SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

You need therapy urgently...don't dismiss it because of what you've read or heard. Her narcissism should play no factor in getting therapy for YOUR pain. She has no role in your healing. Go see a therapist ASAP....stop making assumptions.

Also 8 months since dday and 2 weeks since your 1st post and you are still completely stuck in the mud. Your most recent post is almost the same as your 1st few posts. The only person who can get you unstuck is YOU. Stop giving ur ex lunatic anymore of your headspace...and focus on YOU. You will get "stronger" I promise...if you do this.

Then when you feel strong enough....get moving on getting your daughter back.

Start moving forward, get some therapy/help, and start moving forward. This all stops when YOU stop it.

Most of us would have Fox, but it is what it is.

You can do this.

Write out what you have to do. If you are too confused to do it, get a friend to help you organize your actions into steps and prioritize those steps. Use this as your map and where you have to go and do.

There IS another side and you WILL get there.

k9

Therapy won't help me because the type of abuse was narcissistic.

That is absolutely not true. Narcissists often cannot be helped by therapy but their victims often need therapy. You absolutely can be helped if you will see someone who specializes in PTSD therapy. You also might benefit from some temporary anti-anxiety medications.

Look, I know seeing someone for help doesn't seem manly to a lot of people. But asking for help when you need it is one of the most logical, manly things you can do. If you weren't constantly being besieged by sneak attacks and if your daughter hadn't been taken by force, you might be able to heal on your own but it would still take years. And you could relapse easily at another trigger. Once you've developed PTSD from abuse, you are more susceptible to it. You need help not only in getting through this immediate episode of PTSD but you also need professional help to prevent recurrence. This isn't standard laziness or even fear causing your issues. This is your body's response to trauma and you are not in control of it if you are blacking out or having panic attacks. A professional can help you get this under control.

Your daughter needs you. But if you don't get the help you need, your anxiety and PTSD issues could be used against you. From everything you've written, there is no blow too low for your ex. In addition, getting help for your issues may put a professional in your corner for testimony at a later date. You need all the credible people in your corner you can get. And a PTSD therapist really could help you heal faster and stronger than you could do on your own.

I'm so sorry you are going through all of this. Your ex and her AP are horrible people not fit to raise a garden, much less children. I hope you get your daughter back.

[This message edited by Tearsoflove at 3:28 PM, July 28th (Friday)]

If you take the advice to "man up" to mean "don't be a doormat, rugsweep, or sacrifice your self-respect by doing the pick me dance", it's good advice for most of us under the circumstances of infidelity. But you aren't under normal circumstances. You are no longer with your ex so none of the typical advice applies.

What you are describing with the anxiety and the blackouts during triggers are physiological nervous system responses to trauma. "Man up" didn't work for World War I & II soldiers suffering from "shell shock". It didn't work for Korean Conflict and Vietnam War Vets suffering from "Battle Fatigue". It didn't work for Gulf War Vets suffering from "PTSD". That's because you cannot control your neurological symptoms. Your body is in fight, flight, or freeze mode. And it's not surprising. Your ex and her AP are not typical cheaters. You've been subjected to random guerilla warfare you can't prepare for. Your body is in constant alert mode because of it. Unpredictable attacks mean that you cannot relax. Your ex and the AP have engaged in every possible tactic to bully, gaslight, defame, and ambush you that has ever been thought of on these boards. I don't know if they are personality disordered or just evil. But it doesn't matter. You need professional help and it's not because you aren't "manning up". It's because you've been on edge over this for longer than your body can handle well and it has shut down on you repeatedly. And it will continue to happen each time you are ambushed. You have to get some help from a professional for the anxiety and the reflexive reactions you are having. If you do not get help for this, your health will suffer. Your body's immune system is likely compromised and the stress is probably causing damage to your organs. Please see if there is any way you can see a PTSD specialist for help. That is the very first step to you "manning up". You really need to take care of yourself.

