SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I like what Ok Now wrote.

Your wife has been testing you. Possibly pushing you so she can walk away from the marriage.

So give her what she wants.

A divorce.

She lies. She cheats. She has a PA and multiple EA's with multiple men.

And what do you do? You forgive her.

How can you possibly forgive her when you do not know the extent of her wrongful actions.

Go see an attorney and file.

You then watch her actions.

That is what will truly make up your mind.

And until she knows remorse and participates in the marriage you have nothing.

So get tough. Act tough and show her tough love.

That will be the only way you will get her respect.

HM

Get tough, my husband was undecisive about OW until I told him I was leaving. You need to detach yourself and not to manipulate her, but for your own protection. You have nothing to lose at this point.

I pay all bills, grocery shop, cook or buy must dinners....she does no housework.

This is a great place to start.

How about she pay her own bills and cook her own dinner starting now.

By doing these things, she will see that you can no longer be walked all over and will get her out of the fog of the affair.

I forget...Is this OM married?

justinpaintoday - Even though my experience is brand new, I have learned that being nice is NOT going to do the trick to get your WW back. She'll just continue to take advantage of you. We have to find our inner strength to take a stand against the mistreatment we are receiving from our spouses.

The advice we're finding in SI is awesome! The best I have heard so far is: we must risk our M in order to hopefully save it.

Well unfortunately no one could tell me my WW response was anything but wrong. I knew it too but the heart is a tender vessel.

I was thinking today about the selfies she still takes. She never sends them to me so all I can do is assume another man gets to enjoy these. I think I am finally understanding that this 3 month hell ride is not going to end happily ever after.

I still struggle with the low self esteem question: Why wasn;t I enough? And even now why am I not worth fighting for? I know these are unfair to ask myself but they do hang in my mind. I would have done anything to save this M.

Perhaps filing for D will create a dramatic change. Perhaps not but I will continue IC and SI as this progresses. I will need support more than ever. Is 3 months too soon to file considering her unwillingness to transparency or IC? I know I have to answer this myself.

I believe it is completely natural to question our own faults in this devastating time, but we HAVE to learn that it's not our faults. We have to keep repeating that to ourselves until we believe it. I still go round and round with myself about something HAD to be wrong or he wouldn't have strayed. However, then I think - HE must have the problem if felt like his only solution was to look outside our M. I have to keep telling myself that I'm a good person - probably too nice of a person - and I did nothing to deserve this treatment. You must start to think in this manner too. While my situation is only a couple of weeks in, yours is 3 months. You need to detach yourself from her and take time to really look at yourself and what you want out of life. Being alone is a very scary thought but I think you are still too close to the problem to think clearly. ((hugs))

Thanks Left out. Weird. everyone here is like a sister, brother, and friend all at once. Stay strong.

Why wasn;t I enough? And even now why am I not worth fighting for?

I know you don't see this yet, but YOU are not the problem here (unless you keep taking her out for dinner). She is. YOU are enough. Repeat that time and again. The fact that a grown woman is taking selfies and possibly sending them out is just so ridiculous at best. That pretty much shows you the shallow state of her mind right now.

Is 3 months too soon to file considering her unwillingness to transparency or IC? I know I have to answer this myself.

I have read many times on here to wait 6 months before making any life changing decision. Even people who are sure they are going to R bc all is going well wait it out just to make sure. This is all SO EMOTIONAL/impossibler to rational. Of course, this is a decision only you can make. Why not start with the 180 as you decided earlier. And as someone suggested, so some investigating to see what she is up too. Remember, the 180 is a way to start taking care of YOU so that no matter what happens, you are in a much better place.

We all are in this together. Unfortunately. You stay strong too!!

LA44: I like your advise. The 180 is going okay today on day 1. I think I am so eager for something to happen to close the frustration that D seems like the only logical option. I don't have to force it. I can follow whatever timing best suits my course.

HOWEVER: I hear everyone loud and clear. No more pandering, begging and nicing the relationship thinking WW will change.

Well, thank you jipt. I certainly was never in the position you are in now so I think a lot before I respond...but I ask myself, what would I tell a friend. There are a few guys on here who post often with some good stuff - you might want to follow their stuff: Wert, Blakesteele and the brief but wise, Sisoon.

She never sends them to me so all I can do is assume another man gets to enjoy these

I can understand your complete frustration. You want your wife back to the way things used to be. That is the worst part of all.

You want your wife to be at least sorry for what she has done and you hope the 180 does this for you.

