SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

She wants to work us out, but can't promise she won't contact this guy again.

You're right the fog is bad.

Write out her exact words on paper and give them to her to actually read.

That is one huge contradiction.

If she cannot promise that, the she sure as hell is not interesting in working this out.

Hoosier,

Now that it‘s out then what is your plan?

What is your hope?

What would be your ideal solution to this situation?

It’s a valid question. Last night you told her the marriage is over and that she should get out. That there is nothing she can do that can save the marriage. If that’s truly how you feel then the advice we offer should be totally based on making your exit from this marriage as tolerable as possible. To that end then talking to OM, exposing and all that really has no profit for you.

If however you have some wish that she sees the light and accepts reconciliation then our advice will be geared towards that.

IU Hoosier

First, I just want to say, I believe calling this guy will do you no good. The chances are your wife has told him everything that is going on. What the fuck do you think she told him at 1AM this morning. That she was on a joyride as to why she called him. He does not give a shit about you and quite frankly is not going to back off as long as she keeps running to him. SHE IS THE PROBLEM, not him. Who do you think is giving her directions and ideas on how to fool you and what to do. He told her exactly what to say to you this morning.

You now also know it is her that keeps contacting him, and you also know that she had to be in her car last night so if you do not have the conversation on tape on the VAR, then she definitely has a burner phone somewhere in that car because she did not go to work.

You have NO CHOICE but to call your attorney and get the divorce moving. And yes that is going to send her running to him, and she will have sex with him. You have to accept that as hard as it is, and if she comes back to you if her affair fizzles out that will have to be something you will have to be able to live with.

That is out of your control right now,. this bull shit about can't promise she won't keep calling him. If you choose to live with that, and I do not see how you can, the next step she will meet him if she has not already, or she will tell you she has to go out with him to see how she feels. That is what she told you on the original D Day and it has not changed. Do you really think she will keep in contact with him and not meet him.

As far as the VAR is concerned. You have all the information you need unless you want to be hurt on what you are going to eventually hear on it. You got it to stay one step ahead of her but she has now given you 3 D Days in three weeks. And she's telling you that you have more in store for you.She will stop using the burner phone so you will hear the gory details if you want to.

The name of this website is Surviving Infidelity, and YOU WILL SURVIVE. yOU DO NEED TO START TELLING EVERYONE WHY YOU ARE GETTING A DIVORCE. If you are telling her parents, and you should if you have a relationship with them, tell them point blank that the divorce is being caused by her wanting to have a husband AND a boyfriend. DO NOT BEG THEM TO TALK TO HER. Believe me they will.

I urge you to keep posting to us. People her can help you cope with this. You are young, have no children and you can get through this.

I believe if she did not hook up with him in Mexico that she was prone to be ripe for an affair for some reason (does not matter right now), and that she saw the single life, met some guy, and thought she could have both, or thought she could.

I know you are hurt, but as they say the glass is only half empty or half full. If he had been in US she would have done much more to you and you would have the same result that would have been a lot more devastating had you found out after she was banging him every week for months and months, which a lot of people in this forum have had to endure.

Have in there. Please do not let her hurt you any more.

IUHoosier, I sent you a PM

Who do you think is giving her directions and ideas on how to fool you and what to do. He told her exactly what to say to you this morning.

We don't know that for a fact.

In fact, there is no evidence at all that the OM has called her at all. It seems she is doing all of the calling.

Which makes it odd why she continues to pursue this guy and idea. If he is calling her, than it has to be at her work.

Can't promise she won't be contacting him again. To me, from my viewpoint, that says it all. If the fact that divorce proceedings have been started didn't wake her up or at least get her to decide one way or another, she's put you in an untenable situation of waiting for her to decide the future of your M. Is she so foggy that she thinks it's normal for you to quietly sit on the sideline waiting for her big play?

If she sees him and he blows her off after getting what was denied to him in Mexico and in the cancelled weekend ( which IMHO is a likely scenario) does she expect to be welcomed,back by you with open arms? No rationally thinking person would believe that, yet I suspect that's her own "worst case" scenario. You know that's not going to happen.

When the door closes on the way out, it will be closed for good.

He may not blow her off immediately, but this doesn't have the makings of a long term relationship for him unless somehow his work brings him close by.

Telling family? I suppose that depends on how close you are to them. If she leaves, sure. Don't let her paint herself as the victim.

As usual, Bigger is right. If she wanders, where do you see yourself in a year? I do t know how old you are or what your family situation is, but being single and without dependents in my early 30's put me in the position of being able to pick and choose among the women who 10 years earlier wouldn't have given me the time of day. But that's another story.

My comments,above are predicated on OM being relatively normal and not married or otherwise encumbered. If he's married or in LTR, all,bets are off.

Having had a call to the OM save my marriage, let me make 4 arguments for it:

1. If you divorce you may learn facts that are useful in the divorce proceeding (I am a lawyer). Offer nothing in the way of facts yourself other than I know who you are and you have succeeded in ending my marriage.

2. It is likely he is not telling her everything - ie that he has something to hide. Calling him lets him know that he is no longer in control of the situation.

3. Calling him makes your W know that she is no longer in control of the situation.

4. There is something to be said for telling someone man to man that he is a POS.

Seems like the weight of opinion is against it. But when I called I exposed lies the OM was telling WW and lies WW was telling OM. Cheaters lie - to their spouses and to each other.

FWIW.

You really should expose this to her family and normally I would say no but in this case you should contact this guy.