A lot of this.

I feel like I'm in a no win situation.

Because I kind of am in a no win situation. She set herself up very well in advance to make this happen. I didn't see it coming.

I'm probably going to take a lot of flack for this but here goes. Most of the time here you will be advised and correctly so... to forget the OM. It's your WW you need to worry about. In your case I wholeheartedly disagree. The OM is about as evil of a person as you can get, (though the evidence you have presented shows your WW not to be much of a saint either). I believe he mistreats and abuses women to make himself appear more masculine and macho. (In other words he fits the bill to be a controller and manipulator.) Your WW fit right into his arms like a fly on sh*t. I believe your WW to be one of those people who can be manipulated very easily... the kind of woman who is a dream girl for the OM. I believe the abuse you have received from your WW has been done for the OM and through the OM. I think he tells your WW to jump and she says, "How high"?

Now what does this have to do with anything? If I were you I would talk to the DA in your area and see if you have enough evidence to have a case against the OM and to get your daughter removed from that madhouse. This is where you need to man up. Do you want your daughter to learn how to let herself be abused like the OM is abusing your WW and to think that is the NORM?

Marriage sucks - i agree with you - likeness attracts likness

Fox,

Please STOP. I promise I get it, but you have to STOP replaying everything. It does you absolutely no good.

The people in this forum are here for you. But you've got to be here for you.

No question you are at the bottom of a big barrel. But only talking about it and taking no steps to change it does nothing.

Please, take this day by day. And let this forum be your support - even more than that, let the great people here be your accountability peers. Report to us the actions you've taken (you've gotten great advice).

I promise, promise that if you take the positive steps suggested here that your pain will slowly subside.

We are here for you, but you have to stop wallowing in the misery.

Please consider a good IC. There is no shame in it. I was traumatized, abused and dealing with PTSD: I have pastors close in my family as well as elders., and many good friends They are wise and helpful. That doesn't mean they know how to effectively deal with the sitauon the same way as a trained therapist. I have an amazing Christian IC that has been invaluable to my emotional health. She is a provision from the Lord as well. Please consider this.

She pulled a knife on me.....She got away with it with probation.

This is someone I trusted......with everything in my life. Everything......forget passwords and Facebook. Talking social security number and my entire existence. We weren't married but we might as well have been

SHE SAID she was on her best behavior till the trial was over.

Her best behavior was still cruel. Still

After.....it got worse

She kept taunting and hurting me

Over and over.......so did he.

Common......"I want to watch you die"

K

Really......

I fucking met him 2 times.......I don't fucking know the son of a bitch and all of a sudden some asshole wants me dead because my bitch ex gave him the ability to prey on someone

WHAT THE FUCK.......AND I MEAN........WHAT THE FUCK?

Really.....

Reallly ....

They exist........they really exist.....someone who really gets off on this shit..

Yeah I'm freaking out a little....

I'm not a bitch.....im not small.....im not weak. I can handle myself. People don't just walk up to me and bully me. He only did because she sold him how....

"You lost your family and your child because you can't keep your shit togehter"

"You seem rather cross are you cross"

"I come into people's lives and break shit"

"I use women for therapy."

"The truth would kill you and I would love to see it"

Silent treatments from her while withholding and using my daughter as a weapon.

Over and over until I was just done.

The betrayal. The cruelty

All of it.

She was waiting for me to do something. I would say something and she would ask me to repeat it so she could record it. Text messages of emotional abuse...

My ex is a malignant narcissist. She's not the candy store shit people complain about on quora. She's the real deal.

She was waiting to hurt me and take my daughter knowing that would hurt me.

For power

For control

To win

For him and her both......to get me out of the way and live her god damn fantasy that I wasn't a part of....

She loved me until, the day she didn't.......

I was blindsided

And he was driving a lot of it. He was wanting it more than her. I guarantee it.

