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Thank you all for the encouragement and helpful tips. I have checked high and low for a burner phone and have found nothing. I didn't however check the trunk so that will be next. He may also keep it at work. Or he may have thrown it away after I confronted him...

I sent a swab of my own DNA along with the condom so that if they find female dna, they can rule me out. They're testing both the inside and outside of the condom. I was hoping to have the results by now, but it might take as long as the 16th. Uggghhh! I just feel emotionally in limbo until they come in. So in the meantime, I'm info gathering. I'm just not finding much.

Luckierthanmost: we have a good marriage, though it's lacking emotional intimacy. Been 5 years + 3 dating. We have two young children, 4 and 2, and we both work, so intimate time together is hard to come by. We're both utterly exhausted. I also don't feel like we've really "connected" sexually since the kids came along. Everything is very physical but not emotional. I have learned that's a common outcome of porn addiction - they get accustomed to receiving pleasure without having to work to please in return. I probably have some blocks as well. I'm sure there's lots for us to work through there, so I guess I'm not completely surprised he could be straying. The fact that he may be more comfortable bringing an outsider into our marital bed vs. talking to me about his needs - well that's the most devastating part of all this and makes me question how much of a marriage there is worth saving :(

[This message edited by pollux31 at 11:31 PM, February 5th (Monday)]

He will need A LOT of work on himself to be a good candidate for R. And it may not be possible at all. With some people, it isnt. Only time will tell. Do not believe words, believe actions. He will show you.

Unfortunately, I second the thought that using condoms is a big plus. Can also second the massive disrespect of using the marital bed.

I hope it turns out to be nothing, but circumstances are just too bizarre for me to put my money on that. I mean, even if he takes his ring off to masturbate and loves doing the laundry... nobody likes condoms.

The porn addiction does beg the question - why? How is the status of your marriage? How is the frequency of your intimacy? You both do seem to have a lot to work on.

This is completely off the mark. Your husband’s actions are NOT reflective of work YOU need to do. If he’s addicted, HE’S addicted; it speaks nothing of your “intimacy” (a real misnomer for sex, because addicts typically seek sex that is devoid of genuine intimacy and, in fact, quite often have difficulty forming intimate connections, preferring the stranger- or self-sex thing to relationships that demand that sort of connection), but rather indicative of what HE needs to address with his own therapist.

If he suspects porn or sex addiction, it would be a really good idea for him to see a CSAT, who will be best equipped to help him deal with the problem.

ETA: that you describe a relationship lacking emotional intimacy doesn’t surprise me; my ex and I experienced the same—it took me a long time (decades) to recognize this and accept he was not able to form that sort of connection, because he worked very hard to convince me otherwise. In your shoes, I’d want my WS’s IC to evaluate the likelihood that intimate connections can be made; for us, that meant testing for personality disorders. A specific diagnosis made it clear I really could not realistically expect more, which helped guide my decision-making.

[This message edited by solus sto at 2:07 PM, February 6th (Tuesday)]

Thanks again all for your perspectives and continued support. It's so helpful knowing what things to look out for that I wouldn't have otherwise thought of.

Solus sto: thank you for explaining that the way you did - it gives me so much strength and conviction. I do have guilt over not putting more effort into our sex life, however he had a choice to talk to me (which he didn't) and also countless choices to turn away from this journey (which he didn't), so my guilt will only be used to guide a path forward AFTER R (should we be able to get there) and not one bit to exonerate any of his wrongful choices.

I feel the same about the JO story. A friend of mine's husband asked 35 of his friends/colleagues if they'd ever done that with a condom and only 1 person admitted he did. So, I guess it happens but it's not very likely. Even my husband couldn't explain WHY he did it. Most of his responses were searching for something I'd accept, that sounds logical. Lots of "I don't know why" and "I guess I just..." and "Maybe...". Each time I didn't buy it, he came up with a new reason, ending it on a question like even he wasn't buying his own BS.

His excuses were:

1. I don't know why, i just did it

2. I just wanted to try it (really, you're 35yo and you're just NOW suddenly curious for the first time? you don't know already?)

