SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

No it does not matter if they were physical. My WH has a Ea/PA and after he got caught he didn’t end the affair, they just stopped having ohysical sex and had phone sex for a year instead as that was “better” in his screwed up mind. It wasn’t. Betrayal is betrayal and my WH knew it at the time and so does your WH. This whole church nonsense is just another manifestation of your WHs obsession with power and control. He wants the power and prestige of his position which allows him to exert control over you and over others and the church aspect of it allows him to justify it allbin his own mind.

Here’s the deal: until HE is committed to seeing and understanding this situation for what it is and his need to behave in this way his mistreatment if you (and abuse of others via his position) will never end. Until you see HIM making these changes this will not end. Until he gets it this will not end. Until he wants to change it for HIM this will not end. So what are you willing to do in the meantime? Wait?

I’m sorry it sounds like the people in your life are so blinded by religious nonsense that they will do this to you. My WHs stepmother (the OW in his fathers affair and now his wife) lived with her first husband who was homosexual and who relentlessly cheated on her with other men for about 15 years (he is now living with his boyfriend) because the church blamed her for his homosexuality because she was not being an good enough wife. Had she supported him better been better he wouldn’t have been gay. That’s the same ignorant mentality you are dealing with now of a different variety

You said you husband was involved in a church that expected him to divorce you if you didn't comply with their unconventional expectations of what a wife should be. It took him 6 1/2 years to leave that church. He may have left that church, but he didn't leave that mentality behind. You're supposed to put up and shut up.

I agree with this statement by Charity. It sounds like you've been in a codependent relationship for a long time. You've been the adult and he's been the child. You've been taking care of everything and cushioning him from the consequences of his own actions.

Don't get down on yourself. Unfortunately, this can happen to the best of us. I was in a codependent relationship with my husband for awhile after he spent time in the hospital. I got sucked in, and I didn't realize it until our first Dday.

I suggest checking out the Codependency thread in the I Can Relate section. Read the first page, especially.

The first six years of our marriage he was involved with a very toxic religious organization that told him, within months of us inviting its leader to co-officiate with my father at our wedding, that I if I didn't accept the church's (very unconventional) teachings, he could divorce me.

Would you say that this first religion you and your husband were involved with was a 'cult'? The reason I ask is that I have some personal experience with people involved in a cult. They can be extremely hard to rid yourself of their grasp (think mind control techniques).

Yeah, the first “church” was a cult, I just didn’t want to say that so succinctly. It sucked HIM in when we were vulnerable ... he had just graduated school with me, we were starting a new life, his (abusive) dad was dying, and an old roommate introduced him. The leader was a father figure to him and played on his weaknesses.

I told him so within weeks of my moving and seeing the dynamic, but I was 21, broke, no job, living in a new state, and my parents wouldn’t let me leave him and come home. They’re ultra religious too, swing back and forth between charismatic and Calvinist Reformed.

My WH ultimately followed the same pendulum swing my folks did and left renouncing the cult. He’s seemed very different these past few years. VERY egalitarian, did a 180 in our marriage ... or so it seemed ... he would argue for women’s rights against these naysayers. But I think the “alternate reality” we lived in perhaps indeed contributed to this mindset that he can be close to every woman that enjoys his presence and talks to him about theology. That it’s my fault if I don’t buy in to what’s going on. That I should keep working to pay for his spending and he never has to account for his time or whereabouts because, well, pfffshah. He’s still saying he was working with the women.

He was my first ever serious boyfriend. I don’t know; I’m still young. I’m only 35. I’ve got so much time and energy in now that I want to be wrong .... but he will have to grow up. I’ll read the codependent thing. My father actually described his behavior as such. Never said I was ... but maybe I am enabling. I’ll take a look.

[This message edited by textingministry at 6:23 PM, January 21st (Monday)]

Now is the time to set new rules about YOUR life.

How you want your life to be lived - what type of church you worship at. What job you want and where you want to live.

You need to take back the power in your life NOW.

