SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Welcome to the club no one wants to find themselves belonging to.

I don’t recall see whether your wife is in IC. If not, you need to get her there ASAP. Try to find a therapist well versed in dealing with infidelity.

You need to realize you are only 2 weeks out from DDay and your wife is still deep in the fog. Please understand that her feelings for the OM have been clouded by the thrill of illicit sex and that thrill was enhanced by having sex in a very high risk location, namely the classroom. Discovery would have ended their teaching careers. That she is saying she is still in love with OM is not all that unusual 2 weeks out although it is very painful to hear.

At this point, your biggest problem is them working together and not having NC. This is just as big a problem for OM’s wife. Ideally you don’t want the wayward even visually seeing one another let alone actually interacting. You and OM’s wife need to talk with your spouses to see how they can avoid one another and then compare notes. Obviously the permanent solution is for one of them to quit. If they are being assigned projects together by administration then one of them needs to request to be reassigned.

You need to realize that this A is 100% on your wife and that you did not contribute to her having the A. You very well may have contributed to the problems and stress in the marriage. No marriage is perfect and some are a lot less perfect than others. The solution is communication or counseling or even divorce but not an A!

Know that your thoughts and emotions will go through wild fluctuations and that this is going to be your new normal. However over time it will slowly get better.

Please try to keep yourself healthy. Eat, drink lots of water, avoid alcohol, talk to your physician if you are having problems sleeping. Read in the healing Library and come here with questions or just to vent. We are here for you.

WS wants to die, not commit suicide, just die so WS does not have to face these emotions of love, betrayal, guilt, etc. This in turn makes me feel sad that WS feels this way, and I want to try to comfort WS. I start to think that I am capable of passing over my own emotions and feelings in this matter in order to make WS feel better and have everything return to “normal.” Please help.

She's quite the little manipulator, isn't she?

As far as communicating with the OM's wife on FB, I think you should talk on the phone with her. There's a 50/50 chance the person whose been writing to you is NOT his wife, but him pretending to be her. It's HAPPENED many times. Please call her to make SURE it's her you've been writing back and forth with.

Lastly, being passive will get you steamrolled, and when you're more concerned about HER feelings than your own, that means you're being passive.

Time to take control.

You have gotten some EXCELLENT advice here. Please please please do not put the cart before the horse. You can decide that the end result you WANT is reconciliation, but reconciliation is a group act, and more often than not, the way for a betrayed spouse to GET reconciliation is to play hardball now.

She does not get to come home, to start marriage counseling, to accept any motion of reconciliation from you while she is STILL in infidelity. And she is still in infidelity. She has refused to establish No Contact. She has refused to change her job She has refused to do anything. You cannot reconcile with that person, as they are not reconciling with you.

I spent months and months in limbo, thinking I was working toward reconciliation with a person who wasn't actually doing the work. Trust me, it is the most crazy making thing you can do. For two months, he refused to establish NC, and so we wasted hundreds of dollars on marriage counseling that consisted of me talking about my feelings and trying to make things right, and him having his cake and eating it too. For many more months, while I was in IC dealing with my trauma, he took it to mean I was in IC trying to come to grips with the idea that he should be allowed to continue his affair.

I second what another poster said about getting verification from the wife. My husband and his AP also concocted a bullshit story about the OBS. And since it was a long distance relationship it was MUCH harder for me to get to the OBS. You guys clearly live in the same town and have met before. At least talk to her on the phone. Meeting her in person is better. Go to her place of work if that's what it takes.

You can WANT to reconcile, but you cannot reconcile until she is OUT of infidelity. Yes, it's hard. Yes, you feel sympathy for how broken hearted she is. My husband used to wake me up and night crying about how much he missed his AP. It was so hard for me to watch someone I loved cry and be so heartbroken. But as hard as it was, it was better for me to say that I did not accept infidelity.

Just as she is watching YOU be heartbroken and not caring, YOU have to not care that she is heartbroken that she has to break up with her lover. Stay Strong. You deserve more than some stingy love. You deserve more than some woman who "can't decide" who she loves best. You are her husband and the father of her children. If she can't see what she owes you, then she doesn't deserve you.

