SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

As others have said you can get a measure of justice by divorcing your wife then giving reconciliation a try. Move back into the family home with your wife and kids after the decree has been issued; she won't have the honor of being your wife, [I mean that sincerely] and you will feel that she to has suffered from her betrayal and that the pain hasn't all been one way.

Respectfully, I don't think this makes much sense. Divorce isn't free, ever. Not to mention, WW doesn't work, so now they'll need to figure out the health insurance, etc. There are tax issues that will cost money as well, including a decrease in the standard deduction (assuming the home is paid for, as it sounds like it is), and the loss of your WW as an exemption, just to name a few. All for what? So a piece of paper isn't there?

SWAT, if you want to divorce, then divorce. If not, then don't. Please do keep in mind that using a divorce as a 'badge of dishonor' and nothing more is costly, confusing to the kids, and in the end, serves zero purpose if you're living together.

As I've said before, if you want to reconcile, then I'm behind you 1000%. If you don't, I'm behind you 1000%. If you want to divorce, and later decide you want to remarry SS17, outstanding. But please remember that marriage is not just a 'romantic display of your affection', but also a legal standing. If the divorce is only to 'teach a lesson', then please give that the full thought it deserves, from both the romantic side AND the legal side.

I'm really pleased you've made another move forward. You sound as if you're in a much better place mentally than you were earlier today, not that you sounded that bad off earlier I can't say it enough - you've shown incredible strength throughout this ordeal. No matter what the outcome, you should be very proud of how you've handled all of this ugliness. There aren't many men that would be as collected and calm as you've been. Your kids are very lucky to have you as a role model.

((((SWAT))))

Hi SWAT,

FWIW, you are still pretty fresh from the 2nd DD and you don't have to make up your mind yet. D/S/R, it doesn't matter, you have a lifetime tie to SS17 and I see you trying to make that work. That is impressive and honorable. I am also completely amazed that you were both able to have your question/answer session. That took guts on both of your parts. That she answered you honestly even knowing that you could walk away and never turn around is beyond impressive. There are many WS that can not and never would take this chance, my xWH included. I never got the honesty, I never got the chance to meet the man he really was and decide if I could love him. My xWH was not brave enough to do what SS17 has done. That is a gift, chose to do with it what you will. I have great hope and faith in you both. Take time, move slow and decide for YOU.

Respectfully, I don't think this makes much sense. Divorce isn't free, ever

I tend to agree with you painful past; its just that some BS's [not suggesting SWAT has this opinion], just can't reconcile without some measure of retribution. They would rather suffer the inconvenience as long as the WS has suffered extreme loss as well. For obvious reasons its more effective in situations involving a WW.

With reconciliation as the goal, some folk take different routes to the same objective. There is a post in JFO where the BS has stated they are willing to consider reconciliation after divorce. Some people need to recover their pride and this is the way they choose to do it.

Swat

I am sending you hugs my friend.

I think dinner once a week is fine if you are up for it.

As to the interrogation, it truly sucks when you see what a wayward person does and acts like to receive validation.

You begin to realize there is nothing you did wrong. There was nothing you could have done better.

The issues lie within SS17. They are hers to fix.

There is nothing wrong with being disappointed with your wife Swat.

She caused a world of hurt to you, your marriage & your family.

But there is also nothing wrong with loving that broken person, sticking with her, being her friend and demanding that she become the woman she once was, the mother she is and the wife she vowed to be.

Demand it Swat!

You deserve it......

HM

one of the best posts I read in the healing library was essentially to slow down - don't do anything drastic for at least 3 months

You will be dealing with your WW for the rest of your life regardless of your feelings because there are children involved.

Same here for me so i am just passing along what I am working on but here said better by happyman

But there is also nothing wrong with loving that broken person, sticking with her, being her friend and demanding that she become the woman she once was, the mother she is and the wife she vowed to be.

I also like how my cross country coach told me to "attack" a hill = you look two feet in front of you and pump your legs like hell. Don't look at the top of the hill or you will psych yourself out

From my army days, seems like you got KISS down = you got out of the kill zone. Got into a safer space.

Dinner and lots and lots and lots (did I mention lots) of more honest even if painful emotionally conversations will hopefully allow you all to rebuild your emotional intimacy with one another

one day at a time and yes... keep watching

only trust actions

time will bear out enough fruit for you to be able to make bigger decisions like D or genuine forgiveness and R much much later

they say the average here is 2 to 5

but hey, it's the journey that matters

so focus on being the best you throughout

you deserve nothing less

Thanks everyone.

Happyman thanks for understanding. I do love her but not who she has been.

Merida, I fully expect lots and lots of conversations and they likely aren't going to be pretty. I honestly just need her to put all of her cards on the table.

I believe everyone has a right to earn respect and a chance to redeem themselves. They don't deserve it you earn it. When you screw up you admit it and take your punishment. I've been called on the carpet for lots of things while in the military and at work. I've admitted my mistakes and took my lumps when appropriate. I've never once had someone say they don't respect that.

