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My husband and I have been together for 10 years. Known each other almost 20. A week ago, after baptizing our 6 week old infant (and 3 days before Christmas), I was awake at 4am feeding the baby and his phone was sitting out (left mine on nightstand). We have no privacy restriction when it comes to electronics (he uses mine, I use his), so I picked up his phone to play a game. My WS dislikes social media immensely and is quite vocal about it. So I noticed the Snapchat app on his phone and I opened it. What I saw was horrifying. DOZENS. DOZENS of women’s individual accounts. Going back at least 6 months. I found videos. MULTIPLE. Him ejaculating and sending videos to these women and talking dirty. Words that I have never heard my husband mutter in our time together. EVER. Disgusting things like “you want my cum baby girl? I’ll be edging here for awhile to get a nice big load for you.” They were women that promoted porn, I noticed. Would try to get him to pay to continue the erotic conversation and illicit videos and photos. He would tell them not to end because they brought a smile to his face and “a bulge to his pants everyday.” Even called them babe. Calls me that. Calls our 3 year old babes. WE HAVE 2 DAUGHTERS. That’s was the first thing I thought of.. what kind of example are you setting for your daughters? My family were in town for the baptism and Christmas. I woke him up and kicked him out of the house. My family heard everything. I was humiliated. Hindsight is 20/20. Looking back, our intimacy was on the downslope for years. In 2013, I found porn on his computer. I didn’t know how I would feel about it.. I always assumed men looked at it. But when I VISUALLY observed what he was looking at, it made me sick. I asked him to stop and he promised he would. Well.. he didn’t.. and here we are. It escalated to individual conversations with actual women and exchanging sex acts on video and photos. I felt dead inside. Hopeless. PURE anger. I wanted to shout it from the rooftop so I could expose his infidelity. I asked for a divorce. Then, day 4, we talked. REALLY spoke. Even though I couldn’t make eye contact with him, he showed remorse. Motivated for change. Willing to do anything I ask, including living in the bonus room or selling his vehicle to pay for a hotel for awhile longer. Scheduled individual and marital counseling, if I CHOSE to go. Requested to speak with our (mine and girls) to revisit his faith... note, he’s never gone to church with me or kids. After our conversation, i left the house to go meet with a woman from church to talk. She’s pregnanf with their 3rd child. I listened to her for a long time talk about how much she HATED her husband. And I believe she meant it. Then I spoke with a close friend of mine who had a different view. Her and her husband had both had A’s (years apart) and finally told one another about them. Went to therapy and really worked on rebuilding and they were able to. As of today, as we get ready to go sit down with our priest, I am CHOOSING to forgive him. I know it’s early. Only a week in. But one thing I realized after speaking to other women is that I LOVE HIM. So much. We’ve dealt with alcohol addiction with him, but he’s never really admitted to having any type of problem until now. I’ve told him for years that he’s narcissistic and after he did some research, he finally believes me. He says he’s so disgusted with the man he is. He just always thought he was right. Keeps apologizing to me for never really listening to me or valuing me as a wife and mother. So I have decided to give my marriage another shot.

Comments? Thoughts? Opinions?

I know the risks. I work in mental health. But, should this happen so quickly? The acknowledgment and strong will to change?

Don't commit to anything until he gets into IC and does some work. If he has alcohol issues, is NPD, and is addicted to porn - he's going to have a lot of work to do. I have a daughter and felt the same way when I saw the porn my EXWH was looking at. I remember saying to him "You know those girls are someone's daughter, right?"???

Hi, welcome to SI, the best club no one wants to join. I'm so sorry you find yourself here.

Gently, you don't even know exactly what you are forgiving as it seems you don't yet know the extent of his addiction or whatever issues he has. I'm sorry doesn't cut it, it will take years to move through this nightmare he has inflicted on your marriage. He's spending family money on porn.

You cannot fix him, you cannot change him, his words sound great, his actions will speak volumes. Just because he says he will change doesn't make it so. He got caught, what else is he going to say? Please be cautious and vigilant. It sounds as though you are basically sweeping his despicable destructive actions under the rug. You are in shock like most of us were after discovery.

He had an alcohol problem, now a porn addiction problem. How do you know he has not met up with any of these women? Honestly, I'd make an appt. asap to get checked for STDS.

Sometimes love is not enough. Please don't allow love to blind you to the truth. You have to be willing to lose the marriage in order to save it. Personally, I think you are jumping the gun, healing from this crap takes years, not weeks or months, and it will be his consistent actions over a long, long time that will make him a safe partner for you. Right now he is not a safe partner.

Is he willing to meet with a psychiatrist who specializes in porn/sex addiction? What he is doing is perverted, IMO.

