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Just curious if alcohol was a big influence on your WS behavior and affair. During the time of the affair he was a functioning drunk. He still worked but he was in a constant state of drunk or hung over. Lots of clumsy careless mistakes to the point that I actually threatened to leave because his drinking was spirlaling and becoming embarrassing and concerning. His affair partner was our next door neighbor who was an alcoholic as well. All of their interactions started and ended with alcohol. She was 20 yrs or so years older than us and not attractive so I did not see her as a threat at all...she was a drunk (functioning) like my husband but kind. Matter of fact, she exposed the affair to me while drunk and in a fit because he didn’t want to drink with her that night...(mother’s day May I add)

Anyway, he hasn’t drank since DDay and is back to the responsible man I married. I guess I’m just wondering if alcoholism was a apart of anyone else’s affair.

My H was drinking heavily during his A, but you asked,

I guess I’m just wondering if alcoholism was a apart of anyone else’s affair.

I don't see it as "playing a part." I see it as one of the details of that ugly time period, not a reason why he did things while he was drinking. I don't buy anybody's excuse of saying they did things while drunk.

I actually had said the words out loud to my sister that I was going to pursue a D if he did not turn it around and stop the alcohol abuse early in the new year (2007).

I did not know he was also cheating (or that his A I knew about earlier in 2006 had never ended).

While there may have been factors of the time period that influenced both your H and mine to drink heavily while also cheating, I don't think the cheating caused the drinking, or that the drinking caused the cheating. Just two ugly destructive, marriage killing behaviors going on at the same time.

Last night, my H and I argued about his alcohol use and the A. He's a functioning alcoholic too and also smoked weed like a chimney. Still, functioning and no one outside the house would have noticed. Except that his AP was a friend of ours and his coworker who also smoked weed and drank. He'd bring her back to our house so they could smoke and mess around. I do not smoke or drink so I guess I wasn't a fun partner.

Anywho, I've always turned my head away from his drinking and would convince myself it wasn't hurting anything. And just try to live with it. But I have mentioned over the years how I don't like it, I didn't like that I was afraid to talk about anything important after 7pm because I was afraid he'd just forget the next day anyways. I didn't like that he'd pass out at 8p every night and we would not have a chance to communicate and connect. He'd leave me to get the kids ready for bed every night.

I read where alcoholics have issues with their brains even when sober. Infidelity still can be an issue because of all the other things alcohol does to the brain even in between drinking. I don't let that excuse the fact that he had an A during work hours when he wasnt drinking... If anything that bothers me more. That's what we were arguing about last night... That he chose to have his A while he was clear headed and sober.... Yet I feel like he drinks at night so he can talk to me or be with me. He says that's not the case but that it just happens to correspond with when he drinks. Ugh

He asked me last night, "how is my drinking hurting you? I don't abuse you physically or mentally." Seriously... We've had this discussion over the years... At least the last 12 years of our marriage.

I told him the ways it still hurts me and the kids. I listed several ways. He seemed to listen but then again ask the same thing. He's not getting it. But why would he? He's addicted to it, and puts it above all else.

Since dday, he's been doing better and better at working on us. But last night when I saw him bring home more alcohol than usual when he knew I wanted to talk... It hurt. His alcohol is a trigger for me. He knows how much I hate it but won't try to do better in that area and it scares me that if he isn't trying... He's also in the mindset where he could have another A. It effing sucks.

So yes, I do think alcohol had a role to play in the A, as did the weed. He stopped the weed after dday when I asked. But the alcohol had such a grip on him that I don't know if he will let it go.

[This message edited by Lovehurts777 at 9:58 AM, December 15th (Saturday)]

@Lovehurts777:

"how is my drinking hurting you? I don't abuse you physically or mentally."

Oh. My. Goodness.

I heard exactly that from my WH. Word by word.

Are they all wired the same way?