He will wonder WTF you are going to do.

I want her to come to her senses and realize what she's doing. I do think she can fix this with years of help and action, but don't know if I can go through anymore. I don't know if there is a way to do that without finalizing divorce. She's stuck in the fog and nothing is jolting her.

I'm going to talk to my brother in law tonight (her sister's husband). He will tell his wife who will tell her other sister. I'm really close with all of them, so hopefully they help.

I know if she leaves and pursues him further, I will not take her back. It's more than just fog at that point.

Those are fair outcomes. The onus is on her to get out of the fog, no contact to renew the fog, and work on herself,so she can figure out why she went there and how to avoid it in the future. If there are marriage issues, you can work on them jointly afterwards.

But they are moot until he big issue is resolved.

If she chooses the dark,path, that's entirely on her, too. You did what you could consistent with maintaining your self-respect. If she does, the wheels are,already in motion.

IU Hoosier, Don't like the affair? then burn it down. Tell everyone, Affairs are like vampires they don't like the light of day. If you might consider reconciliation then make sure your wife knows that you are wanting to stay married but not willing to share her and give her your list of non-negotiables Polygraph, IC, std testing, whatever else you think you need. If she can't decide that's a decision, she's made hers and you make yours

IU Hoosier

If you call this guy, be prepared for how you are going to feel if he tells you he wants your wife and to go fuck yourself. Will you get any satisfaction from that. It is highly unlikely that a married guy would be in mexico with his buddy and pursue this, and what the hell do you think he told his wife when your wife called him at 1AM. THE OVERWHELMING ODDS ARE HE IS SINGLE!!

You have a lawyer already who will advise you on any legal matters that you are paying. Do you really think if you call him begging him to leave your wife alone he will after the last three weeks. Come on get real here. Just what she needs to see is you groveling to her boyfriend. There are no kids involved so what legal ramifications are there for a guy living in Canada.

You do not need any more hurt or disrespect, especially from this piece of shit OM.

You just told the forum that if she runs to him you will never take her back.

YOU NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU MAKE THAT CLEAR TO HER, BECAUSE I WOULD BET HE HAS PLANS ALREADY TO COME DOWN HERE THIS WEEK END IF SHE DOES NOT MEET HIM SOMEWHERE. SHE CAN'T GO TO HIM UNLESS YOU GIVE HER THE PASSPORT BUT SHE CAN DRIVE TO THE BORDER.

yOU MIGHT ALSO ASK HER DOES SHE REALLY THINK YOU ARE JUST GOING TO LIVE WITH HER AND LET HER CARRY ON THIS AFFAIR/

[This message edited by Badhurt at 1:49 PM, June 3rd (Tuesday)]

I went back and re-read some of your earlier posts. It appears that your WW is easily manipulated . What's her history? Was she in therapy before the cheating?

She hasn't been in therapy before, but she definitely should have. Her dad passed away when she was 20 and she never really grieved. This was the main reason she started going to therapy a few months ago. And then this happened. She told me that her therapist and her don't talk that much about the affair and they do more talking about her other issues. So the therapist doesn't really know what's going on, at least not 100%.

Great. The therapist is concentrating on a historical event (death) the therapist can't do a damn thing about except control her grief while ignoring the increasing and potentially more grief-causing event (the affair) that could be altered with a dose of reality thinking.

Maybe she won't talk about it with the therapist, either. I don't know. But to me, from this distance, it seems that someone's priorities are screwed up.

If you get a chance, tell her that maybe you'd both benefit if she spoke with her therapist about her "interest " in this man before she decides to do anything irrevocable. If she won't, then you have more evidence in favor of one of your potential paths. If she does agree to do so and actually does, make that a 180 exception.

Clearly at some point the therapist addressed it because after one session she suggested leaving for a week.

She told me last night and again in the email that she wants to do Couple Counseling & she said it again in her email. I've been saying this the whole time, but I won't do anything until she decides she isn't going to contact this guy anymore. Am I wrong? No way I should put any more effort into this if she can't even decide she wants me over this guy.

Or would the MC help her see things more clearly and end the want to talk to the POS?

Honestly, I'm sorry to say I see this as a stalling tactic for her. You told her weeks ago, either end things and let's work on this together or you were filing for divorce. Now she's offering couples therapy to keep things as they are - Contacting him and no immediate consequences.

Do a list of pros and cons

Pros

It will get the issue out of the hidden places in her mind where it currently resides

It will let you tel her with a neutral present that you mean what you've said about NC or divorce

It may force her to adequately verbalized why she's drawn to this guy she barely knows and is willing to sacrifice her marriage for him

It will let you tell her with a neutral present why you have take such decisive action which I'm sure she thinks is unfair and drastic

Anything else you can think of

Cons

You may hear things you don't want to hear or wish you never heard

Most here argue that MC while WS still in the fog is unlikely to succeed

Most here argue that MC without IC (on the A issue) isn't likely to succeed

If MC is a whacked as IC is, you may get some really bad advice

There is no way MC won't find things about you and the M to criticize even if for no other reason than to appear neutral

Anything else you can think of

You have a different agenda than most. You aren't expecting resolution at MC but the start of a process to get WW out of the fog so real progress can be made. In that respects, MC could be of value. It may prevent her from taking that irrevocable plunge given that you have not give up on M to her yet.

Can you continue with the D and agree to to MC as well?

Worst case, MC is a waste of time and a small amount of money, perhaps you find out more about what is motivating her.

Best case, the fog starts to clear.