Repeat that over and over. Be strong. Be tough. Do NOT accept her fog. Do not move toward reconciliation until there is something to reconcile.

Hi. I'm sorry you're faced with this, but it's great you found this site. You'll get lots of advice here, mostly good, take what you want and ignore the rest. The advice you've received thus far is very good.

Having said that, here's some of my advice&questions, some of which have already been posted by others:

1. Go see a GOOD lawyer IMMEDIATELY! Don't let her know you've been to see one. Just so you know your options.

2. Go buy a VAR (voice activated recorder) or a GoPro thingy immediately and use it to record all your interactions with her. She might try to falsely accuse you of domestic violence to the police. Better safe than sorry, and there have been betrayed husbands here who were hit with false DV charges. I know you probably think she wouldn't do that, but considering her cheating you don't know her as well as you did. As all of us who were betrayed thought (wrongly) we knew our partners. Another option is to ask a friend with you to stay with you guys for a while to lower the tensions, reduce the chances of false DV charges etc.

3. Start documenting your and her care for the kids immediately. I recommend you be as detailed as possible, and I recommend you send the details of the day every day to a good friend of yours or to an alternate e-mail account so you will have time-stamped proof in case of a custody battle. Hopefully you won't need it, but you migt.

4. You mentioned being in counselling already. That's great! Is he/she experienced in infidelity or PTSD?

5. Go see your doctor about STD testing. Be aware that if you have sex with her in a moment of weakness, you risk getting an STD and/or getting her pregnant.

6. Continue to confide in your friends&family about this. You need and deserve their support.

7. Make sure you eat, sleep and exercise as much as possible. If you're having trouble, talk to your doctor or a pharmacist. DO NOT DRINK ALCOHOL. It's way too easy to spiral out of control. I stopped myself quite close to becoming an alcoholic in the aftermath of it all.

8. Google "No more mr. nice guy pdf", it's a great book available online for free that might be a source of great strength and self-esteem for you, as it was for me. Also, google "Codependent no more pdf", also available online for free. Another great book to read on this topic is "Married man sex life primer", I'd recommend you go to the library and get a copy of it.

9. Go to the "I can relate" subforum here and check out the "Betrayed menz" thread on the first page. Read and post there.

10. If you will continue to give her yet another chance, she needs to go to IC at least for a month before you two even consider MC together. I recommend YOU find a good IC for HER, one that you will know has a no-nonsense approach to infidelity (knows that cheating is 100% cheater's fault,...) and go to her first session with her to make sure the counsellor knows all about the cheating. Only after that should you try MC with her.

Furthermore, google "How to help your spouse heal linda macdonald pdf", it's a great book available online for free that might help you two tremendously. Read it on your own at first.

12. I think it's important that you tell her that as a condition for you to attempt to reconcile with her is for her to write you a detailed timeline of the affair(s). Upon telling her, notify her you'll want her to undertake a polygraph test afterwards to ascertain you have the full truth.

13. What was her and your childhood/youth like? Please, google "Toxic parents pdf", it's a great book available online for free. Also, check out "Families and how to survive them", it opened my eyes on the topic of childhood issues and how they connect to adult relationships.

14. A phrase that I've heard a lot here and with which I agree is that you must be willing to lose the marriage(relationship) to save it. You mustn't think of her as the prize and you mustn't approach this from a position of weakness, of you trying to win her back by being nice etc. You must get therapy, you must get into the mindset that you will be ok even if you divorce and that you will not settle for rugsweeping or anything less than her being fully remorseful and committed to redeeming herself and helping you heal.

15. If she continues to have (non-professional) contact with him despite you demanding she stops, and if you'll want to stop the affair, SERVE HER WITH DIVORCE PAPERS. Remember, even if you serve her, you can always stop the divorce later if she proves remorseful etc. But it's a good wake-up call for the cheater that very often works.

