SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

If she's refusing to answer questions regarding her affair, then she's NOT doing everything a WS is supposed to do to help the BS heal. She's also not remorseful. Once her A was out in the open, if she wants to stay with you, then she needs to understand that she doesn't get to call ANY shots about the R. If you want details, she provides them or it's over. It's that simple. DO NOT NEGOTIATE with a WS.

There was an evolution in the tone over time. In the first posts after the affair was over there was pining. The Plan C posts fall into this category. However, the later posts showed conflict in her feelings if not actual remorse.

If she was actually remorseful she wouldn't have lied when you were suspicious and she wouldn't have lied after confronted about the first email. She is regretful, but I doubt remorseful. If the nutty lady hadn't sent you the email you'd still be in the dark. Your wife admitted to nothing until she was caught and then it was only after her 3rd strike and undeniable evidence.All of this played out with a minimum of 4 years of gaslighting and 2 more years of living a double life.

You seem to be leaning hard towards reconciliation but don't let your desire for R blind you to the facts, and how you will process them in the years to come. Just like knowing all the details R or D is a personal choice with many mitigating factors. From what you have posted here if I was in your shoes there is no way I could put this kind of betrayal behind me and get over it.It would gnaw at me constantly.

the pos used her like a piano. filled her with false hope to get what he wanted and dumped her like a hot poteto when he found a new woman and still she is/was caring for him

MyName,

You asked about the level of detail you might want to know about the adultery. As others have stated, the level is specific to you and your makeup. And you will be going through a period of questioning her as you process everything. A timeline was mentioned. That will give you a basis for asking questions. The level of detail you need will come over time. The categories would be the Who, What, Where, When, and How of the adultery. The Who is not just the AP. It includes who knew of the A, when did they know, did they assist in carryout the A by covering things up, acting as an alibi. Those people are not Friends of the Marriage. She needs to renounce them and have no contact. You need to know who they are so you aren't left to wonder at each future social occasion or community event who in the room knew you were being betrayed. The complicity, and the other categories, get at how she pulled off the deceit over such a long period of time, how did she hid it, the steps she took to deceive you. All of this goes toward you understanding, say to the 90th percentile, what went on. Should you chose to Reconcile, you will need to come to accept who she is and what she did. You need to know what you are reconciling yourself to. She needs to answer the question, "Have you ever tracked him on social media?", because that is different than no contact.

You may have already found the SI "I Can Relate" forum "For Those Who Found Out Years Later". Reading there may provide you some additional perspective.

For me, feeling like Plan B or C or Z would be a dealbreaker. Not during the A, because none of us were any better than plan B during the A, but now and moving forward.

What if this long lost “love of her life” were to contact her now and tell her he made a mistake and wants to plow her driveway again? What would her reaction be? And IF she were to say no and by some chance was sincere, why? Would it be because she felt scorned by him or because she truly sees you as plan A now?

She could say all the right things now (or not) but how would you know if it’s the truth? How she really feels? Poly? Maybe it doesn’t matter. Maybe you’ll always feel like Plan C. If you think that’s the case then I would start towards D. If things change with how you feel you could always go back to trying R. Hell, isn’t that kind of what she did? Only you won’t be pickle dipping in the meantime.

[This message edited by LetItBeMan09 at 7:15 PM, January 30th (Tuesday)]

you need to thank the person who tipped you off because that person has the moral character and courage that your wife lacked. They gave you the truth. Give them the props because you were about to sick the police on them when they were trying to help you get to the truth even though you denied the obvious.

I know there are suggestions that she may be mentally ill. Not your problem. She gave you the truth your wife didn't. Give props where it is deserved

[This message edited by Western at 7:29 PM, January 30th (Tuesday)]

Sorry to hear. Sounds like she was filling an emptiness with him instead of communicating with. u. Does not give her a reason to cheat. My wife did the exact same thing.

Please watch on YouTube Anthony Robbins how to rebuild a broken relationship if your trying to reconcile.

OP, you need to understand that there are 3 issues you are dealing with:

1. Her character flaw. She is a cheater and with that comes lying, deceiving, disrespecting etc. She has shown you who she really is and you need to believe her. Her actions spoke much louder than her words.

2. She is not in love with you. Period. Sounds like she found this out some time ago and has acted on it. She is still in love with the POSOM (and yes, he is a POS too). No matter what she says, you being Plan C rings very true, and she has, again, clearly shown you this by posting on that website years after the affair (one that he broke off) and over a period of years. You need to believe this too.

3. She is currently in survival mode and will say ANYTHING to avoid a divorce - this is because you caught her and she has not had time to prepare. This will not last long.

Basically, she HAS told you the truth in her writings etc and you need to believe it.

Be very careful of attempting R when you know that she is deceitful (capable of easily cheating), does not love you (is in love with the other man) and is now lying!

MNiN,

TimelessLoss and others have given you some very insightful information. But being that the 'Plan C' topic is being thrown about here freely(some speaking like it is simply a fact), let me offer my general opinion of this:

Wayward thinking, and behavior, is just that---wayward. It is done with poor boundaries, and an almost disconnected mindset. 'Broken' is the best word that we can seem to use to describe this.