Then see if he can fit into your life. Not you fitting into his. He’s absolutely not a partner in your marriage. He is a selfish dictator that uses “religion” as his means of justification.

Allowing any other woman to live in your home is unacceptable. Look that up in the Bible and it is a Commandment.

Trying to stop you from taking a job you wanted b/c it was an inconvenience to him? Again selfish on his part.

Get your power back now. It is what made my R successful and changed our dynamics. My H knows I’m not afraid of being alone and will leave him if necessary. He knows I will no longer accept or tolerate his poor choices.

I was a bit of a doormat in our marriage. After 25 years of M and it being his second Affair I realized that if I didn’t change - he would not be forced to change.

My H never came home in time. Never called when late. Lived a very nice lifestyle b/c he traveled extensively for his job. He was all over the world and cane home and I never complained. Not once.

Now? He hates to be away from home. Lol. Not sure why but I certainly have my own social life (with friends) that keep me occupied. He’s not my sole focus anymore.

I am.

I should keep working to pay for his spending and he never has to account for his time or whereabouts because, well, pfffshah

This is referrred to as being lazy and taking advantage of you. You will have to establish boundaries to thwart his unbalanced expectations. Whether, or not, your relationship becomes successful may depend on establishing and vigilantly maintaining those boundaries.

Getting yourself moved is a good plan, regardless of separation or divorce.

Watch his actions. What is he doing to help you feel safe? Unless he acknowledges his actions recovery won’t work.

Please get yourself some individual therapy.

I’m still young. I’m only 35. I’ve got so much time and energy in now that I want to be wrong ....

In poker, the key is knowing when to fold. When the cards you're holding aren't going to win, quit putting money in.

"within months of us inviting its leader to co-officiate with my father at our wedding, that I if I didn't accept the church's (very unconventional) teachings, he could divorce me."

I was stuck on this sentence in your original post.

You have to ask yourself WHY you were ok with that?

[This message edited by sewardak at 12:20 PM, January 22nd (Tuesday)]

Why you were okay with that

I was 21, fresh out of school, broke and jobless with no prospects because I studied religion, and my parents flat out refused to allow me to come home since I married him. They’re ultra religious too and said since I chose to make those vows I’d have to live with them. I can’t remember how many times I called begging to come home. Didn’t know about women’s shelters back then.

So fast forward to now, and I thought I had a man that had grown up and healed from his own personal stuff he dragged me through. And our marriage was better, or so I thought. But apparently not because here I am in this forum.

So used to putting on the “happy” face now, it’s silly. My family thinks I should just forgive him. Not forget, but forgive. I think I just need to find the energy to keep going. His crud is why I went back to school and made myself marketable.

He’s said a lot lately he’s so afraid I’m going to finish my masters degree and leave him. He wouldn’t be so afraid, I think, if he had watered his own damn field from time to time, rather than running after every green patch of land that wants to “pray” with him. Screw it - it’s about the kids now, and if he changes in the meantime, God bless him.

Honey take really good care of yourself! You deserve it. Get that masters degree!

He’s said a lot lately he’s so afraid I’m going to finish my masters degree and leave him.

Said to guilt you! He finds it easier to say things in an attempt to manipulate than to do the hard work of adulting. You two are not equally yoked and he has alot of work to do to make that hapoen. It hasn’t been his nature to do “the work” so he’d have to get comfortable with that concept.

What happens when your closest link to God cheats on you then tells you you're the crazy one for calling it cheating?

He continues to lie and cheat until you kick him to the curb. Even if he never had sex with these women, it sounds like he was priming himself and them for sexual relationships. Multiple affairs. With emotionally vulnerable women. This isn't just dishonest, cheating behavior; it's predatory behavior. Using his status as a minister to cover up his intentions doesn't make him a good guy.

Quit listening to the words of a proven liar. Look at what his actions tell you.

You're only 35. You have plenty of time to rebuild a better life for yourself. You do not have so much time invested in the marriage that you cannot walk away. My marriage lasted almost as long as you've been alive, and let me tell you: my biggest wish about my marriage is that I had left back when I was still 35. If I had, I could have had a life. By staying, I cost myself everything. My life is ruined because I stayed. I'm too old to recover and rebuild now. You aren't. It isn't too late for you.

