SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I'm very sorry you've been betrayed. I'm writing to say you can heal. You can survive and thrive.

Posting here, telling your story, can help. Reading helps, too. You'll find posts that resonate with you. You'll find posts that help you heal.

I think finally I have understood, after 8 months, that I truly can’t change her. I can’t make her who I want her to be. She isn’t who I thought she was. I don’t know what the future holds.

THAT is a great realization. It often takes a lot of time and a lot of work to get to this. As bad as you feel, realizing you can't change your W is a big step.

Since there's no point in obsessing over your W and what she will and will not do, where DO you spend your energy?

Most of us will say: on you.

Figure out/decide what you want - stay, go, kick her out, gather more data?

Process the anger, grief, fear, and shame that come with d-days and false R out of your body. You may want the help of a good IC for that. The more pain you process out, the clearer your thinking will be and the better you'll feel.

Hear your internal messaging. Are you blaming yourself for your W's A? We take in a lot of messaging from outside that blames the BS, so this could be happening. Are you locking yourself with one feeling and ignoring others. A lot of us are taught to do that. Are you feeling weak? A lot of stuff comes in that says that. Etc., etc., etc.

In actuality, your W cheated because of her own issues, not because of issues she had with your or your M. (I, too, argue that MC at this point is useless, especially after she spent months lying to your MC, unless your MC treats the A first and treats the A as a problem your W caused. Too often, an A is treated as a symptom of an M issue rather than as the individual issue it really is.

In actuality, you need a lot of strength to recover from infidelity, whether you D or R. (The good thing is that you have the strength, even if you don't realize it yet.)

*****

Your W has continued to lie, and that is a bad sign for the future. At the same time, some WSes do start telling the truth and stop lying.

If you want R, I recommend developing a list of requirements for R. If your W signs on, start R. But they have to be real requirements - if she fails to deliver, R ends.

Common requirements include:

NC - no contact with ap; if ap initiates contact, report to BS and together decide how to respond

Transparency - BS has passwords to e-mail, voice-mail, phones, etc.; WS keeps BS informed of whereabouts, activities, and companions at all times

Honesty - WS answers BS's questions when they're asked, although sometimes a break is necessary, sometimes an answer is best deferred to MC session, etc., no more lies.

IC for WS - to change the thoughts and feelings that supported the A, with signed release that enables C to talk with BS about WS's goals and progress (so the BS can make sure WS's IC isn't being lied to).

IC for BS - for support

MC - to help communications between the partners

Some (Most?) people have individual requirements - my W must arrange dates for us on a weekly basis and must initiate sex sometimes. What are yours?

[This message edited by sisoon at 3:53 PM, May 7th (Thursday)]

Dittos on the No More Mister Nice Guy book.

Read it. Internalize it. And don’t get defensive when it hits you between the eyes.

Thank you all. I can’t stress how helpful it is to hear real words from real people even if only on the net. Hell with this quarantine who knows how long until connection with tigers is even possible.

I loved the boom suggestion - I will absolutely read that.

To answer some of the other questions, I don’t know what I want. I know what was in my head and the image of a happy marriage didn’t exist.

We were best friends for years. We got married young....we built the life we have together. Little did I know it was being undermined, I think I still need to reflect and come to terms with the fact that it is over how I remember it. How I re,ember her is over.

The expose thing I honestly am very torn about. Just the other day there was a thread full of men wishing they hadn’t told anyone. I didn’t want to tell anyone because I was still protecting her. I told her that even. I didn’t want my family to treat her different if I choose to stay. Since I don’t know what I want I figured best to let it sit for now...and to not tell anyone u til I have made a decision.

Thank you all for your brutal honesty, and your opinions. I know no matter what I have a long road ahead. it feels so much better to know this choice for plan a or b or whatever doesn’t have to be made now, and I can change it at any time. I hadn’t thought of it like that....

As far as keeping the affair to yourself, you’re going to discover that with an affair this long plenty of people knew about and condoned it. I also believe that it didn’t stop until the OBS contacted you, which means he dumped her after he got caught.