I'm not looking for retribution or to punish her. That isn't going to accomplish anything. I'm just going to have to tread lightly and watch for changes in her behavior.

Hi Swat,

I have been following your story from the beginning but this is my first time posting.

It seems to me you need absolute certainty that you have the whole truth.

WW says she will do whatever it takes to win back your affection. So why don't you make her take a lie detector test?

So the hits keep on coming. Sort of anyway. WW asks to talk briefly before I have to work. Seems she now recalls having four EA's. I'll give her credit she just spit it all out and seemed to be remorseful. I think she was in a panic and thought I would be angry.

I don't think she realized I knew this. WW has had "friends" on the Internet for years. I'm sure I mentioned she never deletes anything. So yeah I knew about the conversations. Never confronted her about it because at the time I didn't ever think I had to worry about it.

So when I said "I know" she was shocked and asked why I didn't say anything before. My only reply was "why do you think I asked you several times if you had ever cheated on me before? I was pretty specific about the time frame so I thought you would figure if out. I admitted to her that before it wouldn't have mattered since I trusted her. I told her I appreciated her honesty but I had to go. So here I am three hours later sitting in a parking lot thinking "Really your just thinking about this now"

Sometimes I just wonder why people really bother at all.

she's obviously had wayward behaviors and thoughts. She finally figured out how screwed up this was and instead of ignoring it or hiding it or minimizing it she went straight to you and confessed. I think this is a good sign.

I'm seeing a "no excuses" approach to her cleaning things up. She's obviously starting to recognize her lack of boundaries and discovering her path of betrayal goes beyond OM.

It's tough for a betrayed spouse to be a "confessional" but at the same time, you get to track how serious she is about cleaning up EVERYTHING by her recognizing on her own her path to breaking your heart. She's not just journaling and keeping this private; she's humbling herself, and letting you know as she grows.

If she keeps at it, she'll remember her first willful act of selfishness that probably goes back to her childhood, and have some amends to make there too.

Just be careful about allowing yourself to be a "confess and release" kind of receptacle, where she feels better but you're stuck holding the garbage to process. What I mean by that is if she turns back into a careless repeat offender on the selfish stuff. My WH took that road for a while, and it was so painful.

I agree with mike - this is a good thing. Almost all couples have similar realizations after dday. I realized I had been deceptive about and minimizing a relationship I had (before my H and I met, and right at the beginning) for 20 years, after dday. I had lied to myself about it, thinking I was protecting my husband.

She is talking, being vulnerable, and telling the truth. All good signs that she is remorseful and trying to be a good candidate for reconciliation.

I have tended to be suspicious of her all along. But it does seem that in this case that she put honesty, your right to know, and total transparency above her own self preservation and trying in any way to salvage her marriage. Hats off to her for this one.

I give your wife props for coming clean. I think she is really beginning to realize how self focused she was and that she needs to change her ways. I'm glad she's on SI getting help and I think it's what is helping her wake up and see what she's been doing .

I'm pulling for both of you but realize you both have a long tough road ahead. Giving you both lots of support and strength.

While everyone is hopping on the reconciliation bandwagon, and the recent ADMISSION of his WW is better than her continued lying, let's all remember a few things and most importantly, that SWAT is doing EXACTLY what is needed - detaching and watching.

First, SWAT already knew about her "friends." This is not her revealing anything he did not know.

Second, she is holding onto her affair. She still needs her fix of the OM. While it is old news that she lied to and about SWAT, had sex with OM, kept seeing him after exposure, held onto her disgusting journal, and all that. What SWAT has to deal with is that she is not mentally free of OM. She knows she has OM on a string and while she is not happy about facing consequences for it, she shows signs of still clinging to her need for drama and the ego kibbles she gets from OM's undying adoration/bunny boiling behavior. I expect that SWAT has or will uncover yet another keepsake from the OM that his WW fondly retains. And then we will hear that she "forgot" about it like she had to see OM one more time to ask him to stay away or forgot about her lie-filled journal, or....

The one thing SWAT needs is time in a detached atmosphere to see if she can get healthy. Right now, SWAT knows she is anything but healthy and safe.

Only with time, SWAT will be to one to judge if she is really is moving towards being a safe partner. And the best way for him to assess this is maintain the course of divorce. Either she really will do whatever it is takes to make it up to him (however grand gestures from her have proven to be nothing more than feeding her need for drama) or she will return to the selfish, entitled, and lying person she was.

Calling for him to stop the divorce and go back to her for reconciliation seems absolutely contraindicated at this point. The one thing in all this that is clear is that she is ONLY looking at her behaviors (and possibly changing) because of the firm actions that SWAT has taken.

SWAT holds the cards now. He doesn't want her money. He finds what she did and her treatment of him abhorrent and he has detached. He is watching the possibility of her changing. And he is caring for his kids.

SWAT, you are handling this like a man. Stay the course. And realize that no matter what is stated on this board, everyone wishes the best for you.

Recognizing a problem and admitting a problem are only two steps. The hardest part is effecting permanent change. That's what SWAT has to look for.