"Our" AP is also a fun partner. I do not know much but alcohol is definitely there to some extent. The weed may well be, too.

Sorry you are here.

[This message edited by MsMittens at 10:26 AM, December 15th (Saturday)]

I’m my H was also drinking during his cheating binges heavily. His addictive tendencies go together.

Hello all!

I was a barely functioning alcoholic during my EA - we were actually BOTH alcoholics (me and xAP) and we were both circling the drain. I got sober on June 29, 2010 and haven’t ever looked back.

I used to drink every day (started with wine but then eventually it became a fifth of Bacardi a day) so I was never clear headed - my short term memory was shot. I feel like the same voice that enjoys the ego kibbles from an A is usually the same voice that occasionally tries to tell me that I couldn’t possibly be an alcoholic because I haven’t had a drink in 8.5 years and a real alcoholic wouldn’t be able to do that. I call it my addictive voice and I have learned to separate it from “me.”

I’m sorry all of you had to go through all of this!

cpt, Congratulations on getting and staying sober. Recognizing that addictive voice and not letting it control you - that's great work!

I view alcoholism as a physical disease, not as a moral failure.

Having said that, IMO an alcoholic - any addict - cannot be a good candidate for R unless s/he stops using the addictive substance/behavior. That's because - again, IMO - the drug lifts inhibitions and that can lead to self-sabotage, more addiction, more betrayal.

It's harder for an addict to R, because it requires healing from being a WS AND controlling the addiction. That's unfair to the addict, but IMO it is what it is.

The addiction is a bigger problem than the betrayal. A WS addict can't solve the betrayal without solving the addiction.

Perhaps a better way of saying that is: an addict betrays him/herself by doing the addictive behavior, and a person is too open to betraying others if s/he is betraying him/herself. Therefore, the addict has to stop the addictive behavior to heal.

Again, JMO.

[This message edited by sisoon at 12:53 PM, December 15th (Saturday)]

Sometimes I wonder about the booze and the A as a chicken or egg issue...

In the year+ before the A went sexual, it got very very bad. I began therapy 10 days after they 1st had sex (little did I know...) and his drinking was one of the first things on the list (mind you, this was in 2008). I confronted, cajoled, etc., but he wasn't giving it up. I decided the drinking wasn't bad enough to leave the M.

It continued pretty bad for years. While DD was in high school and I was working in another city, she would call me about it and was concerned. I talked to WH about it, but it didn't slow down until after DD left for college. I still work out of town a lot, so it's possible he just drinks a lot when I'm not coming home. The suicide attempt changed that - and he had some other surgery a few weeks ago so no drinking while on the pain meds.

As to the chicken/egg thing, to me, EVERY character/behavioral deficit that goes into having an A are identical to alcoholism or any other addiction. Starts with a lack of rigorous honesty - to one's self (I drink, but I don't have a problem is no different than "I'm f*cking someone else, but I'm not a bad spouse" ). Add in entitlement, rationalization, self loathing, etc.

Technically, I don't think my WH is SA, but I would be ecstatic if he would go to SA meetings (I found the test online and answered as if I was my WH, giving every benefit of the doubt and it came up borderline). I think the work from an SA group - rigorous honesty, not f*cking other people, having a group to call you on your bullsh*t excuses, etc - would be helpful to a WH that at 11 months (+ suicide attempt) has yet to "get it" to demonstrate remorse or empathy, be vulnerable, not tell lies, etc. But I don't think he'd ever allow himself to be so vulnerable. Sigh.

[This message edited by gmc94 at 12:53 PM, December 15th, 2018 (Saturday)]

Thank you, Sisoon!

In my experience, addiction is a mental issue- think about it - have you ever met an addict that had a happy childhood?? I have not and I now counsel addicts. Addiction and bad behavior are symptoms of a larger problem. Before I started drinking I was still an asshole- I just wasn’t an asshole that drank every day - the alcohol just lowered my bar on how to get the ego kibbles that my addictive Voice was calling for. I had a huge ego and no self-esteem and self-confidence- the booze just made it easier to cross the line.

