man who had an affair with his wife.He will never look on him favorably. With NC and working on you and your marriage..the hooks of the affair that are still present will soon come off and you may not see him so favorable.

Slowuptake: I think your time would have been better spent reading hte newspaper rather than giving me the definition of a scumbag. Right now you clearly don't know what I need, as that is not it. I really appreciate the replies of people that understand, or try to understand. I'm being honest, I don't have a problem doing that. My problem is getting out of the fog and being sure that I do want to be out of it. I appreciate the responses that get me thinking and help me to see the light. Things like what is missing, didn't I always want a family with kids because yes I did so that is a great question. Is it possible once I get something I am no longer interested? I'm not saying everyone needs to be nice but there is something to be said about posts that to me cross the line. We know we fucked up or we wouldn't be here as waywards. I don't need to post each time about what a fuck up I am. As a wayward they already say that yes we fucked up, are fucked up and we are also the parent picking up your kids from camp and making dinner for them, helping you through a tough time with your spouse or family, teaching your kids, cleaning your teeth, your office assistant etc. So while I don't expect you to like me if I slept with your spouse just know that we cannot be solely defined by one word "scumbag cheater"

It took fertility treatments for me to have kids, it was a struggle and nothing that I wanted more, yet now that I have them I sometimes take it for granted, and they drive me nuts often. I try to remember how badly I wanted them and how thankful I am to have healthy happy kids. It's helps to be reminded sometimes as we lose our focus and get selfish. In the morning I go in and cuddle my youngest. I love that time and think, wow what if I didn't live here? I need to try to think of those things.

Right now my mind knows what it needs to do but my heart still isn't sure. I can't feel it yet. Once I can get over ap I feel like I can start to work on my marriage with more authenticity. Right now it's half ass. I honestly think my husband deserves better. I just hope that with time I can be be the wife he deserves, not sure there is enough time in the year though.

Confused,

Why are you so bothered that your actions may define you for now?

My WH is a good father, he can be a good husband, he is an excellent sales person, an industrious employee, a good friend.

But during his As, he was not a good father, most definitely not a good husband. His obsessive behavior with his APs made that impossible. He was still a good employee and an excellent sales person. He was not a good friend. He used them or blew them off to be with his AP. He is not that person now.

It's ok to admit you did good deeds while in your A, but at your core you were not a good wife, etc. It doesnt have to define your future.

We are all walks of life, people you look up to and yes we lead this secret scumbag life but we are still able to be good people too. We are lost and messed up and looking in all the wrong places to feel better.

There is something to this. Last week my wife was driving behind a car being driven by an elderly lady when she saw something go flying off the car. Turns out the lady left her purse on the hood and drove off. Credit cards and other items went flying everywhere. My wife actually risked her neck to pull over and retrieve all of the items and stuff it back in the purse, where she found a wad of cash and even keys to an office and a vacation home. She spent the rest of the day trying to track this lady down before eventually connecting with her and returning the purse that night.

The lady was overwhelmed and tried to give my wife money (she refused). She then went on about how nice the people in this town are and that my wife must be some kind of an angel. She recently moved to this town, and apparently saw my fWW as a shining example of the type of people who live here.

Not the selfish person her affair would suggest.

It's interesting - one person's devil can be another's angel, depending on the circumstances. I don't think she's the "devil" by any stretch, but if you'd asked me around this time last year I damn sure wouldn't have described her as an angel.

Objectively, my wife is a good person. Always has been. She has shown a ton of growth in the last year, but I'm pretty sure she would have done the same charitable act even if the incident occurred during the middle of her affair. That's just who she is and always has been.

That doesn't make those destructive and bizarre 10 months any easier to digest, but it sure makes R a lot easier.

Just some food for thought. I wish you the best, confused43.

Confused

Bless you for confessing. That took courage.

Now, you are going to need more courage. A lot.

Courage to dig deep and figure out why you risked your family and crushed the soul of a man who did not deserve this.

Courage to make a decision and put your husband and family out of their misery (yes, even if they do not know it, your kids are now in harms way). Keeping your husband in limbo is not fair to him - if you want to be single, he deserves to know now instead of a year from now.

Courage to face his anger (and it will come). Courage to face his fear. Courage to face his confusion about how can he stay with someone who (to him) hates his guts enough to give herself to another man in every way, hates him so much she would make him a part-time Dad, hates him so much she willingly has thrown away his devotion to her...

Courage to face him as he cycles through a million emotions - none of them good...

None of this is easy. Facing your demons and the wake of your destruction never is. But you have taken a huge step forward in becoming a better person and a better partner, even if you wind up divorced.

Strength and blessings to you on your journey to healing.

Sal1995- yes that is alot of what I've been trying to say and yes your wife would of course done the same thing. Even though we live a double life we are still who we are, even if we are making bad choices about the affair. I would totally have done the same thing, or a lost dog, or whatever it is. Deep down I am still a good person but I made very bad choices that I now have to live with and try to learn and recover from and help my husband too.