16. Yes, it would be extremely hard to not see the kids every day and it would be hard on the kids. However, it is much better for the kids to not see you everyday if that means that they won't grow up in a toxic household due to their mom's cheating, disrespect,..., where their dad is being destroyed emotionally due to their mom's actions. What the kids need to grow up emotionally happy, mature and strong young adults is to have at least a part of their lives emotionally healthy and safe (i.e. the days they will spend with you), to have at least one parent (i.e. you) emotionally stable and healthy (and you can't be that if you remain with a cheating, unremorseful spouse) and to have access to a good children's therapist (it's up to you to get them to see a good therapist). Please, consult a good therapist for kids to hear his/her opinion before you decide to stay married to her because of the kids.

17. You DON'T HAVE TO DECIDE RIGHT NOW whether to give her another chance or not. That decision can wait for quite some time (but make sure waiting to make the decision doesn't hurt you legally, financially, physically/health-wise,... -> talk to your lawyer etc.). Remember, even if you start the divorce proceedings, you can stop them. And even if you finish the divorce proceedings, you can still reconcile with her despite divorcing her. If she's truly remorseful, she will be desperate to get you back even if you divorce her. And if she'll be willing to stay without you despite the divorce, it will be a good sign she's doing that not because she wants the financial,..., security of the marriage, but because of you. So again, no need to make quick decision.

Also, like others have said, it's a roller-coaster, being cheated on. It's one of the most shocking and traumatic things you'll ever experience in life. It is perfectly understandble to be dazed and confused from all this, to not know what exactly to do, to feel one thing one moment and another the next moment. As time goes by and you work on healing yourself, things will get considerably better.

What's crucial is that you don't make any really bad decisions in this first stage of being totally mentally fuc-ed up, like getting her pregnant, getting an STD, you cheating on her with someone else and thereby demeaning yourself, you becoming an alocoholic, crashing a car, beating him up and ending in jail etc.

18. Most of all, keep talking to us, the more you talk to us, the more we can help you and support you!

Best wishes

[This message edited by HobbesTheTiger at 7:08 AM, January 18th (Monday)]

I agree with the others R can not happen if they still work together.

Sorry you are here. You have gotten great advice. Remember - this is not your fault, you were not the cause, she is broken and you can't fix her, she has to work to fix herself.

You can take care of yourself and your kids. Those kids know something is going on. You should look into getting them IC help too, mention "family issues" to their teachers so they can give you a heads up if they see any changes in the kids.

Please don't have sex with her again until you both have STD testing. It might protect you and any women you have sex with in the future if this does not work out.

Plus - I agree with those who say it won't work if they continue to work together, too much history, too much temptation.

I am with the others who say that R is going to tough if not impossible with her working with op. Th thing is, I live in Pennsylvania, and I know the job market for teachers. In our district, when a position comes available, they will have 200 teachers apply for it.

She is in the fog. File for D and it will knock her out of it.

Everyone is telling me that R cannot happen if they are still allowed to see each other, even if it is on a professional basis. I COMPLETELY agree. She needs to find another job ASAP. However, jobs in the teaching profession are not plentiful, nor are they available now, during the middle of the school year. Best possible scenario for her find a new job is for something to open up for the next school year, which means that she will be around him in the old job for the next 6 months until summer vacation.

Our family cannot survive financially if she quits her job right now. A transfer within the district will probably not work either because there has to be an internal position available for her to transfer to, which there isn't (I checked). I know it would be stupid to say I will trust her to avoid all but the most necessary contact, but because of the situations above, can I/should I deal with this professional-only contact out of necessity, for now? Believe me, if it wasn't necessary because of financial reasons, I would have insisted she quit her job already.

Given all this, what advice do you all give?

marie2792 nailed it in post 2 in this thread.

The first thing you have to do is stop the self blame.

Your WW betrayed you, and has shown no remorse. She in fact, as you said, loves this guy more than you.

Protect the kids, you stay in the house, she needs to stay out. Keep your IC going.

I would file papers, seek custody and in a separation agreement, make sure she contributes towards the household. Then sit back and watch what she does from there. Does she come home ? How do you know she has ended all contact ? Has she made an effort to change jobs ?