You're wife's thinking during, and at least for a year or two after the affair was definitely wayward. It may be wayward today, but from what you have described, she appears much clearer-headed. She has been displaying the behaviors of what you would expect from a 'good partner' for some time now. She appears to empathize with your pain. She will answer any question that you wish to ask.

I'll assume that she was a 'good partner' for many years prior to this affair. You weren't some Plan B, C, or whatever for 20something years of marriage before this shit started. She didn't have some master plan to 'have you and the kids on the side' while she pursued her real love for decades.

Simply put, somewhere along the way, she became a wayward. And yes, in her mind during this time, you were not her Plan A---her fantasy was. And you can NEVER compete with fantasy.

What you have now, in front of you, is the fallout. You are doing the right things; she appears to be doing the right things(although if I missed it, IC would be HIGHLY recommended for her). You need to take the time, absorb all that has happened, and then decide what direction that you would like to take. That is your decision, and your decision only. If you choose to reconcile, then you will also need her commitment. But that is for a later discussion.

I saw this on another site. With you feeling that you are a plan C, this looks to apply to you:

Why stay?

Why allow them to disrespect you?

Why allow yourself to be treated like this?

Why listen to another lie?

1) First and foremost, your spouse is a person of low character

2) Second - The affair is not nor will it ever be your fault

3) Lawyer. Today. Know your rights. Start the Divorce. Start to get primary rights to your kids (if you have some). You can always stop the process in the future.

4) Doctor - get STD/STI/HIV tests started. Your life depends on it!

5) Counselor for you. One that has experience with infidelity. You're going to need to talk with someone about this

6) Eat.

7) Sleep (at least 8 hours a night if possible)

8) Drink water (avoid alcohol at this point, it won't help)

9) Get to gym and start working out - it helps the body, the mind, and the soul

10) Start to separate funds

11) 180 like your life depended on it.

12) DNA your kids. Not so much to see if they are yours (hopefully they are), but to show her that you can't trust anything about her (again, if you have them)

13) Expose. Lies thrive in the dark.

14) Don't know who originally posted it, but they are a genius:

Just Let Them Go

The end result?

The end result is to respect yourself in the end, let go of the people that don't value you or respect you.

That is the end result.

The quickest way to get a cheating spouse back is to let them go with a smile on your face wishing them the best in life and hoping that everything works out in their relationship with their affair partner.

Seriously, the quickest way to get them back.

Nothing else works better or quicker.

Let them go.

Agree with them and their feelings,

"you should be with the OM, I hope he makes you happy, good bye"

Wouldn't that be true love?

If you really loved your spouse, and wanted them to have what they really want in life which is the other person they're in love with, wouldn't letting them go be the approach if you really love them?

Why focus on the affair or the drama associated with it?

Just let them go. Give them their freedom.

You can take a good hard look at yourself in the mirror everyday and improve yourself but do it for you, not for someone else, the changes will never stick when it's done for someone else, do it for your benefit and you will probably make those changes last much longer if not indefinitely - because it's for your benefit and you realize the importance and value in that benefit because YOU are involved.

I will never tell someone to change to entice a WAW back when she's been cheating on him. I don't care how bad a marriage, there is never an excuse for cheating. That is a personal decision that someone makes to cheat on their spouse. If a marriage is really bad, leave, get a divorce, speak up to your spouse and tell them flat out "this marriage sucks and if things don't change I'm going to leave you and find someone better" and if things don't improve, leave that person.

But cheating, no excuses.

Think about cheating.

A wayward spouse who cheats on their spouse goes behind their back, secretly, telling lies, feeling guilty, getting angry at their spouse for getting in the way of their fantasies but never owning up to their actions, never admitting what they're doing. If a person who cheats on their spouse felt justified in their actions, why hide and go behind their spouses backs when they start cheating, why lie, why make up excuses about late nights at work and going to a friends place and sleeping over because they drank too much and any other such nonsense?

Deep down, the cheating spouse knows there is something inherently wrong with their actions otherwise they wouldn't lie about their actions and hide what they're doing.

Fighting the affair? For what reason?

To compete with the OM or OW for your spouse?

What message does that communicate to your wayward spouse?

They have lots of value and you have none because now you have to compete with another person for their love? Competing with your wayward spouse's affair partner never works, it just prolongs an ugly drama filled process.

The easiest way to show you will not tolerate cheating in your relationship is to let that person go. That is the easiest and most effective way to show this.

"Look wife/husband, I won't be in an open relationship with you, I won't give you X number of days, weeks, months to make your mind, if you really feel like you need to sit on the fence on this decision and can't decide between your affair partner and me well I will make the decision for you, you can be with them because I'm no longer an option. I love you and wish you a good life with them and hope it works out for you because it didn't work out for us. Now the best thing we can do for each other is to make this process as graceful and peaceful as possible for us and our children, I'll contact a lawyer/mediator and get started on the process of our legal separation/divorce."

You give them what they want.

You don't fight them on this issue.

You agree with their feelings,

they want to be with the other person, fine they should be with the other person, let them be with the other person.