We are not talking about an affair with one affair partner here like your friend, this is a much more serious issue that goes very deep, dozens and dozens of women.

That’s just it.. it’s happened so fast. Already had a marital counseling session and since it’s the holiday, IC will happen after the new year. He hasn’t drank since this began (more abuse, not dependent on it). I hate to be so optimistic.. because I wanted to slap the S*** out of him and light all of his clothes on fire in the front yard for 3 days.. but he is genuine. If this was a client or patient I’ve seen, I’d believe that they were on the road to recovery. Accepts all responsibility. He knows the risks. Always been a dealbreaker for me. I’m sure it is for most people in their marriages. He knows I will leave if this happens again. My mind is boggled. I’m confused. I know it’s too soon. Actions speak louder than words. We all know this. But I already see a change in behavior.

Annb, you’re right. I replied before I saw your post. He is willing to see whoever it takes to address his own issues. He’s made it clear that I have nothing to do with this. Just to clarify, not defend him, he hasn’t spent money on it. He would discontinue the conversation and carry it over into another chat with another porn person. I verified that on the account - Snapchat, credit card, and other spending. The way he left his phone out.. when it’s usually glued to him... almost made it appear like he wanted to get caught. The therapist also mentioned that as well. We subconsciously do things like this.. if there’s guilt/shame involved. I believe he wanted to stop. Just couldn’t.. IF it is truly an addition issue. Long family history. I did follow up with OB. All is good there. I, too, feel like I am jumping the gun... but I do want to save our marriage. So what do I do then? Trying to tell my 3 year old where he was for Christmas was awful. I just kept saying he’s at work. She loves her father.

Forgot to mention that he’s the one who showed me this website. To me, that speaks volumes.

How did he deal with his alcoholism?

How long has he been totally sober?

AA?

12 step work?

We’ve dealt with alcohol addiction with him, but he’s never really admitted to having any type of problem until now.

When I was growing up, I came from a series of broken homes, all of which were torn apart by alcoholics and their severe character flaws.

Protect your children and get out of this toxic marriage. If you want to forgive, then fine, but find a good lawyer and start moving towards D. At this point, I am much more concerned about your children rather than your drunken, porn addicted, cheating, lying husband.

Sorry for what you are going through.

I've been married to my husband for 31 years. He had a heavy cocaine and alcohol problem concurrent with a porn addiction. He went to rehab for 30 days. AA and NA 12-step meetings every day for many months with relapses at times. He's been drug and alcohol-free for 27 years. The porn addiction never stopped. He sees a CSAT, goes to 12-step meetings for sex addiction, has a sponsor he meets with weekly.

I've heard it all. The sorrow for putting me through all this. The promises to change. The lies. The solemn ritual we had at a deserted beach when we built a bonfire and burned all of his porn magazines and DVDs. The 3 month, 6 month, one-year sexual sobriety chips he presented me which were all lies!

I can't speak for your husband and his behavior but it's so easy for an addict to be contrite and seemingly want to make a 180-degree change overnight. Words are cheap. Actions mean everything.

As far as forgiveness, that's appropriate when someone works on themselves and proves they've changed for the better. It takes time to make those changes and more time to see if those changes are long term. You can't forgive someone for stabbing you in the back when all they've done is switched hands.

TC - I haven’t posted here for a very long time, literally, because my WS was “only” a porn addict as well, though I don’t believe he took it quite as far as your husband has.

I would encourage you to really read up on what porn addiction *is* and how it rehires the brain in ways that can NEVER be undone. Some experts believe it’s more addicting and damaging than cocaine. Those same experts say that a true *addiction* can never be completely undone because we are surrounded by such suggestive visuals throughout our society. This isn’t something that he can white-knuckle his way out of. It’s something that takes years and years of work on his part to learn his triggers and how to get around them.

My now X swore he too could change. After all, his wasn’t as “bad.” But as I’d read, even in the best of cases, 6 months was about the most a person could force themselves to be clean without the true, deep to the gut work. Even then, there are NO PROMISES. It’s a brain addiction and not something you can talk your way out of. Mine made it a little less than 6.

My biggest fear was also my child, at the time a pre-teen son, and I simply could NOT/would not take a chance of him or any of his friends coming across this vile, nasty stuff. I will give X credit, one of the agreements in our divorce was that our son would always have his own computer and own log-in while with his dad & X has stood by that—he told son it was for client confidentiality. Son is now 20 and that’s still the norm.

