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Is this a DDay??? SO issues...

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WhoTheBleep posted 2/10/2020 13:26 PM

I'll give you the backstory and I will attempt to be fair on all sides and not view this through the sensitive lens of a formerly traumatized BS.

SO and I met on OLD 9 months ago. He was my first (and last) OLD first date. He's been dating on and off for years. On our 3rd date, he described himself as a rule follower and serial monogamist. He said he dates one at a time because he doesn't like to lie. I called myself the same. Nothing has ever given me an indication that he is not what he claims to be. He keeps his word. Shows up on time. Is a complete gentleman. Does not sell himself or talk about what a good man he is. His actions show that. He is physically affectionate and tells me everyday that I am beautiful. But he does not lay it on too thick. It's classy and a good balance.

We have not exchanged I love you's. (Although I've been feeling it the past month or two, for sure) We have not had "the talk" about being exclusive or deleting our dating profiles. I hid and deactivated mine a few months ago as I knew I liked him and didn't want to be bothered with other men distracting me. I told him I did this and I never asked him his status, even though I occasionally wondered.

Within a few weeks of dating, he introduced me to his family, adult kids, grandkids, in-laws, and closest friends. he incorporated me completely into his life and I had every reason to believe he thought of me as his SO. I introduced him to my parents and a few friends as well shortly after. We spend the night with each other at least once a week. We really only see each other when I don't have my kids and his work schedule allows. Usually no more than twice a week.

He has not yet met my kids, as I told him a couple of months ago that I wanted to make sure we were on solid ground, and that we were both ready for the fallout from STBX. He had never asked me about it, and agreed to go by my timeline. A few nights ago I told him that when my sister comes to town in a couple of months, I think that would be an easy casual way to introduce him to the kids, as he would be meeting my sister, and we will have been dating almost a year by then. I told him that I wanted to incorporate him into my life. He was completely on board and had no issue with it.

He is comfortable going into his phone right in front of me and scrolling through his text logs, showing me photos. He is always where he claims to be and often sends me photos of the mundane places he is (tire shop, his couch, out with a buddy). He is definitely a nerdy personality and not your typical smooth operator. In fact, he is a bit socially awkward at times, and we have both joked that he and I might be on the spectrum. As we have weird quirkly similarities about bright lights, noises, and scratchy fabrics.

Which is why I was completely blindsided early Saturday morning when a close friend called me and told me that SO messaged her close friend on our dating app. Introducing himself saying good morning. They went back and forth a bit and he described his life. Definitely him. Definitely the words he would have used. He was not hacked. It was just dumb luck that my friend was there when she got the message, otherwise she never would have known.

I was out of town when she called me, so I told her to have her friend arrange a date with him as he knew I was out of town. He said he couldn't that night because he had plans with friends (truth), but went on to tell her his days off from work and give her his personal phone number. She never responded. This morning he messaged her good morning, and again she didn't respond. She's removing herself, now.

Now admittedly I'm a complete OLD newbie. I was on for a hot minute before I left. SO has been on for years and years. Even if this wasn't a DDay, I feel he should know after 9 months whether or not he is sure about me. Either way, this hurts like hell and I feel like I've been punched in the gut. I've had an awful knot in my stomach for 48 hours. It feels just like D-Day. I have forgotten how bad that was. I went dark and haven't texted him until a little while ago when I returned from my trip. A benign good morning (he works nights). Followed by a little small talk. Then I told him I needed to steal some of his time when he gets a chance. There are things on my mind I want to talk to him about.

I already bounced this off of a good male friend who is an online dating veteran. We both had the same idea. Play dumb and give SO the chance to lie to me. If he is 100% honest, then there is a chance we are just sucky communicators (admittedly I have held back due to my terrible marriage) like maybe everybody is supposed to have "the talk." I feel like he has held back as well. And if he lies, well then that's that. Lies are a deal-breaker. I don't plan to tell him what I know or how I know it.

We are meeting tomorrow afternoon. I don't want to screw this up by approaching this the wrong way. Help me, you good people. My stomach is in knots and I don't even know if I'm thinking straight.

[This message edited by WhoTheBleep at 1:42 PM, February 10th (Monday)]

Chili posted 2/10/2020 14:48 PM

Oh boy Bleep.