Do you really want to waste any more time and energy on a lying, serial, predatory cheater who shows no remorse, has no intention of working to make the marriage better, and is probably only using you to earn money for him so he can indulge his philandering?

Take care of yourself and quit worrying about him or the marriage. If you can support yourself, you'll be better off alone for the rest of your life than tied to someone you cannot trust and who doesn't care enough about you to keep his pants zipped.

Best of luck.

I strongly disagree with those telling you it doesn't matter if he had sex with her. It absolutely matters.

Don't get me wrong. He's cheated,regardless.

But,if he has told you there wasn't anything physical with her,and there was,then you're attempting reconciliation based on lies. So it will fail,even if he never cheats again. In order to truly reconcile, there can be NO lies. No secrets he shares with OW, but not you. It is crucial that the WS is totally honest,about everything, at all times.

I've said it many times. You can NOT reconcile with an unremorseful WS. You also can't reconcile with a liar.

But,if he has told you there wasn't anything physical with her,and there was,then you're attempting reconciliation based on lies. So it will fail,even if he never cheats again. In order to truly reconcile, there can be NO lies. No secrets he shares with OW, but not you. It is crucial that the WS is totally honest,about everything, at all times.

THIS^^^ Honesty is paramount to R. It is the foundation to R and even if you think it doesn't matter now, if you R and find out years later he lied to you, it's going to matter a lot then. Lies like that have ruined many Rs and ended in D even when the BS was pretty sure the WS was lying all along. Infidelity can be overcome by many but further lies and disrespect are a deal breaker for most.

Texting, are you in IC? Could you get into IC? You have a lot to unpack in regards to your history with your WH, your parents who didn't support you and still don't support you now if you did need to D for your own healthy and safety, on top of the trauma of infidelity. Do you have better friends who are pro-you and pro-your health that you could reach out to?

It really saddens me to see that your parents don't seem to care about what your WH does to you because they saw your marriage as you signing up for the abuse. That's terrible. I hope you have a much nicer and more compassionate support group outside of them to lean on who don't see a choice you made over a decade ago as justification for the abuse you're experiencing today.

Married 28 years with two teenagers. A minister 12 years older, at 60, had been preaching there for 8 years. I had not been in church with WW and kids for a long time. They were going 3X per week. He was a married, serial-cheating, drunken, predator, minister who threw the charm and charisma at my vulnerable WW, mostly through texting at first. Once I was ask to separate, I knew someone at church was likely hitting on her. I attended a service, met the preacher and knew right away that he was the one. I know my wife very well and I had researched the ministers family on FB before going. I watched their reactions. I turned into a diy PI. I got solid proof and went to the OBS of 12 years first, then one month later asked preacher to meet with him. He chose not to. I then met with the church board and he was asked to step down. I also informed our family and our community. The A went on about 5 months that I know of. Even after his resignation, they got caught by OBS and she filed for divorce from her lying, cheating preacher husband. We divorced, remarried and are doing well nearly two years later. I had made some poor decisions during our marriage or I would have walked away. I am a better husband and father now. I made sure the predator never got back behind the pulpit. These kind of shenanigans happen with about 25% of preachers by age 40. I trust nobody and it gets easier as time passes.

Manofintegrity, I’m so sorry to hear about your experience. Church, where you ought to be able to bare your soul and find new strength, has caused so much heartache instead.

I found out last night that my 11 year old daughter has been waking up to go into church early not to help her father, but to follow the AP around when she gets there early with my WH. My little daughter noticed them flirting since the moment the AP moved in and made it her mission to thwart them. She saw it when I left the room and they thought no one was looking. My daughter tried to justify her father’s behavior and said he was only using sarcastic humor like he does with me and her, not flirting back.

