SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I'm not sure if people really "change", but maybe are more aware of themselves. As a young person in college, with little dating experience, I allowed myself to be the OW. My bf and I broke up, and he started dating someone else, and I stupidly thought if he was coming back to me for sex…that "meant something". Did I ever think about his gf? NOPE. I was like 19 years old.

But, I also realize that a college romance as a 19 year old is way different that cheating on my spouse, or in a long-term committed relationship.

It isn't that WS are "forever undatable people", but the combination of what *I* experienced with their combined experience generally doesn't make a good combination FOR ME. The thought process behind having an affair, for whatever reason, and for however long…is not something I will ever understand or have sympathy or empathy for.

Without that common ground of understanding, then I think the relationship will be more difficult than with someone you "get". Why would a fWS want to be around someone that views them cautiously? You have to know if you are a fWS and you are trying to date a fBS, there could be additional challenges in the relationship. If a fWS doesn't understand that, then they don't "get it".

I personally liked the fWS I tried to date, but he triggered me like crazy. I couldn't see myself ever really being comfortable around him.

Here's how I see it:

1. At least you know up front. How many of us would have loved to have known information like this about our WS before we made a commitment?

2. She's putting it out there - take it or leave it.

3. Hopefully she has looked within herself to discover some things that led her down that path.

4. Sometimes, even after trying to work on a relationship, things aren't going to work out with a couple because they find out they aren't that compatible or one has evolved and the other one remains in an immature state that was fine when they were dating in their 20s. It doesn't mean the WS isn't capable of change.

5. Remember, you are only hearing ONE side of the story.

If you continue in the relationship and really get serious, I think some couples counseling would be good just to make sure everyone is communicating well and their aren't any issues that are being suppressed by the excitement of being in love again.

Even if a wayward had completely done a 180 and they really were different, for me personally, that's not a risk I could take. I'd always, always wonder...

YMMV.

Be very careful. MY EX was a ws.twice.He said he would never hurt anyone like that again. HE was in counseling and found God.He had an affair and left me and dd6 within 4 months.

An update: We have been dating for two months now and she truly is an amazing woman in so many ways. But, at the same time I feel like she still has so much work to do on herself before I can totally feel comfortable. I feel like she has some FOO and co-dependency issues that she hasn't really delved into before.

We talked more about her A and specifically what happened AFTER D-day. What I found out was a bit unsettling.

She did not go NC with OM immediately and actually saw him twice more while trying to maintain a "friendship." All the while her H was still living with her during this time. She maintains that they were separated though despite still living together. After her H moved out she then began to see a different guy for about a month. Then before her divorce was final in 2009 she began what would be a 4 1/2 year relationship with another guy.

During this relationship there were 3 or 4 breakups in which during each time she would see other guys before eventually getting back together with him. She finally ended it for good back in Dec. But, they went to Vegas together with another couple in January and stayed in separate rooms.

She dated a couple other guys in Jan/Feb. before I started dating her in early Feb.

She obviously knows my past and has been super about listening to my concerns and is 100% willing to do whatever it takes to make me feel safe in this relationship. Frankly, if she hadn't been like this I would have been gone. But, her positive qualities make me think she is worth the chance since she is so open to doing things to improve herself and has a renewed faith as well. I even discussed having her come on here and read and even contribute some and she seemed very open to that as well.

Just kind of wanted to get this out there. BS as well as WS are welcome to chime in with your opinions. Thanks.

As a non-dating member here, I rarely if ever post on these types of threads because I feel I don't have much recent experience to offer.

That said, judging from your latest update, and the number of relationships in which she kept her husband as second choice, that's a whole lot of times being an OW in my opinion.

WAY too many.

AJ's MOM

My instinct says cut bait. She has never taken time to be alone, from your timeline. Always running from one thing to another. It's not healthy and it's not encouraging. You can't really work on yourself if you keep clinging to different relationships to make you happy. Also, from your summary, her way of talking about the divorce seems to gloss over the pain she caused. Oh, they were 'separated'? I wonder how her BH saw it!

People need to be comfortable being alone and happy with themselves first and foremost, and her relationship history shows the opposite pattern.

I really cannot think of a single positive thing to say about your update. Maybe that I'm glad you're still willing to post here and hear what people are going to say? Because surely if you are posting about it again it's because you know this is a trainwreck waiting to happen. Her relationship habits and boundaries are just awful.

Bro - you wrote your update with much trepidation. Why?

Wow...it's like every other sentence is "yet another guy."

Dude...I'm sorry to say it, but this woman is going to be another lesson for you.

[This message edited by SeanFLA at 7:20 PM, March 26th (Wednesday)]

No judgment from me. Please update us on the inevitable train wreck, though.

I think it is Dr. Phil that says something like, "The biggest predictor of future behavior is past behavior." And I truly believe that. That is not to say that everyone doesn't learn from their past and change for the better. Many people do. I just don't think it is the majority. I don't care how much work a fws has done, I (me personally)don't think I could date one, just because of my triggers and emotional hangups. I don't think that all fws should be shunned. None of us are perfect. I just don't think a relationship like that would make me feel safe to be in. I wish it didn't have to be that way with me. :(

Food for thought:

Has she ever been able to live without a relationship or has she always been defined by her relationship?