The point is

I CAN NEVER RELAX. I stay like this.

On defense. Staying in one place because anything I do is war.

If I move forward she will do something. If I get my daughter she will do something. She already is. Telling her I don't love her. Am I going up on abuse charges. Ext

And I going up on molestation charges next......is my daughter going to hate me next.......when's my domestic violence charge coming......when am I going to get stabbed....

When am I going to fucking disappear and be buried in the woods.

Are they going to torture me....

Am I going to get jumped and heated to death.

He's already tried to draw me out.....i told him no way in hell and I could beat his ass till he quits moving.

I'm not that guy......I don't want to fight.....I want peace....I don't live like that.....I don't fucking want that....

I DONT FUCKING WANT THAT OR ANY OF THIS FOR MY LIFE.......

If I even show that I'm having a good fuckkng time she will do something to take it.....she's already hinted at it

Something to take it.....something to hurt me until

She pushes me so far and takes enough that I will end my own life because of fear or no where to go

I'm always on full alert. Ready to be mean....ready to stay mean.

My body is in fight and freeze mode.

I don't know what to do about that.

What can you do when the enemy you never had is out there and will do anything to hurt you just because your alive and they want you dead

They want me locked up so they will try

They want me to commit suicide so they will try

They want to murder me slowly and painfully

Now the hell can you move forward with someone who wants these things for you.

Man up....

I have.......

I'm not dead........

I miss my family.....I miss ,y kid that they came ant took.

I was supposed to have her for the weekend....

She said she wanted to be tolerable with eachother.....she dropped her off and went and got an order of protection against me.

Even the damn judge saw through the whole thing. He still had to give it. I kept it together in court....

Therapy can't help me

It's not going to change the fact that my ex turned on me

In a fuckkg. Day..........after 7 years

She literally turned into a nightmare. Took about a month for the guy to have full control

"I'm going to take it in all three holes tonight while they sat around decisding which hole.....three guys"

Want the recording

I have it..

And 85 other totally useless ones where I'm being messed with in ways I've never heard of

My reactions.......she soaked them up.

Nude pictures sent to ,e by him

With the caption

Fuck with the right one next time bitch

Do you know what I want to do to him....

What I can....do to him

But I can't....

And I don't want that.

So what the hell is left......

All I can do is restart my life and have my claws out.

I miss my kid so much.......so fucking much

And I'm afraid to even see her.

I sit her typing with tears in my eyes.

Half the time I want to die......half the time I fight all of it just to be ok for moment.

WHAT THE FUCKING FUCK ARE THESE PEOPLE....

WHAT THE FUCK ARE THEY???!!!

Fuck

So sorry you are hurting so badly. Gently some advice, stop focusing on them. Please start putting yourself first. They will not. You are clearly struggling and for real reasons. Please stop rejecting the advice others are giving you to get into IC. We are not against you, we are for you.

You mentioned your daughter again. Please do not keep dismissing therapy. If you don't do it for you, then try it for her. I know some other people on this forum have needed medication as well. It has helped them. If not for you, then for her.

My kids are what has made me consider all options to get help. Every option available me. Every one.

I've calmed down some.......I handle all this better than it shows here.

However......what I just said came out of me. It's raw and in sugar coated.

It is what keeps me stuck. It's why I believe a therapist can't help me. I've learned a lot about being mindful.

What I will face in the future with her will have to be faced and

Risked

The only advice given even by specialists is parallel parenting.

She doesn't want that.

She was mad because

I .......didn't want to see her.

When the court put on the order of protection I said thank God

I paid the court cost and the girl who was recording the hearing that day saw all of it. I told her I was paying for a blessing.

I'm not mad about the order.....I felt more betrayed but it was a relief.

Am getting better and healing. She cannot help me heal and she wouldn't.....

They say the person who hurt you can help make it better but that is the person that won't.

It's up to me to reframe this and heal.

Make it my frame and my story.