As Neveragain said, don't be passive. be aggressive. This is war and your WW is not your friend and not your ally. Your future and your kids future is predicated on what you do from here

and don't just say 'you wish she would have only had just a physical relationship with him'. Maybe both is worse but you would still be here and in distress with the mind movies playing. Remember, it's never 'just sex'.

Everyone is telling me that R cannot happen if they are still allowed to see each other, even if it is on a professional basis. I COMPLETELY agree. She needs to find another job ASAP. However, jobs in the teaching profession are not plentiful, nor are they available now, during the middle of the school year. Best possible scenario for her find a new job is for something to open up for the next school year, which means that she will be around him in the old job for the next 6 months until summer vacation.

Our family cannot survive financially if she quits her job right now. A transfer within the district will probably not work either because there has to be an internal position available for her to transfer to, which there isn't (I checked). I know it would be stupid to say I will trust her to avoid all but the most necessary contact, but because of the situations above, can I/should I deal with this professional-only contact out of necessity, for now? Believe me, if it wasn't necessary because of financial reasons, I would have insisted she quit her job already.

Given all this, what advice do you all give?

I understand all of this. I do. Trust me.

First, your family will not survive if they keep working together. It is what it is. Either she quits, or OM quits. You're playing with fire any other way.

If it was me, I'd push the OM into quitting as much as possible through the OBS, and through the school. I understand not wanting it in the papers. I do. It can be done without news getting out. Speak to the school admin.

It sucks. Consequences.

If you want to save your marriage, someone has to leave their job. I hope it is the OM. Your family cannot survive with them working together, as you've just found out.

Next. THIS IS NOT YOUR FAULT IN ANY WAY SHAPE OR FORM!!!

Good luck, PA. Keep posting. We care and we're here for you man.

Hi.

First of all, a thought outside the box -> would be possible for her to talk to teachers in other schools in the district if any of them is looking for/willing to also change schools, so they could perhaps swap positions? Maybe she could ask people in school that she trusts to help her ask around. Do you have any friends that could help get her a job in some similar profession, profession where she'd be suited?

Secondly, is there any way for you guys to reduce the living costs? I know it's hard, but could you do it? If necessary, could you survive for 6 months on your paycheck, loan against both of your retirements AND her working a minimum wage job for the 6 months plus tutoring on the side for kids needing help in school, plus maybe help from parents or other relatives?

Thirdly, like others have said, think about getting the OM to quit the job. I would, as a member of the legal profession, never suggest using any illegal tactics! However, there's many, many, many, ..., many ways of explaining to him how you will, completely legally, make his life utterly miserable where he'll wish he had taken you up on your "offer" to leave him alone to sort things out with his informed OBS, in exchange for him quitting the job. Now, I won't go into details because it might be against the guidelines of the forum, but I'm sure any competent lawyer might help you figure things out. Again, be careful to not do anything illegal, because you mustn't end up in jail, for your kids' sake. But use your imagination and your lawyer's to think of a few ways how you could take legal vengeance on OM. Then, talk to him, present him with a sample of what you'll, LEGALLY, do to him unless he quits his job in a couple of days/weeks.

So much for now. We're here for you! Bro-hugs and best wishes

[This message edited by HobbesTheTiger at 2:34 PM, January 18th (Monday)]

Given all this, what advice do you all give?

Sometimes the circumstances of life just makes things difficult. In my case, the OM was a neighbor, our kids were in the same school, etc. The ultimate solution was to move, but that takes time. So we had to work through what the boundaries would be and how we would make things work on a temporary basis. However, all of that presupposed one thing -- that my wife was remorseful and was a candidate for reconciliation.

Your wife needs to keep her job for now. That is a given. But is she a candidate for reconciliation?

If she is, you can try to work through the logistics of how her job works out. Will she search for another position? What positions will she/won't she consider in her search? What radius from your home will she search in? In moving somewhere else possible? What is the timeline for finding another spot. What happens if she can't find a position? Do you need to be considering picking up work in any circumstance?

