SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

In almost every thread where terms are important, things can go off the rails because there is no attempt to norm the term meaning and people use the term as part of making a point when the term is being interpreted with a difference meaning by others:

Webster says of "Amends": compensation for a loss or injury : RECOMPENSE

Some here are applying this meaning of Amends in their explanations and others have a broader meaning that Oxford or some other source may be just as relevant, but really not the same thing at all. This is how intelligent people, with clear views, can still have long conversations that appear to be contentious simply because of assumptions that the common words used mean the same thing to those using them. We do it all the time. And Amends isn't the only example in this thread.

If a BS expected or needed to see Amends, of the Webster variety, some may see that as not healthy and others would see it as essential to healing. In general, my view is that amends are almost always a good and healthy thing towards healing a wrong done, so long as the amends are sincere and contrite in origin. If the person that should be offering amends is not of a mind to do so, forcing of it seems to be bitter pill to accept as amends, and not worth the effort to fight over.

n almost every thread where terms are important, things can go off the rails because there is no attempt to norm the term meaning and people use the term as part of making a point when the term is being interpreted with a difference meaning by others:

Webster says of "Amends": compensation for a loss or injury : RECOMPENSE

Some here are applying this meaning of Amends in their explanations and others have a broader meaning that Oxford or some other source may be just as relevant, but really not the same thing at all. This is how intelligent people, with clear views, can still have long conversations that appear to be contentious simply because of assumptions that the common words used mean the same thing to those using them. We do it all the time. And Amends isn't the only example in this thread.

If a BS expected or needed to see Amends, of the Webster variety, some may see that as not healthy and others would see it as essential to healing. In general, my view is that amends are almost always a good and healthy thing towards healing a wrong done, so long as the amends are sincere and contrite in origin. If the person that should be offering amends is not of a mind to do so, forcing of it seems to be bitter pill to accept as amends, and not worth the effort to fight over.

This dovetails nicely with forgiveness, which is the release of all debts owed. If one party truly acts in a forgiving way, yet the other party still acts to make amends, IMO that is the ideal world for healing. Two selfless people acting out in positive ways for each other. The person attempting to make amends is doing so in the same selfless way forgiveness is offered, without expectations of recompense. This makes the acts of amends a true gift and, IMO again, also more meaningful.

But are WS generally selfish people at heart and if they get forgiveness, they stop thinking about the BS in any meaningful way? So acts of kindness, caring, etc, are not offered. Is it the rare WS that undergoes a core change making them selfless and introspective enough to be the type of person to offer kind acts without recompense?

Those questions aside, forgiveness should not be a test to see what WS does. The pessimist in me believes that WSs are not in general caring and good people that naturally act in a selfless fashion, the moment things look good, they resort to selfish type.

For those that want claim they feel sorry for me that IMO women are generally attracted to great looking, tall men, that take care of them sexually, are wealthy, are admired by others, have achieved some things in life, have confidence, are older than the woman, and are not dependent people, please do not bother pitying me. I think I'll be okay in life with these wacky beliefs. Last time for the record: I am not asking anyone conform to any of my opinions (you do you), nor do I think women aren't also attracted to other attributes. I am saying unabashedly that any person asserting women aren't generally attracted to the list above are not being genuine, this is my belief, no amount insults, gaslighting, or personal attacks on me will make me believe otherwise. It's just silly, like asking me to believe the world is flat. I don't think ill of anyone who disagrees, we just clearly see humanity wildly differently. Sure, women hate attractive, tall, confident, successful, sexually adept men! Why wouldn't they dislike those obviously terrible attributes. We'll agree to disagree as I don't see the conversation being gainful to any of us.

Old truck made it sound like marriage is a sacred and transactional relationship between a fully human man and a pair of breasts that said yes . He has only himself to blame for the misunderstanding if those are not his actual views

Balanced people create a rich emotional mental and then physical life together . Thats how marriages start and how they grow . When someone fucks up people can talk about forgiveness but they dont have to . Sometimes just recompense is that you take your hat and leave.

Forgiveness should never be a one sided thing , we all agree the transgressor needs to have remorse and wanting to make ammends is part of that . I also do think we can make the case for a physical aspect to ammends .

For eg : If my husband had a particular preference for a hairstyle and that hairstyle was a high bun or something that didnt feel very comfortable I would prob only do that on special occasions . Lets say i forgot his birthday, and i put together a special evening soon after . I would prob dress up to go out with him in his fav hairstyle even though my head still belongs entirely to me.

Like the earlier discussion on healthy sexuality healthy ammends also need to come from a truly voluntary and self actualized place . Otherwise we are not talking about ammends we are talking about punishments and emotional abuse .

Apparition

Women can devalue men like men can devalue women . Although usually when women reduce men to their wallet and physical or genital length noone gets raped or molested . So , no these are not equivalent social evils

Reducing women to tits ass and blow jobs that are “ owed” to men is never going to be the same thing as women wanting sugar daddies even though the later concept is pretty pathetic and not uncommon .

Oldtruck, You keep saying that people are avoiding the topic of just compensation when they have been telling you for pages and pages.....and pages.....of what just compensation is to the best of their beliefs....betrayed and wayward alike. You just aren't accepting their answers. Maybe it is because it does not align with your beliefs.

But YOU keep moving the target. We've gone from the original topic to sex to other forms of just compensation. But you just posted this:

I started this post to discuss just compensation as my response to a thread that got closed Where the BH needed his WW to go to the gym get toned and look as good for him as his WW looked for her OM.

When your FIRST post in this thread was:

I just read a thread after the OP deleted their posts. So I do not

know exactly what they said.

That last thread had NOTHING to do with the BH needing his wife to look good as good for him as she did for the OM. He actually came into the thread.....IMHO pretty compassionately.....because he was finding himself less attracted physically to his wife due to her continued weight gain. He didn't mention once about how she lost weight for her OM. She, by his description, was putting in EFFORT to the marriage, and to losing weight, but was still struggling. And I believe that he felt guilty about the loss of physical attraction, because he knew that efforts were being made, but he couldn't lie to himself about how he felt.

Never demands about just compensation.....because just compensation....by your definition....doesn't exist.

ETA---DAMMIT!!! BSR already stated the above a page ago.

[This message edited by jb3199 at 8:49 AM, February 28th (Sunday)]

I honestly doubt there is a debate going on here. Debates require that people are open for the logic and arguments of others and preferably arguing the same issue. This is more of an argument and as such isn’t really likely to bring any conclusion or resolution.

The problem is emotions and bias enter and control the discussion. The central issue and cause of this is infidelity.

The BH has accepted and loved his wife. She introduced this into the marriage. She is not the victim here. The BH is not this evil person.

The temporary insanity defence of being broken is not true and being fixed, whatever that is will not save the marriage. plenty of people who are broken do not commit adultery. And plenty of non broken people do commit adultery.

What saves the marriage is empathy. Empathy also Saves the ww.

This thread is now being locked based on sweeping generalizations and the inability to follow guidelines despite multiple warnings.