First, my disclaimer - I haven't ever really dated much - online or not. But I've "seen" lots of people organically throughout my life. So, I don't really know anything about the manners of online dating/profiles. So there's that out of the way.

I just have to say this entire thing really sits bad with me. 9 months - of almost exclusive time - meeting the families (save your kids, which I get - it was over a year that I met my SO's by my choice). But there was nothing in your history outlined here that indicated he was just "trying you on" in a field of many.

The other bit that really bothers me is that he does know at least a big outline of your history, right? He knows all about you being lied to (by omission as well I emphasize). He knows that your STBX had an entire "hidden" life, right? Look - my SO and I were both betrayed and if anything I was overly nutty about disclosing everything and checking in with him about how he felt about me doing x, y, and z. And that was just at the beginning before time and any kind of words had passed between us.

Ok - let me try and concede a little bit. Maybe since you didn't have the big, directed, clipboard checklist talk he thought somewhere in the back of his mind that he had a green light to play the field even though he described himself as a serial monogamist. But he never (like ever, right?) mentioned this idea - even in passing. Or take your temperature on it. Or even ask how that would feel for you. Or even proclaim what he was going to do in some big way.

I'm not doing a good job at conceding.

It feels like a Dday to me too (I've been doing the forehead frown this whole time I think) and I'm way over here in this part of the world.

I just don't like him not checking in with you. Because you can bet I would not be cool with Mr. one-at-a-time changing his tune after 9 months that sure as shit felt and looked and smelled like something else (big words exchanged or not).

I get it was just a "Hello" but why is he "Hello-ing" on a dating site with anyone?

I'm sorry Bleep if I'm sounding like such a hardass on this, but I want you to have a New Beginning that doesn't require you to second guess everything.

I'm glad you're meeting him, but I'm wondering how the playing dumb thing will nudge him into bringing up the topic of his contacting other women. What if he doesn't bring it up at all? Are you going to ask directly? I understand not wanting to throw someone else under the bus and reveal how you found out...but...have you thought about how you're going to get the information you'd like to have if he sits there mum? Or is him not saying anything going to be your answer?

I really hate this for you. Doing your breathing thing - let the stomach get untied. Just remember - you know how to do this. You know how to not only be with someone in an honest way, but how to end a relationship as well. You will do what is right for you. I know it.

justabrokendream posted 2/10/2020 15:56 PM

This hit me wrong:

but went on to tell her his days off from work and give her his personal phone number.

In my mind he's sniffing around. I guess maybe not a "one at a time" kind of guy. Who knows if he has done this before as it was just a coincidence that your friend was there when the message came through.

OLD is a candy store which is why I don't even bother anymore....

WhoTheBleep posted 2/10/2020 16:07 PM

Thanks Chili and jabd. I think of it as a candy store as well, especially if someone has been on for years like SO. My male friend said the chase itself, on OLD, can be an addiction.

Like I said, even if it's not a D-Day, at 9 months if he is still sniffing around it's obvious he thinks something is lacking in me. And that hurts really really badly. Because whereas I know he isn't perfect, and I am well aware of his quirks at this point, he feels like a perfect fit for me. I really do adore him. And to not have those feelings returned is very painful.

[This message edited by WhoTheBleep at 4:09 PM, February 10th (Monday)]

EllieKMAS posted 2/10/2020 16:37 PM

Ummm whatthebleep??

Yeah, 2+2 is not equaling 4 there Bleep. I am trying to think of an innocent explanation for it and really just can't think of one.

At least though - if he does come clean you have something to work with. If not, you know not to expend a whole lot more time an energy on someone who doesn't embrace all of your fabulousness.

Ugh Bleep - I'm sorry

Chili posted 2/10/2020 16:39 PM

obvious he thinks something is lacking in me.

Nope nope nope. Not at all. No matter what this is all about, it's not that you are lacking. The "worst" it could be is maybe you're not a good fit together.

But I am so very sorry you are hurting. That really stinks Bleep. I know this has really felt good for you. Sigh.