We had a long talk about what is acceptable behavior in a relationship. I told her I knew her father was indeed flirting back, and she seemed relieved and wondered whether he had held himself back in front of her because he was aware of her presence (and afraid of getting caught). I’m debating getting her into therapy, too, because she told me she has flashbacks and gets grippingly angry in the middle of class picturing them two together.

She didn’t know I’ve known. I told her I just found out for sure in October but had been talking to her father about inappropriate behavior for a long time, and I had been trying to protect her from the impact of those talks. Turns out she hadn’t talked to anyone about what she witnessed because she didn’t want to cause a fight.

I called an attorney today and scheduled an STD screen. Will likely follow up with another attorney because I didn’t like the one I talked to, but it was definitely informative. Of course, this part was not shared with my little one ... get to hear that burden alone. WH came home from working on new house syrupy sweet, and then started slamming doors and being passive aggressive when I sat numbly and didn’t embrace back.

You’re right ... finding more lies does hit like a stack of bricks and starts the whole process over again.

Texting. I’m sorry that your child had to witness this. I think therapy is a good move and will help her understand the situation better and deal with it.

And the fact your H chose to behave this way in front of his own child is sickening.

I remember on DDay 2 when my life was being blown to smithereens (yet again b/c one DDay wasn’t enough). I was upstairs crying and told my H to take our boys out to dinner without me.

When they came home I asked them how was dinner and my son told me my H spent 20 minutes outside on a phone call. They assumed it was work. I immediately knew it was the OW.

Turns out I was right - it was the OW. Still bugs me to this day. And it was just a phone call.

In your case I hope you can see how you need to get away from this looney bin you have been living in. Your marriage has been manipulated not by a “man of God” but by a cheater who hides behind the word of God.

You need a reality check - because your child is witnessing this and you need to be her role model. Let her know this is not acceptable.

I am so sorry to hear how this has affected your daughter. You will obviously have to keep an eye on her and get her counselling if you see signs that she is acting out as a result of his actions. I encourage you to answer her questions, as this will help her to heal and understand.

Married 28 years with two teenagers. A minister 12 years older, at 60, had been preaching there for 8 years. I had not been in church with WW and kids for a long time. They were going 3X per week. He was a married, serial-cheating, drunken, predator, minister who threw the charm and charisma at my vulnerable WW, mostly through texting at first. Once I was ask to separate, I knew someone at church was likely hitting on her. I attended a service, met the preacher and knew right away that he was the one. I know my wife very well and I had researched the ministers family on FB before going. I watched their reactions. I turned into a diy PI. I got solid proof and went to the OBS of 12 years first, then one month later asked preacher to meet with him. He chose not to. I then met with the church board and he was asked to step down. I also informed our family and our community. The A went on about 5 months that I know of. Even after his resignation, they got caught by OBS and she filed for divorce from her lying, cheating preacher husband. We divorced, remarried and are doing well nearly two years later. I had made some poor decisions during our marriage or I would have walked away. I am a better husband and father now. I made sure the predator never got back behind the pulpit. These kind of shenanigans happen with about 25% of preachers by age 40. I trust nobody and it gets easier as time passes.

And yet another one of multiple experiential stories with what I deem "hypocrites"- under the guise of religiosity. And my opinion about the "power couple " remark? Therein lies part of the complex problem. A "power couple" should not be a thought when a supposed self-proclaimed religious-based couple fails to balance necessity (paying the bills) with a calling. KWIM? In other words, if being a "power couple" is more important than tenets of your religion, then obviously there's a conflict. Choose one over the other. Obviously, one ambition took over the supposed predilection to your faith.

In other words, I grow tired of supposed religious (who supply testament to such) people who so balatantly violate their religion. And yes- humans make mistakes, but my patience for unsubstantial "reasons" - for that constant reference to religiosity and not owning responsibilty, quite frankly pisses me off. Figure out your priorities...career? Religion? or a reasonable balance between the two, And your husband is a hypocrite who is undeserving (even lending forgiveness) of any religious affiliation or the guise of such.

My personal opinion and your decision to acknowledge and/or dispute such.