But from that I have seen, your wife is not coming out of the fog of the affair as long as she is still having an affair, that is impossible.

The OM is telling your wife everything she needs to hear right now. Things like the affair is the right thing to do, you are wrong in telling her how to live, etc.

The OM is helping your wife rationalize the wrongs and making all of this seem like the best thing to do.

You need to get this affair stopped if you want a chance that your wife will ever get out of the fog.

Is the OM married?

DO they work together?

Have you confronted him?

Do not let the affair be so damn easy for them. Get the affair out into the light. Fight for your marriage by getting this OM out of your life. Now your wife will see this as something you are doing to hurt her. But hopefully when the OM throws your wife under the bus, as many times happens. Your wife will snap out of the fog.

Sorry for read about your situation brother. You can click my profile and read my story. I too, have a WW.

I didn't discover SI until a couple of weeks after my DDay. But you know what, I did do a decent job of "following the rules" without knowing about them. I guess, it just felt logical to me.

So you're 3 months out from your DDay and you're still on square #1.

Every situation is different, but it's amazing how things are so common too.

Here's what you have to do. You have to start thinking about yourself. Simple as that. You have to be selfish in a sense.

Ask yourself, why do you love your wife. Why do you want to make it work. Is your wife the same person you fell in love with?

Do you really want to be with this person knowing what she did? Is she trying to fix the marriage or situation?

Is this marriage even worth saving? Is your WW worth the fight?

If you have to, write it out and read it to yourself.

Man up, take charge of the situation. You're in the drivers seat. You command where that vehicle goes. Not the passenger. Decide which way you want to go, left or right.

But if the left side has a road block and is flooded, well, you only have 1 option. The sooner you realize this, the better off you will be.

Be strong. Take care of yourself. I know it's easier said than done brother. But think with your head(the one on top of your neck) a bit more, and less with your heart.

As stated by others, do not use divorce as a threat. It really has to happen. You're trying to use it as a form of manipulation. Doing the same thing she's doing. She's manipulating you too.

[This message edited by UneasyFeelings at 12:43 AM, March 24th (Monday)]

WW PA was last summer. I have very little concern the PA is still active. It was a one night stand. The concern is the potential for EAs and in general the online fantasy playing with othet men. I have no evidence it is still occurring but certainly not in a position where our M is protected from it.

It is very apparent my WW killed our M in her heart a year ago when the communications with other men started. I know she is staying to eat cake and a slight sliver that there is hope. Lately her heart has been hardening. I know her well. I believe she is demonizing me and focussing on the negatives (2 percent of M) as a defense mechanism. The couple times she did face the raality of her choices she broke down in tears ashamed

I figured I would file tommorrow but my heart keeps hoping and raising doubts. I cant give you a good reason why i want to be with a wife that cheated. Refuses to invest in R. Does nothing for me. I cant even tell you why I love her. But I do. Is it wrong to delay filing a few weeks until my heart feels strong enough? I began the 180 yesterday. It sucked to not be so wrapped up in her (codependant) but I felt better watching out for my health.

I feel compelled to tell you about my story since they are so similar. Remorseless WW who was a SAHM that had everything provided for her.

I caught her and she sat on the fence and basically rubbed the situation in my face. She didn't know what she wanted to do and I doted on her to try to get her to see my side.

At some point during that time she had to go out of state to visit a sick relative. I couldn't go. I fretted over what might happen and so on. You know what happened when she left? Nothing. My "drama" was gone and I finally had some peace. I realized right then if she walked not only would I be OK but my life would be easier.

When she got back things changed. I wrote up and handed her a list of things and told her "If you do anything on this list you are CHOOSING to be divorced". I laid it all on her. I told her "if you choose it, it's ok, just know it is your choice". "once I file it's over FOREVER". It wasn't an idle threat either I had my lawyers cell phone number. She would have had papers in a matter of hours from my phone call.

Once I did that it the fog was gone. I was willing to walk and she knew it. It wasn't fun and games anymore.

What you don't realize is you have ALL OF THE POWER in this situation. She just has you convinced you don't.

let's be honest, this is what you have to offer

The funniest thing is she has never had to do a thing. Works 10 hours a week for fun money. I pay all bills, grocery shop, cook or buy must dinners....she does no housework. I have been an accomplice in creating this situation of entitlement and privilege.

All she has to offer you is a cheating spouse.

Negotiate accordingly.

You know what keeps me up at night? It isn't the fact of what happened. It's the fact that I went through all of the pain I did and it was completely in my power to stop it.