If your husband has an addiction personality disorder...mine is also NPD & alcoholic...it’s going to be even a tougher, if not an impossible road to recovery. That’s just the reality. Counseling may help him but the more importantly it is CRITICAL for you! You will have to learn how to navigate through a minefield for both you and your girls—being the child of a NPD parent is HARD. I would recommend doing a LOT of reading. There’s a great book, “The Wizard of Oz & Other Narcissists: Coping with the One-Way”, that was like reading my own life story.

Crumbs

I am an alcoholic with 20 years of sobriety. Recovery from addiction is a lifetime commitment and not many people are able to maintain successful sobriety. You need to watch your husband's actions to see if he is a safe partner for you. In addition, your husband needs to be diagnosed by a CSAT if he is a true sex addict. If he commits himself to attending 12 step meetings for sex addiction on a weekly basis (daily if he is a newcomer), gets a sponsor, begins to participate in service work and works the 12 steps in a consistent, continuous manner, he may begin to be safe, but it will take some time. He should also engage in IC with a CSAT. If he does not commit himself to these things for the long term, I would seriously consider getting out of the relationship. In any event, he is not safe right now. My advice is to not let him back in the house until you see that he is willing to do whatever it takes to stay sober. Addictions always progress when left untreated. If he has not physically cheated and he is not getting the help he needs, it is only a matter of time. My WH was diagnosed with SA 3 years ago when he was caught in a PA. I knew he had issues with porn, but thought that was the extent of his sexual acting out. I was blindsided by the affair. He has 22 years of sobriety from alcohol/drugs. He goes to IC with a CSAT, he attends weekly 12 step meetings, has learned to understand and respect his triggers (one of which is masturbation - had to give that up). I will always live with the fear that he may relapse. It is a long, hard, agonizing road. I know this is really hard to hear, but you and your kids deserve a safe and happy life. Please do not let him off the hook if you choose to stay. It will end badly if you rugsweep this.

I, too, feel like I am jumping the gun... but I do want to save our marriage. So what do I do then?

Then simply DO NOT jump the gun.

There is nothing wrong with you wanting to salvage the marriage. That is your(and his) decision to make---and no one else. BUT, as it has been mentioned already, your husband is not safe at this point. It is going to take a committed, consistent effort to start to rebuild the trust that has been destroyed.

So what do you do?

You observe. And while you are doing this, there are steps that can be taken that will help build your knowledge(and confidence) if you are encountered with any setbacks. You can see an attorney, if for NO OTHER reason than to gain knowledge of what potentially lies ahead if you do need to terminate the marriage. It's always smart to know where you stand legally, and financially, if your husband chooses not to continue his path to sobriety. A little emotional detachment may also be beneficial, especially if fear is one of the driving factors to try and reconcile. Like it was said before, there is nothing wrong with wanting to reconcile---just make sure that you are doing it for the right reasons....not simply based out of fear.

TheCalamity,

~You have a pm~

How are you doing, Calamity.

I'm glad you decided to repost, deleting a post is against the rules, and in order for members to support you, it's good to have the whole story even if it's ugly and painful. Understand we've all walked in your shoes, different stories, same pain. Most cheaters follow what we call the Cheater's Handbook, your husband is no different.

Only you know what's best for you, and I'm sure you understand that the odds of your husband changing his behavior are slim. It can be done with a great deal of work and commitment and his willingness to understand he has so many underlying issues that need to be addressed.

One day at a time....

I am CHOOSING to forgive him.

If I were you I wouldn’t let him know that too soon. I made a mistake of letting my WW know right away that I wanted to R and that didn’t give her any time for her to envision a life without me and that really slowed down R.

[This message edited by Gunnut at 12:42 PM, January 3rd (Thursday)]

Let him work for your fogiveness. Don't serve it up on a silver platter. Your desire to have a seemingly good marriage is what allowed him to take advantage of you in the first place.

In my experience, there may be more to this than he is admitting.

Could have progressed to a PA. Try to find out. Look at his cell phone bills and the location history on his phone.

Good luck

Calamity - so sorry you are here, but you came to the right place! I am hesitant to say too much on here since you said your WH is the one who showed it to you, but I felt like sharing some info that might be helpful to you.

Do not let him get away with working through this on his own. I know you said he mentioned IC, and that is a great first step, but often after a few sessions they will think they can handle it on their own, and trust me, sex addiction is insidious. Alcohol and drugs are not needed for your body to function, so as long as an alcoholic or drug addict can avoid triggers, they are able to stay sober. I’m not trying to downplay alcoholism or drug addiction, as they are both huge issues in and of themselves, but sex is supposed to be a healthy part of a good relationship, so in a way, for a sex addict to have a sex life with their spouse is like asking an alcoholic to have just one drink, or a cocaine addict to only do one line. They need a LOT of guidance to navigate such a tricky addiction, it’s really not something they can will away on their own.