3. Well you know how much it rubs and irritates in the water. I thought the lubrication would help with that. (so why not just get out of the bath?)

4. I thought it would feel good with the tightness. (riiiigggghhhhhht)

Someone telling the truth - even if embarrassed about it - wouldn't really answer this way, would they? I would expect maybe the first knee-jerk "I don't know" but then relay their reason and stand by it. and be matter of fact about it. get irritated even when i doubted it. Could there be a motivation that awful about JO'g with a condom that he would rather take to his grave than admit openly to earn back my trust? The only place my mind can land is that he was actually with someone else.

[This message edited by pollux31 at 10:58 PM, February 7th (Wednesday)]

Also, for those who don't know, if you are info Gathering and your partner has a Gmail or Google login that is always up on their phone, it literally tracks EEEEEVVEERRYYYYthing. And since it is tied to their account, it will gather all of the activity from all of their devices - personal phone, work phone, personal laptop, work computer, tablet, iPod... ANY thing they log in from. It shows what websites or apps that they used and when, often times what they searched for or exactly what they viewed, what device they were using, where they went and how long they were at each place each day for the past 28 days... and it will put it all on a nice little timeline or in filtered categories and you can scroll and view or download it all in a little bundle.

It's really simple too:

1. Open the Google or Chrome browser on any device is there email is open on and tap the three little bars on the bottom right-hand corner.

2.tap "Recent"

3. Tap the three dots in the upper right hand corner

4. select "my activity" and watch the magic unfold period

4b. You can also get there by pulling up their email, and going to Settings > My Account > Personal Info and Privacy.

5. Poke around, go exploring. Click on all the links.

6. Take pictures of the screens with your phone so that you have hard evidence before it gets wiped away.

I've been able to learn so much without even having to pickup my husband's phone because I can see it all from the tablet. For instance, I know exactly the minute that he got to the gym the day of the A, and when he left, when he got home, when he left again and where he went. SO powerful!!

[This message edited by pollux31 at 6:57 PM, February 6th (Tuesday)]

Pollux,

Can you tell what You Tube pages he visited? Craigslist pages, porn sites? TMI I know, but was there semen in the condom? Don't answer if TMI.

ETA: a fantasy may have turned in a fetish that makes the JO session a "take to the grave" reason to lie.

[This message edited by TimelessLoss at 10:15 PM, February 6th (Tuesday)]

Pollux, the way I caught my H and all his cheating and lies is by doing just as you describe. The way that Google saved everything. The most horrified I ever was though was when I listened to all the Google voice texts that he sent to the whores. It recorded his voice. I had to listen to that.

But it is how I put the whole timeline together, basically found out everything.

Google/gmail is a great resource for a BS for sure

Kaygem, it's good to know I'm on the right track. I haven't turned up much just yet, but i'm logging anything suspicious and looking for patterns. I'm feeling like he's either telling the truth, or he has a secret device. There have been some recent sign-ins on unrecognized devices to his Twitter account, but he doesn't have the app downloaded on his phone or tablet. So I'm hunting for answers. He should know better than to try and fool an analyst!

Timeless, thank you for the additional perspective about fetishes. I am clueless to this world, and I will remember this tidbit as I'm evacuating the things I'm finding (or not finding) things. I can't see all YouTube videos as he has deleted his history. I guess it erased it from his Google history too. He forgot to unsubscribe from a couple amateur soft porno channels though so I know he interacted with those at one point. Doesn't seem to be connected to him personally in any way, but I'll keep prodding. And yes, there was semen in the condom. Is that an important detail? If so, please explain. I'm here to learn.

[This message edited by pollux31 at 11:01 AM, February 8th (Thursday)]

pollux,

You thought that if it was just a solo JO session why would he would spin the tale that he did. You asked if there could be anything about a solo JO that he would need to take to the grave. The absence of semen could have indicated that he had a fetish about sperm.