You will never convince a person to change their feelings with your arguments and logic. You can not find one member on this website in a situation where they are dealing with infidelity where they got their spouse to change their mind about how they feel about their affair partner.

You can't say "don't love them, love me instead",

you can't say "look at me, I'm better in every way compared to your affair partner, pick me instead of them",

you can't say "you took marriage vows, you promised to love me"

I agree, you don't have to make it easy for your wayward spouse to have an affair, but when you let them go, "lovingly detach", you don't have to worry about making it easy for them. It's no longer your concern, they can have you or them but not both and not at the same time and since they've chosen to have an affair, they've made their choice, there is no profit in fighting that decision. Let them go and move on with your life, that is the quickest, easiest way to get them back.

You definitely don't support them financially and enable them, that would be weak, wussy, clingy, insecure behavior - something in you telling you that you need to support them financially while they're having an affair, hoping they'll realize how nice you are and come back to you.

Just let them go, have them move out or you move out and live a good life without them.

[This message edited by CheekyB at 6:55 AM, January 31st (Wednesday)]

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[This message edited by MyNameIsNobody at 11:14 AM, February 15th (Thursday)]

Just so it's not lost I want to reiterate what will determine where her head is today. Ask her to write up a timeline that SHE will be sending to his girlfriend (though it would be best coming from an email account that you control)

This will completely salt the earth of any possible future relationship between the two. If she is harboring any hope for a future with him, fantasy or not, she will resist this tactic. You simply need to say "I need this to heal". It's a pretty black and white decision, anyone in any form of remorse WILL jump at any tool that they can use to re-win your trust.

Tell her to write a letter detailing why you shouldn't go out and have a revenge affair.

The A was between your WW & the OM. He broke it off when he realized your WW was not going to leave and when he met his now GF.

Writing to the GF would serve no purpose as he did not as far as you know have sex with your WW after he was with his GF as he then wanted a normal relationship.

Yep the guy is a POS but he was only taking what your WW was giving him freely. Sending a NC letter to the OM in my opinion is acceptable & to the GF to create some drama in his life if that's what your after then go for it.

For me after she subjected you as her plan B or C, then pined and reminisced about her love for the OM for years on a public forum would have absolutely driven the last nail in the M

[This message edited by notanotherchance at 8:57 AM, January 31st (Wednesday)]

MyName,

Any steps you take to act on your own future takes away fear of the unknown. Your last post tells me you have arrived at a waystation. A "pre-decisional" waystation from which you can assess in what way you want to move forward. Your heart and mind are likely misaligned, sending you conflicting signals. At least not ripping yourself to shreds to the point that you can't think rationally. My saying this is not to attempt to minimize your pain. Instead it is a reflection that your not bleeding out all over the floor. Maybe out of the ER but still in the ICU?

Time is on your side. You have a fair measure of control. She needs to understand and live the fact that, to you, her adultery just occurred. She went through her post A processing without making herself vulnerable in any way. Without any outcome really needed. She wrote her way through it after her adultery partner dropped her. In that way it was all still selfishly driven.

I think you've played this about as well as you could. All on her now to help you heal. She needs to understand that your healing leads you to a place and time where you can make final decisions about your future.

Things you have to look forward to (sarcasm) are anger and resentment. Those will be thrown into the mix of stuff on the emotional rollercoaster. Infidelity just keeps on delivering hits.

Stay strong. Keep posting. BTW, you have my permission to drink one glass/bottle of fermented water this Sunday.

Hi MyName

I want to commend you for taking some control back and demanding what a BS deserves from his WW to even consider trying R.

If she’s truly ALL IN then she’ll want to do these things for you.

I do think a good question was asked by another poster and you should ask her to include that in her response to the question of why you should believe she picks you and not him. The question is, if he would come to her now and say he’s ready to share a life with her, would she go? How would she respond to that?

I also want to say that I agree with sharkman. I can’t remember if you have contacted his spouse yet, but that would be a good piece of the plan. Although my thought would be to wait for your WW to deliver on what she has promised first.

Then, once you think you have it all, have a discussion about how the OBS deserves to know and that you plan on contacting her. That you are both complicit in this awful lie if you don’t let her know. If your wife is truly remorseful she won’t try to stop you. If she does, then you can let her know that you can see she is still protecting him and if she wants him and not you then she should go be with him.

But take one step at a time. Telling her you are going to do that before she starts the work you have asked for my hinder the process. It may be too overwhelming.

I’m sorry you find yourself in this position, but you are doing well to work your way out of her Infidelity. It’s a tough road but if you walk it well you will find happiness again, one way or another.

Tried to reread your posts for clarity. If he did not continue the affair after meeting and starting a relationship with the new GF then I would not contact her. But if he did, then she deserves to know, if he is still with her.

It was unclear to me which case it was.

Just curious, what is the website? I don't plan to seek out the OP's whife's posts specifically, but I am just curious about the site.

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[This message edited by MyNameIsNobody at 11:15 AM, February 15th (Thursday)]

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[This message edited by MyNameIsNobody at 11:16 AM, February 15th (Thursday)]