As far as keeping the affair to yourself, you’re going to discover that with an affair this long plenty of people knew about and condoned it. I also believe that it didn’t stop until the OBS contacted you, which means he dumped her after he got caught.

Sorry man but this is where you’re at. OBS told you, etc.

I doubt this is a highly kept secret. They usually aren’t.

One thing more. Go easy on the dope. I'm not going to lecture you on the pros and cons but as a former very heavy user I can tell you that while it can help with the pain, it also can interfere with decisive decision making.

My brother has been in a relationship with an emotionally abusive cheating wife for 20 years. His solution has been to work, come home, smoke dope, ignore her and sleep on the couch. That's his life. I fully believe the dope is keeping him from thinking about his well being. It has been a crutch. And so there is no end game.

I'm not saying you can't smoke a bow now and then, but overuse is counterproductive. Free your mind and your ass will follow. You will know what to do.

So the affair ended 3 months before DDay 1 so that meant it lasted over 5 years. Has she told you why she lied about the length of time? Did she think 2 years was a more forgivable timeframe?

Are you sure the affair wouldn't have started up again if you hadn't found out?

The affair's a lot to get over on it's own but there's already a lot of lying here to try and unravel as well.

I hope you find the best way forward for yourself through this.

Can I ask if they are coworkers? or any chance that they could still be communicating? Do you know AP and OBS?

is the OM a co-worker?

to recover there must be NC between OM and WW. cannot

have NC if they work together.

how did WW meet the OM?

again based on how will guide you on what steps to take for NC.

how did WW and OM contact each other?

need this to verify there is NC between them.

you want the truth schedule a polygraph test for WW.

kids?

dna test them.

This is such a sad story. I can’t imagine your pain in finding out about this.

6 years is an awfully longtime. The amount of sex and the lies that had to be told for something to go on this long has to be staggering. For her also to let you believe she ended it years prior is just cruel. She never confessed to help you, but rather let you find out from the other BS after her hand was forced. This isn’t the act of someone who now professes undying love. She sees her whole life blowing up and that is the only reason you know what you know, and it may still be the tip of the iceberg.

She needs to have some sort of consequences. If it were me, I would expose, and have her live somewhere else until you get your feet under you again

The excuse of I kept banging him him because I didn’t know how to end it is bull. The doing it just for sex is bull too. After 6 years most women having sex with someone with no emotions doesn’t ring true

I hope you send the other BS a bouquet of flowers for Mother’s Day. Without her you WW would still be lying to you today

Your wife decided that for six years you have an open marriage.

Six years. Whoa. Sorry OP.

Work at getting your head straight, I suspect to get right you're going to need to ditch your lying, cheating wife. Take your love goggles off. Who the hell are you married to?

Your WW has been cheating on you for more than half of your M, it has been a sham and like you well stated there are thousands of tainted memories now, she really had a double life, my suggestion after such a huge betrayal is to file for D and dump her, I always suggest that when it comes to LTAs like yours and with serial cheaters.

OTOH if you insist on trying to R, keep in mind that for it to be successful, it typically takes from 2-5 years with a fully remorseful WW doing all the necessary work to help restore the M she destroyed, right now and based on what you have posted you simply DON'T have that, don't be surprised if the A kept going right up until they were caught and she was outed by OMW, after all she had been doing it for years and nothing had changed plus why would OM give up on a free side piece of ass, think about that, and no you simply don't carry a 6 year LTA for "just sex", she even admitted she didn't know how to stop it (bullshit).

Again it there's a chance to R successfully she would need to be fully remorseful, instead she probably just regrets getting caught. You know what helps with remorse ? FULL EXPOSURE with ALL family and close friends, exposure typically kills the "beautiful, romantic and exciting" aspect of the A and replaces it with pure shame and embarrassment, the more she hates the A, the more she will hate OM and the less likely she will be to cheat again in the future. Have her apologize to both sets of parents for her huge betrayal, demand she gets tested for STDs (you should too), ask for a polygraph (this may no be her first rodeo), and demand she signs a postnup in your favor in case she cheats again in the future (no alimony/spousal support and she doesn't touch your retirement.