We had a good relationship before this. I never saw it coming.

She rewrote history a lot....

Said we always fought.......we never fought.

Several months before....she was talking about him and his wife.....said they treated eachother badly....

It was a red flag he was telling her this stuff.

She said that after we broke up.

We didn't ever treat eachother like shot.

My daughter only saw two loving parents.....that's it.

Until the day she was caught cheating. It was the first fight my 4 year old ever saw.

Her leaving......was because I was getting in the way of her affair.

Her order of protection was because I was trying to keep my daughter away from him....

And I still will.

It won't have much affect. She will use her mom's address and live with her affair partner.....I can't go near her so I can't see what's going on.

If it all goes south for her and she sees me having the life I used to again.

Believe it or not......she has the entitlement to try to come back.

With the order she would come up with something......and because I was in the dark she could deny everything...

Hell......she was caught by both me and his wife and they still deny the affair.

......she put the order on when I found out he was getting a divorce.

I asked her about it.....she said that they were getting a divorce on their own because of their own problems and she had nothing to do with it....I was like..

Yeah ......yeah right......this conversation is over.....when dealing with people who are mad......you just become mad with them.

She even told me she didn't send the nude pictures to anyone.

She told me she didn't even take any.....what can you even do with someone like this.

She denied all of it......when she was logiced out she would blame me for it and hang up.

Early on she had nothing to blame me for......after the cruelty.

I withstood 3 months of it. Without a reaction.....

And finally I reacted.....she said it was hot to see me angry and fighting back. She was turned on.

When someone loves you....you don't fight them

Marriage should be about peace.

It's not a game of winners and losers in a war.

Part of me is glad......I was going to ask her to marry me New Years..

This all happened in November.

Think about more kids......thank god for that.

Early on......I have messages of her admitting to a lot of it and telling me it was on her......and it was.

When she rewrote history it was all on me and she would hang up or disregard any early messages.

Messages like

"I'm fucked up babe......I need to find myself. I went from one man to the next to the next without knowing who I am. I need my freedom and independence. I'm a terrible mother and girlfriend.....I feel smothered because you asked me not to hang out with my coworker"

Um.....the co worker that touched you sexually in the bowling alley? And then told me he could take any girl and leave the man broken....the married one .......with his own son....

That co worker.....no......not a good idea.....

She had been cheating with him for 6 months....soon as she got her new job. He was hired at the same time.

Either he left his wife or she kicked him out. I think she kicked him out.

I don't know......I'm completely in the dark now.

Anyway.......what a totally messed up deal.

Family is important to me.......we had a good one.....we had a good life.

She was right about one thing...

She's fucked up.

Affair partners do stuff like this or so I've read. They paint you black and the new one can do no wrong.

She isn't just having an affair. She's also a narcissist. I would have said this was limerence but her childhood was worse than usual.

Neglect heavy......,by mom and covert abuse....

Abandoning father.

If I knew then what I know now.....I would have ran south so fast. I didn't have all that mess growing up.

Her mom is worse......at first she was devalued by her mom and wanted nothing to do with her. Soon as the baby was born she was brought back into the family...

She said she wanted the baby to be Pentecostal and know god. Pert of my exs abuse was because of her mother using god as a weapon instead of loving....

I told her.....that wasn't the god I knew....

I'm just ranting now.....

Sigh......

The advice here isn't being ignored I promise.

Everything that's being said is not falling on deaf ears. It might seem like it. But it's not.

What came out of me was when my defenses are down....

During the day I deal with it better. I get tired and I see it like that.

I'm afraid of the future. I'm afraid of all the things I said. I was never like this before.

I know the long term is a broken home and my kid caught up in it. The best gift we could have given her was taken by lies and affairs.......pure selfishness for a relationship based on the pain of to partners and two young children who weren't even a thought.

All that mattered was their happiness. I hope their relationship fails...........