I see where you're going with that, Timeless. Aye, so many things I've been forced to imagine that I never thought conceivable, just for the sake of landing near a shell of an explanation that even remotely makes sense :( Even if my husband didn't cheat, his hiding of things has caused me to envision all these horrible possibilities about him. I can't "unsee" them. I can't see him the same ever again. How could I ever have security with him again?? :'(

[This message edited by pollux31 at 11:09 AM, February 8th (Thursday)]

Pollux,

Yes, the loss of safety, security and trust. I guess for now I would offer that you will never trust him the same way again. Trust has a chance of being built little by little is there are sustained, consistent actions on his part for years.

He said he would do anything to regain your trust. Time for him to get crackin'. Have you seen anything?

The test will give you more of sense of what you might be dealing with.

Put a var in his car.

Timeless - what do mean if I've seen anything? Do you mean evidence of rebuilding trust? He has made some small efforts but he thinks my being amicable while I gather all my info and await the DNA results is a sign of forgiveness. I'm letting him remain somewhat relaxed because it's easier to research all his data and keep tabs on him that way. You know what they say: "Keep your friends close, and your enemies even closer."

Is there a recommended VAR from this group? What features should I look for? What is the best place to hide it in the car?

Pollux,

Yes, my sentence should have read "...seen anything from him."

I think it is fine to lie low for now while you do your investigative work as long as the DNA test results are not weeks away. It disarms him.

I use/used a Sony ICD AX412. Throw the batteries put that come with it. Buy lithium for longest life. Consider buying two so you can swap then out. Some people use velcro and attach the VAR under the seat. For me the easiest/best was to slip the VAR between the passenger seat and the center console. The gap was quite narrow and held the VAR securely. The car seats were black and the VAR was black so you couldn't make it out.

Caveat: Recording people without their consent when you are a party to the conversation is legal. When you are not a party to the conversation it is unlawful. This isn't legal advice since I'm not an atty. I'm posting this because other members would post to tell you the same thing.

I will stop using a VAR when there are no cheaters, everyone drives the speed limit, and there are no rolling "stops" at stop signs. Situational ethics? Yeah, guilty as charged. YMMV.

The wait is brutal. I can tell you are analytical which is helpful. I too was motivated like you to absolutely seek for the truth no matter what. Just watch for him to change in any way as the date comes for the DNA test to be back. He could be ha nginf onto hope if he is guilty but start to crack under pressure and change it up a little. Some lists bluff to the bloody end. Maybe he is telling the truth. I agree it doesn’t add up right now and either way it is his tault for putting you in this situation.

I’m not sure I would not also start discussing a poly to see is reaction and out more pressure. Sadly, we all have advice here by catching someone. I hope you don’t join us but we will help you out to make sure you really know.

I mean really....how would he feel is he came home to such freaky circumstances. Did you surprise him by coming home early or something? Why was he washing the sheets? Why would he have just thrown that in the trash? Why was his ring still off? It is all so odd unless he wasn’t expecting you. Sadly, it could have been someone from the gym?

[This message edited by Jesusismyanchor at 8:17 PM, February 8th (Thursday)]

I taped mine under my child’s booster seat. Isn’t that nice?

pollux,

I'm thinking forward to the test results. Can you get them w/o him knowing? If the results show the presence of another person's DNA, sit him down w/o telling him the results. Tell him he has one minute to come clean about what happened if there is to be any chance of R.

I would bluff him in the same way if the results show only his DNA. Tell him he has one minute to come clean about everything going on with him.

He broke a bit when you first confronted him. Create another setting around the test results where he feels under pressure.

You may want to weave the timing of this around your use of the VAR.

Just some thoughts that play to your strengths.

Jesusismy made a solid observation.

If he's cheating, could it be someone from the gym?

Does he have a regular schedule for the gym?

Definately hide a VAR in your house.

I used the Sony from Walmart$50.

Cover the light on it with black/dark duc tape.

Turn the volume off or as low as it will go.

It records when there are sounds- mine comes on when the

Dishwasher runs, the dog barks, etc. but it's worth it.

Oh yeah- it has a VAR button and a record all the time button. Make sure it's on VAR and it will record for hours.