I am in no way excusing bad behavior due to alcohol as I’m the one who made the decision to drink. Today, and since 6/29/10 I have made the decision NOT to drink.

I am typing this on my phone so I have to be brief but I went in to a lot of detail in a thread started by I Survived So Far called “it’s not the truth.” It’s in my recent posts in case any one is interested. I described the thought process and mental state. ISSF has some pretty great stuff in that thread!!

[This message edited by cptprkchp at 7:50 PM, December 15th (Saturday)]

My WW was wasted when she had her ONS. Her EAs involved going on dates with coworkers to after work happy hours. They started as group happy hours but then devolved into one on one dates. Some of my the conditions of R is no drinking or socializing in mixed gender groups without me. She almost never drinks anymore and that’s improved her mood overall. I don’t think that she’s an according to Hoyle alcoholic, but her issues with entitlement and bad boundaries made the lowering of her inhibitions because of alcohol, a bad combo.

Yep. Drinking was a big part of their relationship, and uncharacteristically, my H would come home at night (assumedly after fucking one of the 2 APs), grab a stiff drink, and carry it to the man cave area where I would sometimes find him passed out in a chair. When we went on a beach vacation to "celebrate" our 20th anniversary he was close to crossing the line from EA to PA with OW1; what struck me as odd during that vacation is that he bought a pack of cigarettes. And "my H doesn't smoke" or so I thought. Turned out I didn't know him nearly as well as I thought I did.

So yes, alcohol and other indulgent, escapist behaviors became part of his repertoire. I don't think the alcohol caused him to cheat so much as made it easier to do so, and a way to escape from the mess he knew he was in. Oh, and his excuse for the heavy drinking at the time? He was learning to be a connoisseur of "good" whiskey!

And I will also throw out there he also had another escape during those years, and it was porn. Again, I had no idea. As you might tell, my H and I were estranged for several years prior to his turning to other women to get his emotional and physical needs met. So I really didn't know him, and the past 4 years have been an interesting exercise in seeing the man for who he really is and was. Porn is no longer a thing, and he only drinks occasionally, and only with me nowadays.

[This message edited by psychmom at 7:00 PM, December 18th (Tuesday)]

Yes but it was ME with the alcohol problem. I was abusing alcohol for about 4 years. It definitely added to our negative cycle. The thing WH did during A tho was always making sure I got my booze :( he was always offering to stop and buy me what I wanted. I asked him about this, was it it keep me “sedated” and “clueless”? He said it was to “keep me happy” still upsets me so much....

I'm not addicted to alcohol but I had a drug problem which hit its peak during my A. Addiction runs in my family and I've tried most drugs over the course of my 50 years. About 10 years ago, I was under a doctors care for nerve damage in my neck. I was prescribed opiates in increasing dosage and strength over the years. By 2013-2014 or so I started abusing them and by 2015 I decided to have an affair and my life fell apart. Not just cheating but stealing meds from family members to avoid/mitigate withdrawals and other shitty behavior. It's like I was a different person.

I'm not saying that I was so out of it that I had an affair. Rather, the drugs helped me care less about the things I loved the most. When I was going through withdrawals, I would call/text my AP and she would supply the dopamine hit that I was missing and I would feel better temporarily. Some say that certain drugs change your brain chemistry and affect decision making. I'm not a doctor so I don't know about that but it seemed to be the case with me to a degree.

6 months after dday, I went into an outpatient treatment program and I have been clean for 2.5 years now. I didn't necessarily do it to save my marriage per se, I did it for me and my kids in an attempt to break the cycle of addiction that ran through my family like a wildfire. It stops with me. We just passed our third anniversary of dday and are still working it out. Still on the roller coaster some days but we are working through it and I am confident things will eventually be ok.