Keep posting frequently, the collective wisdom of SI can help you go through this difficult situation.

I agree that the affair ran way too long for there not to have been any emotions in it. You would think that she would have been heavily emotionally involved initially, and perhaps it tapered off towards the end, which helped her finally distancing herself from it.

You were plan B for most of this period though, which equates to being plan B for a fairly long time in your own marriage. This is something that you will have to come to terms with.

Another huge !!!!!!!! Her offering to move into the spare room. You kicking her out into the spare room is common and usually advisable. Her offering. Not that common. It more likely indicates that she has cut the emotional cord with you, probably when the affair commenced. 6 years ago. She is giving 'both' of you space.

If she was R material, she would be trying to narrow the gap, not creating it.

Too many red flags here for you unfortunately.

Her offering to move into the spare room. You kicking her out into the spare room is common and usually advisable. Her offering. Not that common.

Absolutely agree with paboy here. Read other stories, WWs and WHs that are desperate the Reconcile are much more likely to try to smother their BS than distance. When you said she offered this I was thinking that was a big red flag that she wants some space to continue the A or she has already told the AP that you and her are splitting up and she doesn't want to lie to him.

This thing is probably still going on.

I’m not so sure that I would read too much into her offering to move into the spare bedroom. He gets the real story of how she set him up to go to MC and lies for 8 months about how it was over 4 years ago when in fact it went on right up to his first d day. I remember our first go at it. Her trying to come over and hug me and me disgusted just looking at her. She tried the smothering routine too.

My guess is she was giving him an out so that he wouldn’t throw her out completely. It couldn’t have been pretty and she was cutting her losses.

I also wonder how anyone can keep something like this under wraps for 6 years. Especially in at least his mind he had a good marriage. Where was she and him going at it? Did she ever bring him around and have him interact with you?

I’m not so sure I would stay or keep the MC. How could she be such a good liar to fool the MC? I just hope the MC didn’t know the truth.

I know that the 2-5 year timeline is typical, but frankly I would have a hard time thinking this is something that you can come back from. She may be crying now, but where was the compassion in MC to tell you the truth about your life.

[This message edited by waitedwaytoolong at 9:16 PM, May 7th (Thursday)]

Brother, get IC for her and you. MC is for when she can be truthful in conversation otherwise you will continue to have DDays

Buffer

The only consequences your wife gets is from OBS.

You need to stand up for yourself. Work on you, stop the MC. You may want to compare notes with OBS as she seems to better at getting info.

Exposure is used to get you support, not to punish her.

See an attorney to know your rights.

So a little more story. She worked for him. They worked in an industry that had late nights and drinking. She was an alcoholic. I never realized the extent....but she was. She has gotten better recently (last year or so)....and I do believe she has gotten drinking under control. They stopped working together years ago and the affair apparently slowed down but didn’t totally stop until this all blew up, or so she says. I’m positive she hasn’t seen or talked to him since august when we started R....but now I don’t trust myself honestly.

Had a rough night tonight. Said a lot I shouldn’t have. It hurt but I feel better honestly. I love the idea of a poly. And the idea of sending OMW flowers lol. I really am thinking of calling and meeting up with her to compare notes.

Looking forward to a weekend of taking care of myself.....working on myself, reflecting on all of what you say and said, and being me. I’m above this. I didn’t do anything wrong. She’s the one broken and she’s responsible to fix it....not me....and that’s if I allow her.

I told her tonight I will do one more MC but I don’t see the point in spending my money on it until she figures out her own shit.

I also sent a note to her sister.....she told me during timeline that she told her sister once years ago but that it was over. I basically said I knew that she knew and didn’t blame her for not telling me the story as it wasn’t hers to tell. Felt good to say.

I am struggling with the dichotomy though, I am a good person. Some of the anger is making me do things that just aren’t me. I can’t let her make me a different person. I know who I am.

[This message edited by HurtbyBestFrnd67 at 11:55 PM, May 7th (Thursday)]

She was an alcoholic. I never realized the extent....but she was. She has gotten better recently (last year or so)....and I do believe she has gotten drinking under control.

