SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

As a rule I see immense positives when a WS feels a need to confess.

It shows that they realize their actions were wrong and that they cant go on with that albatross around their necks. The way I see it a marriage can’t be “complete” if such great burdens aren’t dealt with. Your marriage can survive the infidelity but it won’t prosper with secrecy.

I don’t want to jump on the too-drunk-to-prevent-it bandwagon right away but your description of your brother isn’t really endearing him to us. Would he be the sort of guy to slip a date-rape drug into your wife’s beer? Her description of what took place meets that pattern.

Her reaction too fits that type of rape too.

What’s suspicious in the story (well… a LOT is suspicious) but what I noted is that you went to sleep but the three of them staid on drinking. Where was his wife when this happened? Why did your wife and your brother decide to remain when/if she left? If your brother slipped her a roofie then he would hang around waiting for it to kick in.

If that’s the case then this isn’t infidelity but rape. Your wife couldn’t have prevented it no more than a man had held her down at gunpoint.

But then… just maybe she got drunk and had an affair.

There are many reasons she may have kept it and many reasons for now saying it. Work it out in front of a counselor.

Bigger

In my opinion she got drunk and had an affair which is what she is basically saying. The blackouts etc based on her account still lead to a feeling she had sex with my brother. She's confident they had sex therefore that's the facts I tend to go with.

Cheating with my brother puts her in a bracket beyond was it one guy or ten, being my brother is like something worse than a thousand men.

Bigger

In my opinion she got drunk and had an affair which is what she is basically saying. The blackouts etc based on her account still lead to a feeling she had sex with my brother. She's confident they had sex therefore that's the facts I tend to go with.

Cheating with my brother puts her in a bracket beyond was it one guy or ten, being my brother is like something worse than a thousand men.

I would feel the same way.

Not much else to say.

I'm confused and don't understand why no one has addressed this. If it is considered rape to have sex with someone who is extremely intoxicated because they cannot rationally consent, how is this not rape? Even if she says she thinks she may have had a part in it, if she was so intoxicated that she blacked out, she was raped. Can someone please explain to me why this is not even being considered?

I'm confused and don't understand why no one has addressed this. If it is considered rape to have sex with someone who is extremely intoxicated because they cannot rationally consent, how is this not rape? Even if she says she thinks she may have had a part in it, if she was so intoxicated that she blacked out, she was raped. Can someone please explain to me why this is not even being considered?

People are considering it, but they are also considering that his wife is lying and/or minimalizing. Did she black out and he raped her (rape), or was she drunk and f*cked him (not rape)? Is the alcohol / drunk part just an excuse for cheating?

People are considering it

I don't see that. Just read the title of this thread. "My wife Had Sex with My Brother," not "Did My Wife Cheat or Was She Raped?" I see 1 or 2 other people who have mentioned it as an afterthought, a footnote, but most are not truly considering it as a possibility. Most are going to straight to her cheating.

I think the rape issue should be addressed first. Assume she was raped and do all you can to confirm that. If she did actually cheat, the truth about that will come out and no more damage will be done. However, if she was raped but her husband continues to act as if she was responsible, irreparable damage may be done to her and them. If your daughter came to you and told you that she got really drunk one night and vaguely remembers Uncle Bob on top of her and woke up the next day feeling like she had had sex, would you even consider that she had consented?

The fact that everyone admits they were very intoxicated means that, legally, she was raped. Legally, she could not consent (even if she did consent or not attempt to stop it). Seems to me that, if she got so intoxicated that she doesn't even know what happened, the excessive drinking needs to be addressed. Has she maybe come forward with this information now because she has realized she has/had a drinking problem and this is part of her recovery from that? There seems to be a lot more to this than just the drunken sex.

The fact that everyone admits they were very intoxicated means that, legally, she was raped.

Unless I am missing something, this is not true. Neither of them may have been able to consent. Does that mean that the brother was raped?