I discovered approximately 2 years in to my relationship with my husband that he had an extreme masturbation addiction. I should have known when the first night we moved in together he tried to put porn on the TV in our bedroom as we were going to sleep. Then again when every door knob felt greasy. Or again when my underwear and lotion kept going missing.

I ended up going through months of finding gnarly stuff - my own underwear constantly found mutilated, torn and tied up in knots and covered in oil, fishnets, pantyhose, porn DVDs in weird places on bookshelves or in couch cushions, but then also sometimes just left in the DVD player, dildos in random places throughout the house including under book shelves, on top of kitchen cupboards, in the trunk of his car, and even shoved in a hole he cut in our mattress, catching him in our living room in the middle of the night even while his daughters were asleep in the room with just a curtain to divide from the living room - The WORKS. Have you found anything at all over the years that you initially wrote off but now would consider to be suspicious? I suspect since you have mentioned to him that he is a narcissist that you have some examples of that stored away in your brain - you might find that the timing of when he was being particularly self-centered might coincide with some of these activities. Write anything like that down and address it with him.

He refused to go to therapy or join a 12 step program, in fact he wouldn’t even admit that he had a sex addiction. So I tried to work through it with him just he and I. I thought we had made a ton of progress, and I essentially viewed it as a non issue. We had great communication about it, and the destructive behavior surrounding masturbation had stopped or so I thought.

I then came to discover 2 months ago that he had been having an affair for At least a couple of months. I have also since found out that he has a meth habit. And now after checking our phone records and finding multiple random Google Voice calls over the years, and at least 2 confirmed escorts phone numbers in the two weeks post D Day, and 3 in the years leading up to it, I am convinced he has been calling escorts for years. Have you checked your husband’s phone records to discover if there are any unusual calls or texts?

I’m giving you all of these nitty gritty details to emphasize that with sex addiction, it almost always goes much deeper than you would even imagine. I second everything that crumbs said regarding how porn/sex/masturbation addiction rewires the brain.

Also, in regards to your husband saying how much he despises social media - I have found it to be true that pretty much every statement my husband made that he was so vehement about, the truth tends to be the opposite of what he was saying.

“I would never cheat on you, I could never let my daughters down by doing something like that” turned into him sneaking her into our house under their noses, and then him immediately moving her into our apartment as soon as I left.

Also “I don’t understand how anyone could do meth, it is so addictive and it completely ruins people, I saw what it did to my ex wife, I would never” - cut to me finding crystals all over the book shelf along with a bunch of empty pens (which another BS on here pointed out to me is a sign of use) and I had them tested and BOOM, meth. I realized I had been finding empty pens around the house for years, and just never knew why they were there.

My husband was also similarly against social media - he had accounts, but was notorious for barely posting anything, so I never paid much attention to what he posted or didn’t post. Turns out he was using Instagram to view slutty cam girl accounts... I would have never known because he didn’t follow them, all he had to do was search sexy hashtags and he could find whatever he needed. If I were you, I would check for all different apps and forms of social media. What’s App is a common one for cheaters, I’m also finding that Instagram has seen a huge rise - my boss’s husband had several ongoing Instagram affairs with videos and photos sent back and forth. Also Facebook has “secret” messages - I’m still not even sure how they work, but I know they exist. And also, on iPhones you can go into incognito/secret mode when searching on the internet as well. Have you been able to thoroughly go through his phone and email? What about bank statements? You mentioned that they were trying to get him to pay for additional time, are you sure he never did?

Also, I know a lot of people on here say that sudden secrecy surrounding electronic devices is a sign of cheating, but with my husband I think he got a thrill knowing that I could find something at any time. We both password protect our phones for the purposes of keeping classified work info private in the case of loss or theft, but we both had each other’s passwords and were allowed to look at the phone at any time. Because I knew I could, I very rarely did. I have since found out that he was using Tinder, then just deleting the app after he had chatted with people and gotten their number. If you get Dr Fine you might be able to recover data from his phone and see if he had similarly deleted any apps or messages.

Also, just know that it is normal for the things he is saying and the videos he is sending to not in any way resemble his sex life with you. In a lot of sex addicts mind, they have a twisted view where their SO is on a pedestal, and their desires are really excessive and messed up, and they would only talk to other women like that because they are just objects to them. Not to say that is an excuse, and it is still incredibly hard to see all of that, but just so you can gain some kind of understanding on the possibility of why.