If she isn't, then the discussion about her job is, for the most part, a moot point. It then becomes about you getting your ducks in a row. Consult an attorney to learn what your rights are. Work through the financials of what life would look like without her. Make plans for what you would need to do to move forward.

My advice is to take a very close look at her actions. From the ones you've already written about -- still loving the OM and not trying to figure out ways to minimize/eliminate the need for close collaboration -- she is indicating that she isn't working with you on reconciliation. If that continues to be the case, she isn't giving you much choice other than to file for D.

If you were to try for a bit longer to see if you can work things out, you need to insist on being respected. I think the starting point would be that you need to see if she will work at establishing some boundaries that help you. She needs to actively be working at loving you and forgetting about the OM. Any of this "I love him" or even "I'm confused" is disrespectful and torturous to you. She also needs to be considering every possible way to go NC or, at a very minimum, make certain they are never alone together. Personally, I think that the whole collaboration topic is an excuse for why they should be able to communicate. If she can demonstrate a real need and purpose for the collaboration, she would need to propose a way to have others present and to avoid the potential for ANY 1 on 1 communication. In addition, there is the potential for them to meet up in an empty classroom. The only way I see that you could be reassured is if she is at school barely before students arrive and leaves immediately after. She can do her paperwork at home. As another avenue, the principal could be involved in a discussion (with both sets of spouses present) where it is revealed that the two of them grew too close emotionally and that this has caused issues at home. It falls short of getting them both fired. S/he could be asked to help in their search for a job for the next year and in developing safeguards to keep them apart. If your wife isn't trying to find solutions that communicate that she loves you, she isn't remorseful about what she did. If she isn't remorseful, you can't build up trust. Without trust, there is no chance at recovering the marriage.

[This message edited by Crushed7 at 2:40 PM, January 18th (Monday)]

However, I cannot tell her co-workers or her supervisors (principal or superintendent). As much as I want to tell the people at her work in order to shame them/keep them apart, there is the potential that they would both lose their jobs.

I'd be willing to wager that everyone at her school already knows all about their A. And I'd bet that your WW's isn't the only one going on there. A's in schools are more common than you'd imagine.

I like Crushed7’s idea of setting up a meeting with the Principal. This action should result in the school making an effort to keep them apart as well as setting additional eyes on them at school. The wayward will know that they will be put under a microscope by the principal and probably assistant principal and they will wonder if other staff also might be watching. They will have to worry that any interaction between the 2 will be noticed and this will give them additional incentive to stay the hell away from each other at school. I’m sure that meeting with the Principal will be humiliating for them but they had to expect consequences for their action.

If you were to try for a bit longer to see if you can work things out, you need to insist on being respected. I think the starting point would be that you need to see if she will work at establishing some boundaries that help you. She needs to actively be working at loving you and forgetting about the OM. Any of this "I love him" or even "I'm confused" is disrespectful and torturous to you. She also needs to be considering every possible way to go NC or, at a very minimum, make certain they are never alone together. Personally, I think that the whole collaboration topic is an excuse for why they should be able to communicate. If she can demonstrate a real need and purpose for the collaboration, she would need to propose a way to have others present and to avoid the potential for ANY 1 on 1 communication. In addition, there is the potential for them to meet up in an empty classroom. The only way I see that you could be reassured is if she is at school barely before students arrive and leaves immediately after. She can do her paperwork at home. As another avenue, the principal could be involved in a discussion (with both sets of spouses present) where it is revealed that the two of them grew too close emotionally and that this has caused issues at home. It falls short of getting them both fired. S/he could be asked to help in their search for a job for the next year and in developing safeguards to keep them apart. If your wife isn't trying to find solutions that communicate that she loves you, she isn't remorseful about what she did. If she isn't remorseful, you can't build up trust. Without trust, there is no chance at recovering the marriage.

Can't put it any better than this. If your wife isn't ACTIVELY trying to show you that she is recommitting to you and the marriage, then you have nothing to work with. Nothing.

"You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink." Same goes with your wife. You can tell her what you will and will not accept, but ultimately she has to start doing the hard work if she wants this marriage.

You shouldn't accept any less.