I am not taking sides. I agree with coco that more investigating needs to be done. The drinking absolutely needs to be addressed. But at this point, until information is revealed to show contradiction/confirmation, the fact is that she believes that she had sex with CP's brother...and CP is in excruciating pain.

Unless I am missing something, this is not true. Neither of them may have been able to consent. Does that mean that the brother was raped?

Actually, I've been wondering this myself. I guess it would depend on who was more intoxicated and who the aggressor was, if there was one. Although, most men have trouble getting and keeping an erection when extremely intoxicated, so I don't know how likely it is that a woman could rape a man in such a state.

I understand the pain. Either way, CP, you have been betrayed. The only thing you know for sure that you were betrayed by your brother, assuming that some sort of sex occurred at all. I'm not questioning that it did, but since the brother denied it, you have only your wife's word to go by. To what extent the betrayal, not sure yet. If it was drunken sex and his wife betrayed him, too, that's one thing. However, if his brother assaulted (raped) his wife, that is an entirely different situation. Has the brother's wife been asked about this at all?

[This message edited by cocoplus5nuts at 12:46 PM, February 21st (Saturday)]

Also, she says she vaguely remembers the brother being on top of her. That would make him the aggressor, at least in that moment.

She says all she remembers is falling while getting a beer and my brother helping her up. Then she wakes up to a vision of him on top of her and the feeling the next day that they had sex.

Assuming this is true, this is absolutely the brother raping the wife. She fell. She either blacked out or passed out. She woke to him on top of her. She was completely out of it, but he was aware enough to "help" her. That is rape, people!

I read this when first posted and have to say, it does not seem like cheating to me. The way OPs wife describes it and the feelings she had, are exactly how date rape and victims of sexual assaults have felt. In many cases it's only after immediately reporting to police that the woman can confirm sexual intercourse actually took place, following the use of special kits to test for semen.

I say this assuming that your wife is telling the truth. Please try and be supportive of her and not accusatory. She probably tried to suppress the memories of the incident, but finds it hard to shake of, especially as your brother is a constant reminder.

I really think your brother is the one in the wrong here. If your wife hasn't already, I think counselling would be a good idea for her.

I honestly don't believe this is infidelity.

She was completely out of it, but he was aware enough to "help" her. That is rape, people!

I really don't want to jump to any conclusions with such little information, but it is the 6 year lapse in time from incident to confession that concerns me.

I don't want to minimize anything...especially the trauma of rape. I also understand trying to suppress. But what I don't understand, is that she wasn't a victim of regular abuse by her BIL, so if this was rape, why did she continue with her regular behavior...especially with the BIL and his wife? I haven't heard mention that all of this came out in IC. Does she go to regular counseling, and if so, did it start after this incident?

Or is it the real possibility that she had drunken sex with her BIL?

The most surprising thing to me is that we have this truism on JFO; cheaters always lie. Called damage control; the WS wants the minimum pain and misery for both parties, so the truth is the first casualty, yet most posts on this thread seem to accept her statement that it was non-consensual sex.

Whats happened to your cynicism guys. She's lying! the story just doesn't make sense.

It was probably a short affair and now all was about to be revealed so she blabs; after 6 years. Look at her behavior after the 'rape'. She didn't exactly avoid the brother and given she's a flirt anyway, whats the most likely version of the truth?

Had she come forward within a reasonable amount of time..not SIX YEARS later..then, ok, it would be reasonable to believe she was raped.

However, her behavior towards the man some of you want to call a rapist makes her story more than unbelievable.

why if that was the case would she still want to hang out with them and go on vacations etc with someone that could do that. One night on the way home after she worked third shift she saw my brother and sister in law pulled over by the police.

She chooses to go on vacations with her rapist? She chooses to put herself in a situation where she will be alone with her rapist? Her drunk rapist?

And she has had boundary issues in the past..