Who is she really?

I'm only posting here because somehow(Yea, I'm learning my reasons) I managed to pick 5 different women who, ultimately were unfaithful. Sounds like she's looking for a KISA. Don't become one.

I'm trying to understand what about her has so charmed you against this backdrop of persistent longterm waywardness. Only a few months in it's hard to tell how genuine a person really is. Some people are expert at appearing how you want them to be. I have a sister like this. Could she be one of these chameleon types? I hope not for your sake. I hate to rain on your parade but this doesn't sound very good...Be careful and guard your heart!

Going thru the hell of multiple D-days, gaslighting, and failed R tends to make someone ultra aware of behavior that just doesn't jive.

Please reread what you wrote here. Are you sure you are now "ultra aware?". The uneasiness in your gut is telling you something.

That said, judging from your latest update, and the number of relationships in which she kept her husband as second choice, that's a whole lot of times being an OW in my opinion.

WAY too many.

I agree... seems she likes to start new relationships before ending old ones...

Arent things always peachy when you start seeing someone 'new'.. after 6 months or so the lustre wears off and reality sets in.

If you do plan on still seeing her tread very very carefully.....

I personally make no judgment about people who "see others" while officially separated, moved out, etc, or before the D is final. I dated before my D to my first H was final. He was living with the OW, but I still know in my head, when we decided to separate, the M was over as far as I was concerned. I understand others view it differently and I accept that.

But with my perspective, still mostly only the original situation would be of concern: the 1.5 year A while fully married to her H. One of my questions about that is: Was the OM also married? To me, that makes a huge difference. Yes, it is bad to cheat on your spouse, but it is twice as bad to cheat on them with someone else who is also married in my view. It just shows so much lack of empathy.

Now to share some of my actual experience. My first H obvious cheated on me. When I was dating my current H, we talked about this some (many years before SI). He admitted to cheating on his first wife when he was 25 years old. He did tell me he was very unhappy in the M, but also admitted cheating was the wrong the thing to do and that ultimately, the failure of the M was both their faults. He will still say that to this day, but never defends cheating.

He was married to his second wife for 8 years and did not cheat on her, but she cheated on him, and that was what led to the end of the M. Even though his second M was also far from perfect, he never cheated on her nor even thought of it. To me, I guess the second M counted more when I was trying to get a picture of the kind of man (and kind of cheating risk) he would be.

So imagine my shock when after being married to him for over 10 years, he cheated on me and with the SAME WHORE he cheated on his first wife with back when he was only 25! I don't know why I'm telling this here because it changes nothing. I don't think what happened in my situation is any predictor about others who have cheated on the past, or the woman you are dating. It is just part of the facts and details of my case.

And even with all that, my H learned his lesson and is extremely remorseful. There are too many details to tell, but the fact it was the same whore as when he was married to his first wife makes it seem that this woman was somehow "extra special" to him. But knowing what I know now, it is more that she was extra persistent and that is what he gave in to, not any special weakness toward that particular woman.

Now it has been more than 7 years since then. We have no guarantees in life that we won't be cheated on, no matter how carefully we think we choose. But I am confident that my chances of being cheated on again while with my current H are very very low, and definitely lower than if I were to have to start over with someone new, even if that person had no known track record of cheating. I'm not sure what my H learned, if much of anything, after he cheated on his first wife. But in this marriage, he learned a heck of a lot and definitely demonstrates in his daily life that he has no tolerance for women who act inappropriately, flirt, try to tell him their personal troubles, and so on.

Bobbi, the OM was single. But, I completely get what you are saying about it making a difference. My XWW cheated with a guy that was engaged to be married and raising 4 kids together with his fiancé and never showed one bit of remorse for the fact that she contributed to breaking up that family.

I appreciate all of the replies. I am treading lightly and taking it slow. I'm also going into this with both eyes open and she knows that. She has so many good qualities that it just makes it hard for me to give up on her.

There are no guarantees in life. Has she changed? Maybe. Will she cheat again? Maybe. Should this stop you from having a relationship with her? Only you can decide that.

True, past behaviour can be an indicator of future behaviour. But how that behaviour would impact you in the future and how you would react to it is completely in your control.

I even discussed having her come on here and read and even contribute some and she seemed very open to that as well.

I hope she does join SI....that she reads the stories with an open heart, takes advantage of the wisdom and reads the recommended readings. If she is really feeling what you state (renewed faith, etc), she would embrace any new tools (SI) to help her get where she is aiming to be (a better her).

On one side, she has been willing to talk to you about it and is open to the number of guys and timelines (even when they make her look bad)....so that is a positive.

However, if she ever stumbles on her new path; her retort can be "well....you knew how I was".

Given your history and her opposed history - this would scare the heck out of me for my heart.