It's kinda dammed if you do and dammed if you dont.

On the one hand if you expose to her place of work she could be fired and your family suffers with no guarantte of the marriage surviving but it will stop them interacting on a daily basis at work.

If you do not expose to her place of work then again your family will suffer & your marriage will destruct most likely due to the continuation of the affair during their daily interactions.

What to do. The trusting her to NC with the OM thing is kinda out the window. Even if she called you muliple times during the day to tell you where she is and what she is doing will serve no purpose as a sex act could take anywheres from 5 seconds to ....

So unless you strap a camera to her head that allows you to monitor your WW 24-7 then you will never know what they are doing while they are still actively working together.

Your only option if they keep working together without exposure is to trust her and again good luck with that.

MPA you are not the first BS that has stated that the WS can not afford to quit their job as it would create fiscal destruction.

A few of them continue to live as a cuckold with their WS still in an active affair. A few after a period of living like a cuckold decided no more & filed for D. And still others finally said enough is enough filed for D sold off their houses & split the assets and started over.

Again as other posters have stated trust nothing that comes out of your WW mouth & ensure you speak directly with the OBS.

The choice is yours my man, good luck forward.

[This message edited by notanotherchance at 2:39 AM, January 19th (Tuesday)]

I don't know what to tell you. Yes, quitting her job would be financially ruinous. So would divorce, right? Setting up two houses, etc...

I'll tell you this, a lot of spouses with Coworker APs say that stuff. Oh, they can't quit, blah blah blah. They convince the BS of this and use it as an excuse to stay in the Affair, to stay in the fog.

And the way you can tell is while you are fretting about money and the roof over your children's heads, she is talking about how confused she is and how much she loves her affair partner. You think she's going to get past this while seeing him every day in the CLASSROOMS where they were having sex?

While you are worried about money, she ALREADY endangered you and your children's finances and well being. If they were ever caught having sex at school, they would have been fired, right? No income, no unemployment for being fired for cause. Think about that! She's worried about the money now. Why wasn't she worried when she was having sex in a public school classroom?

If she were one hundred percent remorseful and committed to reconciliation, if the Affair were over and both BSs had commitment from their way wards, then maaaaaybe there was a chance to stick it out. But that's not the case. She's still "confused" and she's using the money to torture you.

What if she stayed in the job but moved out? It would still cosy money but at least you wouldn't have to pretend you were in reconciliation while you so clearly are not. Also, a consequence like that would inspire her to get her shit together, end the Affair, get a new job, etc.

To let her stay in the job when she is clearly still in the Affair, in the fog, and making excuses... Well, you have more than money to worry about. What happens when you have a mental breakdown dealing with the stress of this ongoing and continued trauma and it affects your job? I estimate o have lost about fifty thousand dollars of unproductive work time (I work on contracts) due to my husband's affair.

What does your wife think the best plan of action is? I know you say she says she still loves him....surely she doesn't plan on keeping the status quo. It just seems like she should be the one to come up with a solution to the problem she created.

What does she teach? Are there colleges nearby?maybe she could be an adjunct professor? Or teach at a trade school or some type of school that is not within the district?

While you are worried about money, she ALREADY endangered you and your children's finances and well being. If they were ever caught having sex at school, they would have been fired, right? No income, no unemployment for being fired for cause. Think about that! She's worried about the money now. Why wasn't she worried when she was having sex in a public school classroom?

Her choice to have her romantic fling put you and your children at risk financially. Financiallythe roof over your heads. Financiallythe food in your fridge and the heat from your furnace. She put that on the line. If she was caught screwing around with her coworker in a classroom she would have lost her job, and could have lost her teaching license on top of it. She was MORE THAN WILLING to risk losing her job for her love affair. She was willing to risk losing her paycheck for cheap, illicit sex in empty classrooms. She put that sex, and the high she was getting from it, before you and her children. She was selfish, reckless and stupid.

Rumors and gossip will get around the school. She might already have a target on her back. So the smartest thing she can do is negotiate a transfer, now, before this whole thing blows up into an even bigger mess.