EllieKMAS posted 2/10/2020 16:42 PM

obvious he thinks something is lacking in me.
If he thinks that, then he definitely ain't the sharpest marble Bleep. I know that hurts when it happens but YOU ARE ENOUGH ALWAYS.

northeasternarea posted 2/10/2020 16:44 PM

it's obvious he thinks something is lacking in me.

Don't go there. This has absolutely nothing to do with any lack in you. Has he ever told you that you are the only one he is dating? Any discussions about exclusivity?

ThisIsSoLonely posted 2/10/2020 16:44 PM

Be careful NOT to make this about you:

Like I said, even if it's not a D-Day, at 9 months if he is still sniffing around it's obvious he thinks something is lacking in me.

He could be scared shitless. He could be a commitment phobe. He could be like 99% of the WS we see on here. What none of these things are is about you - so stop that.

I say - go in on an honest foot. Ask him if he's still on any dating apps AND if he's still contacting other people. If he says "yes, and we never had the talk so..." then you have your answer. How you move forward with him after that depends on how you feel and how he feels. If he lies and says "no" you also have your answer. You will get answers about him either way - which is fantastic for you. If he asks you if you looked him up or whatever and found him on there you can honestly answer. The chances of him asking if he messages a friend of yours is likely less than 1% so you don't have to worry about that.

Of course, you could avoid all of this, if at this juncture you feel like you don't want him anymore if he is not 100% committed to you at this stage. That is completely appropriate. Then you can end it now however you'd like - tell the truth and get out.

So my longwinded advice is this:

1) Think long and hard about if you even want to move forward with this guy under any circumstances if he were to answer in the affirmative and admit that he is still on there and talking to others

2) If the answer is yes or maybe, then ask the question about being on there and talking to others - if he lies, you have your d-day unfortunately and some insight into who he is - if he answers honestly then you have some decisionmaking to do if you are undecided after question 1.

[This message edited by ThisIsSoLonely at 4:45 PM, February 10th (Monday)]

WhoTheBleep posted 2/10/2020 17:15 PM

Has he ever told you that you are the only one he is dating? Any discussions about exclusivity?

No, and no. Because of my history, I have kept things very light with him. I've held back saying I love you. I refer to him as "the man I'm dating". (Boyfriend just sounds weird at 45, anyway). I say things like, "if this continues to progress", "if this continues to go well". I have been absolutely gun-shy in opening my heart completely to him. So is there a chance he could have doubted my feelings or commitment to him? Absolutely. I was hoping my actions and body language at the other small compliments I pay him would do the talking for me.

And as far as something lacking in me, I meant in his opinion, for him. Although the awful words stbx sent to me when I left him keep coming into my mind. And I'm going to be crude:

"No man is going to want a woman in her forties with three little kids. he'll f*** you twice a week and then disappear for four days while you have the kids."

I know wh is sick and abusive and none of that is true (well maybe for some men), but I do not get this feel off of SO. He has made me feel cherished the entire 9 months, in the way he treats me. Although I'll admit, his words about mushy stuff are very few. And on that note, I have said many times to him that words mean nothing. I pay attention to actions.

Argh... I feel like I'm a blind idiot if I don't kick his ass to the curb. But this just doesn't add up, and I don't know why he would stay on our app knowing I have an account there... It's deactivated, but I can log in at any time. In fact I did several weeks ago to try to find our first messages to each other. But since I'm not paying any more I couldn't see them. But I can still see profiles. (At the time I refused to check for him. I didn't want to be that girl). Anyway, SO didn't blink when I told him I logged in.

[This message edited by WhoTheBleep at 5:47 PM, February 10th (Monday)]

WhoTheBleep posted 2/10/2020 17:19 PM

I don't know..."He's just not that into you" keeps coming to mind. Either that or he's a sociopath and needs constant kibbles and stimulation, like STBX. They couldn't be more different from each other in every other respect, though. So I'm completely thrown for a loop here.

Superesse posted 2/10/2020 17:21 PM

Sorry, Bleep. It is NOT about you, I can tell you that from HERE! Nine months is a long time feeling good to get news like this, but better to know the truth, too. (((Bleep)))

You mentioned his maybe being on the spectrum, and I'd be inclined to see this behavior through that lens. As the BS of a guy with Aspergers's traits (autism spectrum) who knows other BWs of guys like mine, I don't think they really make the normal connection between their "having a girlfriend" and whatever ELSE they do for their male ego. This was explained to me by one autism special ed. XW of such a man, as their "not really being able to generalize well" meaning they don't draw inferences or think of behaviors as being connected, that we would expect. Which is why assumptions about exclusivity don't necessarily ring in their heads at the moment they feel like playing in the candy store!