She has been flirty with guys

There was a neighbor of ours that clearly liked her and drove a motorcycle. She and I had discussion about him and that she should tone it down as he's really into her. What does she do but ask to There was a neighbor of ours that clearly liked her and drove a motorcycle. She and I had discussion about him and that she should tone it down as he's really into her. What does she do but ask to take a ride on his motorcycle a week later.take a ride on his motorcycle a week later.

And then there is this...

She has lied in the past about a few big things

It may have been rape. But her behavior in the last 6 years says otherwise. Partying, going on vacation, and putting yourself in a vulnerable postion with the drunk man who raped you?

That is not the behavior of a woman who was raped.

I think she is lying. I thin k she had sex with him willingly. This is by far not the first time a BH has shown up her with a "rape" story.

Polygraph.

If she is telling the truth, she will jump at the chance.

Or..tell her it's time to go to the police station and file charges.

I bet she comes up with a million excuses why she can't do that.

I would do some investigating. Im betting she has had sex with him more than once over the last several years...willingly. Maybe he threatened to out their affair, so she came up with this rape story..from 6 years ago.

[This message edited by confused615 at 10:23 AM, February 22nd (Sunday)]

Former cop here that (at the time) specialized in domestic abuse – including sexual crimes.

Based on the VERY scant info we have I was thinking possible date-rape drugs. A LOT of the symptoms are in line with rape victim mentality.

But it’s ONLY an opinion based on the VERY scant info offered.

Let’s put it this way… If I had heard this story the day after I would have gotten out my rape-kit and ordered the blood samples to test for the most common rape-drugs. Granted I would also check on blood alcohol and question her about her drinking habits and patterns…

[But then… the long time since the event to admission is one of the key elements in making this sound like rape. This is VERY COMMON – the RULE rather than the exception.]

If this was alcohol-induced blackout sex then this is plain and simple infidelity and the way forward is through dealing with infidelity.

But…

IF this was rape…

Then dealing with it as if it was infidelity won’t work…

I for one don’t accept the “I was too drunk” excuse. Nor do I accept a blackout excuse. I have this theory that there is ALWAYS a moment a person can decide to not go on. But IF she was drugged she wasn’t capable of reaching that moment.

I asked you a question you haven’t answered:

Would he be the sort of guy to slip a date-rape drug into your wife’s beer?

Forgot to add:

A poly where you ask a direct question like

“Have you had more than one sexual encounter with [name of brother]”

Would be an ideal way of getting the scope of what took place.

First off, please notice that I started my comment with, "Assuming this is true,..." She could be lying. I don't know.

But what I don't understand, is that she wasn't a victim of regular abuse by her BIL, so if this was rape, why did she continue with her regular behavior...especially with the BIL and his wife?

It is very possible that she didn't/doesn't realize it was rape. She may think she is responsible because she got so intoxicated. A lot of people, including victims, believe that still. That's part of the misogynistic rape culture we live in, blaming the victim. If that's the case, she would want to continue the facade that everything was fine. Also, we don't know she wasn't the subject of threats from the BIL.

I don't know why she brought it up now. That's something that CP needs to find out. All I'm saying is that he needs to tread lightly here.

Despite everything else, the scenario described is that of a rape, plane and simple. The more I think about it, the more I really wonder why people are questioning her behavior. It is very typical for rape victims. How can you all not know that?

Many (if not most) rape victims never tell anyone. Many continue to live and work near their rapists. Anyone who pays any attention to recent information about rape victims knows this. I find if very disturbing that so many of you don't seem to realize that.

Despite everything else, the scenario described is that of a rape, plane and simple.

It most absolutely is not. And I don't care how much case law that there is on this, a person is responsible for their level of drinking. I do believe that the "own your shit" applies to alcoholics...just as it does to waywards, gamblers, or *insert vice here*.

My brother was too drunk to drive when he got in an accident, and his good friend was killed. The alcohol impaired his judgement---where is his responsibility?

Right where it belongs...on him. Just as it is on CP's WW, if she was not drugged. The bottom line, is that CP is going to have to dig for the truth.