Thanks Damaged. I am sorry for your pain as well.

You are right 100%. Everyone is on this post. I wish being kind, loving, loyal and giving was enough to make people do the right thing. I can do that all day.

I have set boundries. Transparency and IC only to backpedal when she refused. Last week I told her IC and going back to church is enough. (She again got defensive and refused). I backpedaled again. I could insist on these things again but I already know what the answer will be: refusal and defensiveness.

When I took her out for a nice dinner and show she told me at dinner. I want to be with a man that accepts me for me and won't tell me "i'm angry all the time". I tell my wife nice things all the time. When we argue she gets really angry (bad for a conflict averse person). She is mad a lot. She can't own up t that. Her parents are also pumping her up with "your great he sucks" support as well. Even though they called me "son" for 20 years.

It's hard, so hard to do what's best for me. I just like knowing she's there. The idea of being alone scares me. The idea of starting over scares me. I love being married and sharing my life with a woman (my wife). The idea of the fairy tale ending kills me. Disappointing my children. Losing all my in-laws and the family times. HOW DO I GET PAST IT? How do I know that I know that I know I did everything possible and the M is over?

For me I am determined to either be a better husband for my WW after this if we can R or I will be a better husband for my next wife

Correct attitude

Is it wrong to delay filing a few weeks until my heart feels strong enough?

Wrong attitude!

Your heart won't feel stronger in a week, or a month, unless YOU decide to take control of your future.

Thanks twisted. Agreed ....self enpowerment has been my biggest challenege

(((Justinpaintoday)))

Keep the faith brother.

I sent you a PM.

Busy day so don't have much time to respond and read all of the posts.

I read your responses....I can relate.

I am glad you found SI when you did, I did 6 months AFTER my DD.....horrible, co-dependent choices were made by me during this period.

I had a very unremorseful spouse during the first 12 months.....she found regret earlier....but that was based on loosing her relationship with her AP. Yep, pretty horrible thing to have to accept.

Wife reluctant to MC, refused IC...she thought I was the weak one....and I went along with that charade (f codependency!). Don't allow yourself to do this.

Insist on IC for BOTH of you.....wait for MC. I know it may be scary for you, but right now you are both in it for yourselves. I foolishly thought we were in this battle together at the begining....like you would be if one of you was diagnosed with cancer. Sadly, this is as far from the truth as possible. Our wives very clearly, through their actions, displayed where their desires and allegiances rested.....they have had time to "warm up" to their lot in life while in affair land.....we had no such opportunity. This is why your posts resonated with me so deeply.....you are struggling as I have struggled. Time to post-pone helping your wife....you need IC for yourself. You need it because you are overloaded by this event. You need it because you need to break your part of what I suspect was a destructive cycle within your M pre-A. You need it so that you can tend to your hurts....both that were inflicted by your wife and those you inflicted upon yourself (codependently and subconciously...but you still hurt yourself).

Choose therapist wisely....make sure they are schooled in adultery. It is a unique stress with unique affects on you.

GOOD NEWS!!!! My wife DID find remorse, I accepted and forgave (2 different process's) her, offered R and we started true R about 6-8 months ago. I am 22 months out from DD #1 now.

Keep in mind your wife IS seeing what she can and can't take into her future.....what she can and can't keep alive from your past. The answer is simple.....not much. Same for you.

You did nothing to make her choose adultery, you could not have done anything to keep her from this choice. There were dynamics in place long before your discovery....most likely started in childhood.

I don't come into JFO very often.....because of what happens when I read posts like yours. It brings me back to a very dark place.

I see and feel your state of being. I was there.

You can and will move through this trial just as I have and am doing.

God is with us all.

[This message edited by blakesteele at 9:40 AM, March 24th (Monday)]

BIG NOTE HERE:

There is a time and a place to exercise righteous anger.

When your wife chose and is choosing adultery (reluctance to take responsibility for her sin)....it is a perfect time and place to exercise righteous anger.

A grievous act has and is being committed. It is in direct conflict with Gods commandments...and is strongly disobedient. We are called to expose and defend against this....for our good as well as for the good of the offending party. Ultimately, they have to choose for themselves...but we are absolutely called to expose this for what it is. Righteous anger is a prudent, responsible way to do this.

I point this out through probably too much projection......it took me 2 months of weekly therapy to get in touch with my anger. That is how broken I was, how far I was willing to hang on to my codependent nature.

Peace.

[This message edited by blakesteele at 9:47 AM, March 24th (Monday)]