OLD is so scary for this very reason. But I agree if you haven't specifically discussed being exclusive, he might not think anything is wrong, too. How would you handle that information?

ShatteredSakura posted 2/10/2020 17:25 PM

:(

We have not had "the talk" about being exclusive or deleting our dating profiles. I hid and deactivated mine a few months ago as I knew I liked him and didn't want to be bothered with other men distracting me. I told him I did this and I never asked him his status, even though I occasionally wondered.

IMO, always have the talk. Always. If you're acting exclusive, communicate it to make sure they're on the same page. Never leave it open ended. If I was him (and a lot of what you wrote actually sounds like me), I would say without hesitation that I'm not looking anymore. I'd be thrilled if the woman without prompting told me she deactivated her account and wanted to be exclusive with me, if I was in the circumstances that you described.

Some people use online dating sites (like OKCupid) to also find friends. I always found this a little suspect...but could it at all be possible this was his intent? IMO even if it was, I would not like it very much and would ask them to stop.

He said he dates one at a time because he doesn't like to lie. I called myself the same

I'm the same type, it's nice to hear someone else is! If I want to meet and then have repeat dates, I'm not going to continue looking around. I want to be 100% invested in the one person and see where it goes. It's an attitude that seems very rare these days. People are so worried that the'll miss out on "the one" if they don't date 5 people at once. And in this current age, I am doubtful those are chaste dates either. "Trying people on for size" is so demeaning and objectifying IMO.

[This message edited by ShatteredSakura at 5:37 PM, February 10th (Monday)]

WhoTheBleep posted 2/10/2020 18:16 PM

Of course, you could avoid all of this, if at this juncture you feel like you don't want him anymore if he is not 100% committed to you at this stage.

I'll need to figure that out before tomorrow. I honestly don't know. But my first emotional gut reaction was that I would walk if he still wasn't sure about me, and he admitted that.


But I agree if you haven't specifically discussed being exclusive, he might not think anything is wrong, too. How would you handle that information?

Superesse, thank you for your insight on Asperger's. The more I think about it, the more I think it is a possibility for him. We have similar traits as I described, but his social awkwardness surpasses mine. In fact I don't believe I am socially awkward. He has definitely said some things, harmless, that make me raise my eyebrows. Just not the delivery a person would make who is not on the spectrum. (I'm going off on a tangent here, and I am completely not qualified to diagnose anyone with anything. Back on track, lol)

So how would I handle that information? If he honestly was waiting for the talk, I could handle that and we would have the freaking talk. But I'm not sure that's what we have here... He might just be a garden-variety cheater. And I need to know which he is. I want to give him the opportunity to tell me the truth without backing him into a corner and making him feel like he must lie. I want a genuine answer.

[This message edited by WhoTheBleep at 6:17 PM, February 10th (Monday)]

Alonelyagain posted 2/10/2020 19:33 PM

Hi Bleep. Iím sorry that youíve found yourself in this position. Iím embarrassed to say that I did the same thing your SO did and feel compelled to explain my reasons for doing in the chance that it may give you some insight. I also characterize myself as being a serial monogamist.

I was a BH doing the in-house separation thing while the D proceedings were pending and met a woman on OLD more than a year after the divorce complaint was filed but about 2-3 months before finalized. I would spend nights at her place, met her kids, and was introduced to her parents on NYE (a few days after my divorce was finalized). We were SOís. She was one of the few women on OLD who was willing to date me when I was ďseparatedĒ. While I wasnít interested in actually cheating on my SO, I was very curious about what type of woman I could attract when my status changed to ďdivorcedĒ. So after being with her for 5-6 months, I reactivated my profile.