Is she going to AA? Has she stopped drinking altogether? If not, I think you would be wise to take her alcoholism seriously as you consider whether you want R or D. It's a lifelong condition which will always require her commitment, much like marriage. And if she's half-assing it the way she's been half-assing R, that tells you something too.

ETA: Don't beat yourself up too much about letting some of your harsher thoughts out. It's not optimal, but it happens. It doesn't necessarily mean you're changing into a monster. But here's a neat trick when you're getting your buttons pushed:

Four-Square Breathing:

1)Let out all of the air in your lungs to the count of four.

2)Keep your lungs empty for a count of four.

3)Inhale for a count of four.

4)Keep your lungs full for a count of four.

Doing this a couple of times when you're stressed can actually lower your blood pressure. And it WILL help you find your calm. It's often used by military personnel and first responders.

Also, remember that you are not required to engage with her unless you are desirous of the interaction. She doesn't get to say "we need to talk" anymore. She forfeited that right. You talk when/if YOU are ready.

[This message edited by ChamomileTea at 1:46 AM, May 8th (Friday)]

Can’t believe I’m finding myself here. Like so many others, I never saw myself in this situation....until it happened.

Welcome, there are a lot of us that can't believe we arrived here either. This is a useful series of forums, but remember that there are a lot of wounded people here at various stages of healing, or not healing, and you should only take what is useful to you.

I spent the last 8 months trying to reconcile with someone who kept the truth still. I did everything right. I said it was a safe space. I heard details that crushed me. But the full story, she couldn’t give me.

I think this is standard fare, the cheating begins with the lying, and the lying often starts LONG BEFORE the sex and continues for LONG AFTER the sex ends. Standard characteristics of WS's are debatable, but lying is one that is universal. When my wife finally got true remorse, she confessed that she'd been manipulating me by lying to me for our entire relationship, mostly little lies, but some big whoppers also, one of which was sex with another man. Remember, the easiest person to lie to is the person that trusts you.

She tells me “she didn’t know how to stop” and that’s why it kept going.

Yeah, heard that one as well, as have many of us. Sounds crazy right? Well, in some cases, some people just don't know how to get out of something that they got into. My FWS also got into this affair, and then quickly wanted out, but he kept coming around, wanting sex, wanting to "talk", and wanting to "go places", all of which all was just wanting sex. My FWS didn't want to lose what she had, her marriage, home, family, and yet she had endangered it for whatever reason, and just didn't know how to get "out of it" without losing what she had, thinking she might get exposed, but finally was able to extract herself (after his wife found out).

Now, you might think "it's easy, you just stop fucking the other person" but that is not WS thinking.

I think finally I have understood, after 8 months, that I truly can’t change her. I can’t make her who I want her to be. She isn’t who I thought she was. I don’t know what the future holds.

Correct, you can only manage you, and she may be some of what you thought she was, but there is another side. That other side could cheat on, lie to, and endanger you for years.

She says she is remorseful but she said that 8 months ago and still lied.

Regret is not remorse. Remorse is something else. My wife hit remorse 9 years after her affair ended, and after 6 months of MC. It was obvious when it happened, there was no question of what was being seen and demonstrated.

8 months of reconciling. Of kicking myself, thinking about what went wrong in the past and how I missed the signs.

You missed the signs because you trusted her. She abused that trust. That is it. Nothing more, nothing less, and there never will be anything more or less to it no matter how long you analyze it.

How can I ever believe her again? How can I ever trust her?

Long term affairs and the persons who carry them out, are something else. There is a separate discussion line you might want to look into in "I can relate".

Good luck, and yes, I will amplify the "broken" spouse theory. My FWS was really troubled under her exterior, and she hid it well, but it was apparent that any psychiatrist who had worked with her for several years would have known that, so I should have known that when I met her and we got married (a little irony there). My wife, when remorse kicked in, confessed a lot of things, and told a lot of stuff about her life before me, family of origin issues, and etc. All that helped explain why all her sisters all cheated on their spouses and also fucked every willing married guy that looked at them sideways. There is ALWAYS a reason for this behavior, but you may never find out.