I want to forgive her for my own sake.....but I can never forget what happened. I relive it every day in pieces.....triggers..

I don't see a good solution to this.

I said to her.......

You were never like this before. You were happy and we had a good life. Then sent her pictures of us as a family

She said.

You will never see that girl again. I will never smile like that again. I want you to fade to nothing. All the memories we have that are good. I will make them bad....

you......don't......matter. I never think about you, I want you to get out of my daughters life and go away.

I have early messages where she said.....she would do everything in her power to make sure my daughter and I would keep the good relationship.

Months later.....she told me she regretted that thatnrealtionship had gotten much worse.......

Right after That she started withholding.......

Telling me I don't love my kid....

I don't......get it....I don't identify with it..

I don't cheat......I don't have affairs......I don't do drugs.....I'm not a criminal.......

I'm not a gambler.....I'm not an alcoholic....I wasn't abusive.

What the hell do people want.......she left me for the exact opposite.

Some asshole.....

I hope she regrets it......I hope he does her as bad as he did his wife.

She even admitted to me his wife looked diminished....

She was.....

His grandmother told her not to marry him. He's 34 and just lost wife number 2.

You just keep walking in circles here & spinning your wheels man...not sure how you expect anything to change. You still keep talking about "she, her, him, they, she her, him, they, she, her, him, they, etc. etc. etc." ...despite everyone here telling you to stop focusing on them.

You keep saying counseling won't help...despite never having even tried it...and 100% clearly needing it desperately.

What's Fox going to do for FOX? What's your plan to unstick yourself from this pain? You been reeling long enough...now it's time to move forward. Start making a plan to do so...and stop giving these assholes your headspace. STOP !!!

I feel as I read your posts that you have battered wife's syndrome, even though you are a man and you all were not married on paper, you were together and had a child.

So what I mean by this is that you are now being abused horribly, by a horrible man and now your ex. People who are emotionally abused spiral out exactly like you are doing because you are in shock, they say they don't believe what the abuser is saying about them, but deep inside that dark hole you are in you are believing much of what they are saying. They do it just for this reason, to get you to be so focused on the crazy and to NOT DO ANYTHING ABOUT STOPPING THEM. They want to keep you down, this guy is a bully and gets off on keeping you in the hole you are in. They want you to stay there. They want you to never ask for help.

Listen there is no doubt that there have been horrible, just horrible things said to you and about you. You may think you are alone but in that regard you are not. There are THOUSANDS on this site who have had emotional abuse happen to them, horrible things have been said to them, done to them...this is why I mentioned the battered wives syndrome. You my friend are being emotionally abused.

This is why we want you to get help, even if it goes against every bone in your body. We have seen it when we try to get women to leave abusive men, they have been so battered that they don't think anyone can help them. They feel like they some how deserved it, even though they don't....at all.

So we are hearing you, loud and clear. Now you need to hear all of us. YOU ARE NOT ALONE, THERE ARE MANY OTHERS who have lived thru the same thing. They do know what you are going thru, and they want to help you.

Reach out to a mens group, reach out to a church group, ask your friend for a referral to anyone you can talk to, you need someone who is just on your side. Just you.

Be strong enough to reach out, even if you are scared and lonely and un sure of everything around you. Just do it. Baby steps. Take one thing at a time, all the rest will slowly start to fall in place when you reach out for a helping hand.

[This message edited by realitybites at 11:12 AM, August 1st (Tuesday)]

You really want to know what to do? Get as much money together as you can and get just as far away from Tennessee as you can get. Cut all ties with her and anyone she knows (except your family). I can already see she isn't ever going to let you near your daughter. So go! Go build you a life somewhere else where you don't have see her or have any contact with her or the POS she is with. Eventually the POS will get tired of her and throw her away like yesterdays trash. That's when she will wake up. Leave. Get away from this life and situation that is crushing you body and soul. This is not running away, this is surviving. GO! I wish you well.