Reallyscrewedup: thank you for your post. Very true and I hope I do have the courage. point taken.

I just wish I could get rid of the wishy washy me and start to focus, although focus has always been a problem for me unless I really really want something.....that's what worries me.....I'm not there yet really really wanting my marriage to work. I do "want" it, just need to feel it more inside of me.

Thanks!!

The wanting is all about you. Not the AP.

In my A , I felt 20 years younger. I felt like I was finding my true self. The OM loved this band I fell in love with. I could have loved the music on my own. Not because of him. I started running more because of OM. Why didn't I find this love on my own ?

I was there all along. I had buried myself. My BH dodnt do this. Our M had issues, but I chose to bury my head in the sand and cheat.

I doubt any vet on here would disagree that good people do bad shit. I believe that with all my heart. I have devoted my life and profession to helping others.

But I shit all over my M.

I had to recognize that maybe I wasn't as awesome as I projected. I had weaknesses and failings and a mean streak.

Wayward side is not about ignoring or rug sweeping. It is facing your demons. And being better.

Last thing. What do you respect in a partner? You mentioned you lost respect for BH because he was merciful. What do you respect ? Do you respect the OM ?

I mention this because my own sense of respect was fucked. I loved men who were macho and emotionally unavailable. I have developed an aMazing respect for my BH since DDay. Something deeper. I respect his fidelity and his honesty. His fight to stay with me against his pride.

[This message edited by Mrs Panda at 9:11 PM, February 12th (Wednesday)]

It took a great deal of courage to confess! And you absolutely did the right thing. Most of the time, the right thing to do is difficult. You've given your marriage more of a chance of making it through this by taking this step - IMO.

Regarding your therapist, our couple therapist is famous for saying, 'happy people don't cheat,' and it does make sense to me. There has to be something within the marriage that is not working - communication, sex, etc. It can be that the person who cheats isn't a happy person inside, but a portion of that rests within the marriage. I do believe that, and I can see where it rings true in many situations, including my own.

Moving out? I can tell you that as a BW, I still get angry and hurt that I had to watch my WH go through his process of grieving that (very brief) A. It was like twisting the knife he had already stabbed me in the heart with. It's totally unfair to make him comfort you through that. While I do believe that it may make R more difficult. I also believe you need to earn your way back into the marriage and his good graces.

The best of luck to you both! You've done a courageous thing and I hope you both can get past the hurts and grow old together : )

I think your time would have been better spent reading hte newspaper rather than giving me the definition of a scumbag.

Sorry, don't read newspapers, they're full of hidden agendas, sensationalist half truths and outright lies, too much like a wayward.

Right now you clearly don't know what I need, as that is not it.

Ok, let me take you back a couple of months to a certain 'newbie' who came on asking for help, support and guidance.

Turns out this newbie's BS didn't know about the affair.

The vast majority of respondants to the post said she needed to confess.

The newbie was adamant that she didn't need that.

After much subtle and blunt persuasion, pleading, cajoling, arguing, debating from WS's and BS's alike the newbie changed her stance.

Now let's go back even further.

At some point years ago Confused43, you decided you needed more passion in your life.

You decided you didn't need that from your husband.

You decided you needed an emotional connection with a man other than your husband.

You needed to have sex with a man other than your husband.

You needed to abandon your family.

My whole point is that since you have admitted yourself, that you are still foggy, don't you think that based on previous thinking/actions, that your decision making process on what you need is more than a little irrational?

So with that I'll repeat, because the message obviously got lost in the method of delivery last time.

Is it possible this -

I wish I could say I was further along in my mind for remorse

could be as a result of this -

I do not want to be defined by my affair and I think that is one of the problems i have sometimes with the tone of some posts I read on SI. I think that is absolutely correct that I behaved poorly, like a scumbag low life, but it truly is not who I am.

Because what I, bluntly and others subtley, have been trying to get across to you is that while ever you think of yourself as a 'Good person who made some unfortunate mistakes', you are not going to reach full remorse.

But then again, what would we know. Since it's not as though we've BTDT. Oooh wait.........................never mind.

[This message edited by SlowUptake at 3:25 AM, February 13th (Thursday)]

confused43,

I'm wondering if the confession didn't give you want you wanted...For your husband to get really angry and kick you out and demand a divorce.

By not doing that, you are still faced with having to make a choice. To stay in your marriage and fight or to get a divorce.

I know that part of my wish washiness is that I didn't want to be the one to make the decision. I wanted him to be the "bad" guy and divorce me. Instead he proved to be the bigger person and told me to figure out what I wanted. He didn't demand a NC. He didn't demand full access to my accounts . He told me to figure out if I was coming or going. I have to figure out what I want. I had to stop the affair on my own. I had to be an adult and face my bad decisions.

His disappointment in me is harder to take than any anger he will ever show. I can handle anger and I can relate to anger but disappointment hits me harder. I don't want my husband to be disappointed in me. That kills.

I'm not second guessing your decision to confessing. I think however maybe to examine the motive behind it.