I spoke to two women from OLD and met one for coffee. I had no interest in her and didnít even kiss her goodbye on the cheek. My then-SO somehow found out about my reactivated profile and that I had talked to a woman from OLD, and called me on it. We met in a bar over a drink. I told her everything, even that there were two women, not just the one she knew about. She asked me if I wanted to know who told her but I said no because I didnít want to shift any blame in my mind to that person. Because she was an XBW, my then SO couldnít forgive me and broke things off with me.

That transpired about a year ago and I havenít met anyone who compares to XSO. I canít believe I threw that away just to measure my attractiveness. Iím such an idiot. I donít know if youíll find this helpful, but itís a relief for me to admit this out loud.

WhoTheBleep posted 2/10/2020 19:43 PM

Alonelyagain, thank you for sharing your story. I'm sure it wasn't easy. Had you had "the talk" with your SO about being exclusive before reactivating your profile?

You've actually opened my eyes to another possibility. My SO recently moved closer to the center of the action in our area, and now 8 min from me. He was about a 35 minute drive away when I met him. Last night, I went into a fake OLD account I had made post marital D-Day, and I can see that he updated his profile with his new location. He moved about 2 months ago. So now I'm wondering if he did that to see what fish he could catch now that he was geographically more desirable. This doesn't make me feel any better, by the way. "Let me see if I can do better than Bleep." Ugh, what an icky feeling if this is the case. Makes me want to run.

I don't blame your SO for ending things.

He's been dating for years. My close male friend has been dating for years. I know the women that are around here. I will tell you right now, my SO will not do better than me. I'm pretty rare, so I've been told by others throughout my life. And I feel it in my soul that I am a good catch. I have a lot going for me. I will actually feel sorry for him if he loses me. I know he will certainly regret it. Likely instantaneously, and then more so after he goes on 20 bad first dates.

This is where my mind is going. I can't believe I'm here... I'm really confused. And hurting.

[This message edited by WhoTheBleep at 8:54 PM, February 10th (Monday)]

Alonelyagain posted 2/10/2020 20:04 PM

Bleep, I think that you may be on the right track with this latest possibility.

We didnít explicitly discuss exclusivity, but if the shoe was on the other foot, I would have thought that she cheated on me. I donít blame my XSO for breaking things off with me as I was totally wrong. I canít believe that I actually did that. I had never cheated on anyone and my XWW cheated on me multiple times and yet I still did that.

[This message edited by Alonelyagain at 8:10 PM, February 10th (Monday)]

BearlyBreathing posted 2/10/2020 23:00 PM

Hi Bleep and sorry you are hurting.
I think this points to communication ....and why it is so critical.
(And sorry for TMI but you had the not having sex with others convo, right?)

I hope that you two clear the air and find a path forward. But do remember this has nothing to do with you and your value. You ARE the catch.

Curious why heís been single but dating for so longó nothing wrong with it, but wonder if there is a pattern when things start to get serious....

WhoTheBleep posted 2/11/2020 03:44 AM

A

nd sorry for TMI but you had the not having sex with others convo, right?)

He told me before we were ever physical that he is a serial monogamist. I declared I was as well. After that conversation there is no need to have it again, right? We are both adults. We both know what that means.

As far as being single for so long, since 2011, he did have one or two relationships that lasted a year. I had asked what happened, and apparently he caught at least one of them in a lie. I didn't ask for details on every single relationship failure. He also took time off from dating, and focused on his family. I made a comment one time about how no one snatched him up. He said it was him that was too picky. And that he was glad that he waited (meaning glad that he met me, even if it took a while).

Yeah, everything about this says we were in an exclusive relationship. My gut feels this, regardless of what was said and spelled out in a "talk."

[This message edited by WhoTheBleep at 3:45 AM, February 11th (Tuesday)]

EvenKeel posted 2/11/2020 07:20 AM

Oh Bleep!!! This just sucks! I am so sorry!

He told me before we were ever physical that he is a serial monogamist
I would definitely ask him what this means to him!

I think I would also tell him that it bothers you that he is still has a profile up and see what he says. If he comes back with "Oh - I totally forgot about it and never even go on there" Then you know for sure he is a freakin liar.

I would definitely feel him out first to see what he tells you and how he responds. That will give you all you need to know.

Please update us when you are up to it. Sending you strength and goooood mojo today!!!!

(ps - This sucks. I know I already said that but this deserves it twice)

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