I know when I found the porn my husband would watch, I questioned why he was so turned on by things that he had never asked me to do, and he said he didn’t know. I also asked how he felt about the fact that these women look super trashy and fake, from their hair and nails to their outfits and the noises they would make, and he said it was just a means to an end. The problem is, their brains have been wired to find those things enticing and arousing.

SAs tend to have a lot of self loathing (like your husband saying he is disgusted with himself). There is a LOT of shame surrounding the act for them, which is another reason why they do whatever they can to hide it. Your husband needs to dig deep and examine why he has so much shame surrounding it, and why he felt it appropriate to do these things behind your back.

Do you know if he was exposed to sex and/or porn at a young age? I know my STBX told me he watched pretty hard core porn for the first time at age 10 or 11, he and his brothers had found his dad’s stash, and in my research I’ve found that exposure at a young age, especially while they are going through early puberty, is a huge factor in SA. Because porn itself is very unrealistic, they develop unrealistic expectations for what sex should be like, and when they don’t get all of the outfits and over the top moaning and screaming in real life, they substitute it with porn, because they know it will get the job done.

Of course any choice on whether to stay in your marriage or not is completely up to you. This type of choice is made all the more difficult by the fact that you have an infant. I did not get such a choice, as after DDay my husband decided to shack up with the AP and we have not spoken since other than to handle logistics, but I definitely do not envy the position you are in. I can’t imagine having a christening and going through the holidays with something like this looming.

I too loved my husband beyond words. I worked through all of these behaviors for years because I thought that we loved each other so much that we could work through anything, and that it was my duty as his partner to see him through this and to help him get better. I put a ban on porn after I found it one too many times, and unfortunately all that did was make him better at keeping it in places where I wouldn’t find it. He did not want to get better, so he didn’t, he just got better at hiding it from me. And when I would find it anyway, I did not stand up for myself and lay down any ground rules on what would happen next, at least not any that I stuck to. I was not good at setting boundaries and sticking to them, because I was afraid of making him feel bad about it because he seemed so ashamed of it. I thought I could love him out of his addiction - that my support and telling him it was ok to talk to me about it would make it magically disappear. But it didn’t, and it progressed to a point that I could never have imagined. Please, please, please, whatever you do, don’t think that you can love this away - you both need serious counseling to get through this!

If I could go back in time to when these behaviors were first discovered, I would have taken a radically different approach. I would have insisted on individual therapy as well as a 12 step program, with no promise of staying in the relationship, just the promise that I would think about it if he did a TON of work on himself. If I had done that, I might be in a very different position now. Even if he didn’t do the work, I would have at least gotten out before we got married, and splitting up would not be so damn hard. Being in your position, seeing him do the real work would help you see his remorse and begin to move forward.

You may get some TT, as a lot of times with SAs the porn/masturbation is not enough and it advances to something physical. I truly hope that is not the case for you, but it might be a good idea to get yourself tested just in case. Also, even if it was not physical, remember that the discovery of all of this is a trauma. I hope that you are able to get into counseling sooner rather than later and begin to work through this. Don’t let anyone minimize your pain just because it was all virtual - the betrayal is real, and everything you are feeling is valid!

[This message edited by HeHadADoubleLife at 11:44 PM, December 31st (Monday)]

This may have started with porn, but this is not porn. Once he stopped watching,and started interacting with these girls, its beyond porn.

At one week,you dont know the extent of his cheating, therefore you dont know what you're forgiving. And true remorse takes time to develop. It takes years to heal from this. And if he truly a narcissistic sex addict, true reconciliation will be extremely difficult.

Hi, I am new on this forum so take what I say with a grain of salt. Basically I can mostly relate to your situation because mine is very similar. I felt the same way after a week willing to forgive and forget. I then went back and forth based on the cooling off of emotions and things going back to “normal” too quickly for me. Now granted only 3 months in since discovery, I realize I love him, we have two children together and 15 years of good and bad times together. This was not as personal for me as a true another person with emotional attachment which makes things less complicated I suppose. My husband also started going to church, stopped drinking excessively and started spending more time with us his family. It’s a work in progress for sure. My big thing is that because of my faith I want to forgive and be forgiven. None of us are without sin. I hope you two find your solution. Just giving my perspective.

Porn addiction is real and he needs real help to stop. My WH was a porn addict since I met him and I just dealt with it (stupidly) for 23 years. Men are conditioned to think porn is no big deal but that’s not true. He needs a counselor and he needs to realize how damaging porn is. It’s been a long battle for me to get WH to realize how damaging porn is and he finally said he has stopped now during our R. I am still skeptical but he’s told me that he doesn’t look at it anymore. I suggest the Healing Broken Trust podcast, truly a life saver for us!