Other people have commented on the alcoholic who wakes up hung over, realizes he has to stop drinking, swears to others he'll stop drinking, feels better until he thinks a little,drink can't possibly hurt. You know this aphorism as others have used it here.

I'm sure SWAT has done surveillance work before. He's doing it now. He doesn't have to decide today, tomorrow or next month. He's waiting for her to do her own version of the 180 - change behaviors and reactions she's developed for her whole life. That isn't easy or guaranteed.

There's a big gap in your timeline that you haven't address and was wondering if you could.

Your injury while at work was in May'13(the day she was with OM)....your dday was February14. That's 9 months!!! You claim she was the "model wife" during this time........was she really?

Considering all the lies, broken NC, texts, emails, meetings, PO violations that have happen since dday......do you still feel she was the "model wife" during that time?

Look, I'm not trying to stir shit up.....but I find it completely suspicious that your WW just stopped all contact with POSOM during this time, considering what has transpired since your Dday.

I admitted to her that before it wouldn't have mattered since I trusted her.

And now there is no more blind trust, right? That's what we BS come to terms with from this point forward, and it sucks. Personally, I wouldn't want to be a babysitter for my spouse for years to come. But it really depends on if the WS starts to "own" the A, their "shit", and its consequences before you feel a tiny bit safe on the notion that the WS finally "gets it" as to what they've done. Some of us have an WS who isn't even at that level yet. Shit, my XW hasn't even apologized at all for her A's. Even after the D was final. She is still in denial despite all the evidence I have. I don't envy you here SWAT. My XW made my decision really easy for me to D. SS17 is actually doing some work here for herself and it's going to fluster you for a bit.

Sometimes I just wonder why people really bother at all.

Well, at the very least hopefully you might get a "why" out of all this effort whether you both change to R or finalize with D. The direction SS17 is taking, the path of owning it, "appears" correct. It's just now a matter of the work she needs to continue to do. It's all about the actions now and quite frankly what you will conclude from your observations.

I give her credit for coming to you about those "friends" and recognizing them as EA's, finally. So what is she going to do about it now? All I can say is that "social media" apps were never a necessity for survival of the human race. But it sure as hell is an enabler and pacifier for the broken.

So sorry (((SWAT))))

Ask yourself, what made you ignore that stuff back then? The flirting online and EAs. I know you said you trusted her, and I believe you, but this is something to really look into about yourself. It's something I think common with us BS, we see certain things but simply don't want to believe it. Do your own work here, be careful not to be totally focused on her work. Are you sure you had the wife, marriage and life you thought? What else did you see but ignore? This is something that's so hard for us BS, we are not at fault for trusting, but it's a real hammer to realize our marriages were maybe not what we thought.

Again, I cant believe this was truly 'forgotten' as usual. It appears you asked very specific questions pertaining to these EAs, and I assume were lied to? until another "revelation"? I could see perhaps her kind of forgetting it if you were focusing more on discussing OM specifically, but the fact that you lead the questioning to this specifically, idk, I just don't know. It is common for WS (and liars in general) to be very savvy about admitting only what you ask. Example "did you talk to OM today?" "No". Then you find out they texted, "but you didn't ask if I texted, you asked if I talked!! I didn't lie!"

You are doing good SWAT. watch and wait, in the meantime, don't forget to live yourself and focus on yourself. It's really easy to get focused on untangling the A mess and therefore focusing totally on the WS. I have often felt like "oh here we go, WH is getting all the attention again", when we talk about his behavior or all the questions are for him to answer, he's got my full attention trying to figure him out, etc.

So when I said "I know" she was shocked and asked why I didn't say anything before. My only reply was "why do you think I asked you several times if you had ever cheated on me before? I was pretty specific about the time frame so I thought you would figure if out. I admitted to her that before it wouldn't have mattered since I trusted her. I told her I appreciated her honesty but I had to go. So here I am three hours later sitting in a parking lot thinking "Really your just thinking about this now"

To the last question: No, sadly. You asked, several times, and even gave the timeframe. She probably didn't/doesn't think of these things as EAs, but after thinking over and over about your conversation, realized you did, and BAM - revelation (or, as some would say, credit for an admission).

I don't think she was 'lying', per se, but I do think she knew what you were getting at and is after credit for being 'open and honest'.

SWAT, you probably know the real truth - we're all just speculating - but your WW is extremely manipulative, and while I believe she wants you back and isn't interested in OM, I do think she's still somewhat playing a game, hoping to 'win' by getting you back. I don't yet see any 'fixing her shit' happening. Again, you know more than I or anyone else here as you know her, but as an observer, that's my take on her actions.

Does this mean it's hopeless? Nope. You're in the driver's seat, and you're watching for changes. That's really all you can do right now anyway.

(((((SWAT)))))

Toby. Absolutely not she was no where near being a model wife. It appeared that way at first. That may have been one of my first posts here. Her affair started early that year as mostly an EA. She got up the nerve to cross the line. Then I got hurt. I think she really panicked and broke it off. I believe that was the last sexual encounter they had. Did they still communicate, yes according to her time line and messages I found.